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Mysterious Email Problem

 

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This problem started happening on October 21.

?

I can send emails to my group from my Outlook, and see they were posted to the group when checking group Messages, but I do not get a copy of the emails sent back to me.

I do not get any emails from members of the group posting to the group on my Outlook, but I can see the messages posted to the group when I check group Messages.

?

Any ideas?

?

Don
 

Don

I do not get any emails from members of the group posting to the group
on my Outlook, but I can see the messages posted to the group when I
check group Messages.
Since you gave us so few clues, there are several "is it plugged in" things to check:

Are you subscribed to the group at that outlook address?

If you're logged in to the group, hover over your name (or click on it) in the upper right corner to see if it is the outlook address or a different one you used to log in. If you moderate or own the group, search the Members list to see if that outlook address has a subscription.

Is your outlook address subscription set to receive messages from that group?

This will be shown in the Members list as a mod or owner (above), or on the Subscription page for the group if you're logged in at the outlook address. Check to see whether you are subscription Email Delivery is set to receive Individual, Digest, or Summary.

Is your outlook address rejecting all group messages?

On the Subscription page click the Email Delivery History tab and look at the Recent Bounces list. That should have Reasons given by Outlook for rejecting the messages. Of course, if this is the answer you should already know from seeing a B (blue or red) badge after your outlook address in the Members list, or from a red banner on every page when logged in with your outlook address.

Is your outlook account delivering all group messages to your spam folder?

Look within the outlook user interface for the Spam (or "Junk") folder and see if group messages have been delivered there instead of your Inbox.

Shal


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Shal,

I'm sorry I didn't give enough information, but I'll try now.
The first thing I'll tell you is I'm replying to you through the GMF group, and not by replying to an email sent to me on my Outlook, because I never received one.

I am?subscribed to the group at that outlook address, and I'm the owner and moderator. I am in the Members list under Moderators with the correct email address, and I see it in the upper right corner of the page to the left of Help.

Under?Email Delivery I'm set to?Individual Messages.

"Is your outlook address rejecting all group messages?" Today I was receiving emails from the GMF up until about 11:00 AM PST, but not the one I sent asking about this mysterious problem at 6:48 PM PST, and I have not received any more emails from GMF since then.

On the?the Subscription page under Email Delivery History it shows no bounces.

"Is your outlook account delivering all group messages to your spam folder?" No Group.io messages in the Spam folder.

Don
 

Don,

I am subscribed to the group at that outlook address, ...
I am in the Members list under Moderators with the correct email
address, ...
and I see it in the upper right corner of the page ...
Under Email Delivery I'm set to Individual Messages.
That takes care of almost everything on the Groups.io side. One more:

In the Subscription page, in the Advanced Preferences drop-down, is your Message Selection set to "All Messages"?

Today I was receiving emails from the GMF up until about 11:00 AM PST,
but not the one I sent asking about this mysterious problem at 6:48 PM
PST, and I have not received any more emails from GMF since then.

On the the Subscription page under Email Delivery History it shows no
bounces.
... No Group.io messages in the Spam folder.
Taken together these may be a sign of greylisting, or otherwise deferred delivery. If the missing messages do eventually arrive that would be a further sign. On the other hand, delayed as long as 10/21 until now seems absurd, so while greylisting may fit what you've described for GMF, it doesn't fit what you've described for your group.


In your Subscription page for your group, on the Email Delivery History page, does it indicate any recent Successful or Unsuccessful Attempts? How about for GMF? What are the responses, if any?


You can also check the Recent Bounces page available through your Account page to get an overview of delivery from all of your group subscriptions, but I don't expect that to tell us anything new.

If none of these turn up any new clues then I think I'm stumped.

Shal


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One more piece of information might be useful to solve this puzzle.

Is this an Outlook.com account, an ISP account that you read at
Outlook.com, or an ISP account you receive in the email client that's
in MS Office called Outlook?

Many use Outlook to refer to both the program and the webmail service,
and they are not the same. If you're using your ISP email account and
reading it in the Outlook program that comes with Office, or even
having Outlook.com (the Webmail account) retrieve your ISP email, the
problem might be with your ISP's spam filter, not any in Outlook (the
program) or Outlook.com.

Addressing the ISP's spam filter for your account might require some
digging on your part to find out how to make changes to it or might
need a support call. I set my ISP spam filter to send me what it
thinks is spam but to mark it as spam in the subject line. Usually it
is spam but before I did that, I was not receiving some emails that
weren't spam because the ISP's filter though it was.

Donald

On Mon, 29 Oct 2018 01:13:33 -0700, "Shal Farley" <shals2nd@...>
wrote:


If none of these turn up any new clues then I think I'm stumped.

Join the Icom group, a general Icom discussion group on Groups.io:
/g/ICOM (just launched)
 

On Mon, Oct 29, 2018 at 01:15 AM, Shal Farley wrote:
is your Message Selection set to "All Messages"?
Shal,

Yes.

Regarding Greylisting, I did send a test message to myself using the Group Owner email link on my home page, and it arrived hours later. I sent two more after that, and so far I haven't received them.

"does it indicate any recent Successful or Unsuccessful Attempts?" Most Recent Unsuccessful Attempt -?No email deliveries

For?Most Recent Successful Delivery?it says:
MessagePost To SubscriberDeliveredOct 28Response2.0.0 GzgZgPPKNk7oUGzgcgX5vH mail accepted for deliveryDon
 

Something else I'm noticing is I am getting emails through my Outlook program from GMF and others, but not any from GMF on this thread "Mysterious Email Problem."

Don
 

Don,

For?Most Recent Successful Delivery?it says:
Message? Post To Subscriber?
Delivered? Oct 28?
Response? 2.0.0 GzgZgPPKNk7oUGzgcgX5vH mail accepted for delivery

Ok, that's odd.Usually the Message subject line (including group tag) and message number appear in the Message field. "Post To Subscriber" is something new I just noticed recently, and I put in a support request about it.

But that aside, the 2.0.0 response code is a delivery success, as it says. So at least that message made it to your email service. What happened to it from there I don't know.


Something else I'm noticing is I am getting emails through my Outlook program from GMF and others, but not any from GMF on this thread "Mysterious Email Problem."

That sounds an awfully lot like (content-based) spam filter behavior. Maybe Donald's hint about checking the web interface of your email service is on target - assuming that's not where you normally read messages.

Shal


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I just today got an email I sent to my group last Saturday, so that's about a three day lag.

I have recently been using my ISP web mail interface, to see if it has been showing or acting any differently than my Outlook program on my computer. While using the web mail I checked Spam settings, and added Groups.io and my group to the Allow feature. I'll take Donald's advice and check it again.

Don
 

On Mon, Oct 29, 2018 at 08:22 PM, <dgrass1@...> wrote:
I just today got an email I sent to my group last Saturday, so that's about a three day lag.
See this message on an email header analyzer that can tell you very quickly where the message was held up.?

Hope this helps,
Bruce?
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I used the analyzer, and it showed my ISP holding up the email that took almost three days to get to me. I'll have to contact my ISP about the problems I'm experiencing, and maybe I can get something resolved. If I do get this fixed through the ISP, I'll let you all know how it went.

Don
 

I'm still going to contact my ISP, but I thought I would update this slow down of emails using the analyzer.

Many emails get slowed down for as much as three days going from ec2-35-174-158-239.compute-1.amazonaws.com to?mx.cox.rs.oxcs.net?, and many are also slowed down from?web01.groups.io to?cmsmtp ...the last one for four days.

Don
Jim Higgins
 

Received from dgrass1@... at 10/30/2018 03:43 PM UTC:

I'm still going to contact my ISP, but I thought I would update this slow down of emails using the analyzer.

Many emails get slowed down for as much as three days going from ec2-35-174-158-239.compute-1.amazonaws.com to mx.cox.rs.oxcs.net, and many are also slowed down from web01.groups.io to cmsmtp ...the last one for four days.

This info would be much more informative, and subject to further analysis, if you would post the raw results of the analysis, or preferably the complete original headers.

Jim H
 

On Tue, Oct 30, 2018 at 08:36 PM, Jim Higgins wrote:
post the raw results of the analysis, or preferably the complete original headers
That's discouraged on this group because it has public archives.? No sense allowing easy access to just anyone.

Duane?
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Don,

Many emails get slowed down for as much as three days going from
ec2-35-174-158-239.compute-1.amazonaws.com to mx.cox.rs.oxcs.net
That's interesting. I think those may be on the /inbound/ side, representing processing within cox before the message was sent to groups.io. But that would only make sense if the sender of the message is also using cox.net.

and many are also slowed down from web01.groups.io to cmsmtp ...
That's more what I expected, outbound from the group to your inbox.

Unfortunately, when the delay is at the hand-off from one service (groups.io) to another (cox.net) you can't be sure if the delay was due to groups.io holding the message before handing it off, or cox.net not accepting the message when first presented. Mark could tell, from his outbound server logs (as could cox, from their inbound logs) but such detailed logs are not generally kept very long, often only one day or less.

Shal


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For what it¡¯s worth Don, you are not alone in your problem, although mine is an Australian ISP.

Many of my messages to and from my own group are delayed exactly 2 hours, they are held up at a sub server which checks for spam (I¡¯ve checked this on the header analysis site, always held up at the same place). Something in the headers triggers this Spam alert, yet another email sent almost immediately afterwards will get through immediately.

On other occasions messages I have sent do not get delivered EVER, although they show as Sent in both my mail program (Outlook 2016) and on my webmail, which is set to IMAP¡­ and very strangely, when I resend the exact same email (I have just clicked on Forward on it in the Sent Box) usually goes through without a hitch 24 hours later.

I have been battling with my ISP for over 5 months, they say there is nothing wrong at their end. At their request I changed from Windows Live Mail to Outlook 2016, this did not make a scrap of difference.

This past 10 days, I was a little smarter and pasted every delayed mail header in to Word. I also put in ?screen captures of where the ¡°disappeared¡± emails shows as Sent in my IMAP webmail. Each of those show a strange blue curving arrow beside it, it is only beside the ¡°disappeared¡± emails.? When I was speaking AGAIN to the ISP¡¯s tech support, I sent those docs to the person? at the other end of the phone. She agreed that it ¡°shouldn¡¯t be happening¡± and has opened up what she called an ETS¡­ meaning she sent my problem with the documents to a different internal section which checks the servers.. ¡°passing it up the line¡±. I don¡¯t know how long this will take for them to check it out and hopefully resolve the problem.

Maybe it is something in your mail program (although mine has been checked many times), but it is more than likely something similar to a spam checking server problem.

Stick with it, get in touch with the ISP¡­ supply documentation if possible¡­ and do not let them fob you off¡­ if you can prove that it is held up at the same place, they will HAVE to check it out, but don¡¯t hold your breath while waiting¡­ lol.

One thing I noted, I don¡¯t know if this applies to you¡­ pretty well every disappeared email had an attachment of a graphic, but they are not large files, the biggest would have been less than 400 KB. The delayed emails mostly have a very small jpg inserted in to the body of the email¡­ every email is HTML..

I hope this may give you a direction to consider¡­ and I wish you good luck in resolving your problem.

In desperation, I have told them that if they can¡¯t fix the problem, I will pass it on to the Telecommunication Ombudsman

Win

?

From: [email protected] <[email protected]> On Behalf Of dgrass1@...
Sent: Wednesday, 31 October 2018 1:43 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [GMF] Mysterious Email Problem

?

I'm still going to contact my ISP, but I thought I would update this slow down of emails using the analyzer.

Many emails get slowed down for as much as three days going from ec2-35-174-158-239.compute-1.amazonaws.com to?mx.cox.rs.oxcs.net?, and many are also slowed down from?web01.groups.io to?cmsmtp ...the last one for four days.

Don

 

Shal,

I've contacted support at Groups.io about this, and I'm just waiting for a response. I also contacted my ISP today, and they don't think it is their problem...but they didn't seem very knowledgeable. I may try again with the ISP, hoping I get someone that knows more.

WBennett

I am able to stay current on our member postings, by logging into my group and reading the messages, so it's not a huge problem in one respect. I prefer using my email program Outlook, but I can work with checking into my group too.?At first I thought the problem was with my ISP (cox.com), but now I wondering if the problem is Groups.io.?

Don

?
 

I called my ISP again on Friday the 2nd, and this time I got to talk to a tech person a level higher on cox.com. They gave my problem a ticket number after determining the problem seemed to be on their end, and would probably get back to me again the following Monday...Which they didn't. I called Cox again on Tuesday the 6th for an update, and all they could do is tell their tech people I called back with the same problem. Now the email delays had gone up to 8 days, so I called again on Thursday the 8th. The person I talked to could only tell me they still see the ticket number, and thought I should be some kind of email notification from the tech people by Friday...Which I haven't gotten so far. One thing has changed though, as now the delays are down to 30 hours...We're making some progress!

Don
Jim Higgins
 

Received from dgrass1@... at 11/9/2018 10:43 PM UTC:

The person I talked to could only tell me they still see the ticket number, and thought I should be some kind of email notification from the tech people by Friday...Which I haven't gotten so far.

Unless you get connected to the folks "higher up" before asking about the status of the ticket, you run a high likelihood of getting the same runaround you got initially. And if you do get them, remind them that Gio is an email list service like YahooGroups. Until someone realizes that, the problem will probably continue.

Jim H
 

The problem according to a level 2 tech at cox.net is I am black listed by Spamhaus.east.cox.net, and they are going to hand this problem over to their engineers, and thought they might be able to solve this¡­It has to do with reputation. I contacted Mark at support about this also, to see if he might be able to solve this on his end. I'll know how this works out on the 15th, when I have an appointment to talk to that tech again.

Don

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