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Hi Bill, Have a look here for ideas about how many filaments you might need http://lerch.no-ip.com/atm/Filaments.htm James has a downloadable program on there in a zip file that simulates the coating thickness for a given diameter of mirror at a certain distance from so many evaporative emitters. A very useful tool. There is also a rule of thumb for using a single emitter. Something like you have to have the emitter so many mirror diameters from the surface of the mirror to get a reasonably even coating across the entire face. Maybe somebody will chime in with the number of diameters of spacing needed. (mistake?) so maybe I don't need that much power. Your thoughts always Roy M.

Hi Bill & ball, Thanks for the info on the stuff I'm seeing in your photos. I think it's good to see how others solve problems. I think you will do fine with one emitter for the size of bell jar you have. If not you can add more later. Cutting the secondary winding off a MOT is very easy. Get a sharp wood chisle and a small mallet or hammer. Start by chopping off the outer edge of the windings and then work towards the core. A sharp steel wood chisle cuts through the thin copper wire windings like butter. When you get the exposed end of the coil cut flush with the core take a piece of wood or metal and use it to punch the rest of the coil out of the core with a hammer. Make sure you are cutting off the correct coil. The one with the thin wire is the secondary that we don't need. There may be another winding of just a few turns in with the secondary winding. This is a filament winding for the magnetron. We do not need that winding. The primary will have heavier windings and be careful so you do not damage the primary. Just take your time. It helps if you can put the transformer in a vice and position it so it's easy to work on. There will be sections of laminated steel between the primary and secondary windings. These are shunts and are needed so do not remove these either. I'm going to try some clear Poly Tape I got from Ace Hardware to insulate the copper strips. Two layers should do it. I got the idea to use the flat copper strips for secondary windings from http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/edsworkshp/?yguid=228106037 he indicates they work well. Here is the write-up from his files section: xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx REWINDING MOT'S FOR LOW VOLTAGE FOR HIGH CURRENT PROJECTS-BATTERY CHARGERS-FILAMENT HEATERS- ELECTROPLATING-SPOT WELDERS- ECT. To rewind an old microwave transformer make sure the primary winding is good and not damaged during rewinding now saw off one side of the secondary the smaller wire I used a bandsaw and press or drive it out with a drift or wooden dowel. Take out the mica hv insulation for more room for the new winding. The mot in the photo has 1 3/8 inch slot I used 1 ? by .025 copper 8 feet long that gave 9 turns with 2 layers of clear shipping tape [mylar] for insulation . You will get 1.06 volt per turn the larger the wire the higher the current this winding will give 145 amp And 9.61 volt under no load With out to much heating with 20 amp input at 120 volt ac. Under full load Will give 8 volt and a full wave bridge rectifier will drop the voltage another 1.7 volt 6.3 volt final output. A cheap light dimmer will not controll this the induction feed back will burnout the triac but if you have a microwave that the transformer came from it has a 45 amp triac in it that controls the mot for the magnatron that can repace the one in a cheap dimmer Ihave made several of these I use one on my electric metal melting furnace.I used copper flat metal because heavy wire is very hard to wind around the core you can saw or gring the weld on the core remove the primary and secondary but they are hard to replace and have to be tig welded back, also aluminum will work almost as well like the kind used for trim work on vinyl on metal siding, I do siding and most of those guy have narrow strips left from where they cut trim for the facia and window areas and will be happy to give you some. I get my copper from the metal salvage yard they have a ben in side with copper scrap it is about $1.45 pound 1 pound will do a mot. By ed ward edsworkshp xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Good Luck!! Roy <williambelisle2003@...> wrote: of glass to see how well they would be aluminized. They're not mounted to the base plate - just sitting on it. And no, they aren't insulated (for high voltage) nor are they glow bars. Those will come later (with any luck). The smaller metal disks you see in the photos are just stainless blanks to close holes in the baseplate. point where I have the transformer ready to cut off the HV winding, but am not sure how t

Hey Bill, What are those metal bars that mount on the base plate? Some sort of support for something to be metalized? Or glow bars? They don't look insulated for HV coming out of those big metal hockey pucks. Also I found another smaller (800 Watts) microwave oven. I have the transformer prepared for the new secondary winding. I have some copper flashing I cut into strips to use for the secondary winding. Roy M.

Hi, I am new to the group and have just finished building a vacuum chamber for aluminizing mirrors. I had a few questions I was hoping someone could answer. I started using very fine tungsten filaments from quartz light bulbs, but read that the aluminum dissolves into the tungsten, making it brittle and causing it to burn out. I then got some tungsten filaments from Southwest Tungsten's orphan bin, but the variac I was using is not powerful enough to make the filament anything more than mildly hot -- it doesn't even glow. I saw that someone had posted a schematic for a triac power supply but was hoping for a simpler solution (although, if anyone has built one I would love to hear from them). This site shows a large battery charger controlled with a variac to heat the filament: http://www.geocities.com/natsp2000/Aluminizing2.html Has anyone tried this? What about using an inexpensive welder? I will post photos of the chamber in the Photos section if anyone is interested. Best regards, Bill Belisle

Hello Bill & all, I added 7 pics of the MOT I rewound to use as a filament supply. See them at http://ph.groups.yahoo.com/group/VacuumX/photos/browse/3865 file name: Homebrew High Vacuum System Roy M. As noted before the rewound secondary is 4 turns of #6 stranded wire. At 100 Amps six .020 inch. tungsten filaments start to smoke and oxidize through quickly in air. Modified MOT was powered by 10 Amp Powerstat allowing 7 Amps to primary winding of MOT. I have also tested to destruction six 3/32 inch SS wire filaments @ 150-175 Amps. There is more information about the MOT in message 3006. One like it would work fine for your system Bill. Roy

Hi Bill, Yes please post pictures of your system, lots of pictures!! Thanks, Roy M. <williambelisle2003@...> wrote: chamber quartz tungsten solution heat

Drew, Sent you an email today at your NASA address, you probably didn't see it as you didn't call me. Info for you follows: UPS tracking numbers... Box 1, 3 pounds 9X9X9 inches Contains SCR controller #1z752X100374462252 Box 2, 33 pounds, 20X21X10 inches Contains XMS controller and all other goodies. #1z752X100307795724 Sent to the 1685 address found on your web page. Should be there Wednesday. Call me when it arrives and I'll walk you through the setup. Ken

Anybody have one of these?? http://www.orau.org/ptp/collection/spinthariscopes/ring.htm Roy M.

Yes like a Spinthariscope http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spinthariscope http://www.lateralscience.co.uk/spin/index.html I have a small sheet of plastic film coated with zinc sulphide. I have used it to watch the energetic reaction of alpha particles from and Americium 241 source hitting the zinc sulphide crystals. One could make a magnified viewer to place against the viewing window of the bell chamber to get an estimate of the x-ray flux reacting with the zinc sulphide or a piece of fluorescent plastic much like a scintillation counter. Roy M. wrote: make a change to think made of why the and to more discharge current that high risk.

Hey Andrew, What Voltage and Amperage is your glow discharge transformer? Also how are the HV electrodes set up? Do you have the two HV terminals from a neon sign transformer connected to the glow bars (whiskers) and the chamber grounded? How do you have the whiskers arranged in the chamber? How far are they from the surfaces to be coated? Thanks, Roy M. AEROSPACE]" <andrew.n.aurigema@...> wrote: voltage

Hello group, I found this interesting site for the DDO operated by the University of Toronto. Good pics of their mirror coating system, big vacuum bell, diff. pump etc. http://www.astro.utoronto.ca/DDO/instruments/Aluminizing.html Roy M.

Hi all, My D150 is weeping oil so it looks like I need a seal. I find minor and major kits on the web along with individual service parts but cannot find a manual. Does any one happen to have one they could copy for me or have a source for one. Or any advice before I crack the case. From the list of parts I have seen I don't want them to spray all over the room like a broken clock when I take it apart. Thanks for the help. Russell in Chuluota, Florida

O2 for thin film formation Hey Guys, Has anybody heard of putting a puff of pure O2 ( oxygen ) into the vacuum chamber after all the aluminizing is done so that a pure ALO3 coating can form for a few atoms thick ??? This would be after the high vac systems are all isolated and all the power is turned off ( right before I would normally open the chamber door ). Maybe for 12 or 24 hours of O2 soak ?????? If you have, and this magic is real can you let me know what the formula is ??? I don’t like the idea of putting O2 in the chamber but if the vacuum is still pretty hard then there should not be a problem. Thanks Andrew in soggy Florida

I don't understand why you all have to ask the wife if you can build a fusor or anything else. At MY HOUSE, my wife let's me be the boss... ;0) Ken Hunter

VacuumX Group, Thomas, Andrew I have finished the design and construction of the XTAL Oscillator for the Modified XMS Controllers. I posted a .JPG of the schematic for the oscillator in my Files folder for the Group if anyone else is interested. I will make a drawing of the modifications that I made to the XMS Controllers later. Thomas... I will need to send you the details of the modification and the parts for your controller. I think we left it modified differently and I want to make sure that both (all) end up the same to make sure we only have one version of the modification in the field. You should be able to make the changes there in Australia yourself. Please describe the modifications I made to your unit as I have lost the drawing I made. I think I put 2 Banana Jacks for the external memory battery and a few more for the proposed oscillator (+12 and -12 volts I think). The oscillator I designed uses only the +12 volts and it is fed (as well as the output signal from the oscillator) via the one BNC connector (a little bit of RF Magic). I'll need you to verify your shipping address again. I know you have been moving about a bit. Drew... I'll be ready to ship your unit out as soon as I get a chance to test it all together. Eager to hear how it works in a vacuum. Long weekend! Ken Hunter

Hi Drew That looks interesting! Talk about a smoking hole in the ground... Knowing Thomas the way I do, won't be long before he starts looking on eBay for chemicals that glow in the dark.. Don't know if I can re- mail them over to him in Aus or not. Thomas, better check before bidding! No progress this weekend on the XMS stuff. Wife had other plans that "we discussed" Friday after work. At least that is when I found out about them. Still have a couple of days work (might take all week or more all spread out and such) to do then will be on the way. Ken AEROSPACE]" <andrew.n.aurigema@...> wrote:

Hmmm... If I can't bring any "Texas Twisters", my wife and I can't come. We are members of the "Texas Twisters" square dance club and it even says so on our name badges. Well, by then we might be somewhere else anyway so we'll have to see what happens in the meantime. Ken AEROSPACE]" <andrew.n.aurigema@...> wrote: of

Hello, This email message is a notification to let you know that a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the VacuumX group. File : /atm_ken_hunter files/Crystal Oscillator[1].jpg Uploaded by : atm_ken_hunter <atm_ken_hunter@...> Description : Oscillator for Modified XMS Deposition Controller You can access this file at the URL: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/VacuumX/files/atm_ken_hunter%20files/Crystal%20Oscillator%5B1%5D.jpg To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit: http://help.yahoo.com/l/us/yahoo/groups/original/members/web/index.htmlfiles Regards, atm_ken_hunter <atm_ken_hunter@...>

crazy edeal probaly but for a beginner what kind of vacuum can be done whit AC pump from a car I scrap my nissan access and maybe the AC pump can do the beginning of the job after go to the sofisticated pump and chamber to oul pump just and interrogation I like to read your aventureI am retired from optic costing equipment or jack of all trail jack 47'n 71'W

Hey Gang, I bought 200 "preloaded" tungsten coils from Midwest Tungsten' orphin bin and they seem to work fine. They were something like 14 cent each and had the aluminum in the center of a tri-braid of 0.025" dia wires. Total lengh of wire under amperage was 2" and they headed up well and coated out well. I have burned about 10 of them now and there is a trick. you have to ramp up slowly. dull red first for a few seconds then red then cherry red then real power. That 10 seconds dont count towards the 10 seconds you need to exhaust the aluminum from them. I have 36 of these emitters now in my chamber and will be running a "re-use" test tonight. I dont see why I cant hang a little 120mg aluminum cane in the coil and bring up the power. if that works, then I got a way to use up the 3,000 aluminum canes I got by mistake. They are too much metal for a single wire but maybe just right for this much tungsten coil. Just thought I would let you know that the orphin bin is an amazing place to find stuff cheap. Andrew in soggy Florida. From: VacuumX@... [mailto:VacuumX@...] On Behalf Of Ken Hunter Sent: Friday, August 08, 2008 10:36 AM To: VacuumX@... Subject: [VacuumX] Re: Aluminizing coating has a black tinge Hello Joe, Welcome to VacuumX! Try looking through the past posts and the resources to the left side of the Groups main page. There are a lot of hits if you search for "black coating" Here's a snip from message 237. It may not be your problem but there's a lot more to read about this subject. * If you find yourself having "black" coatings, try implementing a third "Pre-Heat" option. I recently ran into a string of failed coatings. While I had originally thoughtthe problem was contamination, I now believe the problem was a result of my rapidly heating the filaments up due to a lack of humor and the resulting impatience that followed. The work around for the string of failed coatings has been a more controlled ramping up of filament tempature instead of my "frustrated, full throttle, get it done" approach I had during my string of failures... :) My supposition is that while loading the filaments, some contamination is inevitable. A pre-heat session boils off the contaminents and gives the pumps a chance to remove the material from the chamber enviroment. Another possibility is the pre-heat and slow ramp up allows for an opportunity for the removal of residual H20 that clings to the surfaces inside the chamber. In any event, while not an expert, I do know that gentle application of filament power produces a nice coating. A rapid "get it done" application of filament power results in a non-reflective flat black coating :0 * Also search for "discharge cleaning", Off hand, I'd think you'll need a bit deeper vacuum in the chamber to get consistent results... Again, Welcome to VacuumX ! Ken Hunter