|
Whatever the reason for the delays, it finally has stopped! It's been two days now, and I'm glad to announce everything is working like normal again.
Don
|
Tonight when I open my mail program there were over 90 emails downloaded, and 85 of them were from my group and GMF. All of them were delayed, until I got to the last one, and that was only seconds old. I sent an email to my group tonight, and I got a copy of it back almost instantly! That's the fastest I'm gotten email from Groups.io since this problem happened back around October 21st, and I'm crossing my finger Cox has fixed this issue.
Don
|
|
|
The scheduled phone call from Cox never came, so I think I'll call Cox and get some more information from them about resetting my IP address...Maybe they might need to be involved in this.
I still keep getting delayed emails from my group and GMF (Sometimes only hours old instead of days), and this is making me wonder abut something. If I was blacklisted would I still get delayed emails (even my own) from my group and GMF?
Don
|
Received from dgrass1@... at 11/15/2018 12:15 AM UTC: I thought when an invite was sent, the person it was sent to could click on a link in the email invite that would tell me they did not want to join. Invitees are told that to decline the invitation they should just ignore it. Standard advice when receiving spam is to never click any links in the spam, not even an unsubscribe link. Responding, even if to tell them to drop dead, tells them that the address is deliverable. I have been in communication with Cox about this, and tomorrow I have a scheduled phone call with a level 2 person to find out what they have been able to do...or not do. Excellent. Perhaps they can explain exactly what the issue is. The error message (if I recall correctly) isn't very helpful. A better explanation may help Groups.io correct the problem for all Cox subscribers. Good luck! Jim H
|
Jim,
As soon as I realized that my periodic re-inviting past members might be construed as Spam, I deleted that list of invited people so I couldn't do that again. I thought when an invite was sent, the person it was sent to could click on a link in the email invite that would tell me they did not want to join. I guess that was my mistake to think that.
I have been in communication with Cox about this, and tomorrow I have a scheduled phone call with a level 2 person to find out what they have been able to do...or not do.
I'll check out the link, and think about your last idea.
Thanks,
Don
|
Received from dgrass1@... at 11/13/2018 07:50 AM UTC: This will be a simplistic explanation of what Spamhaus is, but I was told it's a bot type program designed to look for Spammers. It looks for large amounts of emails sent by an entity, and some how makes a determination the entity is a Spammer, then black lists that entity. At least, that's how I understand it. Don, That's basically it, but Spamhaus isn't triggered by a "large amount of email." They maintain many spam trap addresses located on servers all over the world. Since those addresses are unpublished and have never been used or divulged to anyone, no one has any reason to be sending mail to them. So when they do receive mail it tends to be spam. Enough mail from a single IP and that mail gets a manual review and if found to be spam (almost always) the responsible IP gets listed. Along with that listing is a description of the spammer involved (and other info), if it can be determined. Thinking back on things that I have done on my group, I have one idea of what may have caused this problem. I built up a list of people that I have invited over a period of time (All past members of the group at one time), and it had maybe 40 to 50 people on it. About one a month I would use that list of saved invites, and re-invite them again in mass. This may have made me look like a Spammer. What you describe above - which I read as repeatedly reinviting the same past members who didn't accept your invitation to rejoin previously - is definitely spam. I couldn't guess how likely it is to have gotten you black listed... except to say that your IP (68.7.123.231) doesn't appear in any of the common and reputable black lists. As for continuing that practice... by failing to respond those past members are telling you "no" and as in certain other aspects of our lives, "No means no!" You need to contact Cox to try to resolve your problem. It's going to require contact with someone higher than the initial support level. You may find the following helpful. One other thing you can try if you think your IP really is listed is to unplug your modem overnight. That should result in a new dynamic IP when you plug it up the next morning. Some unlucky soul will eventually get your old IP, so if this works you really ought to call Cox and report the problem you had with that IP so they can fix it. Good luck. Jim H
|
Jim,
This will be a simplistic explanation of what Spamhaus is, but I was told it's a bot type program designed to look for Spammers. It looks for large amounts of emails sent by an entity, and some how makes a determination the entity is a Spammer, then black lists that entity. At least, that's how I understand it.
Thinking back on things that I have done on my group, I have one idea of what may have caused this problem. I built up a list of people that I have invited over a period of time (All past members of the group at one time), and it had maybe 40 to 50 people on it. About one a month I would use that list of saved invites, and re-invite them again in mass. This may have made me look like a Spammer.
Don
|
Received from dgrass1@... at 11/13/2018 12:30 AM UTC: The problem according to a level 2 tech at cox.net is I am black listed by Spamhaus.east.cox.net, and they are going to hand this problem over to their engineers, and thought they might be able to solve this¡It has to do with reputation. I contacted Mark at support about this also, to see if he might be able to solve this on his end. I'll know how this works out on the 15th, when I have an appointment to talk to that tech again. The Groups.io mail server is NOT listed by Spamhaus, so the above error message is "interesting" to say the least. Perhaps Cox downloaded a copy of the Spamhaus RBL at some time in the past when Groups.io was listed and hasn't updated that list since. Large ISPs pay for Spamhaus' services and using a local copy of an old list is one way (against terms of service) to avoid ongoing payments... and also a sure way to get false positive spam reports (and false negatives). You might want to ask Cox what Spamhaus.east.cox.net is. I bet it's an internal Cox RBL based on the Spamhaus RBLs and is out of date. Jim H
|
The problem according to a level 2 tech at cox.net is I am black listed by Spamhaus.east.cox.net, and they are going to hand this problem over to their engineers, and thought they might be able to solve this¡It has to do with reputation. I contacted Mark at support about this also, to see if he might be able to solve this on his end. I'll know how this works out on the 15th, when I have an appointment to talk to that tech again.
Don
|
Received from dgrass1@... at 11/9/2018 10:43 PM UTC: The person I talked to could only tell me they still see the ticket number, and thought I should be some kind of email notification from the tech people by Friday...Which I haven't gotten so far. Unless you get connected to the folks "higher up" before asking about the status of the ticket, you run a high likelihood of getting the same runaround you got initially. And if you do get them, remind them that Gio is an email list service like YahooGroups. Until someone realizes that, the problem will probably continue. Jim H
|
I called my ISP again on Friday the 2nd, and this time I got to talk to a tech person a level higher on cox.com. They gave my problem a ticket number after determining the problem seemed to be on their end, and would probably get back to me again the following Monday...Which they didn't. I called Cox again on Tuesday the 6th for an update, and all they could do is tell their tech people I called back with the same problem. Now the email delays had gone up to 8 days, so I called again on Thursday the 8th. The person I talked to could only tell me they still see the ticket number, and thought I should be some kind of email notification from the tech people by Friday...Which I haven't gotten so far. One thing has changed though, as now the delays are down to 30 hours...We're making some progress!
Don
|
Shal, I've contacted support at Groups.io about this, and I'm just waiting for a response. I also contacted my ISP today, and they don't think it is their problem...but they didn't seem very knowledgeable. I may try again with the ISP, hoping I get someone that knows more. WBennett I am able to stay current on our member postings, by logging into my group and reading the messages, so it's not a huge problem in one respect. I prefer using my email program Outlook, but I can work with checking into my group too.?At first I thought the problem was with my ISP (cox.com), but now I wondering if the problem is Groups.io.?
Don
?
|
For what it¡¯s worth Don, you are not alone in your problem, although mine is an Australian ISP. Many of my messages to and from my own group are delayed exactly 2 hours, they are held up at a sub server which checks for spam (I¡¯ve checked this on the header analysis site, always held up at the same place). Something in the headers triggers this Spam alert, yet another email sent almost immediately afterwards will get through immediately. On other occasions messages I have sent do not get delivered EVER, although they show as Sent in both my mail program (Outlook 2016) and on my webmail, which is set to IMAP¡ and very strangely, when I resend the exact same email (I have just clicked on Forward on it in the Sent Box) usually goes through without a hitch 24 hours later. I have been battling with my ISP for over 5 months, they say there is nothing wrong at their end. At their request I changed from Windows Live Mail to Outlook 2016, this did not make a scrap of difference. This past 10 days, I was a little smarter and pasted every delayed mail header in to Word. I also put in ?screen captures of where the ¡°disappeared¡± emails shows as Sent in my IMAP webmail. Each of those show a strange blue curving arrow beside it, it is only beside the ¡°disappeared¡± emails.? When I was speaking AGAIN to the ISP¡¯s tech support, I sent those docs to the person? at the other end of the phone. She agreed that it ¡°shouldn¡¯t be happening¡± and has opened up what she called an ETS¡ meaning she sent my problem with the documents to a different internal section which checks the servers.. ¡°passing it up the line¡±. I don¡¯t know how long this will take for them to check it out and hopefully resolve the problem. Maybe it is something in your mail program (although mine has been checked many times), but it is more than likely something similar to a spam checking server problem. Stick with it, get in touch with the ISP¡ supply documentation if possible¡ and do not let them fob you off¡ if you can prove that it is held up at the same place, they will HAVE to check it out, but don¡¯t hold your breath while waiting¡ lol. One thing I noted, I don¡¯t know if this applies to you¡ pretty well every disappeared email had an attachment of a graphic, but they are not large files, the biggest would have been less than 400 KB. The delayed emails mostly have a very small jpg inserted in to the body of the email¡ every email is HTML.. I hope this may give you a direction to consider¡ and I wish you good luck in resolving your problem. In desperation, I have told them that if they can¡¯t fix the problem, I will pass it on to the Telecommunication Ombudsman Win ?
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
From: [email protected] <[email protected]> On Behalf Of dgrass1@...
Sent: Wednesday, 31 October 2018 1:43 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [GMF] Mysterious Email Problem ? I'm still going to contact my ISP, but I thought I would update this slow down of emails using the analyzer.
Many emails get slowed down for as much as three days going from ec2-35-174-158-239.compute-1.amazonaws.com to?mx.cox.rs.oxcs.net?, and many are also slowed down from?web01.groups.io to?cmsmtp ...the last one for four days.
Don
|
Don, Many emails get slowed down for as much as three days going from
ec2-35-174-158-239.compute-1.amazonaws.com to mx.cox.rs.oxcs.net That's interesting. I think those may be on the /inbound/ side, representing processing within cox before the message was sent to groups.io. But that would only make sense if the sender of the message is also using cox.net. and many are also slowed down from web01.groups.io to cmsmtp ... That's more what I expected, outbound from the group to your inbox. Unfortunately, when the delay is at the hand-off from one service (groups.io) to another (cox.net) you can't be sure if the delay was due to groups.io holding the message before handing it off, or cox.net not accepting the message when first presented. Mark could tell, from his outbound server logs (as could cox, from their inbound logs) but such detailed logs are not generally kept very long, often only one day or less. Shal -- Help: /static/helpMore Help: /g/GroupManagersForum/wikiEven More Help: Search button at the top of Messages list
|
On Tue, Oct 30, 2018 at 08:36 PM, Jim Higgins wrote:
post the raw results of the analysis, or preferably the complete original headers
That's discouraged on this group because it has public archives.? No sense allowing easy access to just anyone. Duane? -- Help: /static/helpGMF's Wiki: /g/GroupManagersForum/wikiSearch button at the top of Messages list A few site FAQs: /static/pricing#frequently-asked-questions
|
Received from dgrass1@... at 10/30/2018 03:43 PM UTC: I'm still going to contact my ISP, but I thought I would update this slow down of emails using the analyzer.
Many emails get slowed down for as much as three days going from ec2-35-174-158-239.compute-1.amazonaws.com to mx.cox.rs.oxcs.net, and many are also slowed down from web01.groups.io to cmsmtp ...the last one for four days. This info would be much more informative, and subject to further analysis, if you would post the raw results of the analysis, or preferably the complete original headers. Jim H
|
I'm still going to contact my ISP, but I thought I would update this slow down of emails using the analyzer.
Many emails get slowed down for as much as three days going from ec2-35-174-158-239.compute-1.amazonaws.com to?mx.cox.rs.oxcs.net?, and many are also slowed down from?web01.groups.io to?cmsmtp ...the last one for four days.
Don
|
I used the analyzer, and it showed my ISP holding up the email that took almost three days to get to me. I'll have to contact my ISP about the problems I'm experiencing, and maybe I can get something resolved. If I do get this fixed through the ISP, I'll let you all know how it went.
Don
|
On Mon, Oct 29, 2018 at 08:22 PM, <dgrass1@...> wrote:
I just today got an email I sent to my group last Saturday, so that's about a three day lag.
See this message on an email header analyzer that can tell you very quickly where the message was held up.? Hope this helps, Bruce? -- The system Help is your friend.?? /static/help
|
Don Grass
Duane
Shal Farley
Bruce Bowman