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I have a user who is "BOUNCED"
I send a "bounce probe" ... hoping that this is the solution !
question:
How long it takes to unbounce this user
thanks
?
Francois moderator
[irrelevant animated signature removed]
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On Wed, Feb 16, 2022 at 12:30 PM, F1CHF wrote:
How long it takes to unbounce this user
Until they click on the link.? I've had some members that wait too long and the link expires so I have to send them another.? A few have never gotten back into the group. Duane -- Lots of detailed information can be found in the Owners Manual and Members Manual.
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I follow up to Bruce's option. There's also a link in their subscription page, if they are bouncing, and they can click on that as well. They don't necessarily have to click on the link in the email. If you get in touch with them privately, let them know of the website and the email me a login link option. That is the only way that they will see these particular options.
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On Feb 16, 2022, at 11:56 AM, F1CHF < F1CHF@...> wrote:
I have a user who is "BOUNCED"
I send a "bounce probe" ... hoping that this is the solution !
question:
How long it takes to unbounce this user
thanks
?
Francois moderator
[irrelevant animated signature removed]
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...
I don't understand why the user
has to click on something for
the "Unbounce" to work... There
should be a way for the Group
Owner himself unbounce the user,
p.e. just by the act of sending
the probe and it return "message
delivered without errors".
(at least for the first attempt
made by the owner, per user).
If the user wants to leave the
group, use the option to leave
instead.
[ ] Rubens
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On Wed, Feb 16, 2022 at 05:35 PM, Rubens wrote:
I don't understand why the user
has to click on something for
the "Unbounce" to work
Because that's the way Mark programmed it.? Others have asked that just sending the probe without error be enough, but nothing has changed.? Besides, it's the member's email service that's causing the problem, so unless they get something changed on their end, they'll go back to bouncing. Duane -- Lots of detailed information can be found in the Owners Manual and Members Manual.
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...
RA| I don't understand why the user
| has to click on something for
| the "Unbounce" to work
Du| Because that's the way Mark programmed it.
Right. But I still don't understand why.
Du| Besides, it's the member's email
| service that's causing the problem,
| so unless they get something changed
| on their end, they'll go back to
| bouncing.
Right. But still, the simple fact
that I, the user, click on a link
or not, has nothing to do with my
email service having "fixed"
something or not...
So, this is hardly an argument.
(I just would like to know WHY
it's done this way)
[ ] Rubens
.
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hello, let me add some inputs about this BOUNCE question first, the "bounced" guy receive a message (banner) in english, most of them do not really underststand ! question : is there a "banner editor" to put this message in French ? and it is clear that most of them have no idea on their userID and Password to be logged on Group IO !! hi .... I come from the owner manual and I see ..
The affected members are notified that they are Bouncing or Bounced. They are given a chance to “unbounce” their accounts through a banner that is displayed at the top of the Groups.io site whenever they are logged in.
! Important:?Group owners and moderators cannot do anything to “unbounce” members’ accounts. Members must address the underlying problem themselves.
question: so I can do nothing for them ? what is the function of the Bounce Probe ?,?
thanks in advance for your help
francois (moderator)
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On Thu, Feb 17, 2022 at 06:06 AM, Rubens wrote:
(I just would like to know WHY
it's done this way)
Rubens -- All anyone here can offer is their own speculation. My guess is the simple delivery is insufficient proof that there's a real human being on the other end. As an example, an email account can remain active years after someone has died. It takes system resources to continue to send messages to such dead-end accounts. But again, that's my own opinion. If you want a real answer you'll have to ask Mark in the beta group. Better yet, post your counter-proposal as a suggestion. Regards, Bruce
Check out the groups.io Help Center?and?groups.io Owners Manual
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On Thu, Feb 17, 2022 at 06:06 AM, F1CHF wrote:
first, the "bounced" guy receive a message (banner) in english, most of them do not really underststand !
question : is there a "banner editor" to put this message in French ?
Unfortunately, alternate languages is not an available feature. Customization of the bounce probe email with Owner-inserted text (similar to the Invite type of Member Notice) might be a good suggestion for the beta group (https://beta.groups.io/g/main).
and it is clear that most of them have no idea on their userID and Password to be logged on Group IO !! hi ....
I come from the owner manual and I see ..
The affected members are notified that they are Bouncing or Bounced. They are given a chance to “unbounce” their accounts through a banner that is displayed at the top of the Groups.io site whenever they are logged in.
Correct. In lieu of responding to the emailed bounce probe, they can click on the red banner that appears when they log in.
! Important:?Group owners and moderators cannot do anything to “unbounce” members’ accounts. Members must address the underlying problem themselves.
question: so I can do nothing for them ? what is the function of the Bounce Probe ?,?
The bounce probe provides a means to unbounce their accounts by email, without having to log in. As to what you can do:? You can contact them ahead of time, let them know that a bounce probe is coming, and what they need to do to respond to it. Of course, all of this assumes that you might actually have any more success emailing these people than groups.io has been experiencing. This may not be as satisfactory as sending the probe in French, but it's certainly better than doing nothing. Regards, Bruce
Check out the groups.io Help Center?and?groups.io Owners Manual
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My understanding is some of the behaviors that require a true human response is part of the legislated rules
to make groups.io a valid email list server as opposed to a bot powered spam list. That's why to join the user
has to acknowledge they want to be on the list and some other details. Most of that came from the EU as I
understand it but most other countries followed it.
-Ken Cameron, Member JMRI Dev Team
www.jmri.org
www.fingerlakeslivesteamers.org
www.cnymod.com
www.syracusemodelrr.org
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...
Ru| (I just would like to know WHY
| it's done this way)
BB| If you want a real answer you'll
| have to ask Mark in the beta group.
Oops!... Sorry, I didn't notice
that I wasn't in the beta group...
It's because my email reader has
a rule that put all the messages
of both groups in the same folder.
My fault.
[ ] Rubens
.
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Hello Bruce
you said
The bounce probe provides a means to unbounce their accounts by email, without having to log in.
As to what you can do:? You can contact them ahead of time, let them know that a bounce probe is coming, and what they need to do to respond to it. Of course, all of this assumes that you might actually have any more success emailing these people than groups.io has been experiencing.
As I am not super fluent in English
May I translate it to :
hello guy, I have done a bounce probe on your account, please respond to it to unbounce your account ?
?
I have done this action (see at the end) ?and the guy said ... NO he receive nothing !
?
by the way, I try to send me a message (test message)? for the moment I didn't receive it ...
?
so something is wrong ... me or the application ...
thanks for your help
[irrelevant signature removed]
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-------Message original-------
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Date : 17/02/2022 12:26:58
Sujet : Re: [GMF] how long it takes to UNBOUNCE ?
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On Thu, Feb 17, 2022 at 06:06 AM, F1CHF wrote:
first, the "bounced" guy receive a message (banner) in english, most of them do not really underststand !
question : is there a "banner editor" to put this message in French ?
Unfortunately, alternate languages is not an available feature. Customization of the bounce probe email with Owner-inserted text (similar to the Invite type of Member Notice) might be a good suggestion for the beta group (https://beta.groups.io/g/main).
and it is clear that most of them have no idea on their userID and Password to be logged on Group IO !! hi .... I come from the owner manual and I see ..
The affected members are notified that they are Bouncing or Bounced. They are given a chance to “unbounce” their accounts through a banner that is displayed at the top of the Groups.io site whenever they are logged in.
Correct. In lieu of responding to the emailed bounce probe, they can click on the red banner that appears when they log in.
! Important:?Group owners and moderators cannot do anything to “unbounce” members’ accounts. Members must address the underlying problem themselves.
question: so I can do nothing for them ? what is the function of the Bounce Probe ?,?
The bounce probe provides a means to unbounce their accounts by email, without having to log in. As to what you can do:? You can contact them ahead of time, let them know that a bounce probe is coming, and what they need to do to respond to it. Of course, all of this assumes that you might actually have any more success emailing these people than groups.io has been experiencing. This may not be as satisfactory as sending the probe in French, but it's certainly better than doing nothing. Regards, Bruce
Check out the groups.io Help Center?and?groups.io Owners Manual
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On Thu, Feb 17, 2022 at 01:56 PM, F1CHF wrote:
hello guy, I have done a bounce probe on your account, please respond to it to unbounce your account ?
Yes, something like that. Better to notify him before you send the probe.
I have done this action (see at the end) ?and the guy said ... NO he receive nothing !
That's entirely possible. Some providers just seem to have a problem with groups.io, or groups.io may have ended up on his provider's blacklist for some reason. Has he checked his Spam or Junk mail folder? The probe could have landed there. Did you check his Email Delivery History? If the bounce probe you sent actually bounced, the delivery history should say so Generally, it you haven't read the system help section on Bouncing members, now would be a good time to do it: /helpcenter/ownersmanual/1/managing-members/checking-for-bouncing-members?It would also be helpful to know what provider he is using. Otherwise, we are kinda left to guess what's going on.
by the way, I try to send me a message (test message)? for the moment I didn't receive it ...
?
so something is wrong ... me or the application ...
Email providers will often bounce any brief message with "test" in the subject line.? It's possible that the groups.io application is having a problem of some sort. However, I would have expected more people to be reporting it. Hope this helps, Bruce
Check out the groups.io Help Center?and?groups.io Owners Manual
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On Thu, Feb 17, 2022 at 01:56 PM, F1CHF wrote:
NO he receive nothing !
I should also mention he needs to actually click on the link in the bounce probe email. Simply replying to it will not work. There is a PDF file with an example bounce probe email in this group's files area? /g/GroupManagersForum/files? My guess is that the probe email got diverted to his spam/junk folder and he hasn't bothered to check there. But that's just a guess. Regards, Bruce
Check out the groups.io Help Center?and?groups.io Owners Manual
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I thought perhaps my method of handling this problem would be of help to others who find themselves stymied by trying to explain what has happened to someone languishing on the "Bounced" list. I send this to the person:
I received the notice that you had been unsubscribed because of a spam identification.? Thought I'd explain why and how this happens and how to avoid it.? It's a pain in the neck, but the problem is a result of the fact that spammers love to get on lists to spread their junk.? The ISPs (yours would be [fill in their carrier]) have spam filters that will remove what they think might be spam and put it in your spam folder, all without you knowing that it happened. (Yahoo and AOL are among the worst at labeling valid emails as spam.)? Obviously, you can accidentally click on spam also which has the same effect.? When this happens, the ISP will notify groups.io (our list providing service) that they are disseminating spam and ask that the member who objected to the spam be removed from their list. ? Groups.io, in an attempt to be good citizens of the internet will remove the member, but realizing that this is more often a mistake than an actual occurrence of spam, they send the email you received with the link to be put back on the list.? I am grateful that they do this so our members don't miss out without even knowing what happened to their account. I hope you will take advantage of this opportunity.
So, Okay, here's the simplest way to avoid getting into this fix to begin with:
1. Try to be very careful when you're through with a message from a group.? Click "Delete" to dispose of it, and never "Spam" or "Junk".? If you realize you have accidentally hit one of those, then go into that folder ("Spam" or "Junk") and mark it as "OK"; then delete it.
2.? Visit your ISP's web site to check your spam folder with some regularity.? I try to do mine at least every other day. If you do find something in your spam folder, be sure to select it and then click "OK" which will remove it from your spam folder.
Cacky
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That reason seems unlikely. There could be accounts that have not been bounced but the owner is dead. They would continue to receive e-mails forever.
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Having just gone through this bouncing issue for the first time, I could suggest the reason people do not respond.
In this case, my club uses groups.io to handle a mailing list. No-one actually logs in to groups.io - they just receive e-mails with the name of the club in the Subject line. They have no idea that groups.io is behind this.
The bounce probe does not mention the name of the group. The subject line looks remarkably like a junk mail message, just one of the dozens people receive every day. They delete it without reading any more than the subject line. Even when you warn them in advance it is coming, they still do not recognise it.
I am at the point of removing them from the group then inviting them again, because at least then the name of the group appears in the subject line so they will recognise it.
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On Wed, Feb 23, 2022 at 07:36 AM, David M wrote:
The bounce probe does not mention the name of the group.
David -- Well, it actually does. All affected groups are listed in the body of the message. An example bounce probe can be found in the Files area here? /g/GroupManagersForum/files/Bounce%20probe%20example.pdf?
The subject line looks remarkably like a junk mail message, just one of the dozens people receive every day. They delete it without reading any more than the subject line. Even when you warn them in advance it is coming, they still do not recognise it.
Bouncing is an account status, not a subscription status. If messages cannot be delivered, it affects every group that account/email address may be subscribed to. I'm interested in how groups.io is to know which group it needs to put in the subject line. Perhaps it should send a bounce probe for every group they're subscribed to? In my own case that would be 16 separate bounce probes. If you have a suggestion on how to remedy this, we can "bounce" some ideas around here. :-)? But ultimately, it will have to be posted to . ? Regards, Bruce
Check out the groups.io Help Center?and?groups.io Owners Manual
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F1CHF
Duane
Bruce
Ken Cameron