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Re: long term viability
?Peter,?
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?So would the rest of us, I imagine.
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On the one hand what you're asking is a fair question, on the other it is unanswerable - by any service.
?
Its financial viability rests on its business model. I think having monthly and yearly subscribers gives it a more stable revenue base than might readily be achieved by an advertising-based model. And it is certainly more attractive to those of us who are less than thrilled about having our information tracked and sold by all of the "free" web services out there.
?
As to its future management, all I can say is that it is owned by someone for whom this is a passion project - he's unlikely to transfer it into uncaring hands. He already did that once, when Yahoo bought his prior email list service, and is dismayed by the consequences. At the bottom of any page click on About then take the link to the .
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To be fair though, the early history of Yahoo Groups did not uncaring management. At least up until 2007 or so its leadership definitely cared for the product and were working to make it thrive. But that's history now.
?
Shal
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Re: Uggh and I was Liking Groups.io
Shal, ? I knew what you said about Mark not getting any of this before you said it, so I already expressed my view to him through Support, and that¡¯s probably all I¡¯ll have to say on this. ? Don ? From: [email protected] <[email protected]> On Behalf Of Shal Farley
Sent: Wednesday, July 25, 2018 2:01 PM To: GMF <[email protected]> Subject: Re: [GMF] Uggh and I was Liking Groups.io ? Before this line of discussion goes any further let's remember that Mark is not here to hear any of this, so advising him on his choices amounts to little more than rhetorical itch-scratching. The relationship to how members here run their groups seems tangential at best. ? Shal ?
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Re: Uggh and I was Liking Groups.io
?Don wrote:
?jonathon wrote: As a want-to-be consultant, my recommendation would be Before this line of discussion goes any further let's remember that Mark is not here to hear any of this, so advising him on his choices amounts to little more than rhetorical itch-scratching. The relationship to how members here run their groups seems tangential at best. Shal -- Help: /static/help More Help: /g/GroupManagersForum/wiki Even More Help: Search button at the top of Messages list |
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Re: Uggh and I was Liking Groups.io
¿ªÔÆÌåÓý¡°All things considered though,? I think I'm okay with the discount on Groups.IO.?? And, perhaps it should be extended to Charities and Environmental Protection groups as well.¡± ? With that reasoning don¡¯t you think discounts should apply to all groups of different thought? ? Don |
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Re: Uggh and I was Liking Groups.io
Dan, At the risk of getting flamed and being called names, ?That's why this topic terrifies me as a moderator. I think it is essential to GMF's mission that no one feel excluded or belittled when they come here seeking help running their group(s). So an often divisive issue such as political beliefs is treacherous. I did consider not approving the original post, on the principle that no one's political beliefs, not even Mark Fletcher's, are on-topic here. But ultimately I decided that because the message does appear on site I couldn't simply ignore it. Time will tell if that was an error in judgement. ? In recent years, the Supreme court has decided that establishing business practices that favor or disfavor groups of people based on the owner's set of beliefs is valid and is a form of free speech ?Specifically religious beliefs, which I think makes that case qualitatively different than Mark's discount. Protecting the expression of one's religious beliefs have a special place in U.S. law, which goes back to the founding of the nation.? However, I'm divided on my opinion as to whether or not businesses? should or should not exercise that "right".? On one side, it really smacks of discrimination to say "you can buy my product but you can't".? Or, you get a discount and you don't. ?I'm personally a believer in E pluribus unum? - the ideal that we are together citizens first, and members of religious, ethinic, political, and other subgroups second. That does not mean that our differences should be ignored or suppressed, but that we should not allow those differences to prevent us from living and working together peaceably. Shal -- Help: /static/help More Help: /g/GroupManagersForum/wiki Even More Help: Search button at the top of Messages list |
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Re: clarification on direct add feature
Al,
?
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?Yes, if you Invite or Direct Add more than 20 addresses in a 24-hour period.
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?The "why" is spammers, the "how long" is indeterminate - it is a manual process.
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In my own experience once approved for an initial Direct Add my later ones were no longer deferred. But I don't know if "my" means me as an individual or if it would apply to any owner/mod of that group. Nor do I know if others would have the same experience.
?In my experience the entire batch was deferred, and then the entire batch added.?
?
?That seems to differ from your report of some being added immediately and others not.
?
I had ?some in the batch not get added because typos made the email address invalid (user2example.com instead of @), and others were added but immediately had Bouncing status - again usually typos in the user name or domain.?
?
?
The form may not handle leading or trailing spaces on the line, I think I ran into that in some cases.
?AFAIK it shouldn't matter. I was working from an Excel spreadsheet and created a column containing
Display Name <user@...>
for? ?each person to be added. I then copied the occupied cells of that column (a couple hundred rows) and pasted it directly into the Direct Add form.? That is, I excluded from the copy Row 1 (which had a column heading) and the empty cells below the bottom row in use.
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Shal
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Re: Uggh and I was Liking Groups.io
Well I'm very surprised to see that also.? However, Mark Fletcher owns groups.io (as far as I know) and if he wishes to offer discounts or deals, it's his right to do so.
This message is only on the pricing page it seems so it's unlikely that members will ever see it. |
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Re: re time for emails to arrive
This message discusses a tool to analyze headers to see delivery delays.? Might be useful to study delayed emails.
Toby |
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Re: re time for emails to arrive
Win, Shal, here are the Return paths for the 2 emails I mention which had been delayed 23 minutes. ?I don't need the Return-Path or Delivered-To fields, but ?I do need more of the Received fields. The three you included were all internal to your ISP and did not show any delay. I hope this is helpful. If there is something else you need, just ask... ?I still anticipate that the delay will be found in the hop from Groups.io to your ISP; which won't really tell us why. But it is still worth looking because we could get a surprise and find the delay at a hop internal to either Groups.io or your ISP. Shal? -- Help: /static/help More Help: /g/GroupManagersForum/wiki Even More Help: Search button at the top of Messages list |
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Re: Uggh and I was Liking Groups.io
While I [redacted] with the posted sentiment of that statement on the pricing page, I have never allowed any political opinions to be posted in my group, and I would never put a politically inflammatory statement on any page of my group. Somethings need to be kept neutral, and I¡¯m very surprised that Mark does not understand that. Is nothing sacred anymore! ? Don G FOGgers
From: [email protected] <[email protected]> On Behalf Of ~mary~
Sent: Tuesday, July 24, 2018 7:39 PM To: [email protected] Subject: [GMF] Uggh and I was Liking Groups.io ? Someone saw this on the Groups.io page.? ? ? "Groups.io has several tiers of service.? They have ?free tier but then they have paid tiers too. ? ? Oh, and at the top of that page: "Is your group associated with Indivisible ()? Is you group dedicated to countering the Trump administration's immoral immigration policies? Please contact support, and we will upgrade your group to Premium for free." ? .... Now what is the other choice for Groups?? Why did they have to get Political???? ? ? ? |
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Re: re time for emails to arrive
Win,
?If you mean that they do not post to the group's Messages page have a look in the group's Activity log to see if they are listed as "attempted to send" (meaning that the message was rejected). ?
?Go to the Subscription page while visiting the group (or click on your row in the group's? Members list) and click onto the Email Delivery History tab. See if anything in the Recent Bounces section lines up with the missing messages.
?That sounds like your ISP is messages from Groups.io.? That's a (dubious in my opinion) anti-spam technique. The Received fields in one of the delayed messages would in that case show that the delay is at the hop between Groups.io's outbound server and your ISP's inbound server.
?It may be technically true that they aren't blocking Messages from Groups.io, but it does sound like they are deferring them.
?See this related topic, start at message #10318. ?
Go back to your ISP and ask if there's a way to whitelist all messages from Groups.io as a sender, or to remove it from greylisting. The other option is to report it to [email protected] along with contact info for your ISP to see if Mark can convince them to "play nice" with Groups.io. Shal? -- Help: /static/help More Help: /g/GroupManagersForum/wiki Even More Help: Search button at the top of Messages list |
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Re: Uggh and I was Liking Groups.io
mary,
I had seen that in a tweet some weeks ago, but I didn't know it had crept into the site. ?I'm not thrilled about seeing politics injected into what I think should be a neutral, or "safe place," that is
welcoming to all. I think a service like Groups.io should thrive or not on its own merits; I hope it doesn't cost him too much business. It is an old saying: having the right to do something does not automatically make it the right thing to do. GMF is not a political forum and I'm not going to approve political debate here; please keep your own politics out of your postings. Note that no one from Groups.io is a member of GMF so if you wish to express your feelings about that offer to Groups.io best to do so directly. Shal ?GMF Owner ? -- Help: /static/help More Help: /g/GroupManagersForum/wiki Even More Help: Search button at the top of Messages list |
Shal Farley
Don Grass
Toby Kraft