Re: Real Bull 7x14 lathe questions?
I'm sure you're right, and that it should read 50 to 1250 in Low, 100 to 2500 in High. Whether there's enough torque at the lower end of either range to be
useful is perhaps questionable.
I understand that the brushless motor on the new super-duper gearless Sieg is better in that respect. It seems to be a grown-up version of the powerful little electric motors used in model aircraft nowadays. I can stall my lathe at low speed easily enough. I haven't seen the new super duper version to be able to make a comparison. Sieg & RB probably use the same motors anyway, I doubt there's much real difference between them performance-wise. Tony
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Re: Real Bull 7x14 lathe questions?
Andy,
I agree with what you say about speeds, my RB is several years old and the two ranges run to 1250 and 2500rpm approx.
The torque at low speed does depend to a considerable extent to how well the control board is set up but it is not as good as the new single speed hi-tech motor versions. One word of warning though, the cooling of the motor fan falls as a square of the speed so at low speed is negligible so it is relatively easy to fry he motor without realising.
As you say the motors and controllers in the top line single speed models are the same as used in the best electric flying models. They exhibit excellent torque even at low speed (which is how they can dispense with the 2 speed ranges in our lathes and mills), I have them in my model helicopters
Gerry W
Leeds UK
To: 7x12minilathe@... From: andyf.1108@... Date: Wed, 6 Feb 2013 11:17:10 +0000 Subject: [7x12minilathe] Re: Real Bull 7x14 lathe questions?
?
I'm sure you're right, and that it should read 50 to 1250 in Low, 100 to 2500 in High. Whether there's enough torque at the lower end of either range to be useful is perhaps questionable.
I understand that the brushless motor on the new super-duper gearless Sieg is better in that respect. It seems to be a grown-up version of the powerful little electric motors used in model aircraft nowadays.
Andy
--- In 7x12minilathe@..., "Tony Smith" wrote:
>
> > Tony, the "new" verion in your second link still has a gearbox, if the
> statement as
> > to spindle speed in the table below the picture is anything to go by. It
> says:
> > "Spindle speed 50-2500/100-2500RPM", which seems to indicate two speed
> > ranges.
>
>
> Seems to be just a bit of Chinglish.
>
> It's not much of gearbox if it only changes between 50 & 100 RPM for the low
> range.
>
> Actually the description on the old version is the same, so it's wrong too.
> Low should be 50-1100 or some like that.
>
> Tony
>
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Re: Real Bull 7x14 lathe questions?
I'm sure you're right, and that it should read 50 to 1250 in Low, 100 to 2500 in High. Whether there's enough torque at the lower end of either range to be useful is perhaps questionable.
I understand that the brushless motor on the new super-duper gearless Sieg is better in that respect. It seems to be a grown-up version of the powerful little electric motors used in model aircraft nowadays.
Andy
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Show quoted text
--- In 7x12minilathe@..., "Tony Smith" wrote:
Tony, the "new" verion in your second link still has a gearbox, if the statement as
to spindle speed in the table below the picture is anything to go by. It says:
"Spindle speed 50-2500/100-2500RPM", which seems to indicate two speed
ranges.
Seems to be just a bit of Chinglish.
It's not much of gearbox if it only changes between 50 & 100 RPM for the low
range.
Actually the description on the old version is the same, so it's wrong too.
Low should be 50-1100 or some like that.
Tony
|
Re: Which lube do you use
Roy wrote......The problem is cast iron swarf is a
powder; there's enough carbon in it that cutting oil would just make a
mess........
?
True, in black/grey cast iron there is enough free
carbon powder to act as a dry lubricant. In prodution machine work, often a
blast of compressed air is used as a 'coolant'.
Cheers.
???????
Ellis
|
Re: Real Bull 7x14 lathe questions?
Tony, the "new" verion in your second link still has a gearbox, if the statement as to spindle speed in the table below the picture is anything to go by. It says: "Spindle speed 50-2500/100-2500RPM", which seems to indicate two speed
ranges. Seems to be just a bit of Chinglish. It's not much of gearbox if it only changes between 50 & 100 RPM for the low range. Actually the description on the old version is the same, so it's wrong too. Low should be 50-1100 or some like that. Tony
|
?
The general rule for lathes and mills is the handwheels (carriage
handwheel on the lathe) should be about elbow height. This is just
a rule of thumb.
?I got a deal on two bar stools, nice black leather padded seats with back rests, where the top of the seat is
~30" tall. For my 5'10" height, this means I do not really lower
my upper body height very much when I sit down on the stools. They
have the usual bar around the four legs for resting your feet on,
and under my lathe there is a box I can use as a foot rest when I
am leaning over the machine to carefully disengage the carriage
feed lever when turning up to a shoulder and such like that.
?If I had to choose, I would prefer a machine to be a little too
low versus too high, since with a machine at or a little below the
elbow height rule, I can see and reach everything easily. Unless
you can stand on your feet for hours without discomfort
(especially after working all day), I would personally recommend
doing whatever it takes with whatever you have to ensure your
maximum comfort over extended periods of time. Small machines take
light cuts and the time can really add up before you know it. In
my case, I will often prefer to stand for a time, but usually end
up sitting after perhaps an hour or so because I need to get off
my damn feet. YMMV. In any case, you are going to spend a large
amount of time working at those little machines,
so simply being comfortable can make all the difference to your
enjoyment, and add quite a bit to your available patience too...
?In my case, working things out so as to be
able to comfortably stand OR sit at each machine for however long
it takes to get something done, became
every bit as serious a consideration as what
kind of machines I bought and what tooling I
use and so forth. Younger and/or healthier folks may vary
widely on their opinions on the
details, but for me, I need to be able
to sit and work as patiently
as something may?require. If I had to stand all the damn time I'd have to
do something else, or do all work in short bursts, or just go fishing instead.
And of course, YMMV, and widely.
?Just my two cents...!
?John Z., York, Pa. USA
On 2/5/2013 8:47 PM, Ebner Heating Air
Conditioning Co. wrote:
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
?
I'm
getting a heavy bench set up to accept my lathe. After
bolting a heavy set of casters that were sized to
accept the 400 pound weight I ended up with a bench
that is to high to comfortably work while sitting on a
stool. My question would be is there a rule of thumb
'height wise" that?I should shoot for? I don't want to
cut the legs off so that the bench ends up to low.
?
Thanks
Mike
|
In article <1360120342.56572.YahooMailClassic@...>, Mark Schwiebert <maschwiebert@...> wrote: I have old eyes,and use the mini, for tiny work,so I have mine high
enough,that I can focus my bi-focals,and #5 opti-visors. But if you are
going to make heavy cuts,you do not want hot chips in your face. The answer to that is to replace your safety glasses or goggles - you DO wear them don't you! - with a full face visor. I have always worn one of these as I find it more comfortable. -- Stuart
|
My own preference is to have the cross slide handle at elbow height.
Andy
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--- In 7x12minilathe@..., "Ebner Heating Air Conditioning Co." wrote:
I'm getting a heavy bench set up to accept my lathe. After bolting a
heavy set of casters that were sized to accept the 400 pound weight I
ended up with a bench that is to high to comfortably work while sitting
on a stool. My question would be is there a rule of thumb 'height wise"
that I should shoot for? I don't want to cut the legs off so that the
bench ends up to low.
Thanks Mike
|
Re: Real Bull 7x14 lathe questions?
Tony, the "new" verion in your second link still has a gearbox, if the statement as to spindle speed in the table below the picture is anything to go by. It says: "Spindle speed 50-2500/100-2500RPM", which seems to indicate two speed ranges.
Andy
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
--- In 7x12minilathe@..., "Tony Smith" wrote:
I'd be slightly wary, Bob. Hitherto, Real Bull mini-lathes have all had two speed
ranges with the usual hi/lo gears.
Of course, it may be that they have decided to produce a version with a
brushless motor and no gearbox, to compete with the one Sieg have produced
and which LMS sells as the Hi-Torque.
If there is a picture on Ebay,look for a nut on the RH end of the leadscrew and a
rectangular saddle. Siegs don't have the nut, and their saddles are H-shaped.
Real Bull have had the 'Super' version of their lathe for a while.
Old: . (I've got
one of these, same colour too).
New:
The chip guard around the toolpost is new. That'll get annoying fast.
Same deal for the mill-mills they make.
Tony
|
Re: Real Bull 7x14 lathe questions?
I'd be slightly wary, Bob. Hitherto, Real Bull mini-lathes have all had two speed ranges with the usual hi/lo gears.
Of course, it may be that they have decided to produce a version with a
brushless motor and no gearbox, to compete with the one Sieg have produced
and which LMS sells as the Hi-Torque.
If there is a picture on Ebay,look for a nut on the RH end of the leadscrew and a rectangular saddle. Siegs don't have the nut, and their saddles are H-shaped. Real Bull have had the 'Super' version of their lathe for a while. Old: . (I've got one of these, same colour too). New: The chip guard around the toolpost is new. That'll get annoying fast. Same deal for the mill-mills they make. Tony
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Re: Real Bull 7x14 lathe questions?
Hello Andy. As far as I am aware Real Bull ?as of 2 months ago did not produce a version with a brushless motor. Hugh at Amadeal will have the up to date info on this.
John L?| Spain
From: andyf1108
To: 7x12minilathe@...
Sent: Wednesday, February 6, 2013 9:49 AM
Subject: [7x12minilathe] Re: Real Bull 7x14 lathe questions?
?
I'd be slightly wary, Bob. Hitherto, Real Bull mini-lathes have all had two speed ranges with the usual hi/lo gears.
Of course, it may be that they have decided to produce a version with a brushless motor and no gearbox, to compete with the one Sieg have produced and which LMS sells as the Hi-Torque.
If there is a picture on Ebay,look for a nut on the RH end of the leadscrew and a rectangular saddle. Siegs don't have the nut, and their saddles are H-shaped.
Andy
--- In 7x12minilathe@..., "bob_guenthner" wrote:
>
> Anyone know anything about these? Found one listed for $650 on eBay. The description says variable speed and the seller says it has no high/low gear box. Just looking to see if there's anyone that knows anything about them.
>
> Bob
>
|
Re: Real Bull 7x14 lathe questions?
I'd be slightly wary, Bob. Hitherto, Real Bull mini-lathes have all had two speed ranges with the usual hi/lo gears.
Of course, it may be that they have decided to produce a version with a brushless motor and no gearbox, to compete with the one Sieg have produced and which LMS sells as the Hi-Torque.
If there is a picture on Ebay,look for a nut on the RH end of the leadscrew and a rectangular saddle. Siegs don't have the nut, and their saddles are H-shaped.
Andy
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
--- In 7x12minilathe@..., "bob_guenthner" wrote:
Anyone know anything about these? Found one listed for $650 on eBay. The description says variable speed and the seller says it has no high/low gear box. Just looking to see if there's anyone that knows anything about them.
Bob
|
Re: Real Bull 7x14 lathe questions?
That's the same as the seig sc3 that I have. Except I don¡¯t have the cam on the tail stock and I have a cover over the leadscrew. Its the one with the ? hp brushless motor, no gear change, it has no speed readout, that's an optional extra. Don ?
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From: 7x12minilathe@... [mailto:7x12minilathe@...] On Behalf Of Tony Smith
Sent: Wednesday, 6 February 2013 4:06 p.m.
To: 7x12minilathe@...
Subject: RE: [7x12minilathe] Real Bull 7x14 lathe questions?? ? > Anyone know anything about these? Found one listed for $650 on eBay. The
> description says variable speed and the seller says it has no high/low
gear box.
> Just looking to see if there's anyone that knows anything about them.
>
> Bob
The Real Bulls are slightly different to the Sieg, where different means
they have nice little extra touches.
What you're looking at is basically one of these:
The 7x lathes come in two versions; the originals like most of us have, and
then the newer (sometimes called 'Super') variants that have a better motor.
The new ones can do 50-2500 RPM without needing the Hi/Lo gear, everything
else is much the same.
Some have a shorter tailstock so you gain another inch.
Tony
|
Elbow height is good.. Try and avoid using stools or chairs. It's not easy to see over the top of the machine and is easier to have the chips hit your face.even worse, something flies out of the chuck,which can happen.And on that point,it's not easy to tighten a chuck or collet sitting down. Also if you have a confined workshop,the stool is always in the way. Exceptions of course if you are unfortunate to be disabled.
John L Spain
From: Jerry Durand
To: 7x12minilathe@...
Sent: Wednesday, February 6, 2013 2:52 AM
Subject: Re: [7x12minilathe] lathe height
?
Lathe should be about elbow height...more or less to personal taste.
On 02/05/2013 05:47 PM, Ebner Heating
Air Conditioning Co. wrote:
I'm getting a
heavy bench set up to accept my lathe. After bolting a heavy
set of casters that were sized to accept the 400 pound
weight I ended up with a bench that is to high to
comfortably work while sitting on a stool. My question would
be is there a rule of thumb 'height wise" that?I should
shoot for? I don't want to cut the legs off so that the
bench ends up to low.
?
Thanks Mike
--
Jerry Durand, Durand Interstellar, Inc.
tel: +1 408 356-3886, USA toll free: 1 866 356-3886
Skype: jerrydurand
|
Re: Real Bull 7x14 lathe questions?
Do the one's with the variable drive develop as much torque at low RPM's? I guess the real question is, are they as goodor better than the lathes with the high/low?
Bob Well, LMS call them 'HiTorque', and the consensus seems to be they are much more capable at low revs than the standard versions. They've got a bigger motor; 500w vs 250-350W so that helps. I've got a standard Real Bull, and it claims to have a 350W motor. I haven't played with the newer ones, so maybe someone with experience will chime in. There's a comparison chart here: , the LMS and one Micro-Mark have the new motor & controller, the rest are the old style. All from Sieg, not that it makes a huge difference. Real Bull themselves are here: , in the USA the distributor is here: . BigDog have theirs at $750, which include accessories + a 4" chuck (stock is 3"). You'll still need a 4" 4-jaw anyway. The $650 one you were looking at may not be that great deal after all. There used to be large price difference (like $300) between the variants which seems to be vanishing; both from the standard ones getting more expensive, and the newer 'Super' ones getting cheaper. Neither LMS or BigDog stock the standard model anymore. Tony
|
Re: Real Bull 7x14 lathe questions?
Tony,
Do the one's with the variable drive develop as much torque at low RPM's? I guess the real question is, are they as goodor better than the lathes with the high/low?
Bob
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
--- In 7x12minilathe@..., "Tony Smith" wrote:
Anyone know anything about these? Found one listed for $650 on eBay. The
description says variable speed and the seller says it has no high/low gear box.
Just looking to see if there's anyone that knows anything about them.
Bob
The Real Bulls are slightly different to the Sieg, where different means
they have nice little extra touches.
What you're looking at is basically one of these:
The 7x lathes come in two versions; the originals like most of us have, and
then the newer (sometimes called 'Super') variants that have a better motor.
The new ones can do 50-2500 RPM without needing the Hi/Lo gear, everything
else is much the same.
Some have a shorter tailstock so you gain another inch.
Tony
|
I have old eyes,and use the mini, for tiny work,so I have mine high enough,that I can focus my bi-focals,and #5 opti-visors.
But if you are going to make heavy cuts,you do not want hot chips in your face.
|
--- On Wed, 2/6/13, sssfoxtampa wrote:
From: sssfoxtampa
Subject: [7x12minilathe] Re: lathe height
To: 7x12minilathe@...
Date: Wednesday, February 6, 2013, 2:40 AM
?
The recommendation is that your lathe be at elbow height when standing or sitting. I've never been able to get comfortable without the frame of the table hitting the top of my legs. There isn't much room between my elbows and the tops of my legs when sitting.
Since your elbows are different heights when sitting and standing, you need to be able to adjust the table or the chair/stool. Just cutting the legs won't fix your problem.
I finally figured out that if I put the lathe on a taller table and use a drafting stool, my legs aren't at right angles so I have more room for them under the table. The lathe is higher when I am standing, but that puts it closer to my old eyes.
So, for me, higher is better.
--- In , Jerry Durand
wrote:
>
> Lathe should be about elbow height...more or less to personal taste.
>
> On 02/05/2013 05:47 PM, Ebner Heating Air Conditioning Co. wrote:
> > Message
> >
> > I'm getting a heavy bench set up to accept my lathe. After bolting a
> > heavy set of casters that were sized to accept the 400 pound weight I
> > ended up with a bench that is to high to comfortably work while
> > sitting on a stool. My question would be is there a rule of thumb
> > 'height wise" that I should shoot for? I don't want to cut the legs
> > off so that the bench ends up to low.
> >
> > Thanks Mike
> >
>
> --
> Jerry Durand, Durand Interstellar, Inc. www.interstellar.com
> tel: +1 408 356-3886, USA toll free: 1 866 356-3886
> Skype: jerrydurand
>
|
Can some one please teach me how to make this.
Technology marches on: It is actually possible for a 3D printer to print that ring in one go, moving parts and all. That'd solve figuring out how it goes together. Tony
|
Re: Real Bull 7x14 lathe questions?
Anyone know anything about these? Found one listed for $650 on eBay. The
description says variable speed and the seller says it has no high/low gear box. Just looking to see if there's anyone that knows anything about them.
Bob The Real Bulls are slightly different to the Sieg, where different means they have nice little extra touches. What you're looking at is basically one of these: The 7x lathes come in two versions; the originals like most of us have, and then the newer (sometimes called 'Super') variants that have a better motor. The new ones can do 50-2500 RPM without needing the Hi/Lo gear, everything else is much the same. Some have a shorter tailstock so you gain another inch. Tony
|
I would stand on a pallet, rather than cut the legs . I made my bench high as I have a knackered back and stooping is a pain. So general layout work its perfect height, but a fraction high to see on top of the lathe. Don zl1atb ?
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From: 7x12minilathe@... [mailto:7x12minilathe@...] On Behalf Of Ebner Heating Air Conditioning Co.
Sent: Wednesday, 6 February 2013 2:48 p.m.
To: 7x12minilathe@...
Subject: [7x12minilathe] lathe height? ? I'm getting a heavy bench set up to accept my lathe. After bolting a heavy set of casters that were sized to accept the 400 pound weight I ended up with a bench that is to high to comfortably work while sitting on a stool. My question would be is there a rule of thumb 'height wise" that?I should shoot for? I don't want to cut the legs off so that the bench ends up to low.
|
gerry waclawiak
maschwiebert