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Ross, great work. Heartily endorsed!

It's nice to see the interest in A1G catching on. Maybe we'll have our own little movement before too long.

As soon as I get a chance to update the site, I will find the appropriate place to offer a link to your site.

Did I mention that it also saved me a lot of work scanning my cars and kit instructions?

Cheers,
Your list-owner

Hi everybody,

Just a little spiel about a1g freight car wheelsets. Again, these
observations are based on new cars purchased at a hobby shop and not on cars I got from
eBay or whatever.

Style 1:

These are on the earliest Atlas cars and the wheels are a bronze color rather
than the more black appearance of later ones. The insulator is rather small
in diameter. The sideframe journal actually pretty much hides the insulator.
The insulator protrudes from the inner surface of the wheel.

Style 2:

These are just like style 1 except that the insulator is flush with the inner
surface of the wheel.

Style 3:

These are just like style 1 except that the wheels are black, or nearly so.

Style 4:

These are just like style 2 except that the wheels are black, or nearly so.

Style 5:

These have black wheels but the insulator is larger in diameter. You can
easily see the insulator looking at the face of the wheel. The insulator is flush
with the inner surface of the wheel.

Style 6:

These are just like style 5 except that the wheels are silver (nickel plated
brass?). There is a noticeable rim of silver around the insulator on the face
of the wheel.

Style 7:

These have silver wheels too but the insulator is smaller in diameter on the
inside of the wheel than style 6 while it is slightly larger in diameter on
the face of the wheel. The rim of silver is noticeably thinner around the
insulator than on the style 6 wheels.

As stated above, the style 1 or 2 sets were used on the earliest Roco cars
around the 1967 era with the boxes that just had plastic spacers in them instead
of blue cradles and paper inserts. They did spill over into the early blue
cradle period, however.

Styles 3 and 4 followed shortly thereafter and style 5 shortly after that. I
believe that the vast majority of Roco cars had style 5.

I seem to remember that style 6 showed up in about 1969 and I do have Roco
cars with this style, especially the later cars (Container Flats, Hi-Cubes, 94'
tankers, etc.).

I originally thought that Rivarossi built cars had style 7 exclusively but
that is not the case. I have several that have style 6 sets on them.

After Atlas started manufacturing cars here in the USA and had some of them
made in Yugoslavia, it was a mixed bag again. For example, my 2397 (Morrell 40'
reefer) has style 4 sets on it!

Regards,
Doug

I have been interested in the Atlas 1.5 generation kits since I found
out that they existed on George's Web site a few years ago. I have
since collected most of the kits, and have taken some photos of them and
turned them into a Web site. Feel free to visit my site on these car
kits. If you have any additional information on these kits, I would be
interesting in knowing more about them. The site can be found at
.

Enjoy, Ross.

Hi everybody,

I have a lot of time on my hands due to being unemployed right now, so I
thought I would write another little screed \:") These observations are all based
on inspection of cars that I bought new from a hobby shop and not cars that I
bought used.

There are three basic types of four wheel Bettendorf trucks that Atlas used
on the A1G equipment although, upon cursory examination, they look the same.
The differences are apparent by looking at the bottom of the truck.

The first style has what appear to be four round ejector pin impressions, one
at each end of the truck bolster and two immediately behind the coupler
pocket. The molding is flat all the way from behind the truck pin hole until it
reaches the axle where there is a notch for axle clearance. The edge of the
molding right behind the truck pin hole (opposite the coupler pocket) is formed by
three straight edges, one parallel to the bolster and two at an angle. There
are also reinforcing fillets where the bolster meets the truck side frames.
Earlier trucks are a very dark gray as opposed to later ones which are black. I
will refer to these trucks as Roco trucks.

The second style is similar to the first except that there are no ejector pin
impressions and there is a mold number cast into one side or the other of the
bolster. The molding is flat only to slightly in front of the truck pin hole
and then there is a rounded step and then another step under the axle for
clearance. You can see a circular mold line around the truck pin hole. The step
for axle clearance is much deeper than on the Roco truck. The edge of the
molding behind the truck pin hole is similar to the Roco truck in that it is formed
by three straight edges. There are some minor dimensional differences but I
don't think it's necessary to know this to differentiate between the two. There
are no reinforcing fillets where the bolster meets the truck side frames. All
of these trucks I have seen have been a very dark gray in color. I will refer
to these trucks as Rivarossi trucks.

The third style is quite different from the first two. There are two quite
long reinforcing fillets on either side of the truck pin hole from the bolster
to the truck side frames. The molding is flat from behind the truck pin hole to
the notch for axle clearance, although you can see a circular mold line
around the truck pin hole. The axle notch is of similar depth to the Roco truck.
Probably the biggest difference between this and the Roco or Rivarossi truck, in
that it is readily apparent, is that the edge of the molding behind the truck
pin hole is round as opposed to being formed by straight edges. All of these
trucks I have seen are black. I will refer to these trucks as Kit trucks.

Now, onto what trucks were used on what cars, although it's probably pretty
apparent by the monikers I have assigned to them.

As to the first two styles, simply put, all Roco built cars should have Roco
trucks on them and all Rivarossi built cars should have Rivarossi trucks on
them. If you acquire a car that has the wrong style, you can be pretty much
assured that somebody, along the line, changed the trucks.

As far as the cars built here in the USA, Atlas seems to have mixed and
matched, probably based on what they had available at the time. I have some with
Rocos and some with Rivarossis. I have a 2365 (Chicago Illinois Midland wood box
car) that has one of each on it. These cars were all bought at the local
hobby shop new so it's a pretty good bet that they came from the factory that way.

The Kit trucks, as the name indicates, were supplied with the car kits that
were made in the late sixties. These should not appear on either Roco or
Rivarossi built cars. Atlas did release some of the kit cars as RTR later but all of
the ones I own have either Roco or Rivarossi trucks on them. Here again, I
have a 2257 (Rio Grande 40' cattle car) that has one of each on it.

From this I have also learned that a couple of cars I bought used as built-up
kits (they were supplied in kit boxes) either are really the RTR version,
although, for other reasons, I suspect not, or the original trucks were replaced
with Roco trucks. I lean toward the latter explanation because the original
wheels supplied with the kits were plastic and had terrible rolling qualities so
the previous owner probably just replaced the whole truck assemblies rather
than merely changing out the wheels.

Next, variances in the silver wheels. Hopefully, it will not be nearly as
long an article.

Regards,
Doug

After reading this post, I pulled out all my A1G cars (including the
surplus stuff)and checked my 2206 cars (I own 5 of them).

All five of mine are the same, blue lettering, but do have some
slight variation in the white stripe, some have a more opaque stripe
than others and one has a blue tinted stripe.

I have two of the variations of the word Maine on the label.

I have three copies of this car I would be willing to part with.
One is in its original box while the other two do not have boxes.
One is in great shape while the other has one step missing.

I have also noted a difference in the 2321, Shipper's car line
centerflow hopper. Will post pictures as time permits.

Edward Bridges
Granger, TX

Hi everybody,

Just thought I would alert all to the variations of this car in case it is
unknown. The original Greenberg guide doesn't cover this. The supplement does
but I figured that publication may be a little obscure.

Anyway, there are two variations of this car. The basic difference between
the two is that, on one version, the lettering on the middle white stripe is
black whereas on the second version, the lettering is blue.

Also, I will list here, the other more subtle differences:

Black lettering version Blue lettering version


White paint "less white" White paint is brighter

Blue and red paint darker Blue and red paint lighter

Lettering for "STATE of MAINE" Lettering for "STATE of MAINE"
& "PRODUCTS skinnier. & "PRODUCTS" fatter.

I believe that the black lettered version is the earlier one because, on my
examples, this version has the earlier version trucks on it. On the two blue
lettering examples I have, one has black wheels but they have the larger
diameter insulator and the other one has trucks with silver wheels. Of course, there
is no guarantee that the trucks weren't changed over the years but the truck
pins on the two blue lettered versions appear to be untouched.

Another interesting thing about this car is the lettering on the ends of the
box inserts. There are three different spellings of "Maine"! Coincidentally,
each spelling is represented on the boxes for my cars. One has "Main", one has
"Mane", and the third, the correct spelling "Maine". I imagine it was the
Austrians trying to decipher the English language that resulted in this.

I hope this information may be of some use.

Regards,
Doug

I picked up a 2273, PRR caboose MIB recently, which is sort of
interesting. Although the car is factory painted PRR, you can see
patches of red paint in places where the carbody wasn't painted
brown very well and you can clearly read B&O lettering in places as
well as see the B&O herald.

Is this a common thing with A1G equipment. I once had an Atlas Alco
FA-1 that was factory painted Wabash, but was painted over Rock
Island (I think, I no longer own the locomotive, just remember it).

Any knowledge of this practice would be greatly appreciated.

I will post a picture of this odd car as time permits (I work a lot
of overtime this week!).

Edward Bridges
Granger, TX

The 85' and 94' cars have a long sharp edged lid on their boxes.

They're not quite as sharp as the Roco 5" boxes though, right?

They are sharp, but not as sharp as the smaller boxes. I can gather
up the different boxes and shoot pictures of them since I do have
the digital camera handy today.

Edward Bridges
Granger, TX

Rick wrote:

I've seen both versions of the truck pins mentioned. The flat one is on my
N&W center depressed flat car and could of been a bit more narrower at the
head. Over the years it seem to warp the axle on the center wheel that rides
across it making it turn in a orbital fashion instead of turning true on
it's points in the truck. It's still one of my most favorite A1G cars even
with it's problem.
Rick

You could try to straighten the axle. Maybe the pin isn't pushed in all the
way. Or, you could just leave it as an historical example of the consequences
of early N Scale (called N Gauge by Atlas back then) manufacturing techniques :>
)

Doug

Well, I will be looking for a correct Roco style box for the car as
well as the insert and cradle. The car itself is in excellent shape.

I have quite a few of the Rivarossi style boxes here, but no Roco
style boxes.

I went back and looked at my cars and the longer Roco built cars do
have a rounded edge on the lids.

The 85' and 94' cars have a long sharp edged lid on their boxes.

Two more auto racks and I will have all four of them. I already
have all the other 85 and 94 foot cars, all MIB.

Its nice to see some life in the list again.

Edward Bridges
Granger, TX

Edward wrote, in part:

I have quite a few of the Rivarossi style boxes here, but no Roco
style boxes.

Yup, the Rivarossi style boxes seem easier to come by than the Rocos.

I went back and looked at my cars and the longer Roco built cars do
have a rounded edge on the lids.

After I wrote my little article about boxes last night, I went and dug
through my older cars (chuckle, as if any of them are new) and I found that my
original Warren jumbo tanker came in a Rivarossi passenger style box (the lid edges
are flush with the box sides and the edges are sharper). I bought this
directly from a hobby shop (in 1968) but I thought at first that maybe the owner of
the shop had put it in this box (possibly the original box was damaged in
shipment). However, the paper insert says "MADE IN AUSTRIA" at both ends and the
lid, of course, just says "ATLAS" The other boxes for these cars with the
rounded edged lids and overhanging the box say "ATLAS MADE IN AUSTRIA" on the lid
and don't say anything on the paper insert as to country of origin. So, I
deduce that this box is, in fact, correct for this car.

The 85' and 94' cars have a long sharp edged lid on their boxes.

They're not quite as sharp as the Roco 5" boxes though, right?

Doug

I have looked through my early cars that I bought directly from a hobby shop
and have found that although what I said before is generally true, some of the
pins which look like they were supposed to have flat heads have a little bit
of a dimple in them. This appears to be more of an artifact of the molding
process rather than a design feature though.

The later pins actually had a very discernible dimple though, really a hole
in the center of the head. The spare Atlas truck pins in Atlas packages that I
got on eBay are this style.

Also, there does appear to have been some intermixing so other factors along
with the truck pins may have to be used to verify vintage.

Doug

I've seen both versions of the truck pins mentioned. The flat one is on my N&W center depressed flat car and could of been a bit more narrower at the head. Over the years it seem to warp the axle on the center wheel that rides across it making it turn in a orbital fashion instead of turning true on it's points in the truck. It's still one of my most favorite A1G cars even with it's problem.
Rick

From: dgosha@...
Reply-To: a1g@...
To: a1g@...
Subject: [a1g] Roco truck pins
Date: Sun, 31 Aug 2003 18:39:19 EDT

God, will this never end? :>)

On the early Roco cars, the truck pins had heads that were flat across and
had a fairly sharp rim on them (unlike some other manufacturers' cars that had
almost round headed pins).

Later on ('70s?) they had a dimple in the middle of the head. I am going to
check my cars further ,though, to see if there was intermixing in the later
cars. But, the early ones all had flat heads.

Doug

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That's exactly how the printing on those Acme trailers read. Kind of looks as if they couldn't get all the printing in.
Rick

From: dgosha@...
Reply-To: a1g@...
To: a1g@...
Subject: Re: [a1g] What does the printing say around tht Acme logo?
Date: Sun, 31 Aug 2003 12:34:57 EDT

Rick wrote:

Hi, I got the flat with the Acme trailers on it but have been trying to

read

what the printing says going around the Acme logo. I've been meaning to
look for the Athearn (HO) flat kit with the Acme trailers to see what

that

small print actually says. If anyone should know that answer and/or can
decifer the printing, would you please tell me what it says.....
Thanks,
Rick

HeHe, this has kinda been duscussed here before. In the black circle, it's
supposed to say "ACME FASTFREIGHT" but some versions say "ACME FASTEFREIGHT"

I don't know what the heck it's supposed to say in the red circle but I'm
assuming "DEPENDABLE SERVICE" However, the one I have says "DEPENDA" at the top
of the circle and "CALY" or "CALV" and "SERVI" at the bottom.

Doug

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There are three of the 4 85' stock cars listed on that "auction
site". All except the Northern Pacific car are listed.

I will not be bidding on this trio as I own all four of the 85'
stock cars from a previous auction.

Thought I would let the group know as some are probably looking for
these.

Edward Bridges
Granger, TX

Having looked closer at your photo of your gondola packaging, I would say
that that box was originally from a 0-6-0 saddletank loco (#2186). It has the
"ATLAS MADE IN AUSTRIA" up in the corner and it has two snaps at the top and one
at the bottom. My other Roco built locos all have one snap at the top and two
at the bottom and the lids are slightly different.

Although, I guess there could have been some variation as to where the snaps
were located.

Doug

Yup, Edward, it's been re-boxed. The Roco cars in 5" boxes were never in the
"snap" type boxes (well some were but they were still basically the sharp
edged Roco boxes and the "snaps" were at diagonal corners, not having two on one
side and one on the other), although some of the Roco built locos were.

In addition: I believe that the American made cars (in 5" boxes) were all in
Rivarossi style snap boxes.

The slightly longer cars like the bulkhead flats and container cars (the
center flow hoppers should have been in this style box because they barely fit in
the 5" box and I have seen couplers broken because of this) came in boxes
kinda like the Rivarossi passenger car style boxes except the lid corners are more
rounded and the lid overhangs the box instead of its edges ending up flush
with the box sides. Of course it says "ATLAS MADE IN AUSTRIA" up in the corner.
All cars made by Roco regardless of size or box style have this in the top
left corner.

The giant 86' or 94' cars came in their own style box (of course) which
measure about 8" X 1 7/8" These had the Rivarossi style snaps on them, two on one
side (top of car) and one on the other (bottom of car). Again, it has "ATLAS
MADE IN AUSTRIA" up in the corner.

The kits, of course, came in cardboard boxes :>)

Doug

There won't be any clear lines from breaking and the shell paint
color will cover where the stirrups are supposed to be.

One of the two 2311's i have has this exact problem. One of the
stirrups is not completely there, but there is no exposed plastic
where it would have been broken off.

Edward Bridges
Granger, TX

I have posted a photo of the packaging I have for 2234 (Cotton Belt
gondola). I believe this car was repackaged by its previous owner
as the box looks very much like the boxes my WDT switchers came in.
All of the Roco manufactured cars I have that are in boxes do not
have thwe rounded edge of the lid this box has.

Sometime down the road I will come up with the right box for this
car if this is indeed the wrong one. here is no tape residue or
label on the box anywhere.

Edward Bridges
Granger, TX

I have posted pictures of the variations of 2311, 2312 and 2351 A1G
cars. I hope these are of some help. I tried to get as close as I
could to the ACME trailers but it didn't turn out like I wanted.

I will point out more differences as I find them as I have more cars
coming in, some duplicate what I already have.

Edward Bridges
Granger, TX