¿ªÔÆÌåÓý

Re: radiated noise from a twisted set wire


 

¿ªÔÆÌåÓý

Another important point is the "twisted pair" requirement. The question seems to have an implied EMI (Electro-Magnetic Interference flavor.? On that assumption, I mention that not only is the radiated power dependent on the frequency components of the current in the wires, there is a spacial factor as well.?? High rate twists will tend to cancel the low frequency radiation patterns if the current "out" is balanced by the current "back".? I.e., the area of the loop formed by the current loop of the wire spacing and that loop can include the earth return if the current is essentially outbound from the source and coming back in some other path than the 3 wires.? Unless the 3 wires are a differential pair with a single wire shield, you are pretty much assured of unbalance and higher radiated energy.? Modeling the spatial factors in LTspice is not something I would even begin to try.? RF modelling software that includes 3-dimensional object modelling along with electrical factors is called for in this instance.
Regards,
Charles Patton

On 11/21/2018 9:50 AM, Andy ai.egrps@... [LTspice] wrote:
?
flpierson wrote:

? ? "What I need to do is take the FFT of the average current of the three wires. How do I go about doing that?"

First, define what you mean by "the average current of the three wires."

I don't even know what "average current" means in the context of an FFT.? Usually an FFT operates on a waveform.? When you average that waveform, you no longer have the waveform; you have just a number.? You can't take an FFT of a number.? Does "average" mean "filtered" or "smoothed"?? Why bother doing that?? Can't you just take the FFT of the current as it is?

What do you mean by "the three wires"?? Do you want the FFT of the current through each wire -- hence, three FFT spectra?? Or do you want the FFT of something like the net current of all three wires combined?

In LTspice it's easy to get the FFT of any number of signals..? Plot the ones you want on a waveform plot, then right-click > View > FFT.? Here, you can choose how many data samples, the time range over which to evaluate the FFT, whether to do a wee bit of smoothing by averaging adjacent time points, and whether to apply a windowing filter.? The latter is unnecessary if you've chosen the time span to include an exact integer number of cycles.? The waveforms that were plotted are highlighted in the top, but you can change which one or ones you want.

Click OK.? Now, if you had two or more waveforms selected, you'll get another window that lets you choose again exactly which ones to plot.? If you want all three, just highlight them all.? Or you can enter an expression here (such as I(R1)+I(R2)+I(R3)).

Click OK.? Voila, there's your FFT spectrum or spectra.

Now, if the thing you want is the FFT of the combined current, figure out what that means to you.? Do you want the common-mode current?? Differential mode?? Make an expression for what you want.? Then implement it.? You could do that with a Bv source added to your schematic (so that it exists as a separate signal that can be probed), or you can enter the expression later in the FFT process.

If you are new to FFTs, make sure that you do all the things necessary to get a good FFT.? Choose an appropriately small Maximum Timestep.? Disable waveform compression by adding ".options plotwinsize=0" to your schematic (it's essential!).? Make sure to use an integral number of cycles in the time interval passed to the FFT.? If there are start-up transients, wait for those to die out before starting the FFT.? Choose the total time interval wisely, as it affects the FFT's appearance -- one cycle is probably too little, 1000 cycles is probably too much.? Finally, LTspice's FFT shows you tons of high-order harmonics that may have no meaning, so ignore them, unless you are sure that the waveforms have meaningful data up there at those frequencies.? I guess the philosophy is it's better to start with too much data and discard what you don't want, than to start with too little and not know that there was more.

Regards,
Andy




Virus-free.

Join [email protected] to automatically receive all group messages.