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SX-28A Hum

 

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I just finished pretty much a complete overhaul of a nice condition (physically) SX-28A. Replaced just about every resistor and all caps.

?

Radio is working well except for a 120hz hum. When I switch the Bass in, the hum goes away.

?

Yes, there is ripple on the plates of the 6V6’s, about 6vrms, but that is there independent of the bass switch position. The output side of the HV filter is clean, no ripple. I paralleled another 47uf 450v cap across the choke input cap and there was no difference.

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I double checked the wiring against the schematic along with component values. Is the schematic correct in this area? I found once schematic error maybe there is another?

?

Thoughts?

?

Tom

W3TA


Re: S-85 refurbish: I've got a problem during the RF alignment of bands 1 and 2 - trimcaps don't peak!

 
Edited

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Emanuele,

?RE:? Assuming each of these should be two different coils, it seems one of those two coils is split in two. Yes, now it is clear

??????and both L3 and L6 are similar looking ?too

?

RE: ?Can C62 happen to be a sort of gimmick between the S1 rear and front rotors? ??After all it's 2pF only..? that might be almost right; not the rotors but the fixed contacts.? ?do you see a likely gimmick? ??So that Must be it.

Halli used to show gimmicks in manual drawings and parts lists??

Here is the S-40B in answer to the question.


--
don??? va3drl


Re: S-85 refurbish: I've got a problem during the RF alignment of bands 1 and 2 - trimcaps don't peak!

 

Hi, Emanuele,

That's an interesting thought about a gimmick capacitor. But the parts
list for the S40B specifies C62 as 2.2mmf, 500 V, bakelite, with a
Hallicrafters part number (47A160-4).

73,

Maynard
W6PAP


On 2/13/25 15:01, Emanuele Girlando via groups.io wrote:
Don,
the first left picture is L3, the second right is L6.
Can C62 happen to be a sort of gimmick between the S1 rear and front
rotors? After all it's 2pF only..
Enjoy this other picture of the MIX section of my S-85..
--
Emanuele (IU1KNR).
<>


Re: S-85 refurbish: I've got a problem during the RF alignment of bands 1 and 2 - trimcaps don't peak!

 
Edited

Don,
the first left picture is L3, the second right is L6.
Can C62 happen to be a sort of gimmick between the S1 rear and front rotors? After all it's 2pF only..
Enjoy this other picture of the MIX section of my S-85..
?
--
Emanuele (IU1KNR).


Re: S-85 refurbish: I've got a problem during the RF alignment of bands 1 and 2 - trimcaps don't peak!

 

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Guys, agreed for L3? , but the connections to L6 ?don’t have a source wire shown and don’t have the same switch profile for grounding so the L6 area is a big part of the mystery.

The switch profiles and pointers [whatever each is called properly] seems clear enough on the drawing, so that is not inquestion?

The S-40A, changes? to get to the S-40B ?might offer some clues.? Is there an S-40 manual? What does it show.

Another thought; it is easy to add ,subtract, and change caps and resistors, but changing a big stock of custom band-switches might rattle the cage of the bean counters, and won’t be easily accepted, or might be a lot of work [what do they stock?, and does halli build switches from various ?wafer sets?].

Even those custom coils might be hard to change.

Note that L3 and L6 don’t have the same part number.

From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Maynard Wright via groups.io
Sent: Thursday, February 13, 2025 5:04 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [HallicraftersRadios] S-85 refurbish: I've got a problem during the RF alignment of bands 1 and 2 - trimcaps don't peak!

?

Hi, Emanuele,

This would not be an unusual way to wind a transformer of the types like
L3 and L6, especially if there is a turns ratio much higher than unity.
That might be the case in these receivers, but we aren't told that by
the available literature.

73,

Maynard
W6PAP


--
don??? va3drl


Re: S-85 refurbish: I've got a problem during the RF alignment of bands 1 and 2 - trimcaps don't peak!

 

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Emanuele, good to see you out of hibernation!

Are you portraying L3 ?? ?so? one coil is in the middle and the other is split with half on each side???. So lots of mutual inductance between the upper and lower coils shown on the schematic ??

Did you see my image showing S1A rear with rotated rotor to show it in each of the 4 positions? And what do you think?

It is unclear to me about what your images are showing… so far, will try again.

?

From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Emanuele Girlando via groups.io
Sent: Thursday, February 13, 2025 4:17 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [HallicraftersRadios] S-85 refurbish: I've got a problem during the RF alignment of bands 1 and 2 - trimcaps don't peak!

?

I meant something like that:

(forget the values!)

--

Emanuele (IU1KNR).


--
don??? va3drl


Re: S-85 refurbish: I've got a problem during the RF alignment of bands 1 and 2 - trimcaps don't peak!

 

Hi, Emanuele,

This would not be an unusual way to wind a transformer of the types like
L3 and L6, especially if there is a turns ratio much higher than unity.
That might be the case in these receivers, but we aren't told that by
the available literature.

73,

Maynard
W6PAP


On 2/13/25 13:16, Emanuele Girlando via groups.io wrote:
I meant something like that:
(forget the values!)
--
Emanuele (IU1KNR).
<>


Re: S-85 refurbish: I've got a problem during the RF alignment of bands 1 and 2 - trimcaps don't peak!

 

Hi, Emanuele,

Are you still having trouble with Bands 1 and/or 2? If so, I wonder
whether C62 might have been removed to make your S-85 conform with the
schematic?

73,

Maynard
W6PAP


On 2/13/25 13:09, Emanuele Girlando via groups.io wrote:
What an interesting thread!
My one cent contribution:
see how the L3 and L6 are actually built in my S-85.
L3 L6
Assuming each of these should be two different coils, it seems one of
those two coils is split in two.
Another brick against the shaky wall?
--
Emanuele (IU1KNR).
<>


Re: S-85 refurbish: I've got a problem during the RF alignment of bands 1 and 2 - trimcaps don't peak!

 

Hi, Don,

I agree that there is no signal path to the right for Band 1 in the S-85
schematic and no C62 in the parts list. And the SX-99 has the same
issue from it's BAMA schematic.

There has to be something missing. C62 would do it. I was concerned
with the small value of that cap, but that might be ok. The input
impedance of the grid circuit of V2 will be much higher than the output
impedance of the plate circuit of V1, so maybe a high reactance in the
coupling cap would be ok and might even improve the out-of-band
rejection of the various tuned circuits.

So if there really is a C62 in the S-85, then its schematic and parts
list are both in error. Not the first such problem. But it would take
someone with access to a real S-85 to check that out.

73,

Maynard
W6PAP


On 2/13/25 09:37, don Root wrote:
Maynard, maybe I said /showed that stuff poorly. Hopefully C27c is solid
as a rock, but C29 will develop a good signal voltage up to 1.6? Mcs.

My red lines were only intended to show the path to the plate? …. And
there is no signal path going to the right in band 1.

RE:
The B+ line at the bottom of R26 and C29 is heavily filtered. ?YesIt ought
to be B+ DC voltage only with all AF and RF signals that might be
present filtered to ground.YesAnd C27C, 10 uF, will do that.Yes


--
don??? va3drl


Re: S-85 refurbish: I've got a problem during the RF alignment of bands 1 and 2 - trimcaps don't peak!

 

I can confirm C62 is not installed in my S-85.
?
--
Emanuele (IU1KNR).


Re: S-85 refurbish: I've got a problem during the RF alignment of bands 1 and 2 - trimcaps don't peak!

 

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Richard, you apparently have skipped over a number of posts, I previously posted an image with S1A front? rotated to each band separately. It showed ?that the signaw goes in one of the coils and udes mutual conductance to send the signal out the other coil. It was necessary [for me] to show the grounding wafer/wiper? In each position to see what happens. Maynard seems to go along with my proposal. Then Nick asked about the mixer tanks area. We cannot find a signal path from V1 to V2 for band 1, and likely band 2 [I forget now]. We can see a path for the S-40B but it [C62] is not in the S-85 drawing or parts list. So I/we are stuck at that point. We need somebody to open an S-85 and look to see if there happens to be a C62 or something I am using the manual on Bama, there may well be others?????? Help.

?

From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Richard Knoppow via groups.io
Sent: Wednesday, February 12, 2025 1:18 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [HallicraftersRadios] S-85 refurbish: I've got a problem during the RF alignment of bands 1 and 2 - trimcaps don't peak!

?

I need to take my own suggestion and redraw the circuits for the RF
amplifier. ……………++++++++++++++++++++
?
?

?


--
don??? va3drl


Re: S-85 refurbish: I've got a problem during the RF alignment of bands 1 and 2 - trimcaps don't peak!

 
Edited

I meant something like that:
(forget the values!)
--
Emanuele (IU1KNR).


Re: S-85 refurbish: I've got a problem during the RF alignment of bands 1 and 2 - trimcaps don't peak!

 
Edited

What an interesting thread!
?
My one cent contribution:
see how the L3 and L6 are actually built in my S-85.
??????
?
Assuming each of these should be two different coils, it seems one of those two coils is split in two.
?
Another brick against the shaky wall?
--
Emanuele (IU1KNR).


Re: S-85 refurbish: I've got a problem during the RF alignment of bands 1 and 2 - trimcaps don't peak!

 

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Maynard, maybe I said /showed that stuff poorly. Hopefully C27c is solid as a rock, but C29 will develop a good signal voltage up to 1.6? Mcs.

My red lines were only intended to show the path to the plate? …. And there is no signal path going to the right in band 1.

?

RE:
The B+ line at the bottom of R26 and C29 is heavily filtered. ??Yes ??It ought
to be B+ DC voltage only with all AF and RF signals that might be
present filtered to ground. Yes ??And C27C, 10 uF, will do that. Yes ???


--
don??? va3drl


Re: S-85 refurbish: I've got a problem during the RF alignment of bands 1 and 2 - trimcaps don't peak!

 

Hi, Don,

The B+ line at the bottom of R26 and C29 is heavily filtered. It ought
to be B+ DC voltage only with all AF and RF signals that might be
present filtered to ground. And C27C, 10 uF, will do that.

One could argue that a large electrolytic will not exhibit a zero ohm
impedance at RF and that's true. More sophisticated designs generally
provide paralleling smaller caps throughout the stages where B+ is
required to take care of that. But C27C will come close enough to zero
ohms, with a completely unpredictable remnant impedance, so that you
couldn't count on its B+ line to pass an RF signal in any predictable way.

73,

Maynard
W6PAP


Re: S-85 refurbish: I've got a problem during the RF alignment of bands 1 and 2 - trimcaps don't peak!

 

Hi, Don,

I didn't include that path in my conjectures because it's connected
directly to B+ and a large capacitor to ground in the power supply. Any
variable voltage, such as an RF signal, ought to be subjected to a
really low impedance to ground on that lead. I don't see that as a
viable path for an RF signal.

73,

Maynard
W6PAP


On 2/12/25 18:59, don Root wrote:
*Here is what I see for the S-85 mixer tanks for Band 1 only? … a simple
situation.. but how can any signal get away from the RF amp plate
circuit ans to the next grid???*

*Sorry I overdrew the bare switch. ?????The Band 2 ?connection is more
involved so forget it for now. *

*Is there any answer ??*

**


--
don??? va3drl


Re: S-85 refurbish: I've got a problem during the RF alignment of bands 1 and 2 - trimcaps don't peak!

 

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My problem too? with the S-85 drawing on BAMA and looking at band 1? there is nothing complex? to look at.

?

From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Maynard Wright via groups.io
Sent: Wednesday, February 12, 2025 9:47 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [HallicraftersRadios] S-85 refurbish: I've got a problem during the RF alignment of bands 1 and 2 - trimcaps don't peak!

?

Hi, Don,

I'm missing something because I'm just not seeing a signal path from V1
to V2 for Bands 1 and 2. I'll look a bit more.

73,

Maynard
W6PAP


--
don??? va3drl


Re: Hallicrafters Radios for Sale

 

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Somebody will want to know the model no ?of the Skybuddy?there is more than 1?

?


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--
don??? va3drl


Re: S-85 refurbish: I've got a problem during the RF alignment of bands 1 and 2 - trimcaps don't peak!

 
Edited

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Here is what I see for the S-85 mixer tanks for Band 1 only? … a simple situation.. but how can any signal get away from the RF amp plate circuit ans to the next grid???

Sorry I overdrew the bare switch. ?????The Band 2 ?connection is more involved so forget it for now.

Is there any answer ??


--
don??? va3drl


Re: S-85 refurbish: I've got a problem during the RF alignment of bands 1 and 2 - trimcaps don't peak!

 

Hi, Don,

I'm missing something because I'm just not seeing a signal path from V1
to V2 for Bands 1 and 2. I'll look a bit more.

73,

Maynard
W6PAP


On 2/12/25 18:03, don Root wrote:
Maynard, I began another reply?? but I am verrrrrry sloooooooooooow.

I just looked that up and ?C62 is on the S-40B the parts list? but it is
notinthe S-85 list

see ..

<>
.

All Hallicrafters there =
<>

*From:*[email protected]
[mailto:[email protected]] *On Behalf Of *Maynard Wright via
groups.io
*Sent:* Wednesday, February 12, 2025 7:18 PM
*To:* [email protected]
*Subject:* Re: [HallicraftersRadios] S-85 refurbish: I've got a problem
during the RF alignment of bands 1 and 2 - trimcaps don't peak!

Could the omission of C62 from the S-85 be just from the schematic (an
error)? Maybe the actual S-85 has a C62. Just a thought: I don't have
an S-85 to check that out.

73,

Maynard
W6PAP


--
don??? va3drl