I received a message from groups.io, for one of the groups I manage, telling that a given user had been unsubscribed automatically, as he had marked a message as spam. While I agree completely on this behavior, I don't remember having read somewhere about this automatic unsubcription...

Alberto

This has been a feature for over 2 years, but I don't think it's well documented.? A couple of threads you might want to read through are and

Duane

Hi
I looked at the two threads referenced in the Beta Group.
What I am not clear about is why should the person who identifies a message as spam, be the one to be unsubscribed? Shouldn't it be the person who sent it?
I am sure I am missing something there.
Thanks
Matty

See also:


Frances

开云体育

开云体育

--
Ken Scanes
IndustrialRailwaySociety

Indeed Matty, you are misunderstanding something...

The messages which triggered the end user to mark them as spam are just
normal messages, they are NOT spam. The end user, for whatever reason,
has decided to move them to his webmail spam folder, maybe just saying
'I don't want to see all these messages'. In this case it is right that
they are automatically removed from the group. In cases when they have
accidentally done so they are given the opportunity to rejoin. Many do,
some stay unsubscribed.

We moderators are never told what actual message they clicked on as
spam. My exerience with a group we moved over to groups.io six months
ago is that we got a few of these initially but it soon died down -
those accidentally doing it realised their mistake, the rest obviously
decided groups.io was not for them and stayed away. Yahoogroups no
doubt had a similar system in place except we never were told about it,
people just left.

Dave

On 22 Dec 2017 at 4:45, Matty Smith wrote:

Hi
I looked at the two threads referenced in the Beta Group.
What I am not clear about is why should the person who identifies a
message as spam, be the one to be unsubscribed? Shouldn't it be the
person who sent it? I am sure I am missing something there. Thanks Matty

Ken

Some groups, like GMF, send out a monthly notice. That can include tips about account management. You decide what. For example perhaps first in a thread would be a better match for this member. (Advanced Preferences)

And have you told the member that Delete works? Marking something as spam doesn’t work. They may think they are tidying up their inbox.

Frances

开云体育

On Fri, Dec 22, 2017 at 06:11 am, Ken Scanes wrote:

I have one lurker who on an almost daily basis is
unsubscribed for spam then re-subscribes. I’ve tried emailing him asking if
I can help, no reply. its not really a big issue but the daily emails telling
me he has been unsubscribed and then another telling me he has re-subscribed
are beginning to bug me. How would other owners handle this?

I'd ban him from your group. He is too stupid and harms your group and every other group on groups.io. His complaints make (unsubstantiated) groups.io's reputation as a spammer in his email provider.

simply put . . . if you mark a message as SPAM . . . the future messages are blocked from "you", not to prevent the sender from sending . . . I've often get messages marked as possible spam, marked by others but are not and I want to receive. If the sender is blocked then anyone marking this group as spam might block all group messages to anyone here.

?

Does this mean that when I mark a message as spam on my email program (Thunderbird) it automatically sends a message back to the sender with the information that I marked the message as spam, and if that sender happens to be any Groups.io group I will be automatically removed from that group? I didn't think my marking messages as spam was having any effect other than to the spam filter on my email program. Should I be warning the members of my groups that this could happen inadvertently? I could understand this if someone marked it as spam on the web site, but not with the email program on my home computer.

Jonathan

Yes, you need to warn group members. I think most of us do that periodically or in the welcome letter.

J

Sent from my iPhone

On Dec 22, 2017, at 2:44 PM, Jonathan Sivier <jsivier@...> wrote:

Does this mean that when I mark a message as spam on my email program (Thunderbird) it automatically sends a message back to the sender with the information that I marked the message as spam, and if that sender happens to be any Groups.io group I will be automatically removed from that group? I didn't think my marking messages as spam was having any effect other than to the spam filter on my email program. Should I be warning the members of my groups that this could happen inadvertently? I could understand this if someone marked it as spam on the web site, but not with the email program on my home computer.

Jonathan

[excess quote trimmed by moderator]

At the very least it send a message back to the server that handles the person's emails.
And there is a protocol that requires that server to stop sending messages to the destination that marked the message as spam.
So the only recourse groups.io has if a member or their email service marked a message from groups.io as spam is to unsubscribe the member.
When that happens Mark was gracious enough to attempt to send a message to that member indicating why they have been unsubscribed AND include in that message an "automatic resubscribe" button that is active for 3 days.
I don't know of any other service that does that.
--
Bob Bellizzi

The Corneal Dystrophy Foundation

Fri, 22 Dec 2017 16:44:21 -0600, "Jonathan Sivier"
<jsivier@...>, wrote:

Does this mean that when I mark a message as spam on my email
program (Thunderbird) it automatically sends a message back to the
sender with the information that I marked the message as spam, and if
that sender happens to be any Groups.io group I will be automatically
removed from that group? I didn't think my marking messages as spam was
having any effect other than to the spam filter on my email program.
Should I be warning the members of my groups that this could happen
inadvertently? I could understand this if someone marked it as spam on
the web site, but not with the email program on my home computer.

Jonathan

Maybe the individual in question is not using an offline eMail client
but uses her/his ISP's web interface.

Arno

Jonathan,

Does this mean that when I mark a message as spam on my email
program (Thunderbird) it automatically sends a message back to the
sender with the information that I marked the message as spam, and if
that sender happens to be any Groups.io group I will be automatically
removed from that group?

Maybe.

That will depend on your email service, the list service, and on how you've configured Thunderbird.

Some webmail services (including big ones like gmail) have an arrangement where email list services (such as Groups.io) can sign up to be informed when a mail user marks a message from the list as spam. Groups.io is signed up with many email services because with some of them that's the best way to help ensure that other list members receive list messages. Otherwise the marking of a list message as "spam" goes into the mix with whatever other factors that email service uses to filter spam, adversely impacting other list members who use that email service.

I could understand this if someone marked it as spam on the web site,
but not with the email program on my home computer.

Indeed, the other factor is whether your email service knows anything about what you've done in Thunderbird.

If you are using POP3 to retrieve messages then I think the answer is a flat "no". But if you are using IMAP that raises to a "maybe", because Thunderbird may move messages between server folders, including from your Inbox to your (server side) Spam folder. You'd have to look and see how you have Spam handling configured in Thunderbird to know whether marking a message causes an action at your email service.

Should I be warning the members of my groups that this could happen
inadvertently?

As a general statement, yes.

There have been reports that some email services will even send a report (and trigger an unsubscription) without any explicit action on the recipient's part. If the message is automatically filtered to the Spam folder, and the user doesn't remove it from there, then eventually the Spam folder gets emptied and a report is triggered. That's nuts, IMO, and I hope that's not still the case, but when Groups.io first signed up for receiving reports there were cases which could only be understood as having happened automatically.

Shal

Francis,
I think you don't realize that the recipient doesn't even have to mark the a message from the group as spam.? The recipient's email service might actually do this also and the intendended recipient might never see the email.? This is a result of stringent rules that have been put into place to combat actual spam.? Not all Internet Email Providers' crews seem to be well trained in exactly how to implement the rules, which continue to evolve.
--
Bob Bellizzi

The Corneal Dystrophy Foundation

J, could you post an example of what you post in the welcome or monthly letter?? so we can see a succinct explanation of the issue and warning?
Thanks!
Toby

Toby,

Sure, see below. I actually no longer include it in the welcome letter, but I have a set of wiki pages that I call "tips" and which I rotate in and out of the sticky wiki. The one on the spam fiasco is below. When I find it necessary to post this info directly to the group in a message, I usually add something facetious regarding the lack of technical details ("don't even ask" or something like that;). Here's the wiki tip page:

TIP: Marking a Message "Spam" Might Automatically Remove You From the Group. If you mark a message from this group (or any groups.io group) as spam, either intentionally or accidentally via your email's spam filter, the system may automatically remove you from the group. Check your spam folder regularly, and never delete a groups.io message directly from your spam folder (move it to your inbox first). If you are removed, check your inbox for a resubscribe link.

--
J