J, LeeAnne, Questions: (1) is this a known bug? Don't know, hadn't noticed. Though I usually post in plain text, I also use inline quoting and so seldom leave anything for the ellipses to cover up. On the other hand, this message was sent in plain text and the ellipses worked. So perhaps it has to do with particular quoting styles in plain text. /g/GroupManagersForum/message/1330What does this actually do? It causes any arriving plain text message to be converted to a formatted message. More exactly, an incoming message with only a text/plain message body is converted to one which has both the text/plain original and a text/HTML conversion as MIME multipart/alternatives. (2) what are the downsides to
using the setting "force HTML email"? One downside is that it converts a plain-text quote (the kind I use, with > on the left) into an HTML blockquote - but doesn't style it to include the customary vertical bar on the left. At least, not when received by email - the bar does appear on site at Groups.io (probably by way of an overall page style). A minor downside might be the increased size of the message, containing over twice as much body text. But this is likely to be negligible in most cases. It might have an effect on vision-impaired users, good or bad. The converted message will use a default font and size for HTML, which may not be the same as that used for plain text, depending on the receiving member's email interface. Most might consider it an upside that the converted message will have the formatted style of group links in the footer, rather than the plain text style. Just wondering these things too, and if the ellipses algorithm (what
ever that is!) ... You can see it at work on the message cited above. Joseph's reply is followed by an ellipses button [...]. You can toggle that button to see or hide a trailing quote (of the message he replied to) which was in his reply. ... can be tweaked to work for the plain text emailers? It doesn't always fail. I think it is supposed to work, so maybe the failing cases are fodder for [email protected]Shal
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All, [Mod note: if GMF were not a welcoming place for opposing ideas
Xaun Loc's first reply in this topic would not have been approved.] Further to this I want to say that we can disagree without being disagreeable about it. Let's try to stick to the business of helping each other manage our groups, and leave personal comments about other members unsaid. Xaun Loc, Thank you, J, for convincing me that the groups.io Group Managers
Forum is not a welcoming and accepting place in which to speak the
truth. I don't assume that anyone here has a lock on the truth, especially not where concerns managing members and how best to cope with and/or educate them. That aside, J's complaint about your reply is that you didn't address her question - which was about the functioning of Groups.io's software. So let's see if we can put this topic back on track. Shal GMF Owner
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On Sun, Feb 5, 2017 at 06:14 pm, J_Catlady wrote: Members who post via email who are using plain text email end up with non-trimmed posts on the site - the ellipses algorithm is not working for them. Questions: (1) is this a known bug? (2) what are the downsides to using the setting "force HTML email"? What does this actually do?
Just wondering these things too, ?and if the ?ellipses algorithm (what ever that is!) can be tweaked to work for the plain text emailers? ? --
-LeeAnne ?Archivist
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[Mod note: if GMF were not a welcoming place for opposing ideas
Xaun Loc's first reply in this topic would not have been approved.]
Thank you, J, for convincing me that the groups.io Group Managers Forum is
not a welcoming and accepting place in which to speak the truth.
?
In retiring I might note that the two major topics of recent discussion
have consisted of seeking ways to work around recurring user errors because the
users are either unable or unwilling to follow simple email procedures and
network etiquette that had been well known and common standards for four decades
years or more.
Sent: Monday, February 06, 2017 16:23 PM
Subject: Re: [GMF] forcing HTML email
?
Thank you, LeeAnne. I, too, feel offended by these constant disrespectful
references to group members.
J
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On Mon, Feb 6, 2017 at 04:40 am, Xaun Loc wrote: Perhaps someone should tell the poor little snowflakes to TRIM
THEIR OWN REPLIES. Perhaps someone should tell certain other poor little snowflakes that this was not my question. ? J
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Re: Main group name and deleting subgroup
Sharon, A better system would be
[subgroup].[group]@groups.io [subgroup]@[group].groups.io Pretty close to the same thing. ;-) I don't recall the details at the moment, but way back in beta@ there was a discussion of how to write the addresses for subgroups. I think in those discussions there may be the pros and cons of using either . or - or + as a separator to the left of the @ sign. There was also a discussion of the "subdomain" approach which was eventually adopted. I think it may have won out because it was in line with his plans for enterprise level groups. Shal
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Re: Main group name and deleting subgroup
On Feb 7, 2017, at 3:05 PM, Sharon Villines <sharon@...> wrote:
We won¡¯t have other subgroups because of the addressing. It isn¡¯t natural in email and causes too much confusion for 3,000 members. A better system would be [subgroup].[group]@groups.io or [group].[subgroup]@groups.io Thanks for all your work Shal. Sharon ---- [email protected]Where Everyone Trims Their Tails, Smothers Flames, Ignores Trolls, and Never Sends Private Messages to the List.
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Re: Main group name and deleting subgroup
On Feb 7, 2017, at 2:28 PM, Shal Farley <shals2nd@...> wrote:
My suggestion would be to embrace the subgroup addressing format. It will seem more natural when you have more than one subgroup. We won¡¯t have other subgroups because of the addressing. It isn¡¯t natural in email and causes too much confusion for 3,000 members. I¡¯ll try support. Sharon ---- [email protected]Where Everyone Trims Their Tails, Smothers Flames, Ignores Trolls, and Never Sends Private Messages to the List.
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Re: Main group name and deleting subgroup
Sharon, I deleted the subgroup because it caused name confusion over the new
address on the main group.
But how can I get the mail list to revert back to the simple address
¡ª [email protected] The simple address continues to work inbound as an alias for the subdomain address, but as far as I know you cannot revert the primary group address to the simple form. That goes for web address as well as the email address. Except perhaps by appeal to [email protected]. My suggestion would be to embrace the subgroup addressing format. It will seem more natural when you have more than one subgroup. From Sharon's sig: Where Everyone Trims Their Tails, Smothers Flames, Ignores Trolls,
and Never Sends Private Messages to the List. Good advice for any group I think. Shal
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Sharon, Subgroup has this address. It¡¯s visual gibberish.
[email protected] I read it as "grouppurchases at takomadc". The way to look at is that takomadc.groups.io is the name of the organization, where grouppurchases is one of the addresses at that organization. (In internet terminology, takomadc is a subdomain of groups.io, but that just means it is identified as a particular part of groups.io.) Is there any other possibility for addresses on the subgroups? No. Has anyone else had problems with this? With my PTA group I've just been careful to give the primary and subgroups compatible names. That is: [email protected] - all members of our unit (the primary group) [email protected] - the unit board members [email protected] - the reflections committee [email protected] - school staff who are members [email protected] - school teachers who are members Shal
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Sharon Maybe look in to an enterprise option and use your own domain? Maria
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Main group name and deleting subgroup
I deleted the subgroup because it caused name confusion over the new address on the main group. But how can I get the mail list to revert back to the simple address ¡ª [email protected]Sharon ---- [email protected]Where Everyone Trims Their Tails, Smothers Flames, Ignores Trolls, and Never Sends Private Messages to the List.
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As someone who has owned horses, whose daughter owns horses, and two of my
three grand-daughters own horses, I am not as completely unaware as you might be
assuming.
?
I will admit that many of the cell phone email apps do make it difficult to
edit emails -- probably because the developers recognize that a 2"x3" screen
never was and never will be a reasonable format for text editing.? A cell
phone is a barely adequate device for reading trivial pure-text emails and for
composing short text emails.? It is not, and never can be, an adequate
platform for serious or lengthy email discussions.? Sorry if that doesn't
suit you and your group members, but it is a simple fact and no amount of
I-want-it-to-be-different is going to change that.
?
Believe it or not, people have been using computers and email since long
before the Internet (yes, there was a world before the internet).? This is
not complicated technology that requires a lot of esoteric training.?
Composing an email on a computer is NOT complicated.? What it DOES require
is a little bit of thought and a willingness to THINK.?? These same
people who cannot remember to scroll down to delete the previous email in a
reply (or worse yet, cannot remember to delete a complete digest when replying
to one item) would never fail to remember to tighten a girth would they?
?
?
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
Sent: Monday, February 06, 2017 14:30 PM
Subject: Re: [GMF] forcing HTML email
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Hi Xaun Loc,
Our Mods spend copious amounts of time explaining how to things like copy and
paste, down and upload, heck even some of the mods have trouble understanding
"technology". With all the devices out there it would be a bit difficult and
time consuming to explain to our members exactly how to to do this.
Our? members are not "poor little snowflakes". >:-/???
They are horse owners with animals that need
help they generally can't get anywhere but from our online group. Some of the
horses are in incredible amounts of pain because the part that suspends the bone
inside the hoof has ripped and the 1000 pounds body weight is driving the bone
towards the sole. In mild cases the horse hobbles around until rehabbed in the
worst case the bones are pushed through the soles and the horse remains laying
down for weeks or more. I'm being graphic only demonstrate the seriousness of
what our group communicates about.
It is likely when they join our group, many of our members never needed to
use a computer for anything other than emailing their grand kids. They have more than enough to learn
without having to deal with learning how to trim their posts - especially if
there is an easy way to fix the problem?
--
-LeeAnne
Archivist
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Thank you, LeeAnne. I, too, feel offended by these constant disrespectful references to group members.? J
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Re: Subgroups & Data Usage
Hi Tina, The subgroup's data is included in the main group's data count. ?You can see this when you click on the Upgrade button which is only active when you are in the main group. In other words there is no upgrade button available in subgroups. ?
--
-LeeAnne ?Archivist
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Do subgroups add to the data usage of the main groups or are they stand alone when it comes to the data storage they use please? Just trying to work out if we need to form other full main groups down the line a bit, or if we can just create and use subgroups to spread our data storage use around a bit just now. Thank you for any assistance anyone can give us on this.
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The system for addressing subgroups may be a deal breaker. Main group now can has two addresses: [email protected][email protected]Subgroup has this address. It¡¯s visual gibberish. [email protected]Is there any other possibility for addresses on the subgroups? Has anyone else had problems with this? Sharon ---- Sharon Villines, Historic Takoma Park, Washington DC Where all roads lead to Casablanca
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Hi Xaun Loc, Our Mods spend copious amounts of time explaining how to things like copy and paste, down and upload, heck even some of the mods have trouble understanding "technology". With all the devices out there it would be a bit difficult and time consuming to explain to our members exactly how to to do this. Our ?members are not "poor little snowflakes". >:-/ ? ?They are horse owners with animals that need help they generally can't get anywhere but from our online group. Some of the horses are in incredible amounts of pain because the part that suspends the bone inside the hoof has ripped and the 1000 pounds body weight is driving the bone towards the sole. In mild cases the horse hobbles around until rehabbed in the worst case the bones are pushed through the soles and the horse remains laying down for weeks or more. I'm being graphic only demonstrate the seriousness of what our group communicates about. It is likely when they join our group, many of our members never needed to use a computer for anything other than emailing their grand kids.?They have more than enough to learn without having to deal with learning how to trim their posts - especially if there is an easy way to fix the problem ? --
-LeeAnne ?Archivist
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Re: Group Members Marking Group Messages As Spam
Apologies, Shal, for taking so long to respond. Something very odd happened this week in that the amount of spam went down dramatically so I was not able to check whether items I marked as spam, e.g. from my iPad always turned brown on my laptop. On my macbook it does appear that emails identified as spam are in brown type. If I mark a genuine one as not spam it then turns to a normal grey font. I don¡¯t think that was a setting I chose though it is helpful and does not occur on my iPad or phone.
Thank you for being patient with someone who often finds techno speak difficult. I am increasingly aware as someone who has used computers for years and have a group membership who have also been around a long time that age is creeping up on me and no doubt on many who now routinely use email groups. My mother had dementia and at the end was not even able to use the radio dial to retune to a different station even though she was once very capable. Members in my groups may well be in a similar position so rely on email to work as simply as possible and find change difficult to cope with. There will be many who do not understand jargon or be able to follow instructions but short of banning members who make mistakes or demanding cognitive assessments (!) I am not sure what can be done about this. Over time I imagine there will be more and more baby boomers like myself who struggle with technology but who continue to try and do their best not to upset others.
Just wanted to say thank you, Shal, for always being respectful in your responses and obviously putting in so much time to help others.
Best wishes,
Louise
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
On 29 Jan 2017, at 02:59, Shal Farley <shals2nd@...> wrote:
Louise,
Interesting. Does the brown type have a documented meaning. Is that, for example, the color of all the messages in your Spam folder?
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>
Members who post via email who are using plain text email end up
>
with non-trimmed posts on the site - the ellipses algorithm is not
Perhaps someone should tell the poor little snowflakes to TRIM
THEIR OWN REPLIES.
?
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Shal Farley
LeeAnne