And is there a file size restriction? I know every time I try to load a large file it just hangs.

On 7 Jun 2019 at 23:13, Jim Pruitt wrote:

Mark said that he did not know of a filetype restriction but thought it
was file size.

[excess quote trimmed by moderator]

Just a point - the originator of the thread thought that it could optional and turned on by the group owner if necessary. I do agree that there are problems with such a list - could be too strict. But I can see that it might be useful for an unmoderated group that attracts an audience that would be offended by some language.

Frances
--

---

/g/GroupManagersForum/wiki

/static/help
More help: use the search button at the top of the Messages list.

On 6/8/2019 12:16, Jim Fisher wrote:

I my opinion, HTML in emails wastes bandwidth

This made sense back in the days of acoustic modems. It makes no sense now.

Best,

Glenn

On Sat, Jun 8, 2019 at 01:18 PM, Brian Vogel wrote:

Those problems are entirely of their own making.

Not entirely.? Not everyone can afford a new computer every few years just so they can run the software that demands an upgrade.? I use plain text, an old computer, and simple software.? It does what I need it to.? If someone can't explain things to me using those, then it's usually a case of them not really knowing what they're talking about.? 5 fonts and 13 colors don't help with the explanation .? Quite often it interferes.
--
Help: /static/help
GMF's Wiki: /g/GroupManagersForum/wiki
Search button at the top of Messages list
A few site FAQs: /static/pricing#frequently-asked-questions

Does that mean it is possible to upload HTML files?

Jim Fisher

--
- My thoughts on freedom (needs updating)
- political snippets, especially economic policy
- misc. snippets, some political, some not
Forget Google! I search with which doesn't spy on you

On 7 Jun 2019 at 14:47, Brian Vogel wrote:

Elsewhere where I am a moderator there is both a "spambot" that scans for spam,
and where phrases can be added, and I think that already exists in some form
here when I look at the activity log on the groups I moderate here and the lack
of spam.? In addition, though, there is a "nasty word" filter that every
message is passed through and that sanitizes same which, while convenient, I
really don't support because what the person who set it up considers "nasty" is
far more restrictive than what I think should be allowed in discussions among
adults.

I agree 100% with you on everything you said in this message Brian. If I were
setting up such a file of "bad" words it would be completely empty. I don't
believe there are such things as bad words, just bad use of words, and you
would need a very good AI system to weed that out.

As to the old, "But what about the children?!!," plaint, my response is, "But
where are the parents who should be carefully monitoring the amount of time
their child(ren) can spend online and exactly what they've been looking at and
are allowed to look at."? ?Yes, it's a pain to do, but raising children
involves all sorts of things that are pains to do.

If the children are properly educated they will have been taught what use of
words is unacceptable and why, so censorship of that kind is then irrelevant.
As you say, it's up to the parents to take responsibility for such things, not
to expect software to do it for them. Monitoring of everything they see
on-line, though, is not possible these days, because parents have no control
over what they might be shown on other children's phones when in school or
playing together.

Jim--
- My thoughts on freedom (needs updating)
- political snippets, especially economic policy
- misc. snippets, some political, some not
Forget Google! I search with which doesn't spy on you

I wouldn't argue with any of that, but senders should be aware that formatting
which relies on HTML will not be seen by all their readers. Presumably it's
there because they want their readers to be aware of it?

I my opinion, HTML in emails wastes bandwidth and achieves little of benefit to
anyone, but my prime reason for avoiding it is because it can carry malware,
and no anti-virus software can ever be fully up to date with the latest
threats.

Jim

--
- My thoughts on freedom (needs updating)
- political snippets, especially economic policy
- misc. snippets, some political, some not
Forget Google! I search with which doesn't spy on you

And I have grown bone tired of being told about "the problems" of those who cling to antiquated software and methods of all sorts.? Those problems are entirely of their own making.

The phrase, "Do keep up," springs immediately to mind.? Almost to a person who won't, it's because they choose not to and for no other earthly reason.? That's your (the generic you) issue, and I refuse to make it mine.? Expecting anyone to conform to outdated styles and standards is not acceptable in the cyber world, particularly when it comes to:

1. Using HTML formatted e-mail.
2. Using threaded/conversation view, and expecting that a thread will be read through before responding.

It is well to remember that the entire universe, with one trifling exception, is composed of others.

???????? ~ John Andrew Holmes
--
Brian

? ?Some questions don't have answers, which is a terribly difficult lesson to learn.

? ? ? ? ? ?~ Katharine Graham

On Fri, Jun 7, 2019 at 05:24 PM, Jim Fisher wrote:

For those of us who read in plain text (I know I'm not the only one here), the all caps comes through but not the bold or the underlining.

As I have said, many times in the past, individual choices have consequences.

Yes, exactly. If, for example, someone decides to read their email using PINE because that's what they baby ducked on, that doesn't mean that the rest of us should be denied in-line attachments just because that MUA doesn't support that.

Best,

Glenn

[Political ad removed by Moderator]

开云体育

Mark said that he did not know of a filetype restriction but thought it was file size.? The largest file showed 10.052mb according to Windows Explorer but Groups.io had it as 9.52mb for the 7z file.? I was able to upload it with no problem.? I am not wondering if it failed because I was trying to upload 41 files in a session (although only 42mb total size).? It made no sense why all of my various browsers would error out when trying to upload those files.

Thank you.

Jim

On Fri, Jun 7, 2019 at 05:10 PM, Chris Jones wrote:

Do you really want to compromise an entire group by overlooking unacceptable behaviour on the part of a single member, or a small group of members?

I doubt that anyone wants this.? ?That being said, on really high traffic groups that are unmoderated (and my that I mean that they're not reviewed on a message by message basis like this one is) it is very easy for something to slip through.

Elsewhere where I am a moderator there is both a "spambot" that scans for spam, and where phrases can be added, and I think that already exists in some form here when I look at the activity log on the groups I moderate here and the lack of spam.? In addition, though, there is a "nasty word" filter that every message is passed through and that sanitizes same which, while convenient, I really don't support because what the person who set it up considers "nasty" is far more restrictive than what I think should be allowed in discussions among adults.

As to the old, "But what about the children?!!," plaint, my response is, "But where are the parents who should be carefully monitoring the amount of time their child(ren) can spend online and exactly what they've been looking at and are allowed to look at."? ?Yes, it's a pain to do, but raising children involves all sorts of things that are pains to do.

I also think it's laughable what many people sincerely believe children have never heard.? I can tell you that even in the 1970s I heard language used on the school bus that never exited the lips of my parents, and the fact that it didn't exit their lips told me all I needed to know about it's appropriateness in mixed company.? I think I can count on less than two hands the times I ever heard my father utter the F-word, and it was usually in response to an injury such as hitting a finger with a hammer (and where it's entirely appropriate, in my opinion.? No one said it better than Mark Twain:? "Under certain circumstances, urgent circumstances, desperate circumstances, profanity provides a relief denied even to prayer.")

None of the above is meant, nor should be taken as, an attempt to justify gratuitous profanity on public forms (or elsewhere, for that matter).
?
--
Brian

? ?Some questions don't have answers, which is a terribly difficult lesson to learn.

? ? ? ? ? ?~ Katharine Graham

On Fri, Jun 7, 2019 at 05:24 PM, Jim Fisher wrote:

For those of us who read in plain text (I know I'm not the only one here), the all caps comes through but not the bold or the underlining.

As I have said, many times in the past, individual choices have consequences.

Given that a great deal of content comes through in formatting, and HTML e-mail has been common for several decades now, I am also not responsible for those who choose to strip it.

That's entirely your choice, but there are prices to be paid, and it's not any author's fault when their material is being converted to present in a way not originally composed.
?
--
Brian

? ?Some questions don't have answers, which is a terribly difficult lesson to learn.

? ? ? ? ? ?~ Katharine Graham

Chris,

after that can you address the problem of not using capitals at all; i hate that. On one group I inhabit (not this one!) there are a few members who not only fail to capitalise properly but also dispense with any recognisable punctuation.

itsjustamatteroftrainingthebrainwhichisamazinglyadaptableinhumanbeingsnevermindotherspecies
ofcoursemanypeopledonotwanttohavetheirbrainstrained
theotherbenefitofpunctuationandconventionslikewordspacingisthatspellcheckerscancreativelymisinterprettypos
cheerstim

I have found that encrypting the message with an unknown key really improves legibility.

C5T6xYQ4artNtVrpVGYiP6b2p2SCQE5rLnEFWSF2Q6ROQ+5qqh0Pv/7FJjOEi+RKUWsnKZv7pW1VB/x4Pr9lvQ==

But you knew that.

Best,

Glenn

On 6 Jun 2019 at 15:11, Brian Vogel wrote:

I presume that people follow topics/threads *AND* that they read
the entire thread before they even think of responding to any single item in
it.? That's why threaded view came into existence in e-mail clients.

No, I don't. I am a member of many groups (here and on Yahoo), and other
mailing lists. Using the web for each such site is totally impractical, so I
use an email client. Furthermore, I read emails normally in a batch every
evening. In doing that I take them simply in date/time order, replying to each
one that requires it as I reach it. I rely mostly on quoting in the message to
tell me what is being replied to, as has already been discussed here, but when
I reply I have not then seen any later replies in the same thread. However, my
replies are not actually sent until I have been through the lot. This means
that very occasionally I have to go back and amend or even delete a message
waiting to be sent (I deleted one on this very topic this evening). I tihnk
achieves most of what you intend, although I am still missing on any further
replies sent after I download that day's batch of messages. I suspect not
everyone working my way would bother to do that.

Above,
that AND is not only in all caps but bold and underlined for a reason.

For those of us who read in plain text (I know I'm not the only one here), the
all caps comes through but not the bold or the underlining.

Jim Fisher

--
- My thoughts on freedom (needs updating)
- political snippets, especially economic policy
- misc. snippets, some political, some not
Forget Google! I search with which doesn't spy on you


[ mod note: see reply, split into new thread,
"To format or not to format... Is that the question?"
/g/GroupManagersForum/topic/32091851 ]

There obviously is, but I'll be darned if I can find a list of allowed file types in this group's Wiki or any of the official Groups.io help or terms of service pages.

I'd write Mark at [email protected]?to find out what file types are permitted (which will likely be a short list).? Please report back here on any information you receive.

--
Brian

? ?Some questions don't have answers, which is a terribly difficult lesson to learn.

? ? ? ? ? ?~ Katharine Graham

On Fri, Jun 7, 2019 at 06:26 PM, Epicatt2 wrote:

Just wondering since such an option could be useful to have on any groups where youngsters may visit.

In a way the option does already exist, and it's called a Moderator.

In a (mainly?) moderated group a moderator can and must stop any inappropriate material in its tracks and prevent it ever reaching other members either via the web UI or by email, and IMHO "stopping" means rejecting the message out of hand, not sanitising it. The rejection should (must?) include a clear message back to the originator stating in no uncertain terms why the message was rejected, with an unambiguous warning that any attempt to repeat the sending of unacceptable content will result in removal from the group.

If a group is unmoderated (or the member concerned is unmoderated) then putting them on moderation has to be the first step. Again IMHO having an entire group, or just some members unmoderated does not absolve an owner or moderator from the responsibility of ensuring that members are behaving themselves and that the group is being properly run. Once the individual is on moderation then the "rule" in the paragraph above can apply.

Bear in mind the Terms of Service that Frances linked.? I don't think an owner of moderator can or should try to weasel their way out of trouble by saying "it's nothing to do with me" or some variant thereof. I suspect that if Groups.io (i.e. Mark) realised that any given group was allowing material that was verboten to appear he would be within his rights to simply close it down.

Owners and Moderators must consider the possible impact of their failing to perform due diligence on a group and its members. Do you really want to compromise an entire group by overlooking unacceptable behaviour on the part of a single member, or a small group of members?

Chris

开云体育

--

---

/g/GroupManagersForum/wiki

/static/help
More help: use the search button at the top of the Messages list.

Tim, your point made to Chris is well founded.

Any such non-punctuated messages such as the one as you included post could simply be rejected along with a message to the member indicating that the post was inappropriate for the reason that it was difficult to read. (If the member is not going to use capitals they should/must at least use spacing between words and punctuation to make their texts readable.)

An elaborated explanation for the above should be placed in the Guidelines for your group which advises that such posts will be rejected. This should eliminate the problem or at least vastly curtail it.

Regards,

Paul M.
CRL Owner / Moderator
==

开云体育

I am running into a problem on one of my groups.? A member tried to upload some files but was denied.? He asked if I had restricted the file types since he could upload PDF's but no other file type.? I then tried myself to upload the same 41 files using first Waterfox and then Firefox and both times got a "unable to connect":

"Unable to connect
Firefox can’t establish a connection to the server at 209.145.176.7.

??? The site could be temporarily unavailable or too busy. Try again in a few moments.
??? If you are unable to load any pages, check your computer’s network connection.
??? If your computer or network is protected by a firewall or proxy, make sure that Firefox is permitted to access the Web."

The user then reported that he could upload all of the files except 2 (one was a .7z archive file about 11mb in size).

The total size of the 41 files was about 42mb so it was well under our free site 1gb file total limit and we do not have very many files there so we are nowhere close to our limit.

When I checked the group settings I do? not see any restriction on filetype or file size.? What am I missing?

Thank you.

Jim

Haven't seen anythng about one but, is there any sort of prohibited word list option on Groups.io that can be set up and turned on? Something that could maybe be set to automatically edit curse words to an ersatz word.

Just wondering since such an option could be useful to have on any groups where youngsters may visit.

Paul M.
CostaRicaLiving
/g/CostaRicaLiving
==