Stan, I said that I agree with Barb that some groups probably need moderating and that is up to the owner of that group, not you or me. ? My group is not moderated and never has been.
Cherrill Your mother is the best friend you will ever have.
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On Feb 18, 2018, at 2:13 PM, Stan Gorodenski < stanlep@...> wrote: ? You said "Be kinder than necessary, for everyone you meet is fighting some kind of battle", but I would also add, be more tolerant and understanding.?
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"As an option, is it possible to make the calendar starting with Monday, not Sunday as it usual in parts of Europe?"
How are calendars started in the other parts of Europe?
Don
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In my group I also have members who have been in it a long time or who I have known outside the group for a long time, but that is not the reason I do not moderate them. Perhaps in some groups it is necessary to moderate everyone because of the temperament of the individuals involved. It may be a blanket trait of people in that narrow field of the group. However, I have found that one should be more understanding and accommodating because the person that is causing some problem initially ends up being an outstanding member. You said "Be kinder than necessary, for everyone you meet is fighting some kind of battle", but I would also add, be more tolerant and understanding. This is what is lacking in many groups, and in our society I believe. If someone makes an abrasive comment, abrasive to some but not all, the immediate reaction is to contact the list owner, in a private message, and get the person banned. I have a member in my discussion group who created problems in other groups. He became a member of my group and many individuals in private email wanted me to ban him. I ban no one. There are other ways to deal with a problem. In this case, I worked with him over a long time and he is now one of the best members I have with what he has to offer the group. Stan On 2/18/2018 1:39 PM, Cherrill wrote: I agree with everything here Barb. Although my group is not moderated as we have been together a very long time.
Cherrill
Be kinder than necessary, for everyone you meet is fighting some kind of battle [excess quote trimmed by moderator]
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Stan, Is the above link safe to use? I think the site is safe. My company has used it to check all of our company email addresses and haven't had any problems. It did turn up a couple of addresses in data breaches of retail stores and the like. So we advised employees to change the password on those accounts (and to stop using their company addresses for on-line shopping and other purposes). In those cases the stolen credentials were still encrypted, so it isn't certain whether or not anyone ever managed to gain access to the accounts. But just to be safe... Sometimes I get messages from some of the members of my Yahoo
discussion group that end up in my IP's Spam folder. It has their name
on the message but it is not them. Another kind of fraud that I've seen, that sounds like this, is a message using the Display Name of a friend, or other trustworthy person, but when you look at the details the actual From email address isn't theirs, it is some unrelated compromised account. Something like: Shal Farley <footballer @ oddballdomain.ru> (Not to pick on the Russians, but country-code top-level domains seem to host lots of compromised email servers.) If your Inbox normally shows only the Display Name, "Shal Farley", you might think the message was from me - unless you check the actual email address itself. Those kinds of messages aren't a threat to an email list, as the member's actual email address wasn't used. But yes, they sure are annoying to get in your spam or Inbox. Is this a good link to post in my yahoo discussion group for members
to check their email address for being compromised? Would it end up
causing me a big headache in ways unseen by posting it? The headache I can imagine is a lot of potentially off-topic chatter about the subject, and perhaps a few panicked members. That depends on the nature of your group and members, of course. Shal -- Help: /static/helpMore Help: /g/GroupManagersForum/wikiEven More Help: Search button at the top of Messages list
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I agree with everything here Barb. ?Although my group is not moderated as we have been together a very long time.
Cherrill
Be kinder than necessary, for everyone you meet is fighting some kind of battle?
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On Feb 18, 2018, at 1:12 PM, Barbara Jones < northbaj@...> wrote: It seems to me that those who are in charge of this group set the rules, and the rest of us obey them. I see nothing wrong with being moderated myself, and the that I'm a co-owner of is totally moderated. They don't complain. If a message is moderated out, perhaps the message poster should look more carefully at what can be said and what cannot.
We are lucky to even have to use for our groups.
Barb Jones
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On 2/18/2018 1:23 PM, Shal Farley wrote: Stan,
This is the more common method for fraud these days. Email accounts have traditionally been as vulnerable as the user's discretion in choosing a "strong" password. Stolen or guessed email account credentials are a hot-selling item in the nether regions of the internet.
Shal, Thanks. Is the above link safe to use? Sometimes I get messages from some of the members of my Yahoo discussion group that end up in my IP's Spam folder. It has their name on the message but it is not them. Is this a good link to post in my yahoo discussion group for members to check their email address for being compromised? Would it end up causing me a big headache in ways unseen by posting it? Stan
Email services are tightening up on this, at least the name-brand ones. But in a group with world-wide reach one may have members with services of various quality.
Shal
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Re: Messages under wrong year!
Philip, The only bug is a few messages are archived in 1996, our group didn't
start until September 1998, ... It is possible that is not a bug. Some Yahoo Groups started by migrating the membership and archive from an earlier service. Basically what your Groups.io group did. You could have a look at the View Source of the messages (in either Groups.io or in the Y!Group) to see if the message header fields corroborate the earlier date or show the message as having been received at a later date. ... is there any way of "moving" these messages No. You'd have to ask support to do that for you, and it doesn't strike me as worthwhile, even if the messages truly belong to a later date. Shal -- Help: /static/helpMore Help: /g/GroupManagersForum/wikiEven More Help: Search button at the top of Messages list
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Hello!
As an option, is it possible to make the calendar starting with Monday, not Sunday as it usual in parts of Europe?
I would also appreciate an option with the date as DDMMYYYY, and the clock with 24 hours.
Regards
Ivar Gr?nn
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Stan, I can understand moderating to eliminate spoofed (I don't know what
that means) Forging the From address of an email. Ten or more years ago this was a serious problem for Yahoo Groups - spambots, scammers, and malcontents were sending messages using the From address of group members, and those messages would be accepted and posted if not caught by a moderator. This has become a much less common threat as email systems in general, and Yahoo Groups and Groups.io in specific, have become better at rejecting spoofed messages before they reach the group or its pending queue. I haven't tried it lately, and I don't know that it isn't still possible. or compromised mail accounts, ... This is the more common method for fraud these days. Email accounts have traditionally been as vulnerable as the user's discretion in choosing a "strong" password. Stolen or guessed email account credentials are a hot-selling item in the nether regions of the internet. Email services are tightening up on this, at least the name-brand ones. But in a group with world-wide reach one may have members with services of various quality. Shal -- Help: /static/helpMore Help: /g/GroupManagersForum/wikiEven More Help: Search button at the top of Messages list
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It seems to me that those who are in charge of this group set the rules, and the rest of us obey them. I see nothing wrong with being moderated myself, and the groups.io that I'm a co-owner of is totally moderated. They don't complain. If a message is moderated out, perhaps the message poster should look more carefully at what can be said and what cannot.
We are lucky to even have groups.io to use for our groups.
Barb Jones
From: Stan Gorodenski <stanlep@...>
To: [email protected]
Sent: Sunday, February 18, 2018 12:02 PM
Subject: Re: [GMF] Moderating
Shal,
Okay, I now remember reading this:
"All messages sent to GMF are moderated. This is done to avoid malicious
attachments, spam, off-topic messages, and messages from spoofed or
compromised mail accounts. Despite these measures, be aware that the bad
guys are clever so there's no guarantee that we'll always succeed; you
are encouraged to be vigilant against any and all threats arriving via
email. Your GMF moderators make no guarantees regarding the safety of
emails arriving from this or any other Groups.io address."
But that still begs the question. I can understand moderating to
eliminate spoofed (I don't know what that means) or compromised mail
accounts, but I feel moderation is being carried beyond what I would say
most moderators do in their own discussion group. Once I know a member
is not a spammer, and I know the person is not using the group to push
an offensive agenda they are taken out of moderation. If the individual
becomes malicious, there are ways of dealing with that, the ultimate
step being to place them in moderation status again. It is not necessary
to moderate each and every post of every member of the group. If spam
starts coming from a member that had been taken out of moderation, they
are immediately put back in moderation. It has always been because their
email account was compromised. Once that is cleared up they are taken
out of moderation. It is not necessary to moderate each and every post
and member of the group. We have already had members get off topic, most
recently about what we know for sure, i.e., death and taxes. I think
some members needed a little levity as a break from the details of
understanding and setting up IO. I think that is good, and if it becomes
too much all the moderator(s) have to do is post a message to get back
on topic. If a member continually posts after the group was told to get
back on topic, that person can be dealt with individually. It is not
necessary to moderate each and every post of each an every member.
Stan
On 2/18/2018 12:26 PM, Shal Farley wrote:
> Stan,
>
> > Why are we all continually being moderated?
>
> That's answered in GMF's guidelines.
>
> Shal
> GMF Moderator
>
>
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Re: Groups.io logos, nomenclature, etc.
I chimed in before because I'm new here and was also pondering the nomenclature, as I think about migrating users.
I see a couple recent threads where people abbreviated this system 'GIO'.?
Maybe try "Our GIO group..." (pronounced 'Geo')?
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Re: Groups.io logos, nomenclature, etc.
Bruce, One thing I'm struggling with as we migrate...how to cleanly advertise
this on our web page and in our newsletter? Not exactly what you asked, but see also the Promote section of your group (under Admin) if you haven't. Calling it "our groups.io group" doesn't exactly roll off the tongue,
either. Too true. In a context where you're not contrasting it with a Yahoo Group you could simply shorten it to "group" or "email list" (or just "list"). Or maybe "forum" if you want to emphasize the web presence, even though Groups.io is not a forum system in the normal usage of that word. I've often seen the usage "our IO Group", to contrast with "our Yahoo Group". I'm not comfortable with that usage because it miscasts IO as the hosting company, where in fact it is merely the top-level domain for the service. On the other hand I don't have a better answer. Shal -- Help: /static/helpMore Help: /g/GroupManagersForum/wikiEven More Help: Search button at the top of Messages list
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Shal,
Okay, I now remember reading this:
"All messages sent to GMF are moderated. This is done to avoid malicious attachments, spam, off-topic messages, and messages from spoofed or compromised mail accounts. Despite these measures, be aware that the bad guys are clever so there's no guarantee that we'll always succeed; you are encouraged to be vigilant against any and all threats arriving via email. Your GMF moderators make no guarantees regarding the safety of emails arriving from this or any other Groups.io address."
But that still begs the question. I can understand moderating to eliminate spoofed (I don't know what that means) or compromised mail accounts, but I feel moderation is being carried beyond what I would say most moderators do in their own discussion group. Once I know a member is not a spammer, and I know the person is not using the group to push an offensive agenda they are taken out of moderation. If the individual becomes malicious, there are ways of dealing with that, the ultimate step being to place them in moderation status again. It is not necessary to moderate each and every post of every member of the group. If spam starts coming from a member that had been taken out of moderation, they are immediately put back in moderation. It has always been because their email account was compromised. Once that is cleared up they are taken out of moderation. It is not necessary to moderate each and every post and member of the group. We have already had members get off topic, most recently about what we know for sure, i.e., death and taxes. I think some members needed a little levity as a break from the details of understanding and setting up IO. I think that is good, and if it becomes too much all the moderator(s) have to do is post a message to get back on topic. If a member continually posts after the group was told to get back on topic, that person can be dealt with individually. It is not necessary to moderate each and every post of each an every member.
Stan
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On 2/18/2018 12:26 PM, Shal Farley wrote: Stan,
Why are we all continually being moderated? That's answered in GMF's guidelines.
Shal
GMF Moderator
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Stan, I am confused by the use of the term 'Archives'.
...
Are they referring just to all the messages going back to the start of
the group ... listed in the Messages choice? Correct. It is used informally to refer to the messages stored in the group. In Y!Groups the UI calls it "Conversations". In Groups.io the equivalent is "Messages" and/or "Topics". Various other list services I think do use the term "archive" for the stored messages. I think the informal usage in Groups (both brands) is in part trying to make a distinction between the semi-permanent storage in the group ("archive") versus one's personal email Inbox and/or folders. ... is the problem of learning how to access the 'Archives' just how
to find the messages one is interested in? Yes, although the Y!Group member may also be concerned about the steps necessary to get to that point: signing up for an account and logging in. Which in Y!Groups had always been far too complicated. - Shal -- Help: /static/helpMore Help: /g/GroupManagersForum/wikiEven More Help: Search button at the top of Messages list
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Yes, exactly. An archive of all messages . For example if you search for skypeenglish you will see the messages going from I think 2006 to 2018 those are the message archives.
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On Feb 18, 2018, at 11:28 AM, Stan Gorodenski <stanlep@...> wrote:
I am confused by the use of the term 'Archives'. One individual in my YG is against the move to IO because, among other things, it would require him learning how to access the 'archives.' Maybe it is because I am not a power user, but I do not see any so called 'Archives' in the YG website. The name has also been used here, but I do not see anything in choices and settings of IO that says 'Archives.' What are we referring to when others say 'Archives'? Are they referring just to all the messages going back to the start of the group (in the case of a transfer, the start of the YG) listed in the Messages choice? If so, is the problem of learning how to access the 'Archives' just how to find the messages one is interested in?
Stan
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I am confused by the use of the term 'Archives'. One individual in my YG is against the move to IO because, among other things, it would require him learning how to access the 'archives.' Maybe it is because I am not a power user, but I do not see any so called 'Archives' in the YG website. The name has also been used here, but I do not see anything in choices and settings of IO that says 'Archives.' What are we referring to when others say 'Archives'? Are they referring just to all the messages going back to the start of the group (in the case of a transfer, the start of the YG) listed in the Messages choice? If so, is the problem of learning how to access the 'Archives' just how to find the messages one is interested in?
Stan
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Stan, Why are we all continually being moderated? That's answered in GMF's guidelines. Shal GMF Moderator -- Help: /static/helpMore Help: /g/GroupManagersForum/wikiEven More Help: Search button at the top of Messages list
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I created four subgroups. I think what would be desirable is to color code the messages with a different color for each subgroup, with something like a hashtag that would be fixed at the beginning of each message, something like #Ast. I thought making a hashtag required in settings would do it, but it does not. It forces each member to add a hashtag which would be an inconvenience for them, plus I have it set up so only I can add hashtags. Is there anyway to automatically color code the messages in a subgroup?
Stan
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I doubt the moderators will let this message go through and so I will be surprised if it does.
Why are we all continually being moderated? In the groups I run and probably in those others run a new member is taken out of moderation status after a few posts. Here, we are continually being moderated which I do not like at all. The members of this list are high quality people who have a lot of skills and knowledge just by virtue of the fact that they are creating discussion groups. Instead, we are being treated like children who might throw a tantrum and have to be continually watched. I find this very offensive. When I first joined this group one responder to a question treated me like I was a dummy. We obviously had a personality conflict. When I tried to defend myself I did it very politely and did not attack this individual in any manner whatsoever, but my message was not approved. The moderator said he regretted he had not watched the other person more closely, but I was the one who was targeted. Now, again, as part of the frivolity on a topic within the past day, my post was not approved. There was absolutely nothing offensive about it. I just added to the frivolity. Yet my post was not approved but the other person's post, which my post was based on, was approved.
I find this continual moderation very offensive. We are adults. If someone gets out of line or too far off topic, all a moderator has to do is remind the group to stay on topic, not continually moderate each and every message all of us send which, I think, is very biased. I could point to posts showing it is biased.
Stan
[Mod note: while in most groups a complaint like this would be considered off-topic GMF's mission is to discuss issues of group management. Just don't take it personally nor take issue with other members.]
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Re: Groups.io logos, nomenclature, etc.
On Sun, Feb 18, 2018 at 10:04 am, Don wrote:
Yahoo Groups group is no easier than Groups.io groups to me.
True, but in my experience, most people simply say "Our Yahoo group..." :-) Cheers.
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Don Grass
Shal Farley
Sarah k Alawami