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Re: Why no List-Post: header?

 

I'm not a member of that group and don't really feel the need to be involved in the development of the program. However, I think this change is not a good one for my lists, and I suspect they way most people use their email. That is when you reply to a message from a list you assume it will go to the list. Other lists that I'm on that don't behave this way have greatly reduced discussions because few, if any, replies go to the list as a whole. That is fine if the purpose of the list is just for announcements, but if it is meant to be a discussion list then that seems counterproductive.

Would it be appropriate to send my observation to [email protected] or is there some other more appropriate place to do so?

Jonathan

On 12/15/2017 9:18 PM, Duane wrote:
On Fri, Dec 15, 2017 at 07:12 pm, Jonathan Sivier wrote:
When did this change take place?
It was changed Dec 14 at about noon CST as noted in the thread that Shal referred to, /g/GroupManagersForum/message/3008.? If I were you, I'd post your 'complaint' there so Mark can consider reversing his decision to add this.
Duane
Re: Why no List-Post: header?

 

On Fri, Dec 15, 2017 at 07:12 pm, Jonathan Sivier wrote:
When did this change take place?
It was changed Dec 14 at about noon CST as noted in the thread that Shal referred to, /g/GroupManagersForum/message/3008.? If I were you, I'd post your 'complaint' there so Mark can consider reversing his decision to add this.

Duane
Re: Why no List-Post: header?

 

Now that you mention it it appears that a simple Reply, as I and I suspect nearly everyone on my lists do, replies only to the sender. You have to select Reply List to actually send to the whole list. This seems to be an incorrect action when the group is set to Reply to Group. The default to should be to reply to the whole list and reply to individual sender only when an extra action is taken. When did this change take place? I don't think I noticed it before. I think this will be a problem with some of my groups. It will effectively kill, or at least greatly reduce discussion, having replies to a group message go only to the original sender. Is there a way to work around this other than try to train everyone to select Reply List?

Jonathan

On 12/15/2017 5:33 PM, Shal Farley wrote:
All,
Any Thunderbird users out there? Anyone else notice a change in the behavior of "Reply" when responding via email to messages in discussion groups?
I'm sure most of you are readers of beta@, so for you this is old news. Mark took Drew's suggestion and added the List-Post field to message headers sent by Groups.io.

So my question is: has anyone else noticed a change, and have any comment on it?
Gmail's web interface does not seem to do anything differently. My guess is that most other webmail interfaces won't either. It may only be email client applications that make use of this header field.
Shal
Re: Why no List-Post: header?

 

Yes, I use Thunderbird, and I get a "Reply List" with a dropdown, which offers, in addition to "Reply List", "Reply All" and "Reply".? The last one, "Reply" addresses only the sender.

Cacky

On 12/15/2017 5:33 PM, Shal Farley wrote:
All,

Any Thunderbird users out there? Anyone else notice a change in the behavior of "Reply" when responding via email to messages in discussion groups?

I'm sure most of you are readers of beta@, so for you this is old news. Mark took Drew's suggestion and added the List-Post field to message headers sent by Groups.io.


So my question is: has anyone else noticed a change, and have any comment on it?

Gmail's web interface does not seem to do anything differently. My guess is that most other webmail interfaces won't either. It may only be email client applications that make use of this header field.

Shal
Re: Why no List-Post: header?

 

All,

Any Thunderbird users out there? Anyone else notice a change in the behavior of "Reply" when responding via email to messages in discussion groups?

I'm sure most of you are readers of beta@, so for you this is old news. Mark took Drew's suggestion and added the List-Post field to message headers sent by Groups.io.


So my question is: has anyone else noticed a change, and have any comment on it?

Gmail's web interface does not seem to do anything differently. My guess is that most other webmail interfaces won't either. It may only be email client applications that make use of this header field.

Shal
Re: What will you do with your Y! Groups?

 

bill,

We are constrained a bit because the original, and sole, owner of
the group, lost his login credentials, which are associated with a
non-yahoo address and yahoo won't let him recover them.
If he can still receive messages at that non-Yahoo address then he can transfer his ownership to a new Yahoo account, recovering his ability to control the group.

Contact us in GMF's sister group on Yahoo if you want to follow up on how to do that.


Shal
Re: Group sends 2 messages

 

Jeremy,

It¡¯s every post by someone other than me.

I get two copies of messages. One that goes to the group and to me,
and one that goes just to the group which I am part of.
The screen-shots you sent me off-list show that the sender sent the message to both you directly, and to the group. So that's why you received it twice.

The question then becomes, "why did the sender do that?"

1) One possible answer is that the sender has been "trained" by prior experience to always use "Reply All" when replying to a mailing list.

2) Maybe the sender has their email interface set to use Reply-All by default.

3) Maybe your group has "Group and Sender" selected in the Reply To option.

Both 1 & 2 seem unlikely to be true of all members, but it might be the case if there's some common heritage in the membership of your group.

The third you've said is not true.

So I'm out of guesses.

Shal
Re: invite list has to be approved?

 

Sarah,

I guess they weed out the bad email addresses maybe?
Yes.

The invitations are tracked for delivery success, any rejection by the invitee's email service gets fed into Groups.io's bounce processing system. I think you'll see that both in the group's Activity Log and in the bounce indicators in the Members list.

Shal
Re: Group sends 2 messages

 

[Dang, this was intended to be on-list. Burned by a change currently being discussed in beta@]

Jeremy,

The group has the Reply To set to ¡°Group¡±. I want any replay to a
message sent to the email address for the group to go to all members.
That's a typical setting for discussion groups, but doesn't explain why you're receiving two copies of every post.

Is it every post? Or just some of them?

Shal
Re: invite list has to be approved?

 

J (jkm),

The 20/day is a trigger for when approval is required, not an actual
rate limit on the approvals.
In what sort of circumstances would approval be required for
invitations? I must be missing something, here.
That's the answer. Approval is required when inviting more than 20 addresses in a day (probably 24-hours, not calendar, but I'm not sure of that).

Shal
Re: invite list has to be approved?

 

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When I uploaded my list of 300 members ?to for invites I had to wait until they were approved by then sent out.?That was done I think with in about 2-3 hours. ?All invites got sent out and I have everyone back on the list including some new members to. I guess they weed out the bad email addresses maybe?

On Dec 15, 2017, at 12:33 AM, jkm <jkmoffat@...> wrote:


?

On Dec 14, 2017, at 03:11 PM, Shal Farley <shals2nd@...> wrote:

...., when approves your uploaded Invite list they are all
approved at once.

The 20/day is a trigger for when approval is required, not an actual
rate limit on the approvals.

In what sort of circumstances would approval be required for invitations??? I must be missing something, here.

J
Re: invite list has to be approved?

jkm
 


?

On Dec 14, 2017, at 03:11 PM, Shal Farley <shals2nd@...> wrote:

...., when Groups.io approves your uploaded Invite list they are all
approved at once.

The 20/day is a trigger for when approval is required, not an actual
rate limit on the approvals.

In what sort of circumstances would approval be required for invitations??? I must be missing something, here.

J
Re: Group sends 2 messages

J_Catlady
 

I have a mental image of us being in lifeboats welcoming hundreds (?) of sudden yahoo survivors on board....maybe goes along with my image of yahoo as the Deepwater Horizon from the other night ;)
--
J
Re: invite list has to be approved?

 

Ah good, so I did it right then 2 months ago. Goody gum drops.

On Dec 14, 2017, at 12:10 PM, Shal Farley <shals2nd@...> wrote:

Sarah,

Woops, I uploaded the text file for my group about 2 months ago. Will
they just be sent 20 invites per day at a time?
No, when Groups.io approves your uploaded Invite list they are all approved at once.

The 20/day is a trigger for when approval is required, not an actual rate limit on the approvals.

Shal
Re: Group sends 2 messages

Jeremy Dummler
 

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Hello Shai,
The group has the Reply To set to ¡°Group¡±. I want any replay to a message sent to the email address for the group to go to all members.

Jeremy

On Dec 14, 2017, at 7:14 PM, Shal Farley <shals2nd@...> wrote:

Jeremy,

When someone sends a message to my ?group, I get two copies.? One to the group, and one to the group and me.? How do I shut off one of those?

Are these messages replies to something you posted? If so I think either 1) your group has its Reply To set to "Group and Sender", or 2) the respondent is using the "Reply All" feature of their email interface. In either case you would be receiving one copy directly from the respondent (the one that is to the group and you), and one copy as a member of the group (the one that is only to the group). These two messages should differ in t hat the one direct from the respondent would not have the group footers at the bottom (except it might have a quoted copy of them).

If you mean all posts to the group then something else is going on, and I'd need more info to figure out what.

Shal
Re: Group sends 2 messages

 

Jeremy,

When someone sends a message to my ?group, I get two copies.? One to the group, and one to the group and me.? How do I shut off one of those?

Are these messages replies to something you posted? If so I think either 1) your group has its Reply To set to "Group and Sender", or 2) the respondent is using the "Reply All" feature of their email interface. In either case you would be receiving one copy directly from the respondent (the one that is to the group and you), and one copy as a member of the group (the one that is only to the group). These two messages should differ in t hat the one direct from the respondent would not have the group footers at the bottom (except it might have a quoted copy of them).

If you mean all posts to the group then something else is going on, and I'd need more info to figure out what.

Shal
Group sends 2 messages

Jeremy Dummler
 

¿ªÔÆÌåÓý

Hello,
When someone sends a message to my ?group, I get two copies. ?One to the group, and one to the group and me. ?How do I shut off one of those?

Thanks!
Jeremy
Re: large numbers bouncing

 

Rachel,

Maybe the Yahoo numbers were off the whole time and I'd have no way to
know -- but I'm wondering if anyone else saw a huge uptick in bouncing
emails?
It wasn't huge in my case, but after the transfer of two of my groups I saw several email addresses move to bouncing. I believe that these were addresses that had in fact "gone bad" but for whatever reason Yahoo had failed to set them on bouncing status.

Do folks message these people directly? I don't have too much faith in
a "bounce probe".
I tried sending to a couple of them directly, but for most I just looked at the Reason given for the Recent Bounces (in the member's Email Delivery tab).

For example "554 delivery error: dd This user doesn't have a yahoo.com account" - reasons like that I accepted at face value: I don't expect that a direct message would be any different.

Also, since these were groups of people who know each other IRL, in many cases I was able to verify that the person had another membership under a working address.

Shal
Re: invite list has to be approved?

 

Sarah,

Woops, I uploaded the text file for my group about 2 months ago. Will
they just be sent 20 invites per day at a time?
No, when Groups.io approves your uploaded Invite list they are all approved at once.

The 20/day is a trigger for when approval is required, not an actual rate limit on the approvals.

Shal
large numbers bouncing

 

I moved two groups of about 1400 members ... the YahooGroups showed no bouncing members but now that we are on IO I have
70 and 61 bouncing members .. Maybe the Yahoo numbers were off the whole time and I'd have no way to know -- but I'm wondering if anyone
else saw a huge uptick in bouncing emails?

Do folks message these people directly? I don't have too much faith in a "bounce probe".

Thanks,
Rachel
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