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Back on Y!, in a group that didn't permit attachments, messages with no plain text parts weren't posted. That meant a message containing nothing but an attachment... or nothing but an HTML part (which is sent as an attachment) wouldn't be posted. But a message sent as both plain text and HTML would be posted.

How does Groups.io handle message posting in groups that don't permit attachments?

Thanks.

Jim H

On Tue, Jul 10, 2018 at 10:28 am, Jean Coffinberry wrote:

So there is no other way to confirm I am in this queue?

The longest delay in the process is waiting for the transfer agent to accept your invitation.?It is a manual step that requires solving a CAPTCHA.

At times, the Yahoo transfer queue has been as much as three weeks deep.

See also?/g/GroupManagersForum/message/8697?

Bruce?
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The system Help is your friend.??/static/help

I just had a member in the group I own send me a private email with the following quote:
"Speaking of rule changes, can we stop the Netzero attacks with the dubious ads in the text?? I clicked on a few and they are reminding me of snake oil salesmen of the way past.? How to get rich etc. is really how to get me rich by you buying my book or something similar.

I realized that if I send the message to zoho's quarantine queue, I can see the headers there.? I removed the white list and send a test message.? This is interesting.

X-ZohoMail-DKIM: fail (Signature date is -18 seconds in the future.)

Someone has a time server issue!? How to figure out which one?

The rest of the headers.

"DKIM is an authentication technology (digital signature), so I would expect that setting it up in your email provider would affect the messages you send TO Groups.io, not the messages you receive FROM Groups.io."

That is why I am wondering if something changed with groups.io.

"presume you're seeing this in the "Email Delivery History" of the Subscription page (or in your Members record) in one of your groups? That's where bounce-related info goes. If somewhere else, please explain."

Yes. My own email account history.

"Do you find any exceptions? Do messages from people using Yahoo Mail or AOL, for example, get through? If so that would tend to confirm the idea that the problem is a conflict in the From versus the sender."

I am the only one who notices it. Yahoo and Gmail accounts are fine. I am pretty sure it is the "From". Which, again, is why I am wondering what may have changed at Groups.IO. I have been using Zoho for about a year now. I was doing my own hosting before that. Got tired of managing a mail server and decided to do the cloud thing. :-) It was working great until the end of May. I own 2 active groups.io lists and 1 that I use for testing features. This happened in both groups at the same time.

Is there a way to get a more complete bounce message with headers rather than the short version in the Email Delivery History? That is what Zoho is asking me for.

On Jul 10, 2018, at 1:03 PM, Shal Farley <shals2nd@...> wrote:

I'm not certain, actually, what happens if that's used in conjunction with Plain Text Only. It may be that it would first force the incoming message to plain text, then convert the outgoing message to HTML.

I’ll try all those options and see what happens. I use Plain Text because we don’t allow attachments. When I was using HTML people were not attaching things but dragging them into the email or pasting them in. My biggest objection personally is that the emails become image heavy and ugly. People begin emailing just to send images — like Facebook sharing. It gives them some thing to say.

Is there anyway to prevent that?

I have a program that scans email for viruses — and it finds 3-4 every month just on spam. So it’s still a problem.

The new footers have my subscribers talking about how great YahooGroups was. It’s rose-colored glasses but it is the lack of a reply to sender that is the big complaint right now.

?Odd. Since I don't see that in any of my Y!Group footers. Unless they're talking about Fully Featured Digests. In which case Groups.io is the same.

That was my response but I didn’t go check it.

To use the reply on website, they have to sign in and most have never done that.

?Easy-peasy. ?Tell them to just use the Email me a link to login feature. Receive the message, click on the link, done. Logged in with no password or account setup required. They stay logged in for up to 30 days, so they don't have to do that for every reply.

I think that would be just as bothersome for them. If I develop some of the website resources they might not mind because there would be more to go there for.

Sharon

So there is no other way to confirm I am in this queue?

Sharon,
The Reply To links are dynamically generated for each message.? It would not be possible to put them in a group footer.? You could in the beta group that those links be added to the plain text footer.
I agree that both footers should provide the same links (odd that they do not).
More info on footers here if you haven't found it yet ->?/g/GroupManagersForum/wiki/Footers#Unformatted-28plain-text29-Individual-Message
Thanks
Toby

PS I notice the Beta group uses plain text.? The GMF group uses html.??

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On Tue, Jul 10, 2018 at 09:34 am, Jean Coffinberry wrote:

I applied to start a Yahoo group transfer over 24 hours ago and have not heard back about making GIO an admin to further the transfer process.
Is there a way to confirm that I am in the queue for this?

You will receive an email at the +owner address of your new group when that point of the process is reached.

See also?/g/GroupManagersForum/message/6662?

Regards,
Bruce?
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The system Help is your friend.??/static/help

I applied to start a Yahoo group transfer over 24 hours ago and have not heard back about making GIO an admin to further the transfer process.
Is there a way to confirm that I am in the queue for this?
Thanks,?

jean

The reason for using Reply-To: is that most of the members just reply
to messages, even when the content of the message states to contact
someone else. Reply-To: takes it out of their hands.

Yes, you might be changing the reply default, however although I have my groups set up to “Reply to Sender”, many people do what they have to in order to reply to the group instead.

That said, I agree that your best bet is still to have your group set to “Reply to Sender”, and have the person who wants the replies send the message.

What is the protection that a third party Reply-To email address wants the replies?
Why would Groups.io want to enable such a SPAMMING prone tool?

View/Reply Online (#67077) | Reply To Sender | Reply To Group | Mute This Topic | New Topic

Your Subscription | Contact Group Owner | Unsubscribe

How do I figure out what the links are for these in order to add them back to the footer for a group with plain text messages?

When I click on the links, they do what they are supposed to do so I can’t see the link.

The new footers have my subscribers talking about how great YahooGroups was. It’s rose-colored glasses but it is the lack of a reply to sender that is the big complaint right now. To use the reply on website, they have to sign in and most have never done that.

Sharon
----
Sharon Villines
[email protected]
"Neighbors Talking to Neighbors”
Takoma Park DC and MD

As a native Spanish speaker, I would love to help groups.io be available in other languages.
I have members who cannot understand what the platform says but they would be very engaged in the topics.

Received from David M at 7/10/2018 09:05 AM UTC:

It may be useful for those with good intentions, but it's a bad thing because it overrides the settings the Owner/Moderator thought he was making when deciding whether responses should be directed to the group or to the author being replied to. And - as one example - imagine engaging (foolishly) in a "candid" discussion about your boss and then have someone set the boss as the "Reply-to:" address.

You too seem to have overlooked that this is an announcement group. Only the admin can send messages to it, and any replies go only to the admin. If the admin chooses to add a Reply-To: for an individual message, this is a good thing, because it saves him/her having to forward all the incoming replies to someone else.

I overlooked nothing.

If subscribers to any group - announcement or discussion or whatever - expect replies to go only to the admin... or to the group... or to the poster being replied to... then I think it's improper to allow the admin or a subscriber to direct them elsewhere via embedded "Reply-to:" headers. Granted any party receiving email from the group is capable of redirecting it manually, but I think Groups.io shouldn't become a party to it.

Anyone is currently capable of forwarding messages they receive to anyone they want to, and I believe that's how Groups.io should require them to handle the sort of message redirection you're asking for. That also (usually) provides a record of WHO caused the redirect. That's also a good thing.

Expanding on my concern... when I left Y!, I left Y! behind. Groups.io is what it is... and what it is is better by far than Y! in more areas than reliability. Groups.io can be improved - the search facility currently being discussed is one example - but I'd rather not see some of the bad aspects of Y! brought to Groups.io just because some found them convenient on Y!.

Jim H

Received from David M at 7/10/2018 09:10 AM UTC:

The reason for using Reply-To: is that most of the members just reply to messages, even when the content of the message states to contact someone else. Reply-To: takes it out of their hands.

David

In that EXACT situation --- responders being clearly told in every message to reply to Person X, and only Person X's email address is in this "Reply-to:" that you want to add --- the "Reply-to:" you want wouldn't be a problem.

HOWEVER... a potential problem arises when Groups.io makes this facility available to people who don't make it clear that a response won't go to the location that responders expect it to go. That creates the potential for abuse. There's no need to create this potential when there are other ways ---
admittedly less convenient --- to forward this email. Or perhaps Person X could send the announcements in the first place and you could set the group to reply only to the OP (Person X).

Was this abused on Y!? I can say from personal experience that abuse was attempted, but failed due to the responders being situationally aware.

Jim H

Another way to approach this problem is: what are the criteria for io to decide if the yahoogroup name I enter for a transfer is valid or not? Are these criteria detailed somewhere? Is this group name field case-sensitive?

Hi Bruce, I've been using one email address only, all the time, and there are no pending transfers. There's no reasonable explanation for the error message.

Kind regards,
Heijo

Received from Shal Farley at 7/9/2018 07:33 AM UTC:

David,

In Yahoo Groups, I could put a Reply-To: header in the message I sent, and when people replied, it would go to that address.

I thought I knew Y!Groups inside and out, but this is a new one on me.

I don't know if there may be some combinations of settings that prevents this from working, but it has worked for all my old Y! groups for many years.

It may be useful for those with good intentions, but it's a bad thing because it overrides the settings the Owner/Moderator thought he was making when deciding whether responses should be directed to the group or to the author being replied to. And - as one example - imagine engaging (foolishly) in a "candid" discussion about your boss and then have someone set the boss as the "Reply-to:" address.

You too seem to have overlooked that this is an announcement group. Only the admin can send messages to it, and any replies go only to the admin. If the admin chooses to add a Reply-To: for an individual message, this is a good thing, because it saves him/her having to forward all the incoming replies to someone else.

I'm glad Groups.io inserts a "Reply-to:" header that I assume overwrites any "Reply-to:" a sender may insert.

But it doesn't always! Look at the headers.

In the context of discussion groups where the Owner is given a setting to determine reply-to behavior, the Yahoo behavior is "broken." I'd hope Groups.io never considers implementing it.

As I said, this is an announcement group...

David