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I had an odd experience a few nights ago. Rather than go straight home
from work, I went to a certain branch of my bank to get some cash. This
part wasn’t the problem--the route from work to the bank is very
straightforward, and I’ve done it before. The plan was to go from the
bank to these destinations:
Destination A: Cafe about a mile from the bank, where I planned to get a
bite to eat.
Destination B: Bookstore 2 or 3 miles from the cafe, where I was going
to an author’s appearance.
Destination C: Home, ~15 miles from the bookstore.
What made this tricky was that this was all in a neighborhood with which
I’m not very familiar. I had literally never been to the cafe and the
bookstore. I printed out hard copy Bing Maps directions, and it turned
out to be good that I did.
When I tried to go from the bank to the cafe, neither navigation app I
tried (Waze and Apple Maps) was able to interpret and accept the
destination. I had to rely on the printed directions. When I tried to
set a destination for the bookstore and later for home, it was the same
story. Waze did give me occasional warnings like “railroad tracks
ahead” and “stalled vehicle ahead,” as it normally does.
After the reading, I had no luck entering my home address as the
destination. At this point it was too dark to read the printed
directions. I guessed, correctly, that if I followed a certain nearby
street westward, it would lead me into an arterial with which I was
familiar, and I’d be able to get home with no help from the iPhone. I
put the phone in the cupholder on the console. At a couple of points I
took a quick look at it, and the navigation app did show where I was. I
assume that without knowing my destination, it couldn’t use my current
location to direct me.
Why would something like this happen? Was it a fluke of the moment, or
would it be likely to happen in that neighborhood again? The
neighborhood is pretty far out of my way, and I was there only because I
was very interested in the reading. I don’t really have the time to
make another trip there to test the hypothesis. FWIW, my wireless
carrier is T-Mobile. Thanks for your thoughts.
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What map app are you using? If you are not using Waze you are missing the best app.
I had an odd experience a few nights ago. Rather than go straight home
from work, I went to a certain branch of my bank to get some cash. This
part wasn’t the problem--the route from work to the bank is very
straightforward, and I’ve done it before. The plan was to go from the
bank to these destinations:
Destination A: Cafe about a mile from the bank, where I planned to get a
bite to eat.
Destination B: Bookstore 2 or 3 miles from the cafe, where I was going
to an author’s appearance.
Destination C: Home, ~15 miles from the bookstore.
What made this tricky was that this was all in a neighborhood with which
I’m not very familiar. I had literally never been to the cafe and the
bookstore. I printed out hard copy Bing Maps directions, and it turned
out to be good that I did.
When I tried to go from the bank to the cafe, neither navigation app I
tried (Waze and Apple Maps) was able to interpret and accept the
destination. I had to rely on the printed directions. When I tried to
set a destination for the bookstore and later for home, it was the same
story. Waze did give me occasional warnings like “railroad tracks
ahead” and “stalled vehicle ahead,” as it normally does.
After the reading, I had no luck entering my home address as the
destination. At this point it was too dark to read the printed
directions. I guessed, correctly, that if I followed a certain nearby
street westward, it would lead me into an arterial with which I was
familiar, and I’d be able to get home with no help from the iPhone. I
put the phone in the cupholder on the console. At a couple of points I
took a quick look at it, and the navigation app did show where I was. I
assume that without knowing my destination, it couldn’t use my current
location to direct me.
Why would something like this happen? Was it a fluke of the moment, or
would it be likely to happen in that neighborhood again? The
neighborhood is pretty far out of my way, and I was there only because I
was very interested in the reading. I don’t really have the time to
make another trip there to test the hypothesis. FWIW, my wireless
carrier is T-Mobile. Thanks for your thoughts.
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What happens if you try to plan that route now, back at home, or indeed anywhere else you might be?
Otto
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On 3 Sep 2024, at 03:37, Andrew Buc via groups.io <abuc@...> wrote:
I had an odd experience a few nights ago. Rather than go straight home from work, I went to a certain branch of my bank to get some cash. This part wasn’t the problem--the route from work to the bank is very straightforward, and I’ve done it before. The plan was to go from the bank to these destinations:
Destination A: Cafe about a mile from the bank, where I planned to get a bite to eat.
Destination B: Bookstore 2 or 3 miles from the cafe, where I was going to an author’s appearance.
Destination C: Home, ~15 miles from the bookstore.
What made this tricky was that this was all in a neighborhood with which I’m not very familiar. I had literally never been to the cafe and the bookstore. I printed out hard copy Bing Maps directions, and it turned out to be good that I did.
When I tried to go from the bank to the cafe, neither navigation app I tried (Waze and Apple Maps) was able to interpret and accept the destination. I had to rely on the printed directions. When I tried to set a destination for the bookstore and later for home, it was the same story. Waze did give me occasional warnings like “railroad tracks ahead” and “stalled vehicle ahead,” as it normally does.
After the reading, I had no luck entering my home address as the destination. At this point it was too dark to read the printed directions. I guessed, correctly, that if I followed a certain nearby street westward, it would lead me into an arterial with which I was familiar, and I’d be able to get home with no help from the iPhone. I put the phone in the cupholder on the console. At a couple of points I took a quick look at it, and the navigation app did show where I was. I assume that without knowing my destination, it couldn’t use my current location to direct me.
Why would something like this happen? Was it a fluke of the moment, or would it be likely to happen in that neighborhood again? The neighborhood is pretty far out of my way, and I was there only because I was very interested in the reading. I don’t really have the time to make another trip there to test the hypothesis. FWIW, my wireless carrier is T-Mobile. Thanks for your thoughts.
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Andrew said that he used Waze & Apple Maps, and both failed to recognise the destinations, presumably from each previous one.
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What map app are you using? If you are not using Waze you are missing the best app.
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Will Waze work through CarPlay? ?My Subaru has a nice big screen and voice through the audio system. ?Never tried anything but Maps. ?It works fine, but if Waze is better, I’d like to try it.
?
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Cathy, I use Waze through?carplay in my 2024 Nissan Kicks.
Will Waze work through CarPlay?? My Subaru has a nice big screen and voice through the audio system.? Never tried anything but Maps.? It works fine, but if Waze is better, I’d like to try it.
?
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It works through CarPlay with the Pioneer receiver I fitted to our ageing car.
Otto
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On 3 Sep 2024, at 18:09, Brent L via groups.io <flapdoodle@...> wrote:
Cathy, I use Waze through carplay in my 2024 Nissan Kicks.
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Sometimes cellular data is down. Most navigation apps for the phone rely on cellular data to resolve and display the results.?
If you use a free standing GPS device, it could have the maps installed on the device or accessed from cellular data.?
Or, but rare, the GPS could be blocked foe certain areas or temporarily for circumstances.?
As Otto, you and the Magic 7-ball suggested, try, again.?
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On Sep 3, 2024, at 10:06, Otto Nikolaus via groups.io <otto.nikolaus@...> wrote:
? Andrew said that he used Waze & Apple Maps, and both failed to recognise the destinations, presumably from each previous one.
Otto
What map app are you using? If you are not using Waze you are missing the best app.
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Waze looks very different to the other mapping apps I’ve used. A great feature is that users can add info that you just won’t get from the others.?
(I didn’t know that it was taken over by Google <>.)
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Will Waze work through CarPlay? ?My Subaru has a nice big screen and voice through the audio system. ?Never tried anything but Maps. ?It works fine, but if Waze is better, I’d like to try it.
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Just for future reference, starting with iOS 17 Apple Maps supports offline maps.
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On Sep 3, 2024, at 2:39?PM, Brent via groups.io <whodo678@...> wrote:
If you use a free standing GPS device, it could have the maps installed on the device or accessed from cellular data.
--
Ben in TX
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I’m thinking that I wasn’t clear earlier—the apps failed to recognize my starting point. I was writing a few days after the fact.
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On 3 Sep 2024, at 6:39, Otto Nikolaus via groups.io wrote: Andrew said that he used Waze & Apple Maps, and both failed to recognise the destinations, presumably from each previous one.
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Apple Maps is not reliable. Google owns both Google Maps and Waze. Both now reflect things like traffic, accidents, and speed traps from the same dataset. The choice between the two comes down to the user interface you prefer. I personally prefer Google Maps because the web interface on desktop is easier for me and transfer a route to my phone is very simple. I've done route planning entirely on my phone in Google Maps and Waze and it doesn't matter much. Whichever makes you happier - the result is the same.
?
With all respect to Andrew, this sounds like a combination of operator error and reliance on a poor tool (Apple Maps).
?
I regularly set up routes with multiple stops, often in off the grid places, without issues. I travel for work a lot so many places in many cars through CarPay and directly on the phone.
?
Every time I try and outsmart the phone it bites me (the decision, not the phone). The last time I got seriously awkward guidance was over fifteen years ago when I was routed down a literal cow path (had to open cattle gates at both ends) in rural Eastern Shore Maryland. The data collection and routing algorithms are better now.
?
dave
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Yes, you said the destination wasn’t accepted, but the result is the same: it needs both (obviously).
It looks like there must’ve been a problem will cell reception at that time where you were.
Otto
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On 4 Sep 2024, at 03:53, Andrew Buc via groups.io <abuc@...> wrote:
I’m thinking that I wasn’t clear earlier—the apps failed to recognize my starting point. I was writing a few days after the fact.
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Otto Nikolaus wrote:
?Yes, you said the destination wasn’t accepted, but the result is the same: it needs both (obviously).
It looks like there must’ve been a problem will cell reception at that time where you were.
Before the map apps existed I had a Garmin GPS mapping device. One of my first App purchases was the TomTom mapping app. Apps like this contain GIGABYTES of mapping data and are (almost) entirely independent of Wifi or Cellular connectivity. They CAN utilize connectivity for add-on functionality like traffic or speed traps, and of course they require GPS reception, but they can get you from Point A to Point B with NO connection to the internet.
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Not really germane to the discussion but I have a Garmin GPS that I use instead of Apple or Google Maps. It’s never let me down but it does help to know where you’re trying to go. :-)
I can download the latest map info for free to keep it current
Dutch
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On Sep 4, 2024, at 1:52?PM, Jim Saklad via groups.io <jimdoc@...> wrote:
Otto Nikolaus wrote:
?Yes, you said the destination wasn’t accepted, but the result is the same: it needs both (obviously).
It looks like there must’ve been a problem will cell reception at that time where you were.
Before the map apps existed I had a Garmin GPS mapping device.
One of my first App purchases was the TomTom mapping app. Apps like this contain GIGABYTES of mapping data and are (almost) entirely independent of Wifi or Cellular connectivity.
They CAN utilize connectivity for add-on functionality like traffic or speed traps, and of course they require GPS reception, but they can get you from Point A to Point B with NO connection to the internet.
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The Magic Earth app has maps for the entire earth. Download the maps for the states and nations that you are interested in, then you will only need the GPS satellites, and not need the internet while traveling. The app is totally free, and has frequent map updates.
Alvin
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On Sep 4, 2024, at 1:52?PM, Jim Saklad via groups.io <jimdoc@...> wrote:
Otto Nikolaus wrote:
?Yes, you said the destination wasn’t accepted, but the result is the same: it needs both (obviously).
It looks like there must’ve been a problem will cell reception at that time where you were.
Before the map apps existed I had a Garmin GPS mapping device.
One of my first App purchases was the TomTom mapping app. Apps like this contain GIGABYTES of mapping data and are (almost) entirely independent of Wifi or Cellular connectivity.
They CAN utilize connectivity for add-on functionality like traffic or speed traps, and of course they require GPS reception, but they can get you from Point A to Point B with NO connection to the internet.
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Don’t see Magic Earth in the App store ?
Dutch
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On Sep 4, 2024, at 3:52?PM, potentmap via groups.io <Alvin.Auerbach@...> wrote:
The Magic Earth app has maps for the entire earth. Download the maps for the states and nations that you are interested in, then you will only need the GPS satellites, and not need the internet while traveling. The app is totally free, and has frequent map updates.
Alvin
On Sep 4, 2024, at 1:52?PM, Jim Saklad via groups.io <jimdoc@...> wrote:
Otto Nikolaus wrote:
?Yes, you said the destination wasn’t accepted, but the result is the same: it needs both (obviously).
It looks like there must’ve been a problem will cell reception at that time where you were.
Before the map apps existed I had a Garmin GPS mapping device.
One of my first App purchases was the TomTom mapping app. Apps like this contain GIGABYTES of mapping data and are (almost) entirely independent of Wifi or Cellular connectivity.
They CAN utilize connectivity for add-on functionality like traffic or speed traps, and of course they require GPS reception, but they can get you from Point A to Point B with NO connection to the internet.
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On 4 Sep 2024, at 12:52, potentmap via groups.io wrote:
The Magic Earth app has maps for the entire earth. Download the maps for the states and nations that you are interested in, then you will only need the GPS satellites, and not need the internet while traveling. The app is totally free, and has frequent map updates.
I’ll have to look into that. It’s occurred to me that there was an Italian restaurant (not where I ate the other night), which has good reviews on Yelp, on the same block as the bookstore. I might be able to justify another trip to that neighborhood to see if I still have navigation problems and have a good Italian dinner.
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There are multiple reasons that the your starting point wasn’t recognized. Most relate to receiving a signal from the GPS satellites. Many things can block the signal, like a parking garage, an overpass, being in a deep canyon or valley, possibly the roof of your vehicle, or extreme weather. The military can for national security reasons can block areas. And of course, not turning the feature on, which I doubt is the case for the OP.
As an aside, I used to fly into MSP, Minneapolis–Saint Paul International Airport, then have to immediately drive to Austin on the southern border. The problem is all the parking, including for the car rentals are in the parking structure. The loop in the airport is always busy, and the freeway on ramp is as you leave the airport, so you have to know which turnoff you need as you leave the airport. Not enough time for the GSP to find the satellites.
I have also driven from SoCal to Portland, Oregon along the coast. In areas along the coast you are too low to acquire enough satellites to determine you location, being too close to a cliff or too deep into a canyon. In this case even though I might have a location, I had no cellular data to put a map behind the pin. Was curious, so I was using both my iPhone and Garmin, with preloaded maps. Thankfully, I had unlimited data at the time, because two days of driving with the iPhone’s GPS on racked up the data.
Brent
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On Sep 3, 2024, at 7:53 PM, Andrew Buc <abuc@...> wrote:
I’m thinking that I wasn’t clear earlier—the apps failed to recognize my starting point. I was writing a few days after the fact.
On 3 Sep 2024, at 6:39, Otto Nikolaus via groups.io wrote:
Andrew said that he used Waze & Apple Maps, and both failed to recognise the destinations, presumably from each previous one.
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Dave,?
Other than your experience in the ice ages of 15 years ago, what exactly causes you to call Apple Maps unreliable? Any current issues? I haven’t seen any particular issues.
About 2001, I built s computer desk/mount for my G4 Pismo, for my vehicle, and used them along with a Garmin GPS antenna on the dash or roof. I think the software was Garmin. It was too many years ago. So once I had the basics down, it worked fine. I used it for a 45-day road trip of 10k miles. Later my standalone Garmin unit, even though I had the lates maps, I found them to often be 2 years out of date. Nice when they permanently close the freeway exit to your hotel and it takes 7 miles to get back to the hotel and reservation. I think that was Iowa.
Brent
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On Sep 4, 2024, at 7:28 AM, Dave Skolnick KO4MI < dave@...> wrote:
Apple Maps is not reliable. Google owns both Google Maps and Waze. Both now reflect things like traffic, accidents, and speed traps from the same dataset. The choice between the two comes down to the user interface you prefer. I personally prefer Google Maps because the web interface on desktop is easier for me and transfer a route to my phone is very simple. I've done route planning entirely on my phone in Google Maps and Waze and it doesn't matter much. Whichever makes you happier - the result is the same.
?
With all respect to Andrew, this sounds like a combination of operator error and reliance on a poor tool (Apple Maps).
?
I regularly set up routes with multiple stops, often in off the grid places, without issues. I travel for work a lot so many places in many cars through CarPay and directly on the phone.
?
Every time I try and outsmart the phone it bites me (the decision, not the phone). The last time I got seriously awkward guidance was over fifteen years ago when I was routed down a literal cow path (had to open cattle gates at both ends) in rural Eastern Shore Maryland. The data collection and routing algorithms are better now.
?
dave
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Brent L
Brent
Dave Skolnick KO4MI
Jim Saklad