Re: Using nitric acid to remove broken taps or drills from aluminum
Linky:? On Mar 20, 2024, at 4:36 PM, Bill Williams <BWMSBLDR1@...> wrote:
I do not know if this has been mentioned but the HSM articles were followed up with a book from Village Press. The author followed up with a wire EDM build. Both very professional!? ?Bill If look at ads some give clue how to build
This is IK
The machine need 220 voolt x 1 amp so you need 220 watts.
In ad it needs tap water ??
Speed is 1/16" diameter death 1/16" in 1 minutes and 50 seconds.?
Dave?
<Screenshot_20240320-113153_Drive.jpg>
mike allen
Mar 19? ?
I would be interested in building one like in this vid something with a nice simple power supply . Too bad that the link is dead for the build . Seems a lot of the builds I see have a power supply that was built for Apollo 12 , & I'm sure that's needed
--?
Bruce Johnson
The less a man knows about how sausages and laws are made, the easier it is to steal his vote and give him botulism.
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Re: Using nitric acid to remove broken taps or drills from aluminum
I do not know if this has been mentioned but the HSM articles were followed up with a book from Village Press. The author followed up with a wire EDM build. Both very professional!? ?Bill
If look at ads some give clue how to build
This is IK
The machine need 220 voolt x 1 amp so you need 220 watts.
In ad it needs tap water ??
Speed is 1/16" diameter death 1/16" in 1 minutes and 50 seconds.?
Dave?
mike allen
Mar 19? ?
I would be interested in building one like in this vid something with a nice simple power supply . Too bad that the link is dead for the build . Seems a lot of the builds I see have a power supply that was built for Apollo 12 , & I'm sure that's needed
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I occasionally use a soldering gun when I need heat beyond the typical electronic soldering iron.? I have also used a resistance soldering unit.? Resistance soldering is MUCH better than a soldering gun because the heat is quickly and efficiently developed within the parts.? With a soldering gun, you still have to depend on heat transfer which can take a long time and end up with more of the part heated.? I think the role of a soldering gun for soldering mechanical parts is merely one step above a conventional soldering iron
However, you can get soldering irons with HUGE tips that can get more heat into the part much faster than a soldering gun.? And for some things, such as soldering small brass parts on a brass model railroad engine, speed is important, or everything heats up and other parts start falling off.? Today, most use resistance soldering, and some might use solders that melt at different temperatures and assemble things in a sequence.? But I have seen assembly line photos of people in Japan in the 1960's building small brass model railroad engines that were soldering tiny parts with these giant soldering irons.? That is how they got a local area real hot real fast before the heat could significantly transfer everywhere else.
Charles E. "Chuck" Kinzer
On Wednesday, March 20, 2024 at 01:31:05 PM PDT, Miket_NYC <mctaglieri@...> wrote:
"you might want to look into resistance soldering. It runs a current through the metal and the heat is very concentrated to just the point being soldered. . . . Not cheap by soldering standards"
I'm wondering, could you use a soldering gun for this?? They essentially use the same method. There's a transformer inside the handle that turns the 110 v. current into low voltage, high amperage current that runs through the copper tip and heats it.?
So you could connect two cables where the tip connects and attach their other ends to the work. That would run the high amperage current through the joint. The cables would have to be fairly heavy so they wouldn't get hot themselves, but I don't know how heavy. (Perhaps speaker cable would work here. It's heavy gauge supposedly for the best sound quality).
I use a Weller soldering gun (the same one I've used since getting it for Christmas at age 12, so they're pretty durable!)? That's 100 Watts. I don't know the wattage you need for resistance soldering, but if a single soldering gun weren't enough, you could hook up several.
Mike Taglieri?
On Wed, Mar 20, 2024, 11:09 AM Aaron Woods < awoods550@...> wrote: If soldering is an option strengthwise, but the issue is heat, then you might want to look into resistance soldering. It runs a current through the metal and the heat is very concentrated to just the point being soldered. It is popular with model railroaders working with small delicate pieces. Not cheap by soldering standards but cheap compared to welders. If you look around there are also some DIY articles.
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"you might want to look into resistance soldering. It runs a current through the metal and the heat is very concentrated to just the point being soldered. . . . Not cheap by soldering standards"
I'm wondering, could you use a soldering gun for this?? They essentially use the same method. There's a transformer inside the handle that turns the 110 v. current into low voltage, high amperage current that runs through the copper tip and heats it.?
So you could connect two cables where the tip connects and attach their other ends to the work. That would run the high amperage current through the joint. The cables would have to be fairly heavy so they wouldn't get hot themselves, but I don't know how heavy. (Perhaps speaker cable would work here. It's heavy gauge supposedly for the best sound quality).
I use a Weller soldering gun (the same one I've used since getting it for Christmas at age 12, so they're pretty durable!)? That's 100 Watts. I don't know the wattage you need for resistance soldering, but if a single soldering gun weren't enough, you could hook up several.
Mike Taglieri?
On Wed, Mar 20, 2024, 11:09 AM Aaron Woods < awoods550@...> wrote: If soldering is an option strengthwise, but the issue is heat, then you might want to look into resistance soldering. It runs a current through the metal and the heat is very concentrated to just the point being soldered. It is popular with model railroaders working with small delicate pieces. Not cheap by soldering standards but cheap compared to welders. If you look around there are also some DIY articles.
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Re: Using nitric acid to remove broken taps or drills from aluminum
If look at ads some give clue how to build This is IK The machine need 220 voolt x 1 amp so you need 220 watts. In ad it needs tap water ?? Speed is 1/16" diameter death 1/16" in 1 minutes and 50 seconds.? Dave? 
mike allen
Mar 19? ?
I would be interested in building one like in this vid something with a nice simple power supply . Too bad that the link is dead for the build . Seems a lot of the builds I see have a power supply that was built for Apollo 12 , & I'm sure that's needed
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General tools used to make a sell a pretty nice 3 piece set of tap
handles . they were like these with eh 2 jaws that grabbed the tap
instead of the threaded , bored & the split cross ways like most cheap
tap sets come with . They were like these Wam mentioned but without the
short shaft that goes into a chuck if needed . A good tap handle is a
huge plus towards getting a thread .
animal
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On 3/20/24 8:34 AM, WAM wrote: Set of two sizes here
On 3/20/2024 11:28 AM, WAM via groups.io wrote:
I have a these -
Mine are the original Walton.? I talked to them a while back and the
company that sold them the unhardened tap handle (so the could drill
the holes in the sides) stopped selling them.
Lo and Behold, knock offs start showing up on ebay.? Viper had a
tutorial on using it on his Youtube page that seems to be gone now.
On the mill or drill press I use a Tapmatic tapping head
On 3/20/2024 10:44 AM, davesmith1800 wrote:
FYI
Power tapping is different.
You have no feel and guy doing tapping does not know anything.
This only by checking the edge of tap.
I can feel the tap head if tap is getting dull but the guy doing
most tapping can not.
Most of it is? first time tapping.
We did a lot tapping from 1/2NC to 7/8NF on blanks cost from $10.00
to thousands.? You get good at tap removal.? But use on this size I
would use fluxcore and remove the tap.
This trick will not work on smaller tap sizes
Dave
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Bill here's some info for ya , I think th ethird post with a link
is the issue ya want .
animal
On 3/19/24 9:37 PM, Bill Williams
wrote:
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Years ago (perhaps as much as 70) Model Engineer
ran an article on building a releasing power tapping machine
from a Sturmey Archer three speed hub gear! I have not been able
to find it since. Anyone who gets lucky please post the
location.? ?Bill
On Sun, Mar 17, 2024 at
11:30?PM davesmith1800 < davesmith1@...>
wrote:
Here
photo?
Attachments:
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Re: Material for riser block
I'd wager to say that the Aliexpress has USA steel ion it's DNA .
I'll have teh check our the Ebay bulk box guys? , thanks for that
one .
animal
On 3/20/24 10:00 AM, Chris Albertson
wrote:
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I think if you do a little math you will see that the force on a
raiser block is very low on our mini-size tools. ? What is the
worst case? ? That would be to make a cut so deep that the spindle
motor comes to a stall. ?THere is not way the machine can generate
more force after that. ? It does not depend on the type of metal
ypou are turning or how fast, the limiting factor is the maximum
torque of the motor and drive belts/gears. ? So if you look at the
stall torque applied the raiser, you find that even plastic is
strong enough and even plastic doesn't need to be solid.
But plastic does not keep dimensional accuracy and it gets
scuffed up over time. ? So, you end up with just any kind of.
Metal, ?even the lowest grade of junk-metal will be over kill. ?
? ?Again, as said before. ?Amazon Prime delivers overnight for
¡°free¡± I¡¯d think that I lived an hour from any place I¡¯d be
dependent on Amazon for most everything.
I while back I converted my Harbor Freight Mini Mill ti full
CNC. ?I simply added three motors and wired them to an older PC.
? I had to design and make some motor mounts. ?If the motor had
a maximum torque of (say) 4 Newton meter my mount only had to
withstand a reaction force of 4 Nm, plus a safty factor of about
2.5. ?As it turns out 3D printed plastic motor mounts will do
that. ? On a large machine these parted would be made of CNC
steel because the motors are very powerfull but I¡¯m using only
NEMA23 size stepper motors to run the lead screws on the mill.
?Plastic works for this. ? ?
Back to metals. ?Salvage is a good source of materials. ?
Junk disk brake rotors are very good. ?Barbell weights are made
from cast iron. They can be cheap if bough used. ?Then I can buy
steel bolts over 1" diameter at Home Depot (or Amazon) ?2-foot
log kind that are made to set into concrete are a good value.
There are also eBay sellers who sell a US Postal Service
fltat rate box filled with metal. ?THese ship for $23 and you
get something like 40 pounds, whatever the max weight of a
domestic flate rate box is.
Look at Aliexpress too. ? Being a Chinese site they mostly
ship from China but Chinese shipping rates are incredibly low. ?
I see I can get a 1/2 meter long 100x25mm chunk of aluminum
alloy for $40 and they charge $3.40 shipping.
That said most of what I make now is ABS plastic. ? I can
print it for 2-cents per gram. ? Some parts must be metal,
bearings and bushing, shafts and gears but much of the parts I
make don¡¯t need the strength and certainly don¡¯t need the weight
of steel.
Consider junked auto parts as a source! You can
probably find something out of a front wheel suspension on
a RWD car that'll yield a big enough piece.
Roy
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Re: Material for riser block
I think if you do a little math you will see that the force on a raiser block is very low on our mini-size tools. ? What is the worst case? ? That would be to make a cut so deep that the spindle motor comes to a stall. ?THere is not way the machine can generate more force after that. ? It does not depend on the type of metal ypou are turning or how fast, the limiting factor is the maximum torque of the motor and drive belts/gears. ? So if you look at the stall torque applied the raiser, you find that even plastic is strong enough and even plastic doesn't need to be solid.
But plastic does not keep dimensional accuracy and it gets scuffed up over time. ? So, you end up with just any kind of. Metal, ?even the lowest grade of junk-metal will be over kill. ? ? ?Again, as said before. ?Amazon Prime delivers overnight for ¡°free¡± I¡¯d think that I lived an hour from any place I¡¯d be dependent on Amazon for most everything.
I while back I converted my Harbor Freight Mini Mill ti full CNC. ?I simply added three motors and wired them to an older PC. ? I had to design and make some motor mounts. ?If the motor had a maximum torque of (say) 4 Newton meter my mount only had to withstand a reaction force of 4 Nm, plus a safty factor of about 2.5. ?As it turns out 3D printed plastic motor mounts will do that. ? On a large machine these parted would be made of CNC steel because the motors are very powerfull but I¡¯m using only NEMA23 size stepper motors to run the lead screws on the mill. ?Plastic works for this. ? ?
Back to metals. ?Salvage is a good source of materials. ? Junk disk brake rotors are very good. ?Barbell weights are made from cast iron. They can be cheap if bough used. ?Then I can buy steel bolts over 1" diameter at Home Depot (or Amazon) ?2-foot log kind that are made to set into concrete are a good value.
There are also eBay sellers who sell a US Postal Service fltat rate box filled with metal. ?THese ship for $23 and you get something like 40 pounds, whatever the max weight of a domestic flate rate box is.
Look at Aliexpress too. ? Being a Chinese site they mostly ship from China but Chinese shipping rates are incredibly low. ? I see I can get a 1/2 meter long 100x25mm chunk of aluminum alloy for $40 and they charge $3.40 shipping.
That said most of what I make now is ABS plastic. ? I can print it for 2-cents per gram. ? Some parts must be metal, bearings and bushing, shafts and gears but much of the parts I make don¡¯t need the strength and certainly don¡¯t need the weight of steel.
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On Mar 19, 2024, at 6:29?PM, Roy via groups.io <roylowenthal@...> wrote:
Consider junked auto parts as a source! You can probably find something out of a front wheel suspension on a RWD car that'll yield a big enough piece.
Roy
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Re: Starrett merger/acquisition
I agree with Starrett.?
I have tried Japanese and Chinese.?
Japanese is next best
Chinese is last in on list.
Dave?
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Miket_NYC
Mar 19? ?
I buy mostly used Starrett, but I've bought new Starrett items that they made overseas. They maintain tight control and the new stuff seems fine.
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Re: Material for riser block
I have use dumbbells or 12L14 both works great.?
A36 is harder to machine it gummy and tears it will also warp too as you machine the block.?
There other materials like 1144? that will work too.?
Dave?
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chrisser Mar 19? ?
I tend to machine whatever I have on hand or can scrounge.
I'd like to make a riser block to replace the compound slide. I figure something like a 2x2x2 cube of steel would be pretty close - I just got a 4-jaw chuck so I should be able to machine it to size on the lathe
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Re: Material for riser block
On Tue, Mar 19, 2024 at 06:00 PM, Phil wrote:
I recently decided to do the same thing but decided to use cast iron for it's properties. Of course I didn't have a piece big enough and wound up on line.
No joke, a 3 inch square hunk of cast iron wound up costing me $72 delivered to my door.
In hindsight, if I were to do it again I would have used the piece of structural Aluminum I have sitting on my bench. It is very hard for Aluminum and would have worked just fine.
Good luck no matter what you wind up using, I just thought I would share a small example of my stupidity....
Not stupid at all, IMO. I had an aluminum 'plinth' riser block on my 7x, and I replaced it with a cast iron block recently. The cast iron's weight definitely seems to make a positive difference. About paying a lot for cast iron- when I was 'whittling' down one end of a 25# dumbbell to get the cast iron block I needed, I would have gladly paid $75 to avoid that work. What a mess!
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Set of two sizes here
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On 3/20/2024 11:28 AM, WAM via groups.io wrote: I have a these -
Mine are the original Walton.? I talked to them a while back and the company that sold them the unhardened tap handle (so the could drill the holes in the sides) stopped selling them.
Lo and Behold, knock offs start showing up on ebay.? Viper had a tutorial on using it on his Youtube page that seems to be gone now.
On the mill or drill press I use a Tapmatic tapping head
On 3/20/2024 10:44 AM, davesmith1800 wrote:
FYI
Power tapping is different.
You have no feel and guy doing tapping does not know anything.
This only by checking the edge of tap.
I can feel the tap head if tap is getting dull but the guy doing most tapping can not.
Most of it is? first time tapping.
We did a lot tapping from 1/2NC to 7/8NF on blanks cost from $10.00 to thousands.? You get good at tap removal.? But use on this size I would use fluxcore and remove the tap.
This trick will not work on smaller tap sizes
Dave
|
I have a these -
Mine are the original Walton.? I talked to them a while back and the company that sold them the unhardened tap handle (so the could drill the holes in the sides) stopped selling them.
Lo and Behold, knock offs start showing up on ebay.? Viper had a tutorial on using it on his Youtube page that seems to be gone now.
On the mill or drill press I use a Tapmatic tapping head
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
On 3/20/2024 10:44 AM, davesmith1800 wrote: FYI
Power tapping is different.
You have no feel and guy doing tapping does not know anything.
This only by checking the edge of tap.
I can feel the tap head if tap is getting dull but the guy doing most tapping can not.
Most of it is? first time tapping.
We did a lot tapping from 1/2NC to 7/8NF on blanks cost from $10.00 to thousands.? You get good at tap removal.? But use on this size I would use fluxcore and remove the tap.
This trick will not work on smaller tap sizes
Dave
|
If soldering is an option strengthwise, but the issue is heat, then you might want to look into resistance soldering. It runs a current through the metal and the heat is very concentrated to just the point being soldered. It is popular with model railroaders working with small delicate pieces. Not cheap by soldering standards but cheap compared to welders. If you look around there are also some DIY articles.
|
FYI?
Power tapping is different.?
You have no feel and guy doing tapping does not know anything.??
This only by checking the edge of tap.
I can feel the tap head if tap is getting dull but the guy doing most tapping can not.
Most of it is? first time tapping.
We did a lot tapping from 1/2NC to 7/8NF on blanks cost from $10.00 to thousands.? You get good at tap removal.? But use on this size I would use fluxcore and remove the tap.
This trick will not work on smaller tap sizes
Dave?
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It is by feel.
The tap feels springy?
You also feel this springy feel is lack of cutting oil or wrong oil.?
Also feel cutting edge?
This springy feel is tap about to break.?
Need to use dark cutting oil for steel and most metals.?
Tool steel and 400 stainless only use a new taps.?
Dave?
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Miket_NYC
5:00am? ?
All you guys have far more experience than me at tapping, so can you answer me a question I've wondered about for years? How do you know when a tap is wearing out? I know new
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All you guys have far more experience than me at tapping, so can you answer me a question I've wondered about for years?? ?How do you know when a tap is wearing out? I know new? taps but far easier than worn taps but looking at them I can't tell the difference between them. (Or maybe I don't know what to look for).
Mike Taglieri?
I do most power on? all sizes of tapping .
I have a drum switch for tapping on my mill for work.?
Dave?
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Re: Using nitric acid to remove broken taps or drills from aluminum
I agree
I can find new transformers that 28 and 24 volt 200 watt about $35.00?
I did post here in a different thread
A lot safer.
Dave?
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Gerald Feldman
Mar 19? ?
You don¡¯t need a complicated power supply ¨C just one that is safe. Look, you are going to have water running over your work and the electrode, and when your skin gets wet its resistance drops and your chance of receiving a painful and possibly dangerous electrical shock increases. SO:
?
1) DO NOT run the current supply directly off the AC line ¨C that is just looking for trouble
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Re: Using nitric acid to remove broken taps or drills from aluminum
Hi Bruce look on line for INTERNET ARCHIVES they have popular mechanics PLUS heaps more that can be downloaded.
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davesmith1800