Re: Using nitric acid to remove broken taps or drills from aluminum
EDM has been around since the 1700's.
You think more written about a simple process.?
What found in pass was 40 to 50 volts DC was good and safe.
I found data some machines use a high frequency to get arc going maybe just for advertising.? This in water and do think the high frequency would help under water.?
Back 1940's to 1970's it was manual feed for tap and drill bit removal.? My research only went back to 1940's.??
The article in magazines I read for low cost used 120 volt and no transformer.?
Today we can use microwave transformer and remove high voltage wire and rewire to 45 volts . About 40 turns of #14 coated wire . The house hold wire dos not work and a wire for coils and transformers.
Dave?
Dave?
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Bill Williams
Mar 17? ?
I read it about 40 years ago in the CC library in Colorado Springs! I am not even sure of the date! Try google say" DIY EDM Cheap" Bill
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Re: Using nitric acid to remove broken taps or drills from aluminum
Interesting, the May 1950 issues is 314 pages - not a typo three hundred fourteen...
Popular Mechanics has it¡¯s full archive on Google Books free to read, and their indexes are pretty good:?
--
Buffalo John
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Correction: $60-$70 replacement part
ralphie
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I've not done any power tapping wit my mini-lathe, but I have with my mini-mill.? I remember once that I had a aluminum bushing holder on a John Deere walk-behind snow blower on my deck that was worn to the point that the bushing was slipping in it.? The replacement part was about $6-$70, so I mounted the holder in the fau-Kurt vise on the mini-mill and and would drill, then tap 3 holes 120¡ã apart around the holder.? With 3 set screws, they held the bushing securely.?
It was a great advantage to be able to drill each hole and follow it with the tap in perfect alignment.
ralphie
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Re: Using nitric acid to remove broken taps or drills from aluminum
Popular Mechanics has it¡¯s full archive on Google Books free to read, and their indexes are pretty good:?
You cannot download articles, but I have a big monitor, so going full screen and blowing up each page of an article I take a screen shot and piece them together. (I have a Mac¡you can set the default screen capture to pdf and set the default location, and the Preview app lets you drag one page into another preview sindow to assemble a multi page pdf. ?I¡¯ve gotten a ton of useful articles from them
An example, apropos of tapping:?
Or an interesting knurling tool that might be useful for a mini-lathe:
I¡±ve spent a lot of time just going through them; for metal working there¡¯s a wealth of information; particularly during the ¡¯40¡¯s, when there¡¯s a number of good articles on machining basics.
It¡¯s interesting to see the trends as you go through the decades. Home-built boats were really big in the ¡®30s, home built aircraft in the ¡¯60¡¯s. On Mar 17, 2024, at 2:06 PM, Charles Kinzer < ckinzer@...> wrote:
There were several references to a "Popular Mechanics" magazine issue with am EDM DIY article even in YouTube comments.? One comment said 1963.? One said 1969.? One said 50's or 60's.? I spent a LOT of time looking for it but came up empty.? It doesn't mean it isn't there, but people may be misremembering.
I finally was able to find an EDM DIY article in the March 1968 issue of "Popular Science" magazine on page 149 titled "EDM:? Space-Age Machining in Your Home Shop."? Sound about right?
Here is a link to that magazine - but it won't help.? You can see the article listed on the contents page, but pages 149 through 154 are MISSING.
I have a sneaking suspicion that the design might have been so hazardous that by some means somebody had it excised.? But if you can get your hands on a physical issue (there are copies on eBay right now and often will be), or find somewhere it is scanned complete, that may be the article people are thinking about.
Charles E. "Chuck" Kinzer
On Sunday, March 17, 2024 at 12:14:47 PM PDT, Bill Williams < bwmsbldr1@...> wrote:
I read it about 40 years ago in the CC library in Colorado Springs! I am not even?sure of the date! Try google say" DIY EDM Cheap"? Bill In my home hobby projects, I've usually only tapped holes in the range from 6-32? up to 1/4-20. The smaller 6-32 and 8-32 taps still make me nervous, even when tapping aluminum. Even when using a guide or tap follower to keep things straight, and using tapping lube, my biggest question has always been "how much torque should I be applying, and how much is too much?" Like many hobbyists, I started out with one of those large sets of "tungsten steel" taps and dies. The taps are typically plug taps, so I find the cut is quite aggressive. I will start off with a hole drilled with the recommended number drill, but more often than not, the tap will not start properly, even if I chamfer the opening of the hole. So, I go up to the next-larger number drill, and try that. Often I have to go up two drill sizes to get the tap to start. I know I'm giving up some thread engagement by doing this, but the results have been acceptable for my projects.
But, this past week, I bought a set of HSS taper taps, from 6-32 to 3/8, from an industrial supplier. I'm hoping that the less-aggressive taper taps will give me more luck in starting the tapping, and less anxiety? when trying to decide how hard to twist the tap wrench.
--? Bruce Johnson
"Wherever you go, there you are." B. Banzai, PhD
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Starrett merger/acquisition
Vid dropped this morning by Mr. Pete about Starrett being acquired.
"ATHOL, MA, March 11, 2024 ¨C The L.S. Starrett Company (¡°Starrett¡± or the ¡°Company¡±) (NYSE: SCX) today announced that it has entered into a definitive merger agreement in a go-private transaction with an affiliate of MiddleGround Capital (¡°MiddleGround¡±) in an all-cash transaction for $16.19 per share."
I don't know if it's necessarily as bad as the video makes it out to be.? Could actually be good for the company.? But it seems like tool companies don't have a history of being better after these sorts of transactions.
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Here photo? 
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I do most power on? all sizes of tapping .
I have a drum switch for tapping on my mill for work.?
Dave?
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Re: Using nitric acid to remove broken taps or drills from aluminum, comment to the remark
I have use a Dremel cutoff wheel but on small taps did work.
One way I used one time on a 2-56 in model airplane engine mount. A broken tap it work using a brass welding rod and grit . Took some time but grind down tap.?
Dave?
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Peter Way
12:55pm? ?
I'm glad to hear about the nitric acid method, although it feels like a last resort.? ?
To prevent tap breakage, I only go forward until the next flute, then back a little to break the chip. Alignment is very important, however you achieve that. On bigger taps you can feel a little resistance.I use a light cutting oil. If I don't have that, I use water. I hear kerosene is good for aluminum.
For removing a small screw or tap, I try to cut a screwdriver slot with a Dremel cutoff wheel. I know it's not always practical.
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Re: Using nitric acid to remove broken taps or drills from aluminum
Another thing that helps is using a short handled tap wrench, it's easier to limit torque.
Roy
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Re: Using nitric acid to remove broken taps or drills from aluminum
I found a site that at least shows a couple pages (p151-152) of the March 1968 Popular Science EDM article.
In referring to the article this is stated:? "The technology is not new, back in 1968?Popular Science?published a simple design that uses only one diode, two capacitors, a pair of lightbulbs (resistors), and almost zero concern for safety."
Charles E. "Chuck" Kinzeer
On Sunday, March 17, 2024 at 02:06:14 PM PDT, Charles Kinzer <ckinzer@...> wrote:
There were several references to a "Popular Mechanics" magazine issue with am EDM DIY article even in YouTube comments.? One comment said 1963.? One said 1969.? One said 50's or 60's.? I spent a LOT of time looking for it but came up empty.? It doesn't mean it isn't there, but people may be misremembering.
I finally was able to find an EDM DIY article in the March 1968 issue of "Popular Science" magazine on page 149 titled "EDM:? Space-Age Machining in Your Home Shop."? Sound about right?
Here is a link to that magazine - but it won't help.? You can see the article listed on the contents page, but pages 149 through 154 are MISSING.
I have a sneaking suspicion that the design might have been so hazardous that by some means somebody had it excised.? But if you can get your hands on a physical issue (there are copies on eBay right now and often will be), or find somewhere it is scanned complete, that may be the article people are thinking about.
Charles E. "Chuck" Kinzer
On Sunday, March 17, 2024 at 12:14:47 PM PDT, Bill Williams <bwmsbldr1@...> wrote:
I read it about 40 years ago in the CC library in Colorado Springs! I am not even?sure of the date! Try google say" DIY EDM Cheap"? Bill
In my home hobby projects, I've usually only tapped holes in the range from 6-32? up to 1/4-20. The smaller 6-32 and 8-32 taps still make me nervous, even when tapping aluminum. Even when using a guide or tap follower to keep things straight, and using tapping lube, my biggest question has always been "how much torque should I be applying, and how much is too much?" Like many hobbyists, I started out with one of those large sets of "tungsten steel" taps and dies. The taps are typically plug taps, so I find the cut is quite aggressive. I will start off with a hole drilled with the recommended number drill, but more often than not, the tap will not start properly, even if I chamfer the opening of the hole. So, I go up to the next-larger number drill, and try that. Often I have to go up two drill sizes to get the tap to start. I know I'm giving up some thread engagement by doing this, but the results have been acceptable for my projects.
But, this past week, I bought a set of HSS taper taps, from 6-32 to 3/8, from an industrial supplier. I'm hoping that the less-aggressive taper taps will give me more luck in starting the tapping, and less anxiety? when trying to decide how hard to twist the tap wrench.
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Lately I have just chucked the tap into my drill and ran it into the piece being tapped, usually steel. This is since I found these:?
Taps of Amazon. I do not use a guide. Just drill the clearance hole and tap all free hand. Ralph?
Actually power tapping is very easy. Just tighten the tap into the tail stock chuck Then back the tail stock?hand wheel?until the chuck releases. Then move the tail stock?and chuck toward the workpiece?and lock in place. Lube the tap, start the lathe, and using your hand push the tap into the work piece. When the tap bottoms out release your grip on the chuce. Stop the lathe and reverse it to back the tap out. The maximum tap I use in steel is 5/16-18. I have done brass using a 3/8-24 tap. John Mattis (retired mechanical engineer)
I'm sorta amazed how many youtube videos show guys tapping under power.
I know it's a bit of a must in a production setting, but I was always taught to tap by hand - ideally using some sort of guide or fixture.
Do you guys do a lot of tapping under power?? Just the idea makes me nervous.
|
Re: Using nitric acid to remove broken taps or drills from aluminum
There were several references to a "Popular Mechanics" magazine issue with am EDM DIY article even in YouTube comments.? One comment said 1963.? One said 1969.? One said 50's or 60's.? I spent a LOT of time looking for it but came up empty.? It doesn't mean it isn't there, but people may be misremembering.
I finally was able to find an EDM DIY article in the March 1968 issue of "Popular Science" magazine on page 149 titled "EDM:? Space-Age Machining in Your Home Shop."? Sound about right?
Here is a link to that magazine - but it won't help.? You can see the article listed on the contents page, but pages 149 through 154 are MISSING.
I have a sneaking suspicion that the design might have been so hazardous that by some means somebody had it excised.? But if you can get your hands on a physical issue (there are copies on eBay right now and often will be), or find somewhere it is scanned complete, that may be the article people are thinking about.
Charles E. "Chuck" Kinzer
On Sunday, March 17, 2024 at 12:14:47 PM PDT, Bill Williams <bwmsbldr1@...> wrote:
I read it about 40 years ago in the CC library in Colorado Springs! I am not even?sure of the date! Try google say" DIY EDM Cheap"? Bill
In my home hobby projects, I've usually only tapped holes in the range from 6-32? up to 1/4-20. The smaller 6-32 and 8-32 taps still make me nervous, even when tapping aluminum. Even when using a guide or tap follower to keep things straight, and using tapping lube, my biggest question has always been "how much torque should I be applying, and how much is too much?" Like many hobbyists, I started out with one of those large sets of "tungsten steel" taps and dies. The taps are typically plug taps, so I find the cut is quite aggressive. I will start off with a hole drilled with the recommended number drill, but more often than not, the tap will not start properly, even if I chamfer the opening of the hole. So, I go up to the next-larger number drill, and try that. Often I have to go up two drill sizes to get the tap to start. I know I'm giving up some thread engagement by doing this, but the results have been acceptable for my projects.
But, this past week, I bought a set of HSS taper taps, from 6-32 to 3/8, from an industrial supplier. I'm hoping that the less-aggressive taper taps will give me more luck in starting the tapping, and less anxiety? when trying to decide how hard to twist the tap wrench.
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Re: Using nitric acid to remove broken taps or drills from aluminum, comment to the remark
I'm glad to hear about the nitric acid method, although it feels like a last resort.? ?
To prevent tap breakage, I only go forward until the next flute, then back a little to break the chip.? ?Alignment is very important, however you achieve that.? ?On bigger taps you can feel a little resistance.I use a light cutting oil.? If I don't have that, I use water.? I hear kerosene is good for aluminum.
For removing a small screw or tap, I try to cut a screwdriver slot with a Dremel cutoff? wheel.? I know it's not always practical.
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I use this sometimes when power tapping for maybe a # 10 & up
they work pretty good & their great if doing as bunch of repetitive drilling with different size bits .
animal
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Actually power tapping is very easy. Just tighten the tap into the tail stock chuck Then back the tail stock?hand wheel?until the chuck releases. Then move the tail stock?and chuck toward the workpiece?and lock in place. Lube the tap, start the lathe, and using your hand push the tap into the work piece. When the tap bottoms out release your grip on the chuce. Stop the lathe and reverse it to back the tap out. The maximum tap I use in steel is 5/16-18. I have done brass using a 3/8-24 tap. John Mattis (retired mechanical engineer)
I'm sorta amazed how many youtube videos show guys tapping under power.
I know it's a bit of a must in a production setting, but I was always taught to tap by hand - ideally using some sort of guide or fixture.
Do you guys do a lot of tapping under power?? Just the idea makes me nervous.
|
Re: Using nitric acid to remove broken taps or drills from aluminum
I read it about 40 years ago in the CC library in Colorado Springs! I am not even?sure of the date! Try google say" DIY EDM Cheap"? Bill
In my home hobby projects, I've usually only tapped holes in the range from 6-32? up to 1/4-20. The smaller 6-32 and 8-32 taps still make me nervous, even when tapping aluminum. Even when using a guide or tap follower to keep things straight, and using tapping lube, my biggest question has always been "how much torque should I be applying, and how much is too much?" Like many hobbyists, I started out with one of those large sets of "tungsten steel" taps and dies. The taps are typically plug taps, so I find the cut is quite aggressive. I will start off with a hole drilled with the recommended number drill, but more often than not, the tap will not start properly, even if I chamfer the opening of the hole. So, I go up to the next-larger number drill, and try that. Often I have to go up two drill sizes to get the tap to start. I know I'm giving up some thread engagement by doing this, but the results have been acceptable for my projects.
But, this past week, I bought a set of HSS taper taps, from 6-32 to 3/8, from an industrial supplier. I'm hoping that the less-aggressive taper taps will give me more luck in starting the tapping, and less anxiety? when trying to decide how hard to twist the tap wrench.
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Re: Using nitric acid to remove broken taps or drills from aluminum, comment to the remark
Tap guides are great and fairly easy and cheap to make with proper tools and equipment.? I have plans to make one for myself out of 4140 which I can heat treat and make it more durable. ? Have A Great Day?? Tracy Ranson
On Sun, Mar 17, 2024 at 10:55?AM mike allen < animal@...> wrote:
If ya don't drill & tap much that's where drill & tap
guides come in handy .
If ya have a drill press or access to one these a simple quick
jobs .
?
animal
On 3/17/24 4:43 AM, Ron Y wrote:
In my case the tap broke on the fifth hole. I was just thinking to
myself that this is a cheap tap and I need to get a better set
(these were the Pittsburgh brand from HF that I got probably 30
years ago and was a tiny m3). Of course it snapped just as I was
finishing the thought. I have not had many occasions over the
years to drill and tap such a tiny hole and it happened. I am
hoping that I will actually be able to use a lathe (my back) and
get to learn a lot of this stuff. Remember not everyone has been
doing this for years and years and some are trying to do it with
physical limitations. I used to do carpentry work but can't cut a
straight line anymore. We adapt.? A metal lathe is something i
have always been fascinated with and hopefully be able to use and
have some fun with.
Ron
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I some power tapping on my mini lathe and mini mill but I prefer hand tapping with tap being in proper alignment.? I do not have a power tapping device and only power tap when I am confident that the tap will not break. Have A Great Day?? Tracy Ranson
I'm sorta amazed how many youtube videos show guys tapping under power.
I know it's a bit of a must in a production setting, but I was always taught to tap by hand - ideally using some sort of guide or fixture.
Do you guys do a lot of tapping under power?? Just the idea makes me nervous.
|
I'm sorta amazed how many youtube videos show guys tapping under power.
I know it's a bit of a must in a production setting, but I was always taught to tap by hand - ideally using some sort of guide or fixture.
Do you guys do a lot of tapping under power?? Just the idea makes me nervous.
|
davesmith1800
BuffaloJohn
Ralph Lehotsky
chrisser
John Mattis
T