--- In 7x12minilathe@..., "chucketn" <chunk07@...> wrote:
I am going to make one or more of those thread puzzles with the captive nut. I chose 1/2" x 13 tpi because I have several nuts, and a tap available. Just watching "High Plains Drifter for the umpteenth time, and decided to look up the change gears for 13 tpi. LMS Gear Calculator lists 20,65,80, 20 or 40,65,80,20 or 80, any, 80.
Not at the machine at the moment, and was wondering how these combo's fit. Anyone tried 13 tpi on a 7x lathe? I will set it up tomorrow when the frost is off the pumpkin. Was just wondering...
Chuck
Corection: Third gear set should read 80 any 65.
|
I am going to make one or more of those thread puzzles with the captive nut. I chose 1/2" x 13 tpi because I have several nuts, and a tap available. Just watching "High Plains Drifter for the umpteenth time, and decided to look up the change gears for 13 tpi. LMS Gear Calculator lists 20,65,80, 20 or 40,65,80,20 or 80, any, 80.
Not at the machine at the moment, and was wondering how these combo's fit. Anyone tried 13 tpi on a 7x lathe? I will set it up tomorrow when the frost is off the pumpkin. Was just wondering...
Chuck
|
Re: Tail stock alignment on Seig lathes
GadgetBuilder,
Thanks for the links to your site.
I am grateful to be a member of such a good group of people with similar interest to mine. It is through this interaction with one another that ideas are exchanged which help promote the hobby we all share. I am one who likes to gather as much info as possible before making a final decision on which way to proceed. It also gets me thinking "outside the box" that I often find myself in. In the end I will probably arrive at some hybrid solution to the problem of tailstock alignment that i can live with. I will share it with the group when I finally get there.
Dick
|
Re: Tail stock alignment on Seig lathes
Hi group! ? The plans for an offset lathe center are here.? There are lots of other neat plans there too. When I got my Logan, it did not have a tailstock, so I bought one. 6 months later the guy I bought the lathe from called and said he found the original. Now I have 2. Is there any downside to changing tailstocks? One for tapers, one aligned? I know that it is not a 7x12, but y'all are a knowledgeable group!
?
|
Re: Tail stock alignment on Seig lathes
?
Remember to keep that point lubed when in use;
remember also that when turning tapers between centers, the center pockets in
the work are not aligned with the centers in the spindles. Grease is better than
oil, in this case.? Ball end centers, and a ball bearing one in the TS, if
you do a lot of tapers.
?
Mert
?
?
Mike
Thanks for the pointers.? After getting the
idea from Mert earlier, I already have one started.? I am going to try O1
for the point though.
Thanks
Larry
?
?
?
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Friday, November 16, 2012 6:52
PM
Subject: Re: [7x12minilathe] Tail stock
alignment on Seig lathes
?
Larry ,you can use a boring head to offset a center. Replace the
boring bar with a 3/8" round stock and a 60¡ã point
The
point acts as a dead center and should be lubricated. There is at least one
drawing on the web of an offset center made for turning tapers.There are
only three components.The point,an adjustable sliding bar that holds the
point,and the MT that holds the backplate. The sliding bar is slotted, the
back plate is threaded.The slot length determines how much offset you can
get.
I
use the boring head myself as it has a ?MT#3 which fits the tailstock
of my larger lathe.
mike
From: Larry White
To: 7x12minilathe@...
Sent: Friday, November
16, 2012 9:04 AM
Subject:
Re: [7x12minilathe] Tail stock alignment on Seig
lathes
?
Dick
"offset able tail stock center" I guess I've never seen
one.??Do you have any pictures or better yet, any
drawings.? Sounds like an interesting attachment
Thanks
Larry
Central Texas
?
?
?
-----
Original Message -----
Sent:
Thursday, November 15, 2012 9:46 PM
Subject:
[7x12minilathe] Tail stock alignment on Seig lathes
?
I am thinking of aligning the tail stock on my lathe using a dial
indicator held in the headstock chuck and sweeping the inside of the
tail stock barrel to get a zero zero reading. I also would then fasten
the two parts of the tail stock with a pair of dowel pins to lock the
alignment in position. I do not foresee a need to offset the tail stock
in the future because I have an offset able tail stock center for taper
turning.
I think I have all contingencies covered, but would like to
hear from others who might have done a similar thing. Do you foresee any
problems with my
solution?
Thanks
Dick
|
Re: Tail stock alignment on Seig lathes
The work is running at an angle to the spindle when using the offset tailstock method of taper turning. This angle causes the points to mate poorly with the sockets created by a center drill.
Rather than a point, another center drill socket is commonly used with a hardened ball between the two sockets at each end of the work.
Some discussion here:
< >
John
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
--- In 7x12minilathe@..., "Larry White" <lj123white@...> wrote:
Mike
Thanks for the pointers. After getting the idea from Mert earlier, I already have one started. I am going to try O1 for the point though.
Thanks
Larry
----- Original Message -----
From: michael kolchins
To: 7x12minilathe@...
Sent: Friday, November 16, 2012 6:52 PM
Subject: Re: [7x12minilathe] Tail stock alignment on Seig lathes
Larry ,you can use a boring head to offset a center. Replace the boring bar with a 3/8" round stock and a 60?¡ã point
The point acts as a dead center and should be lubricated. There is at least one drawing on the web of an offset center made for turning tapers.There are only three components.The point,an adjustable sliding bar that holds the point,and the MT that holds the backplate. The sliding bar is slotted, the back plate is threaded.The slot length determines how much offset you can get.
I use the boring head myself as it has a MT#3 which fits the tailstock of my larger lathe.
mike
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: Larry White <lj123white@...>
To: 7x12minilathe@...
Sent: Friday, November 16, 2012 9:04 AM
Subject: Re: [7x12minilathe] Tail stock alignment on Seig lathes
Dick
"offset able tail stock center" I guess I've never seen one. Do you have any pictures or better yet, any drawings. Sounds like an interesting attachment
Thanks
Larry
Central Texas
----- Original Message -----
From: Dick
To: 7x12minilathe@...
Sent: Thursday, November 15, 2012 9:46 PM
Subject: [7x12minilathe] Tail stock alignment on Seig lathes
I am thinking of aligning the tail stock on my lathe using a dial indicator held in the headstock chuck and sweeping the inside of the tail stock barrel to get a zero zero reading. I also would then fasten the two parts of the tail stock with a pair of dowel pins to lock the alignment in position. I do not foresee a need to offset the tail stock in the future because I have an offset able tail stock center for taper turning.
I think I have all contingencies covered, but would like to hear from others who might have done a similar thing. Do you foresee any problems with my solution?
Thanks
Dick
|
Re: Tail stock alignment on Seig lathes
?
Mike
Thanks for the pointers.? After getting the
idea from Mert earlier, I already have one started.? I am going to try O1
for the point though.
Thanks
Larry
?
?
?
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Friday, November 16, 2012 6:52
PM
Subject: Re: [7x12minilathe] Tail stock
alignment on Seig lathes
?
Larry ,you can use a boring head to offset a center. Replace the
boring bar with a 3/8" round stock and a 60¡ã point
The
point acts as a dead center and should be lubricated. There is at least one
drawing on the web of an offset center made for turning tapers.There are only
three components.The point,an adjustable sliding bar that holds the point,and
the MT that holds the backplate. The sliding bar is slotted, the back plate is
threaded.The slot length determines how much offset you can get.
I
use the boring head myself as it has a ?MT#3 which fits the tailstock of
my larger lathe.
mike
From: Larry White
To: 7x12minilathe@...
Sent: Friday, November 16,
2012 9:04 AM
Subject: Re:
[7x12minilathe] Tail stock alignment on Seig lathes
?
Dick
"offset able tail stock center" I guess I've never seen
one.??Do you have any pictures or better yet, any drawings.?
Sounds like an interesting attachment
Thanks
Larry
Central Texas
?
?
?
-----
Original Message -----
Sent:
Thursday, November 15, 2012 9:46 PM
Subject:
[7x12minilathe] Tail stock alignment on Seig lathes
?
I am thinking of aligning the tail stock on my lathe using a dial
indicator held in the headstock chuck and sweeping the inside of the tail
stock barrel to get a zero zero reading. I also would then fasten the two
parts of the tail stock with a pair of dowel pins to lock the alignment in
position. I do not foresee a need to offset the tail stock in the future
because I have an offset able tail stock center for taper turning.
I
think I have all contingencies covered, but would like to hear from others
who might have done a similar thing. Do you foresee any problems with my
solution?
Thanks
Dick
|
Re: Tail stock alignment on Seig lathes
Mert, I do the same thing except the ?MT#3 on the boring head fits my 10x22 tail stock. I originally bought it for my mini-mill.Rarely use it on the mill but every so often on the lathe.I ?turned the point on a short length of A-1 and hardened the point.? mike
From: MERTON B BAKER
To: 7x12minilathe@...
Sent: Friday, November 16, 2012 9:40 AM
Subject: RE: [7x12minilathe] Tail stock alignment on Seig lathes
?
On my 7xs, I have a boring head, mounted on a #2MT. Set with the slide
horizontal, and with a center where the boring bar normally goes, it can be
offset with the micrometer screw. The rudimentary TS offset provided with
the lathe can be carefully centered properly once, and then left alone. The
#2 taper fits my 12x also. I bought the boring head at HF. On sale, of
course.
Mert
-----Original Message-----
From: 7x12minilathe@...
[mailto: 7x12minilathe@...]On Behalf Of Larry White
Sent: Friday, November 16, 2012 9:05 AM
To: 7x12minilathe@...
Subject: Re: [7x12minilathe] Tail stock alignment on Seig lathes
Dick
"offset able tail stock center" I guess I've never seen one. Do you have
any pictures or better yet, any drawings. Sounds like an interesting
attachment
Thanks
Larry
Central Texas
----- Original Message -----
From: Dick
To: 7x12minilathe@...
Sent: Thursday, November 15, 2012 9:46 PM
Subject: [7x12minilathe] Tail stock alignment on Seig lathes
I am thinking of aligning the tail stock on my lathe using a dial
indicator held in the headstock chuck and sweeping the inside of the tail
stock barrel to get a zero zero reading. I also would then fasten the two
parts of the tail stock with a pair of dowel pins to lock the alignment in
position. I do not foresee a need to offset the tail stock in the future
because I have an offset able tail stock center for taper turning.
I think I have all contingencies covered, but would like to hear from
others who might have done a similar thing. Do you foresee any problems with
my solution?
Thanks
Dick
|
Re: Tail stock alignment on Seig lathes
Larry ,you can use a boring head to offset a center. Replace the boring bar with a 3/8" round stock and a 60¡ã point The point acts as a dead center and should be lubricated. There is at least one drawing on the web of an offset center made for turning tapers.There are only three components.The point,an adjustable sliding bar that holds the point,and the MT that holds the backplate. The sliding bar is slotted, the back plate is threaded.The slot length determines how much offset you can get. I use the boring head myself as it has a ?MT#3 which fits the tailstock of my larger lathe.
mike
From: Larry White
To: 7x12minilathe@...
Sent: Friday, November 16, 2012 9:04 AM
Subject: Re: [7x12minilathe] Tail stock alignment on Seig lathes
?
Dick
"offset able tail stock center" I guess I've never seen one.??Do
you have any pictures or better yet, any drawings.? Sounds like an
interesting attachment
Thanks
Larry
Central Texas
?
?
?
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Thursday, November 15, 2012 9:46
PM
Subject: [7x12minilathe] Tail stock
alignment on Seig lathes
?
I am thinking of aligning the tail stock on my lathe using a dial indicator
held in the headstock chuck and sweeping the inside of the tail stock barrel
to get a zero zero reading. I also would then fasten the two parts of the tail
stock with a pair of dowel pins to lock the alignment in position. I do not
foresee a need to offset the tail stock in the future because I have an offset
able tail stock center for taper turning.
I think I have all contingencies
covered, but would like to hear from others who might have done a similar
thing. Do you foresee any problems with my
solution?
Thanks
Dick
|
Re: Tail stock alignment on Seig lathes
I aligned the tail stock of my 12x36 lathe with a coaxial indicator. After that, I was no longer unintentionally turning tapers.
I thought of using a dial indicator, but never did.
Donald
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
--- In 7x12minilathe@..., "Dick" <old_toolmaker@...> wrote:
I am thinking of aligning the tail stock on my lathe using a dial indicator held in the headstock chuck and sweeping the inside of the tail stock barrel to get a zero zero reading. I also would then fasten the two parts of the tail stock with a pair of dowel pins to lock the alignment in position. I do not foresee a need to offset the tail stock in the future because I have an offset able tail stock center for taper turning.
I think I have all contingencies covered, but would like to hear from others who might have done a similar thing. Do you foresee any problems with my solution?
Thanks
Dick
|
There's an absolutely beautiful
Craftsman/Atlas 10 X 24 on ebay right now, but it's at the upper
end of my limit (and then you have to buy tooling) and it's too
far away, but it's what I'd like to have...that plus a small lathe
for the really little stuff...I do some modeling though most of my
"models" are in the scale of 1:1.
Mark
On 11/15/12 3:48 PM, michael kolchins wrote:
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
?
Mark, since you have used machine tools in the
past I would suggest a lathe larger than a mini.A 9x20
would be the smallest I would consider in your place.I
have a 7x12 Cummings and a 10x22 Grizzly. I started on
the mini-lathe and learned a lot. After a couple of
years I decided that a larger lathe was needed.I use
the 10x22 about 95% of the time.The mini-lathe is used
infrequently but comes in handy for some work.When I
bought my first lathe I had no experience working
metal,I think for me starting with the mini-lathe was
a good idea.
Being that you
have some experience,even though it was in the
"distant past" you could save yourself some money and
buy a larger lathe to begin with.Naturally the size
work you do will determine what lathe you need.
I've made a few
shop tools myself,most before I had a metal lathe.I
have made a Panel saw,Wood lathe ( had to buy the
spindles though), a beam saw, sash saw and a treadle
lathe. I still have the wood lathe and the panel saw.I
sold the treadle saw when I got too old to keep the
treadle going. The beam saw never worked to my
satisfaction so I took ?it apart after ?a few
years.The sash saw ran off a 15 hp gas engine.I used
this saw to mill logs less than 16" in diameter and
under 10'-0" long.A neighbor complained about the
noise. Police officer came around one morning and told
me to turn the engine off.
I did turn it
off.The officer asked me a lot of questions about the
saw and then asked me if I would sell it to him.
I wound up
selling him the saw ,after I finished sawing my logs.
mike
?
Hello,
I have a major interest in home shop
machining, partly in support of automotive
hobbies but also just for fabrication
purposes (small equipment, tools, models,
etc). For some weird reason I can't
explain, I am also interested in making my
shop tools (yeah, even lathes, milling
machines, etc) but have to be tempered by
reality so I can otherwise get things
done. I have yet to buy or build a lathe
but have extreme interest in picking one
up near term. I've been looking small
(Unimat, Sherline, Taig) to large (9 or 10
inch swing...yes they get pricey) and
would be interested in any advice on the
best choice for a first lathe. I've been
buying books from Lindsay Publications for
more than 20 years...and yes I know they
are going out of business in Feb 2013. I
have their "last catalog". I also have
some vintage Southbend publications. In
the distant past, I've done quite a bit of
fab work--lathe, milling machine, shaper,
welding, all the other typical tool
suspects and so am not a complete novice,
but have been a way from it for quite a
while as well.
Mark
Knoxville, TN USA
__._
|
Re: Tail stock alignment on Seig lathes
It is straightforward to modify the tailstock so it is easier to align plus it remains as set.
See:
LMS has plans for a similar scheme.
One difficulty with pinning is that the tailstock needs some TLC to get it to lock into the same position each time. My machine needs some side force applied to the tailstock or it can vary a couple thou each time it is locked down. This was more random prior to removing ridges in the tailstock V.
Also, the headstock alignment to the ways should be verified/corrected prior to aligning the tailstock - not something you can take for granted on the 7x12. One method is described here:
Note that the tailstock is typically a couple thou high and one method for correcting this is to shim the headstock up to match while aligning it to the ways. Further, the ram may not travel parallel to the ways as it is extended. Nor is the ram's taper always parallel to the ram travel. Lots of error possibilities with this tailstock implementation.
As a toolmaker you may have already handled these issues but others following this thread may benefit from this sketchy outline of how the various alignments interact.
John
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
--- In 7x12minilathe@..., "Dick" <old_toolmaker@...> wrote:
The tail stock adjustment system is poorly designed and I would prefer that I would not be addressing tail stock alignment from time to time. There may be a better method to deal with the poor design and that is what I hope to discover. I have not yet thought through all my options. I am just on a fact finding mission at this point. I am one who thinks things through before making any changes.
Dick
--- In 7x12minilathe@..., Alan Muller <alan@> wrote:
Can you explain what you would gain from pinning
the tailstock castings together?
At 03:46 AM 11/16/2012 +0000, you wrote:
I am thinking of aligning the tail stock on my
lathe using a dial indicator held in the
headstock chuck and sweeping the inside of the
tail stock barrel to get a zero zero reading. I
also would then fasten the two parts of the tail
stock with a pair of dowel pins to lock the
alignment in position. I do not foresee a need
to offset the tail stock in the future because I
have an offset able tail stock center for taper turning.
I think I have all contingencies covered, but
would like to hear from others who might have
done a similar thing. Do you foresee any problems with my solution?
Thanks
Dick
|
Re: Tail stock alignment on Seig lathes
On my 7xs, I have a boring head, mounted on a #2MT. Set with the slide
horizontal, and with a center where the boring bar normally goes, it can be
offset with the micrometer screw. The rudimentary TS offset provided with
the lathe can be carefully centered properly once, and then left alone. The
#2 taper fits my 12x also. I bought the boring head at HF. On sale, of
course.
Mert
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
-----Original Message-----
From: 7x12minilathe@...
[mailto:7x12minilathe@...]On Behalf Of Larry White
Sent: Friday, November 16, 2012 9:05 AM
To: 7x12minilathe@...
Subject: Re: [7x12minilathe] Tail stock alignment on Seig lathes
Dick
"offset able tail stock center" I guess I've never seen one. Do you have
any pictures or better yet, any drawings. Sounds like an interesting
attachment
Thanks
Larry
Central Texas
----- Original Message -----
From: Dick
To: 7x12minilathe@...
Sent: Thursday, November 15, 2012 9:46 PM
Subject: [7x12minilathe] Tail stock alignment on Seig lathes
I am thinking of aligning the tail stock on my lathe using a dial
indicator held in the headstock chuck and sweeping the inside of the tail
stock barrel to get a zero zero reading. I also would then fasten the two
parts of the tail stock with a pair of dowel pins to lock the alignment in
position. I do not foresee a need to offset the tail stock in the future
because I have an offset able tail stock center for taper turning.
I think I have all contingencies covered, but would like to hear from
others who might have done a similar thing. Do you foresee any problems with
my solution?
Thanks
Dick
|
Re: Tail stock alignment on Seig lathes
Dick
"offset able tail stock center" I guess I've never seen one.??Do
you have any pictures or better yet, any drawings.? Sounds like an
interesting attachment
Thanks
Larry
Central Texas
?
?
?
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Thursday, November 15, 2012 9:46
PM
Subject: [7x12minilathe] Tail stock
alignment on Seig lathes
?
I am thinking of aligning the tail stock on my lathe using a dial indicator
held in the headstock chuck and sweeping the inside of the tail stock barrel
to get a zero zero reading. I also would then fasten the two parts of the tail
stock with a pair of dowel pins to lock the alignment in position. I do not
foresee a need to offset the tail stock in the future because I have an offset
able tail stock center for taper turning.
I think I have all contingencies
covered, but would like to hear from others who might have done a similar
thing. Do you foresee any problems with my
solution?
Thanks
Dick
|
Re: Tail stock alignment on Seig lathes
The tail stock adjustment system is poorly designed and I would prefer that I would not be addressing tail stock alignment from time to time. There may be a better method to deal with the poor design and that is what I hope to discover. I have not yet thought through all my options. I am just on a fact finding mission at this point. I am one who thinks things through before making any changes.
Dick
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
--- In 7x12minilathe@..., Alan Muller <alan@...> wrote:
Can you explain what you would gain from pinning
the tailstock castings together?
At 03:46 AM 11/16/2012 +0000, you wrote:
I am thinking of aligning the tail stock on my
lathe using a dial indicator held in the
headstock chuck and sweeping the inside of the
tail stock barrel to get a zero zero reading. I
also would then fasten the two parts of the tail
stock with a pair of dowel pins to lock the
alignment in position. I do not foresee a need
to offset the tail stock in the future because I
have an offset able tail stock center for taper turning.
I think I have all contingencies covered, but
would like to hear from others who might have
done a similar thing. Do you foresee any problems with my solution?
Thanks
Dick
|
Re: Tail stock alignment on Seig lathes
Hi Dick,
Given your "old toolmaker" handle, you have probably already thought of this, but it might be as well to do the check with the ram both extended and retracted, to make sure it is true with the ways.
Andy
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
--- In 7x12minilathe@..., "Dick" <old_toolmaker@...> wrote:
I am thinking of aligning the tail stock on my lathe using a dial indicator held in the headstock chuck and sweeping the inside of the tail stock barrel to get a zero zero reading. I also would then fasten the two parts of the tail stock with a pair of dowel pins to lock the alignment in position. I do not foresee a need to offset the tail stock in the future because I have an offset able tail stock center for taper turning.
I think I have all contingencies covered, but would like to hear from others who might have done a similar thing. Do you foresee any problems with my solution?
Thanks
Dick
|
Re: Plans for a steam engine to make on the 7x mini lathe
Thanks! ?Now I just have to get the lathe tuned up.
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
On Thu, Nov 15, 2012 at 3:38 AM, mce600 <mce600@...> wrote:
?
--- In 7x12minilathe@..., Robert Schulke wrote:
>
> I'm looking for plans to make a small, useful steam engine on the
> mini-lathe. So far all the plans I've seen are either really small
> (1/2 inch bore), or require a larger lathe. One that could be put
> together from aluminum plate, pipe, bar, etc. would be great.
> Castings would be OK so long as they could be finished on the
> mini-lathe/mill. It should be able to produce at least 1 HP, and
> ideally 5 for powering a small launch.
>
> Thanks in advance!
>
Have a look here
|
Re: Tail stock alignment on Seig lathes
Hi Dick:
Your method will work, but I think it's more reliable to insert a dead-center and sweep the outside of the hardened point. It's easier to see any offset visually, and easier to sweep. Sweeping the inside surface restricts the position of the test point to a small band and the point has to slide on a steep angle of the inside curve. Also the socket is unhardened and may have rough spots near the end. I think the dead center will give a truer representation of the actual center.
mike
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
--- In 7x12minilathe@..., "Dick" <old_toolmaker@...> wrote:
I am thinking of aligning the tail stock on my lathe using a dial indicator held in the headstock chuck and sweeping the inside of the tail stock barrel to get a zero zero reading. I also would then fasten the two parts of the tail stock with a pair of dowel pins to lock the alignment in position. I do not foresee a need to offset the tail stock in the future because I have an offset able tail stock center for taper turning.
I think I have all contingencies covered, but would like to hear from others who might have done a similar thing. Do you foresee any problems with my solution?
Thanks
Dick
|
Re: Tail stock alignment on Seig lathes
Can you explain what you would gain from pinning the tailstock castings
together?
At 03:46 AM 11/16/2012 +0000, you wrote:
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
?
I am thinking of aligning the tail stock on my lathe using a dial
indicator held in the headstock chuck and sweeping the inside of the tail
stock barrel to get a zero zero reading. I also would then fasten the two
parts of the tail stock with a pair of dowel pins to lock the alignment
in position. I do not foresee a need to offset the tail stock in the
future because I have an offset able tail stock center for taper
turning.
I think I have all contingencies covered, but would like to hear from
others who might have done a similar thing. Do you foresee any problems
with my solution?
Thanks
Dick
|
Tail stock alignment on Seig lathes
I am thinking of aligning the tail stock on my lathe using a dial indicator held in the headstock chuck and sweeping the inside of the tail stock barrel to get a zero zero reading. I also would then fasten the two parts of the tail stock with a pair of dowel pins to lock the alignment in position. I do not foresee a need to offset the tail stock in the future because I have an offset able tail stock center for taper turning.
I think I have all contingencies covered, but would like to hear from others who might have done a similar thing. Do you foresee any problems with my solution?
Thanks
Dick
|
OldToolmaker
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