First one i bought for home use was from LIDIL'S????150 watt 6" wheels , a wee cracker. but after using 3 phase stuff in work it was a bit under powered , about 3 months ago I bought an older = 15yr old??300watt nutool grinder ,induction motor etc and after dressing (and a bigger result came from repositioning wheels) have an excellent bench grinder that is smooth as silk ,the wee one i keep with a softish stone for tool grinding and the bigger one for blade /rougher grinding

R McC


________________________________
From: "7x12minilathe@..." <7x12minilathe@...>
To: 7x12minilathe@...
Sent: Friday, 7 October 2011, 11:02
Subject: [7x12minilathe] Digest Number 5297


7x12minilathe - mini lathe users group
Messages In This Digest (23 Messages)
1.1.
Re: mini lathe and non aluminum cutting From: Chris Bailey
1.2.
Re: mini lathe and non aluminum cutting From: MERTON B BAKER
1.3.
Re: mini lathe and non aluminum cutting From: Filip Atanassov
1.4.
Re: mini lathe and non aluminum cutting From: Charles J.
2a.
Moments of Terror in Machining From: Kevin
2b.
Re: Moments of Terror in Machining From: Kevin
2c.
Re: Moments of Terror in Machining From: fmvf@...
2d.
Re: Moments of Terror in Machining From: Vince Vielhaber
2e.
Re: Moments of Terror in Machining From: Paul
2f.
Re: Moments of Terror in Machining From: Paul
2g.
Re: Moments of Terror in Machining From: MERTON B BAKER
2h.
Re: Moments of Terror in Machining From: john brookes
2i.
Re: Moments of Terror in Machining From: Mark Cason
2j.
Re: Moments of Terror in Machining From: Kevin
2k.
Re: Moments of Terror in Machining From: warren hughes
2l.
Re: Moments of Terror in Machining From: David Wiseman
2m.
Re: Moments of Terror in Machining From: David Wiseman
2n.
Re: Moments of Terror in Machining From: Ray Kornele
2o.
Re: Moments of Terror in Machining From: MERTON B BAKER
2p.
Re: Moments of Terror in Machining From: MERTON B BAKER
2q.
Re: Moments of Terror in Machining From: John Mattis
2r.
Re: Moments of Terror in Machining From: Andrew
2s.
Re: Moments:? imports bad? From: john brookes View All Topics | Create New Topic Messages
1.1.
Re: mini lathe and non aluminum cutting
Posted by: "Chris Bailey" cbailey73160@... ? cbailey73160
Thu Oct?6,?2011 3:59?am (PDT)


Now hold on there. They're not COMPLETE trash. If you clean all the muck
and paint off the body of the tool, you can use the back half of the thing
for somethings. Cut off and discard the brazed on tip and then use the body
to mount in the OTHER side of the stock tool holder. Not to cut with but to
keep the top from "leaning" away from the side you're trying to cut with.
Had a couple of tools come loose on me before I found out about this little
trick.

I do agree though get rid of the brazed on tip of these things. They're
practically useless unless you have a tool grinder to put the correct angles
on them to cut with.

Chris

On Wed, Oct 5, 2011 at 9:25 PM, Jerry Durand <jdurand@interstella r.com>wrote:

&gt; **

On 10/05/2011 07:18 PM, SirJohnOfYork wrote:


ATTENTION NEWBIES: If your new mini-lathe came with tools like these get
rid of them right away. Get them out of sight where you will not be tempted
to try using them ever again. They are designed to demonically torment you
and ruin any workpiece as you may be working on. They are Death. Very Bad.
Counter productive. They can visibly age you by wasting away all of the time
that you try to use them. Do not use. Avoid at any cost. Trash. Garbage.
Excrement. Waste. They'll eat up all your valuable hobby time and leave you
with nothing much to show for it. They really, really, suck.


So, do you think these would be good for say cutting tool steel on a HF
lathe straight out of the box with all that nice red grease on it?

:) :) :)

--

&gt; Jerry Durand, Durand Interstellar, Inc. www.interstellar. com

tel: +1 408 356-3886, USA toll free: 1 866 356-3886
Skype: jerrydurand

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Messages in this topic (43)
1.2.
Re: mini lathe and non aluminum cutting
Posted by: "MERTON B BAKER" mertbaker@... ? mertbaker
Thu Oct?6,?2011 4:59?am (PDT)


AHA! Now I know why these toolbits, nothing special, to be sure, are
labeled "junk"! Nobody sharpens 'em and puts the right angles on 'em.
After all, It takes almost 3 minutes per tool freehand, or two minutes with
HF's expensive two table green wheel machine. (I finally bought one, when
it was on sale, &amp; I had the money) Reground, as I said, they are nothing
special, but they work pretty well, at least the 2 sets I have do.

Mert

-----Original Message-----
From: 7x12minilathe@ yahoogroups. com
[mailto:7x12minilathe@ yahoogroups. com]On Behalf Of Chris Bailey
Sent: Thursday, October 06, 2011 7:00 AM
To: 7x12minilathe@ yahoogroups. com
Subject: Re: [7x12minilathe] Re: mini lathe and non aluminum cutting

Now hold on there. ? They're not COMPLETE trash. ?If you clean all the
muck and paint off the body of the tool, you can use the back half of the
thing for somethings. ?Cut off and discard the brazed on tip and then use
the body to mount in the OTHER side of the stock tool holder. ?Not to cut
with but to keep the top from "leaning&quot; away from the side you're trying to
cut with. ?Had a couple of tools come loose on me before I found out about
this little trick. ?

I do agree though get rid of the brazed on tip of these things. ?They're
practically useless unless you have a tool grinder to put the correct angles
on them to cut with.?

Chris

On Wed, Oct 5, 2011 at 9:25 PM, Jerry Durand &lt;jdurand@interstella r.com>
wrote:

?
On 10/05/2011 07:18 PM, SirJohnOfYork wrote:

ATTENTION NEWBIES: If your new mini-lathe came with tools like these
get rid of them right away. Get them out of sight where you will not be
tempted to try using them ever again. They are designed to demonically
torment you and ruin any workpiece as you may be working on. They are Death.
Very Bad. Counter productive. They can visibly age you by wasting away all
of the time that you try to use them. Do not use. Avoid at any cost. Trash.
Garbage. Excrement. Waste. They'll eat up all your valuable hobby time and
leave you with nothing much to show for it. They really, really, suck.

So, do you think these would be good for say cutting tool steel on a HF
lathe straight out of the box with all that nice red grease on it??

:) :) :)

--
Jerry Durand, Durand Interstellar, Inc. www.interstellar. com
tel: +1 408 356-3886, USA toll free: 1 866 356-3886
Skype: jerrydurand


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Messages in this topic (43)
1.3.
Re: mini lathe and non aluminum cutting
Posted by: &quot;Filip Atanassov" vph000@... ? philipat2
Thu Oct?6,?2011 6:02?am (PDT)


HF doesn't seem to have that holder in the moment.
Any feedback for that one:
eight.com/ 5-piece-indexabl e-carbide- tool-set- 39931.html ?

vph

On 10/5/2011 11:08 PM, john brookes wrote:

and it should be mentioned how good the US (or israeli, etc) carbide
is. MSC sells a brazed carbide cutoff which is good for turning and
facing as well - 16$. It will last a long time between sharpenings and
works very well. Another good way to go is to buy the 1/4 in insert
holders from HF (15$ with 20% coupin), and buy some kennametal 2151
inserts. A 5$ insert will last maybe 3 years at hobby rates of use.
They cut through hard steel like butter. The triangular inserts are
tnmp as i remember - can look up. Each inserts has three cutting
points that can be rotated as a point becomes dull. I have been using
several for 8 months for all kinds of stuff, and I have not rotated
them. I have done nasty cuts on hardened steel threads with ease.

&gt; jb

On Oct 5, 2011, at 10:25 PM, Jerry Durand &lt;jdurand@interstella r.com
<mailto:jdurand@interstella r.com>&gt; wrote:

On 10/05/2011 07:18 PM, SirJohnOfYork wrote:

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Messages in this topic (43)
1.4.
Re: mini lathe and non aluminum cutting
Posted by: "Charles J." ebandit@... ? nissan.370z
Thu Oct?6,?2011 6:55?am (PDT)


I just ordered my first mini lathe (Grizzly 7x12, be here tomorrow- hope to have a bigger one 10x22 up to 14x40 or similar this time next year but this is a start), anyway... I seen someone machine titanium fine on the exact same model Grizzly 7x12, so I know tougher metals can be done. I am just learning so I cant say anymore than I have seen it done.
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Messages in this topic (43)
2a.
Moments of Terror in Machining
Posted by: "Kevin" kcc-groups@... ? seanacais
Thu Oct?6,?2011 7:07?am (PDT)


I was sharpening some tools on my 6" Chinese (Homier) grinder today when I started to smell something a little funny but I continue working. After about 10 minutes, I notice that the grinder is getting hot so I go to get my infrared thermometer.

In the next few minutes, I watched the grinder go from 130 to over 180 degrees Fahrenheit. I turned it off.

Just to get a complete picture I took off the wheels and turned the grinder on with no load. Within 5 minutes, the temperature was over 200 degrees. This is where I chickened out and reached to turn it off, but I saw a wisp of smoke coming from the grinder.

This grinder cannot have more than a few hours on it at most. I only purchased it about 2 years ago and it's ground maybe a dozen lathe tools.

It was cheap so I don't mind the money so much, but the thought if this had been a motor on a band saw or other tool that is more automated, the resulting fire would be very bad.

So one more example of being careful of the ratings on the Chinese motors.

Kevin


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Messages in this topic (19)
2b.
Re: Moments of Terror in Machining
Posted by: "Kevin" kcc-groups@... ? seanacais
Thu Oct?6,?2011 7:13?am (PDT)


And to follow up. I did some research since I'm now in the market for a new grinder :-)

Is Baldor the ONLY company not sourcing their grinders from China or Taiwan?

I know Craftsman, DeWalt (B&amp;D), and the others have moved production overseas, but I was surprised that Delta, Rockwell, Porter-Cable, and especially Palmgren all seem to be using Chinese factories.

So this may be a little off topic, but I&#39;d love to hear comments about the different grinders and people's thoughts, experiences with the different brands.

Obviously, I'd love a Baldor, but starting at over $500 retail it's kind of tough to justify spending as much on the grinder as I did on the lathe. :-) And yes, I'm checking craigslist!

Kevin

--- In 7x12minilathe@ yahoogroups. com, "Kevin" <kcc-groups@ ...> wrote:

I was sharpening some tools on my 6" Chinese (Homier) grinder today when I started to smell something a little funny but I continue working. After about 10 minutes, I notice that the grinder is getting hot so I go to get my infrared thermometer.

In the next few minutes, I watched the grinder go from 130 to over 180 degrees Fahrenheit. I turned it off.

Just to get a complete picture I took off the wheels and turned the grinder on with no load. Within 5 minutes, the temperature was over 200 degrees. This is where I chickened out and reached to turn it off, but I saw a wisp of smoke coming from the grinder.

This grinder cannot have more than a few hours on it at most. I only purchased it about 2 years ago and it's ground maybe a dozen lathe tools.

It was cheap so I don't mind the money so much, but the thought if this had been a motor on a band saw or other tool that is more automated, the resulting fire would be very bad.

So one more example of being careful of the ratings on the Chinese motors.


Kevin

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Messages in this topic (19)
2c.
Re: Moments of Terror in Machining
Posted by: "fmvf@..." fmvf@... ? fmvf@...
Thu Oct?6,?2011 8:04?am (PDT)


I purchased a grinder from HF a long time ago when quality was an unknown word "there" (across the ocean). The grinder suffered similar symptoms, using it for 5 minutes it would get too hot to touch. I stopped using it and made a grinder from an old pump motor (C-flange) and a set of pillow block bearings mounted on a piece of channel 6" wide X 1/4" thick. This set up lasted me almost 22 years but finally had to retire it because the internal wiring, not the windings, got so brittle the insulation started to crack in several places.

I recently purchased another one from HF and I'm happy to report that I can use it for about 30 minutes before it gets too hot. They're not too much different from what my first one was, just a little better. Quality grinders cost way too much for us to justify buying one.

Frank.

--- In 7x12minilathe@ yahoogroups. com, "Kevin" <kcc-groups@ ...> wrote:

And to follow up. I did some research since I'm now in the market for a new grinder :-)

Is Baldor the ONLY company not sourcing their grinders from China or Taiwan?

I know Craftsman, DeWalt (B&amp;D), and the others have moved production overseas, but I was surprised that Delta, Rockwell, Porter-Cable, and especially Palmgren all seem to be using Chinese factories.

&gt; So this may be a little off topic, but I'd love to hear comments about the different grinders and people's thoughts, experiences with the different brands.

Obviously, I'd love a Baldor, but starting at over $500 retail it's kind of tough to justify spending as much on the grinder as I did on the lathe. :-) And yes, I'm checking craigslist!

Kevin

--- In 7x12minilathe@ yahoogroups. com, "Kevin" <kcc-groups@ > wrote:

I was sharpening some tools on my 6" Chinese (Homier) grinder today when I started to smell something a little funny but I continue working. After about 10 minutes, I notice that the grinder is getting hot so I go to get my infrared thermometer.

In the next few minutes, I watched the grinder go from 130 to over 180 degrees Fahrenheit. I turned it off.

Just to get a complete picture I took off the wheels and turned the grinder on with no load. Within 5 minutes, the temperature was over 200 degrees. This is where I chickened out and reached to turn it off, but I saw a wisp of smoke coming from the grinder.

This grinder cannot have more than a few hours on it at most. I only purchased it about 2 years ago and it's ground maybe a dozen lathe tools.

&gt; > It was cheap so I don't mind the money so much, but the thought if this had been a motor on a band saw or other tool that is more automated, the resulting fire would be very bad.

So one more example of being careful of the ratings on the Chinese motors.

&gt; >

Kevin

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Messages in this topic (19)
2d.
Re: Moments of Terror in Machining
Posted by: "Vince Vielhaber" vev@... ? michvhf
Thu Oct?6,?2011 8:04?am (PDT)



I have a cheap one I got from Cummins Tools back when they'd drive
a couple of semi trucks to various places. I can sharpen a HSS bit
on it but it doesn't hold its speed very well.

My neighbor has a Delta that won't slow down unless you shut it off,
I imagine a heavy enough piece of steel will slow it down but not that
I've found yet.

At the day job we have one (dunno what brand) that runs on 480 3 phase
and has a build in dust collector. I don't imagine you can easily slow
that one down.

As far as balance and things like that, the only problem my cheap one
has is cheap wheels. Until I built a vibrating table for doing ceramic
mold stuff, when I poured a mold I'd start the grinder and put the mold
on the motor to bust up the air bubbles. It got alot better after I
dressed the wheels.

On Thu, 6 Oct 2011, Kevin wrote:

And to follow up. I did some research since I'm now in the market for a new grinder :-)

Is Baldor the ONLY company not sourcing their grinders from China or Taiwan?

I know Craftsman, DeWalt (B&amp;D), and the others have moved production overseas, but I was surprised that Delta, Rockwell, Porter-Cable, and especially Palmgren all seem to be using Chinese factories.

So this may be a little off topic, but I'd love to hear comments about the different grinders and people's thoughts, experiences with the different brands.

Obviously, I'd love a Baldor, but starting at over $500 retail it's kind of tough to justify spending as much on the grinder as I did on the lathe. :-) And yes, I'm checking craigslist!

Kevin

--- In 7x12minilathe@ yahoogroups. com, "Kevin" <kcc-groups@ ...> wrote:

I was sharpening some tools on my 6" Chinese (Homier) grinder today when I started to smell something a little funny but I continue working. After about 10 minutes, I notice that the grinder is getting hot so I go to get my infrared thermometer.

In the next few minutes, I watched the grinder go from 130 to over 180 degrees Fahrenheit. I turned it off.

Just to get a complete picture I took off the wheels and turned the grinder on with no load. Within 5 minutes, the temperature was over 200 degrees. This is where I chickened out and reached to turn it off, but I saw a wisp of smoke coming from the grinder.

This grinder cannot have more than a few hours on it at most. I only purchased it about 2 years ago and it's ground maybe a dozen lathe tools.

It was cheap so I don't mind the money so much, but the thought if this had been a motor on a band saw or other tool that is more automated, the resulting fire would be very bad.

So one more example of being careful of the ratings on the Chinese motors.


Kevin

------------ --------- --------- ------

Yahoo! Groups Links

Vince.
--
Michigan VHF Corp. . net/ . com/


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Messages in this topic (19)
2e.
Re: Moments of Terror in Machining
Posted by: "Paul" paul_probus@... ? paul_probus
Thu Oct?6,?2011 8:56?am (PDT)


You might have to get more active than watching Craigslist. Go to flea markets, garage/yard sales, etc. My dad picked up a few quality grinders that way and he's not even looking, just could not walk away because of how cheap the price was. Granted, they are not Baldors, but MIA (made in America) Craftsman's and Delta's and I am not sure what else. As someone else said, you can always make your own with pillow blocks and shafting and a separate motor via belt drive, though if you go that route, I would suggest going to a 10" wheel.

Paul

--- In 7x12minilathe@ yahoogroups. com, "Kevin" <kcc-groups@ ...> wrote:

And to follow up. I did some research since I'm now in the market for a new grinder :-)

Is Baldor the ONLY company not sourcing their grinders from China or Taiwan?

I know Craftsman, DeWalt (B&amp;D), and the others have moved production overseas, but I was surprised that Delta, Rockwell, Porter-Cable, and especially Palmgren all seem to be using Chinese factories.

So this may be a little off topic, but I'd love to hear comments about the different grinders and people's thoughts, experiences with the different brands.

Obviously, I'd love a Baldor, but starting at over $500 retail it's kind of tough to justify spending as much on the grinder as I did on the lathe. :-) And yes, I'm checking craigslist!

Kevin

--- In 7x12minilathe@ yahoogroups. com, "Kevin" &lt;kcc-groups@ > wrote:

I was sharpening some tools on my 6" Chinese (Homier) grinder today when I started to smell something a little funny but I continue working. After about 10 minutes, I notice that the grinder is getting hot so I go to get my infrared thermometer.

&gt; >

In the next few minutes, I watched the grinder go from 130 to over 180 degrees Fahrenheit. I turned it off.

Just to get a complete picture I took off the wheels and turned the grinder on with no load. Within 5 minutes, the temperature was over 200 degrees. This is where I chickened out and reached to turn it off, but I saw a wisp of smoke coming from the grinder.

This grinder cannot have more than a few hours on it at most. I only purchased it about 2 years ago and it's ground maybe a dozen lathe tools.

It was cheap so I don't mind the money so much, but the thought if this had been a motor on a band saw or other tool that is more automated, the resulting fire would be very bad.

So one more example of being careful of the ratings on the Chinese motors.


Kevin

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Messages in this topic (19)
2f.
Re: Moments of Terror in Machining
Posted by: "Paul" paul_probus@... ? paul_probus
Thu Oct?6,?2011 8:58?am (PDT)


If it were me, I'd place it outside away from the house or shop, hook it up to extension cords and see if it actually catches fire. :) But I am a bit of a pyromanic. :)

Paul

--- In 7x12minilathe@ yahoogroups. com, "Kevin" <kcc-groups@ ...> wrote:

I was sharpening some tools on my 6" Chinese (Homier) grinder today when I started to smell something a little funny but I continue working. After about 10 minutes, I notice that the grinder is getting hot so I go to get my infrared thermometer.

In the next few minutes, I watched the grinder go from 130 to over 180 degrees Fahrenheit. I turned it off.

Just to get a complete picture I took off the wheels and turned the grinder on with no load. Within 5 minutes, the temperature was over 200 degrees. This is where I chickened out and reached to turn it off, but I saw a wisp of smoke coming from the grinder.

This grinder cannot have more than a few hours on it at most. I only purchased it about 2 years ago and it's ground maybe a dozen lathe tools.

&gt;

It was cheap so I don't mind the money so much, but the thought if this had been a motor on a band saw or other tool that is more automated, the resulting fire would be very bad.

So one more example of being careful of the ratings on the Chinese motors.


Kevin

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Messages in this topic (19)
2g.
Re: Moments of Terror in Machining
Posted by: "MERTON B BAKER" mertbaker@... ? mertbaker
Thu Oct?6,?2011 9:48?am (PDT)


My problem with overseas grinders are First, the two I've bought take
nearly a full minute to get up to speed, and nearly ten seconds to stop
under load, grinding toolbits. Second the wheels are so far out of balance,
that they would hp around on the floor, didn't dare run 'em up on the bench
for fear they'd fall off. With no wheels on, there was still a little
tendency to walk around.

-----Original Message-----
From: 7x12minilathe@ yahoogroups. com
[mailto:7x12minilathe@ yahoogroups. com]On Behalf Of fmvf@sbcglobal. net
Sent: Thursday, October 06, 2011 11:04 AM
To: 7x12minilathe@ yahoogroups. com
Subject: [7x12minilathe] Re: Moments of Terror in Machining

I purchased a grinder from HF a long time ago when quality was an unknown
word "there" (across the ocean). The grinder suffered similar symptoms,
using it for 5 minutes it would get too hot to touch. I stopped using it
and made a grinder from an old pump motor (C-flange) and a set of pillow
block bearings mounted on a piece of channel 6" wide X 1/4" thick. This set
up lasted me almost 22 years but finally had to retire it because the
internal wiring, not the windings, got so brittle the insulation started to
crack in several places.

I recently purchased another one from HF and I'm happy to report that I can
use it for about 30 minutes before it gets too hot. They're not too much
different from what my first one was, just a little better. Quality
grinders cost way too much for us to justify buying one.

Frank.

--- In 7x12minilathe@ yahoogroups. com, "Kevin" <kcc-groups@ ...> wrote:

And to follow up. I did some research since I'm now in the market for a

new grinder :-)

Is Baldor the ONLY company not sourcing their grinders from China or

Taiwan?

I know Craftsman, DeWalt (B&amp;D), and the others have moved production

overseas, but I was surprised that Delta, Rockwell, Porter-Cable, and
especially Palmgren all seem to be using Chinese factories.

So this may be a little off topic, but I'd love to hear comments about the

different grinders and people's thoughts, experiences with the different
brands.

Obviously, I'd love a Baldor, but starting at over $500 retail it's kind

of tough to justify spending as much on the grinder as I did on the lathe.
:-) And yes, I'm checking craigslist!

Kevin

--- In 7x12minilathe@ yahoogroups. com, "Kevin" <kcc-groups@ > wrote:

I was sharpening some tools on my 6" Chinese (Homier) grinder today when

I started to smell something a little funny but I continue working. After
about 10 minutes, I notice that the grinder is getting hot so I go to get my
infrared thermometer.

In the next few minutes, I watched the grinder go from 130 to over 180

degrees Fahrenheit. I turned it off.

Just to get a complete picture I took off the wheels and turned the

grinder on with no load. Within 5 minutes, the temperature was over 200
degrees. This is where I chickened out and reached to turn it off, but I
saw a wisp of smoke coming from the grinder.

This grinder cannot have more than a few hours on it at most. I only

purchased it about 2 years ago and it's ground maybe a dozen lathe tools.

It was cheap so I don't mind the money so much, but the thought if this

had been a motor on a band saw or other tool that is more automated, the
resulting fire would be very bad.

So one more example of being careful of the ratings on the Chinese

motors.

Kevin

------------ --------- --------- ------

Yahoo! Groups Links


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Messages in this topic (19)
2h.
Re: Moments of Terror in Machining
Posted by: "john brookes" haiticare2011@... ? jbrookes40
Thu Oct?6,?2011 10:13?am (PDT)


i have the hf tool grinder - about 175 with coupon. i bought a diamond wheel on sale at enco for 65. so have a good setup. tubelcain has a good youtube video on sharpening drill bits. I have used it for sharpening carbide bits - works very good. The wheel is so true you dont know its on when turning at 3000. jb

On Oct 6, 2011, at 10:07 AM, "Kevin" <kcc-groups@glenevin .com> wrote:

I was sharpening some tools on my 6" Chinese (Homier) grinder today when I started to smell something a little funny but I continue working. After about 10 minutes, I notice that the grinder is getting hot so I go to get my infrared thermometer.

&gt;

In the next few minutes, I watched the grinder go from 130 to over 180 degrees Fahrenheit. I turned it off.

Just to get a complete picture I took off the wheels and turned the grinder on with no load. Within 5 minutes, the temperature was over 200 degrees. This is where I chickened out and reached to turn it off, but I saw a wisp of smoke coming from the grinder.

This grinder cannot have more than a few hours on it at most. I only purchased it about 2 years ago and it's ground maybe a dozen lathe tools.

It was cheap so I don't mind the money so much, but the thought if this had been a motor on a band saw or other tool that is more automated, the resulting fire would be very bad.

So one more example of being careful of the ratings on the Chinese motors.

&gt;

Kevin





------------ --------- --------- ------

Yahoo! Groups Links

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Messages in this topic (19)
2i.
Re: Moments of Terror in Machining
Posted by: &quot;Mark Cason" farmerboy1967@... ? farmerboy1967
Thu Oct?6,?2011 10:43?am (PDT)


On 10/06/2011 09:13 AM, Kevin wrote:

And to follow up. I did some research since I'm now in the market for
a new grinder :-)

Is Baldor the ONLY company not sourcing their grinders from China or
Taiwan?

I know Craftsman, DeWalt (B&amp;D), and the others have moved production
overseas, but I was surprised that Delta, Rockwell, Porter-Cable, and
especially Palmgren all seem to be using Chinese factories.

So this may be a little off topic, but I'd love to hear comments about
the different grinders and people's thoughts, experiences with the
different brands.

Obviously, I'd love a Baldor, but starting at over $500 retail it's
kind of tough to justify spending as much on the grinder as I did on
the lathe. :-) And yes, I'm checking craigslist!

&gt;

Kevin

I had that same grinder, and it lasted me about 10 minutes. The
first second I started it up, I knew something was wrong, as the wheels
would not run true. I tried truing them up, but the motor burnt up
before I could finish. I bought another one, more expensive than the
first, and it was almost as bad.

The wheels were warped, and the bearings weren't true, and one
bearing was far worse than the other, so the shaft would turn in an
ellipse. Nothing can be done about that, except replace the bearings,
which would've cost more than what I spent on the grinder in the first
place, and I would've still have to replace the wheels.

I now have a 10" Wilton Grinder that I bought from a local tool
shop. Even on sale, it was expensive, but well worth it. It runs as
smooth as silk. Out of the box, it had very little vibration, and after
taking a small cleanup pass with a diamond dresser, it ran even better.
I haven't found anything that would bog the motor down, even with some
fairly aggressive grinding.

The grinder was made in Taiwan, not China, so the level of
craftsmanship it just a tad better.

--
-Mark

Ne M'oubliez ---Family Motto
Hope for the best, plan for the worst ---Personal Motto


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Messages in this topic (19)
2j.
Re: Moments of Terror in Machining
Posted by: "Kevin&quot; kcc-groups@... ? seanacais
Thu Oct?6,?2011 11:08?am (PDT)


Film at 11!

--- In 7x12minilathe@ yahoogroups. com, "Paul&quot; <paul_probus@ ...> wrote:

If it were me, I'd place it outside away from the house or shop, hook it up to extension cords and see if it actually catches fire. :) But I am a bit of a pyromanic. :)

&gt; Paul

--- In 7x12minilathe@ yahoogroups. com, "Kevin&quot; <kcc-groups@ > wrote:

I was sharpening some tools on my 6" Chinese (Homier) grinder today when I started to smell something a little funny but I continue working. After about 10 minutes, I notice that the grinder is getting hot so I go to get my infrared thermometer.

In the next few minutes, I watched the grinder go from 130 to over 180 degrees Fahrenheit. I turned it off.

&gt; Just to get a complete picture I took off the wheels and turned the grinder on with no load. Within 5 minutes, the temperature was over 200 degrees. This is where I chickened out and reached to turn it off, but I saw a wisp of smoke coming from the grinder.

This grinder cannot have more than a few hours on it at most. I only purchased it about 2 years ago and it's ground maybe a dozen lathe tools.

It was cheap so I don't mind the money so much, but the thought if this had been a motor on a band saw or other tool that is more automated, the resulting fire would be very bad.

So one more example of being careful of the ratings on the Chinese motors.


Kevin

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Messages in this topic (19)
2k.
Re: Moments of Terror in Machining
Posted by: "warren hughes" ofujunkcy@... ? ofujunkcy
Thu Oct?6,?2011 11:44?am (PDT)


Have two?craftsman' s?and both have been good the newest one did have a sticky switch problem but?apron?inspetion there seemed to be some grinding dust getting in. i cleaned out the switch area and sealed it with some?silicon. it has been flawless ever since. Warren

--- On Thu, 10/6/11, Mark Cason <farmerboy1967@ yahoo.com> wrote:

From: Mark Cason <farmerboy1967@ yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [7x12minilathe] Re: Moments of Terror in Machining
To: 7x12minilathe@ yahoogroups. com
Date: Thursday, October 6, 2011, 11:42 AM

?

On 10/06/2011 09:13 AM, Kevin wrote:

And to follow up. I did some research since I'm now in the market for

a new grinder :-)

Is Baldor the ONLY company not sourcing their grinders from China or

Taiwan?

I know Craftsman, DeWalt (B&amp;D), and the others have moved production

overseas, but I was surprised that Delta, Rockwell, Porter-Cable, and

especially Palmgren all seem to be using Chinese factories.

So this may be a little off topic, but I'd love to hear comments about

the different grinders and people's thoughts, experiences with the

different brands.

&gt;

Obviously, I'd love a Baldor, but starting at over $500 retail it's

kind of tough to justify spending as much on the grinder as I did on

the lathe. :-) And yes, I'm checking craigslist!

&gt;

Kevin

I had that same grinder, and it lasted me about 10 minutes. The

first second I started it up, I knew something was wrong, as the wheels

would not run true. I tried truing them up, but the motor burnt up

before I could finish. I bought another one, more expensive than the

first, and it was almost as bad.

The wheels were warped, and the bearings weren't true, and one

bearing was far worse than the other, so the shaft would turn in an

ellipse. Nothing can be done about that, except replace the bearings,

which would've cost more than what I spent on the grinder in the first

place, and I would've still have to replace the wheels.

I now have a 10" Wilton Grinder that I bought from a local tool

shop. Even on sale, it was expensive, but well worth it. It runs as

smooth as silk. Out of the box, it had very little vibration, and after

taking a small cleanup pass with a diamond dresser, it ran even better.

I haven't found anything that would bog the motor down, even with some

fairly aggressive grinding.

The grinder was made in Taiwan, not China, so the level of

craftsmanship it just a tad better.

--

-Mark

Ne M'oubliez ---Family Motto

Hope for the best, plan for the worst ---Personal Motto


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Messages in this topic (19)
2l.
Re: Moments of Terror in Machining
Posted by: "David Wiseman" david@... ? imagesdw
Thu Oct?6,?2011 12:42?pm (PDT)


My guess is that despite all coming from China, the final quality (hopefully) is different and dependant on the spec put to the factory.

I have a grinder with a label carrying a well known UK brand. Unfortunately that is where the quality ends. The wheels are not in balance, can't get them to balance either. Soon it will be look for another but better, maybe even second hand might be better.

Kind regards,

David Wiseman

Sent from my BlackBerry mobile phone

-----Original Message-----
From: "Kevin" <kcc-groups@glenevin .com>
Sender: 7x12minilathe@ yahoogroups. com
Date: Thu, 06 Oct 2011 14:13:12
To: &lt;7x12minilathe@ yahoogroups. com>
Reply-To: 7x12minilathe@ yahoogroups. com
Subject: [7x12minilathe] Re: Moments of Terror in Machining

And to follow up. I did some research since I'm now in the market for a new grinder :-)

Is Baldor the ONLY company not sourcing their grinders from China or Taiwan?

I know Craftsman, DeWalt (B&amp;D), and the others have moved production overseas, but I was surprised that Delta, Rockwell, Porter-Cable, and especially Palmgren all seem to be using Chinese factories.

So this may be a little off topic, but I'd love to hear comments about the different grinders and people's thoughts, experiences with the different brands.

Obviously, I'd love a Baldor, but starting at over $500 retail it's kind of tough to justify spending as much on the grinder as I did on the lathe. :-) And yes, I'm checking craigslist!

Kevin

--- In 7x12minilathe@ yahoogroups. com, "Kevin" <kcc-groups@ ...&gt; wrote:

I was sharpening some tools on my 6" Chinese (Homier) grinder today when I started to smell something a little funny but I continue working. After about 10 minutes, I notice that the grinder is getting hot so I go to get my infrared thermometer.

In the next few minutes, I watched the grinder go from 130 to over 180 degrees Fahrenheit. I turned it off.

Just to get a complete picture I took off the wheels and turned the grinder on with no load. Within 5 minutes, the temperature was over 200 degrees. This is where I chickened out and reached to turn it off, but I saw a wisp of smoke coming from the grinder.

This grinder cannot have more than a few hours on it at most. I only purchased it about 2 years ago and it's ground maybe a dozen lathe tools.

&gt;

It was cheap so I don't mind the money so much, but the thought if this had been a motor on a band saw or other tool that is more automated, the resulting fire would be very bad.

So one more example of being careful of the ratings on the Chinese motors.


Kevin

------------ --------- --------- ------

Yahoo! Groups Links




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Messages in this topic (19)
2m.
Re: Moments of Terror in Machining
Posted by: "David Wiseman" david@... ? imagesdw
Thu Oct?6,?2011 12:48?pm (PDT)


Mert

I can. Only agree with you, my grinder is bolted down on a shelf, still tries to take the shelf off the wall.

Kind regards,

David Wiseman

Sent from my BlackBerry mobile phone

-----Original Message-----
From: "MERTON B BAKER" <mertbaker@verizon. net>
Sender: 7x12minilathe@ yahoogroups. com
Date: Thu, 06 Oct 2011 12:32:39
To: <7x12minilathe@ yahoogroups. com>
Reply-To: 7x12minilathe@ yahoogroups. com
Subject: RE: [7x12minilathe] Re: Moments of Terror in Machining

My problem with overseas grinders are First, the two I've bought take
nearly a full minute to get up to speed, and nearly ten seconds to stop
under load, grinding toolbits. Second the wheels are so far out of balance,
that they would hp around on the floor, didn't dare run 'em up on the bench
for fear they'd fall off. With no wheels on, there was still a little
tendency to walk around.



-----Original Message-----
From: 7x12minilathe@ yahoogroups. com
[mailto:7x12minilathe@ yahoogroups. com]On Behalf Of fmvf@sbcglobal. net
Sent: Thursday, October 06, 2011 11:04 AM
To: 7x12minilathe@ yahoogroups. com
Subject: [7x12minilathe] Re: Moments of Terror in Machining


I purchased a grinder from HF a long time ago when quality was an unknown
word "there" (across the ocean). The grinder suffered similar symptoms,
using it for 5 minutes it would get too hot to touch. I stopped using it
and made a grinder from an old pump motor (C-flange) and a set of pillow
block bearings mounted on a piece of channel 6" wide X 1/4" thick. This set
up lasted me almost 22 years but finally had to retire it because the
internal wiring, not the windings, got so brittle the insulation started to
crack in several places.

I recently purchased another one from HF and I'm happy to report that I can
use it for about 30 minutes before it gets too hot. They're not too much
different from what my first one was, just a little better. Quality
grinders cost way too much for us to justify buying one.

Frank.

--- In 7x12minilathe@ yahoogroups. com, "Kevin" <kcc-groups@ ...> wrote:

And to follow up. I did some research since I'm now in the market for a

new grinder :-)

G'day,

you will, most likely, only ever buy one bench grinder for your lifetime so why not make it a good one. My Aussie made Webster that I got when I was a a kid is as as good as as the day I brought it decades ago. This machine will well outlast me and it's next owner as well I would think - heavy as lead and full of real horses.

All countries will have their own "Websters", look for them at the used machinery dealers and get yourself a REAL grinder. It doesn't matter if it needs a little TLC, assuming it's electrically healthy what's it going to want to be new again ? a couple of bearings ?

Money well spent.

cheers,
Bob

Very few of the tools I have bought from HF were junk. Those few were
returned, and either swapped for good stuff, or my money refunded. The
cases I remember is from years ago, when any order over $200 was shipped
free. On the first one, I bought that 4x6 bandsaw, among other things. I
think it was $150 then, & the total order made the free shipping amount.
The order arrived, and the bandsaw had broken castings, & went back. The
replacement had broken castings as well, and went back. So did #3.
Finally, the 4th one was whole, & I've used it for over 20 years. HF did
not make a great deal, shipping those things back & forth. The second one
was another free shipping deal, over 50 free, and the big Vise, on sale at
40 bux was backordered. The other stuff was light, and arrived OK. The
vise arrived missing a part or something, and went back. This time, the
replacement was OK. All that stuff arrived via UPS, and shipping heavy
stuff UPS costs. Even with a special contract.

Mert

开云体育

Just FYI, this is from the Baldor web page:
"
These products are
produced at 26 plants
in the US, Canada, England,
Mexico and China.
"


so you may STILL be buying Chinese.

--
Jerry Durand, Durand Interstellar, Inc. www.interstellar.com
tel: +1 408 356-3886, USA toll free: 1 866 356-3886
Skype: jerrydurand

Sorry, you're absolutely right. All others please disregard my last posting.

Thank you for bringing it up, John.

I picked up an aluminum bar yesterday and was surprised to see "Made in
USA" on it. Didn't know we had any smelters left.

--
Jerry Durand, Durand Interstellar, Inc. www.interstellar.com
tel: +1 408 356-3886, USA toll free: 1 866 356-3886
Skype: jerrydurand

Full (physical) support of indexable carbide inserts is critical. That Harbor Freight 1/4" shank set doesn't appear to provide the support needed. Look for a 3/8" shank set instead. There are many sources. Also, as several group members have said, the grade and style of carbide is important for best performance.

Paul in Pittsfield

Based on past experience, this topic will rapidly degenerate into politics, someting best discussed elsewhere.

Please do not add to this topic.

John 7x12 Mod

Shop around. You can get one (new) for much less than $500



-Matt

Long time ago I bought a Black & Decker 1/2" drill motor, one of their promotional tools, for $19.00 dollars. The name plate stated "made in USA". This was back in 1968 and this drill looked like a pregnant 3/8" drill motor, no handle other then the pistol grip.

You could drill one 1/4" hole in a 3/8" steel plate with it then you had to put it down because it got to hot to hold. Drilling a 1/2" hole took about four hours in the same material, again because you had to let it cool off a bit before you could finish the job.

I still have the drill motor and it still works! The only part I replaced is the cord, the original is just too stiff to work with. It still runs, and still used on occasion.

In the US we just know how to make things that can last a long time, even though it was made cheaply to begin with it'll work for a long time.

Frank

Long time ago I bought a Black & Decker 1/2" drill motor, one of their promotional tools, for $19.00 dollars. The name plate stated "made in USA". This was back in 1968 and this drill looked like a pregnant 3/8" drill motor, no handle other then the pistol grip.

You could drill one 1/4" hole in a 3/8" steel plate with it then you had to put it down because it got to hot to hold. Drilling a 1/2" hole took about four hours in the same material, again because you had to let it cool off a bit before you could finish the job.

I still have the drill motor and it still works! The only part I replaced is the cord, the original is just too stiff to work with. It still runs, and still used on occasion.

In the US we just know how to make things that can last a long time, even though it was made cheaply to begin with it'll work for a long time.

Frank

my hf tool grinder has zero tendency to walk. I just placed it on a table and it has no vibration.
here's my advice on buying cheap chinese: Go to Harbor Freight online and READ THE REVIEWS. In truth, Chinese stuff is a mixture of good and bad. HF has EXCELLENT stuff, if you READ THE REVIEWS. The magnifying swing arm lamp is a great bargain at $25 now.
JB

开云体育

Ditto. I use a brazed US MADE carbide tool from msc to cut ss, and it shows no sign of dulling after thousands of cuts.
this is on a swiss cnc gang tool lathe.
But I have used chinese boring bars which work ok, though not as good as a micro 100. I have used these on a 8x12.
You can buy a SILICON CARBIDE knife sharpening stone for under 10$ and hand sharpen any carbide tool.
Carbide tools, including inserts, will cut better if they have POINT, eg a triangular insert or tool, simply because points
need less force to cut. The cutoff tools from MSC are rectangular ended, and about .100 wide. They cost about 16$ and you will give them to your grand children.
There are similar chinese tools for 5$, but avoid. They will work well on mini-lathe, imo.
JB

On Wednesday 05 October 2011 12:08:32 SirJohnOfYork wrote:

If, as I suspect, you are using a tool which has the carbide tip
brazed on you are basically dealing with a junk tool and will not have
much luck.

if its a Chinese tool yes all that is true (I think Chinese carbide uses rat turds as the binder)
now if you use a good grade, high quality brazed carbide like micro100 ( )
you'll have much better luck
these will cut freely and last a long time even with zero top rake and even on hardened stainless
but you will have to cut the feed rate down to under .001" IPR on a light duty machine
we use these on our Swiss screw machines all the time

Brian
--
Nemo Me Impune Lacessit

i dont have the hf tool grinder bolted down.

My grinder is an Aldi's cheapy, the Taurus brand. When I got it I knew
the first thing would be is check the bolts and wheels before turning it
on. Let it run for 15 minutes on its own so if the wheels are cracked
they would let go when I was not sitting in front of it. Then dress the
wheels. This improved balance.... a little.

The left (coarse wheel) was replaced with a white one. What a
difference in cutting performance and balance compared to the original
wheel.

I have tried making new bushes and thrust plates for it but the wheels
do not run true. At least the vibration has improved significantly

The motor is rated at 170 Watts and is to hot to touch after 30 minutes
of hard grinding. The motor in under-powered and I have to live with
that. This is a hobby so I am OK in taking a break for a cuppa while it
cools.

Cheers,

Andrew in Melbourne