Sorry, a VNA is not suited for you. You'll need to understand how it works and what calibration does. Otherwise you won't be able to trust your measurements. Cookbook recipes cover just a fraction of my VNA work. And do get a grip on Smith charts, you won't regret it. No need to be a math wizzard in order to grasp the basics.
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On July 14, 2022 11:03 AM Observer <tvstreamdevice@...> wrote:
Just recieved a nanoVNA today.
Can someone tell me or point me to online sources about , without fancy mathematical technical terms :
How to start , I heard, I need to calibrate ? How ?
How to check antenna impedance, in ohms please, no smiths charts stuff , just ohms !
How to check capacitors and inductor values .
How to check the input /output impedance of test equipment
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On Thu, Jul 14, 2022 at 11:55 AM, Arie Kleingeld PA3A wrote:
It is nice to know what you actually want to measure and how to measure some
basic stuff in the first place.
Arie, you are 100% right. I.M.H.O it's the wrong way to buy something (although very nice) and try to find a problem to solve. The better path (again to my humble opinion) is when you encounter a problem, understand it, find a way to measure it, buy a NanoVNA and then solve it. Or when you want to develop/experiment, first learn the basic stuff. 73 Alex, PE1EVX
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All answers and links to manuals are in the wiki, see the links below.
You'll learn a lot in a short time, faster than letting people type it out again :-)
Then again, if you are not familiar with the language involved, you better visit study that first. It is nice to know what you actually want to measure and how to measure some basic stuff in the first place.
Personally I learned a lot reading the wiki and following a few weeks of meassages in this group.
73
Arie
Op 14-7-2022 om 11:03 schreef Observer:
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Show quoted text
Just recieved a nanoVNA today.
Can someone tell me or point me to online sources about , without fancy mathematical technical terms :
How to start , I heard, I need to calibrate ? How ?
How to check antenna impedance, in ohms please, no smiths charts stuff , just ohms !
How to check capacitors and inductor values .
How to check the input /output impedance of test equipment
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Just recieved a nanoVNA today.
Can someone tell me or point me to online sources about , without fancy mathematical technical terms :
How to start , I heard, I need to calibrate ? How ?
How to check antenna impedance, in ohms please, no smiths charts stuff , just ohms !
How to check capacitors and inductor values .
How to check the input /output impedance of test equipment
|
Re: Common ground and 2-port measuring
In the sketch
from
bobine
It uses two transformers head to tail, which seems logical.
--
F1AMM Fran?ois
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-----Message d'origine----- De la part de Victor Reijs jeudi 14 juillet 2022 07:27
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Re: Common ground and 2-port measuring
Hello Ed,
I postpone my experiments until I can build these transformers needed to do
a proper(?) DM measurement (as described in the earlier article, Fig. 16b).
A month ago I ordered some small toroids (also to make a three way RF
meter), still awaiting them.
I think your T1 measurement is only part of getting a DM model/measurement.
All the best,
Victor
P.S. The article is about CMC build of non-coax/twined cable, so the
model/results I somewhat different then for a 'transmission line' (RF) CMC:
Op di 12 jul. 2022 om 08:58 schreef Ed G8FAX <ed@...>:
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Hi Victor,
Thank you for your update and information.
There are different ways to measure CMC performance as there are different
'lumped' component models of a CMC taking account of parasitic elements of
a practical or real component.
There is merit in making a test configuration and method for how the
component will be used in a particular application. If I were designing and
making a CMC filter, I would use a different method of testing to my simple
proposal, one very similar to your preferred configuration.
I do not have any rf 1:1 center-tapped baluns so am not able to compare
results. If and when you have time to make comparisons, I would be very
interested in your findings.
Kind regards
Ed, G8FAX
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Re: Should I upgrade firmware, and if so which version to use?
Apples and oranges. The Nano is a small dedicated purpose device with a tight team of very smart developers. Windows is a bloated Swiss Army knife *operating system* software by committee. Hardly a fair comparison. I update my Linux boxen regularly and rarely have any issues. 73 -Jim NU0C On Wed, 13 Jul 2022 05:20:30 -0400 "David Wilcox K8WPE via groups.io" <Djwilcox01@...> wrote: Case in point¡. Windows upgrades! How many issues occur every time that happens? It sure generates a multitude of emails to the various QRP groups I follow. Even Linux seems to have multiple upgrades of each version¡. What to do?
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Re: Ubuntu PPA or .deb installation
Not sure this addresses your problem, but I do not see the need for a package (.deb or otherwise) as NanoVNA-Saver comes as a binary for Linux, Mac and Windows, no need to install anything. This worked for me on Linux Mint 20.3 (Ubuntu 20.04.5 LTS): download the zipped file NanoVNASaver.linux.zip from , extract nanovna-saver, chmod +x to make it executable and double-click (or ./nanovna-saver) to run. Optionally you can create a Menu item.
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Re: Should I upgrade firmware, and if so which version to use?
I have not found any upgrade for the NanoVNA that required any "learning curve" besides what was needed initially to learn the instrument. Operation has been as it always was. Some of the improvements included more samples per frequency segment you wished to look at, and adding a display of the frequencies to the memories. This was a great addition to me, as before I always forgot what frequency ranges I had put in each memory and had to go through each one to find out. There have been other "transparent" improvements in the upgrades which I didn't even notice, but helped out. Zack W9SZ On Wed, Jul 13, 2022 at 4:20 AM David Wilcox K8WPE via groups.io <Djwilcox01@...> wrote: Somehow you all missed my point a few days ago¡.. much of the upgrades in
firmware are beyond the pay grade of many of the initial users. Until one
gets used to using the nano (or your handheld or any new radio tool you
have) and performing the tasks it was originally designed for WHY have new
features that one doesn¡¯t need or understand? The learning curve of
upgrading (especially if you have never done it before) can be intimidating
and an error makes your nano useless. It¡¯s always nice to have the latest
greatest whatever but much of the time it isn¡¯t needed. My initial H4 nano
from R&L Electronics still does all I have needed it for. Someday when I
get snowed in or whatever I might look into upgrading but if I don¡¯t need
the new features why bother?
There are those who need to have the latest greatest and for them that is
fine but many of the upgrades are for special needs that don¡¯t apply to all
of us. Maybe if I had a local guru walk me through upgrades a few times I
might change my mind but doing an upgrade just to do it doesn¡¯t make sense.
If it isn¡¯t broken why fix it? I originally had a guru help me set up my
DMR handheld and hotspot and then he moved away¡.. it still does what I
need even though there have been upgrades to the AnyTone 878. I am still
having fun and haven¡¯t needed to write an email here because I screwed up
and bricked my handheld or nano. The newest young guru in our club goes
through it all so fast I can¡¯t keep up. He¡¯s not a good teacher even though
willing to do upgrades on some things¡. But not the nano yet, just DMR.
Case in point¡. Windows upgrades! How many issues occur every time that
happens? It sure generates a multitude of emails to the various QRP groups
I follow. Even Linux seems to have multiple upgrades of each version¡. What
to do?
Dave K8WPE since 1960 and still having fun with my limited knowledge and
initial firmware.
David J. Wilcox¡¯s iPad
On Jul 12, 2022, at 11:24 PM, Jim Shorney <jimNU0C@...> wrote:
?
But if your wife wants to "upgrade" her shoes do you tell her no? :D
The bottom line with upgrades is stuff works better. Who doesn't want that? The developers are very quick to fix bugs so you can be pretty
confident that the latest stable version that is out there won't be buggy.
Could a new bug surface that no one has caught yet? Sure. That is true of
literally everything that uses software/firmware. But it probably won't be
anything major if it took a while to surface.
73
-Jim
NU0C
On Tue, 12 Jul 2022 04:10:55 -0700
"alex" <alex@...> wrote:
Right. The question should be "am I missing something I want to use
right now or am I using something that has a bug and should be repaired
right now." If you don't know what you're missing and all your tests are
performed well, why should you upgrade. Yeah some bugs might be solved, but
others could enter just your tests. This is like a married man who wants an
upgrade of his wife, is it necessary, is it broken?
<> Virus-free. www.avast.com <> <#DAB4FAD8-2DD7-40BB-A1B8-4E2AA1F9FDF2>
|
Re: Should I upgrade firmware, and if so which version to use?
sometimes you get a device that has a very old fw in it (seller had it for a year before selling) ... with maybe slow scan speed and lower points per scan (and that means lower resolution!)... and even on dealers hp you do not find the newest
maybe fw is changed somewhat that it works with this or that windoze soft
or new functions added that may be helpful ... or ...
so ... i would ask what is newest "stable" version for my unit and then upgrade
dg9bfc sigi
Am 13.07.2022 um 11:20 schrieb David Wilcox K8WPE via groups.io:
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Show quoted text
Somehow you all missed my point a few days ago¡.. much of the upgrades in firmware are beyond the pay grade of many of the initial users. Until one gets used to using the nano (or your handheld or any new radio tool you have) and performing the tasks it was originally designed for WHY have new features that one doesn¡¯t need or understand? The learning curve of upgrading (especially if you have never done it before) can be intimidating and an error makes your nano useless. It¡¯s always nice to have the latest greatest whatever but much of the time it isn¡¯t needed. My initial H4 nano from R&L Electronics still does all I have needed it for. Someday when I get snowed in or whatever I might look into upgrading but if I don¡¯t need the new features why bother?
There are those who need to have the latest greatest and for them that is fine but many of the upgrades are for special needs that don¡¯t apply to all of us. Maybe if I had a local guru walk me through upgrades a few times I might change my mind but doing an upgrade just to do it doesn¡¯t make sense. If it isn¡¯t broken why fix it? I originally had a guru help me set up my DMR handheld and hotspot and then he moved away¡.. it still does what I need even though there have been upgrades to the AnyTone 878. I am still having fun and haven¡¯t needed to write an email here because I screwed up and bricked my handheld or nano. The newest young guru in our club goes through it all so fast I can¡¯t keep up. He¡¯s not a good teacher even though willing to do upgrades on some things¡. But not the nano yet, just DMR.
Case in point¡. Windows upgrades! How many issues occur every time that happens? It sure generates a multitude of emails to the various QRP groups I follow. Even Linux seems to have multiple upgrades of each version¡. What to do?
Dave K8WPE since 1960 and still having fun with my limited knowledge and initial firmware.
David J. Wilcox¡¯s iPad
On Jul 12, 2022, at 11:24 PM, Jim Shorney <jimNU0C@...> wrote:
?
But if your wife wants to "upgrade" her shoes do you tell her no? :D
The bottom line with upgrades is stuff works better. Who doesn't want that? The developers are very quick to fix bugs so you can be pretty confident that the latest stable version that is out there won't be buggy. Could a new bug surface that no one has caught yet? Sure. That is true of literally everything that uses software/firmware. But it probably won't be anything major if it took a while to surface.
73
-Jim
NU0C
On Tue, 12 Jul 2022 04:10:55 -0700
"alex" <alex@...> wrote:
Right. The question should be "am I missing something I want to use right now or am I using something that has a bug and should be repaired right now." If you don't know what you're missing and all your tests are performed well, why should you upgrade. Yeah some bugs might be solved, but others could enter just your tests. This is like a married man who wants an upgrade of his wife, is it necessary, is it broken?
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Re: Should I upgrade firmware, and if so which version to use?
Agreed, but I don't know what it is, and perhaps shouldn't blame Windows. However, once I have a setting that works, an update shouldn't change it. - Michael
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On 13/07/2022 10:45, David J Taylor via groups.io wrote: On 13/07/2022 10:40, Michael wrote:
David, []> Windows upgrades: after every upgrade I have to go round my networked
computers and reset the network settings or they won't talk to each other!
Michael (GW7BBY/GB2MOP) Michael,
If you mean the monthly updates, there appears to be something wrong with the way your network is configured.? You should not need to reset the network settings!
73,
David GM8ARV
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Re: Should I upgrade firmware, and if so which version to use?
On 13/07/2022 10:40, Michael wrote: David, []> Windows upgrades: after every upgrade I have to go round my networked computers and reset the network settings or they won't talk to each other!
Michael (GW7BBY/GB2MOP) Michael, If you mean the monthly updates, there appears to be something wrong with the way your network is configured. You should not need to reset the network settings! 73, David GM8ARV -- SatSignal Software - Quality software for you Web: Email: david-taylor@... Twitter: @gm8arv
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Re: Should I upgrade firmware, and if so which version to use?
David,
I agree with you: my NanoVNA with original firmware does exactly what I want I to do. Sure there may be useful new features in the updates, but one thing that really puts me off is that a major feature of this forum is people having issues with updates. It might be worth doing an update simply to see what is involved and learning from the process - but I don't need to.
Windows upgrades: after every upgrade I have to go round my networked computers and reset the network settings or they won't talk to each other!
Michael (GW7BBY/GB2MOP)
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
On 13/07/2022 10:20, David Wilcox K8WPE via groups.io wrote: Somehow you all missed my point a few days ago¡.. much of the upgrades in firmware are beyond the pay grade of many of the initial users. Until one gets used to using the nano (or your handheld or any new radio tool you have) and performing the tasks it was originally designed for WHY have new features that one doesn¡¯t need or understand? The learning curve of upgrading (especially if you have never done it before) can be intimidating and an error makes your nano useless. It¡¯s always nice to have the latest greatest whatever but much of the time it isn¡¯t needed. My initial H4 nano from R&L Electronics still does all I have needed it for. Someday when I get snowed in or whatever I might look into upgrading but if I don¡¯t need the new features why bother?
There are those who need to have the latest greatest and for them that is fine but many of the upgrades are for special needs that don¡¯t apply to all of us. Maybe if I had a local guru walk me through upgrades a few times I might change my mind but doing an upgrade just to do it doesn¡¯t make sense. If it isn¡¯t broken why fix it? I originally had a guru help me set up my DMR handheld and hotspot and then he moved away¡.. it still does what I need even though there have been upgrades to the AnyTone 878. I am still having fun and haven¡¯t needed to write an email here because I screwed up and bricked my handheld or nano. The newest young guru in our club goes through it all so fast I can¡¯t keep up. He¡¯s not a good teacher even though willing to do upgrades on some things¡. But not the nano yet, just DMR.
Case in point¡. Windows upgrades! How many issues occur every time that happens? It sure generates a multitude of emails to the various QRP groups I follow. Even Linux seems to have multiple upgrades of each version¡. What to do?
Dave K8WPE since 1960 and still having fun with my limited knowledge and initial firmware.
David J. Wilcox¡¯s iPad
On Jul 12, 2022, at 11:24 PM, Jim Shorney<jimNU0C@...> wrote:
?
But if your wife wants to "upgrade" her shoes do you tell her no? :D
The bottom line with upgrades is stuff works better. Who doesn't want that? The developers are very quick to fix bugs so you can be pretty confident that the latest stable version that is out there won't be buggy. Could a new bug surface that no one has caught yet? Sure. That is true of literally everything that uses software/firmware. But it probably won't be anything major if it took a while to surface.
73
-Jim
NU0C
On Tue, 12 Jul 2022 04:10:55 -0700
"alex"<alex@...> wrote:
Right. The question should be "am I missing something I want to use right now or am I using something that has a bug and should be repaired right now." If you don't know what you're missing and all your tests are performed well, why should you upgrade. Yeah some bugs might be solved, but others could enter just your tests. This is like a married man who wants an upgrade of his wife, is it necessary, is it broken?
|
Re: Should I upgrade firmware, and if so which version to use?
Somehow you all missed my point a few days ago¡.. much of the upgrades in firmware are beyond the pay grade of many of the initial users. Until one gets used to using the nano (or your handheld or any new radio tool you have) and performing the tasks it was originally designed for WHY have new features that one doesn¡¯t need or understand? The learning curve of upgrading (especially if you have never done it before) can be intimidating and an error makes your nano useless. It¡¯s always nice to have the latest greatest whatever but much of the time it isn¡¯t needed. My initial H4 nano from R&L Electronics still does all I have needed it for. Someday when I get snowed in or whatever I might look into upgrading but if I don¡¯t need the new features why bother?
There are those who need to have the latest greatest and for them that is fine but many of the upgrades are for special needs that don¡¯t apply to all of us. Maybe if I had a local guru walk me through upgrades a few times I might change my mind but doing an upgrade just to do it doesn¡¯t make sense. If it isn¡¯t broken why fix it? I originally had a guru help me set up my DMR handheld and hotspot and then he moved away¡.. it still does what I need even though there have been upgrades to the AnyTone 878. I am still having fun and haven¡¯t needed to write an email here because I screwed up and bricked my handheld or nano. The newest young guru in our club goes through it all so fast I can¡¯t keep up. He¡¯s not a good teacher even though willing to do upgrades on some things¡. But not the nano yet, just DMR.
Case in point¡. Windows upgrades! How many issues occur every time that happens? It sure generates a multitude of emails to the various QRP groups I follow. Even Linux seems to have multiple upgrades of each version¡. What to do?
Dave K8WPE since 1960 and still having fun with my limited knowledge and initial firmware.
David J. Wilcox¡¯s iPad
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
On Jul 12, 2022, at 11:24 PM, Jim Shorney <jimNU0C@...> wrote:
?
But if your wife wants to "upgrade" her shoes do you tell her no? :D
The bottom line with upgrades is stuff works better. Who doesn't want that? The developers are very quick to fix bugs so you can be pretty confident that the latest stable version that is out there won't be buggy. Could a new bug surface that no one has caught yet? Sure. That is true of literally everything that uses software/firmware. But it probably won't be anything major if it took a while to surface.
73
-Jim
NU0C
On Tue, 12 Jul 2022 04:10:55 -0700
"alex" <alex@...> wrote:
Right. The question should be "am I missing something I want to use right now or am I using something that has a bug and should be repaired right now." If you don't know what you're missing and all your tests are performed well, why should you upgrade. Yeah some bugs might be solved, but others could enter just your tests. This is like a married man who wants an upgrade of his wife, is it necessary, is it broken?
|
Re: Should I upgrade firmware, and if so which version to use?
But if your wife wants to "upgrade" her shoes do you tell her no? :D The bottom line with upgrades is stuff works better. Who doesn't want that? The developers are very quick to fix bugs so you can be pretty confident that the latest stable version that is out there won't be buggy. Could a new bug surface that no one has caught yet? Sure. That is true of literally everything that uses software/firmware. But it probably won't be anything major if it took a while to surface. 73 -Jim NU0C On Tue, 12 Jul 2022 04:10:55 -0700 "alex" <alex@...> wrote: Right. The question should be "am I missing something I want to use right now or am I using something that has a bug and should be repaired right now." If you don't know what you're missing and all your tests are performed well, why should you upgrade. Yeah some bugs might be solved, but others could enter just your tests. This is like a married man who wants an upgrade of his wife, is it necessary, is it broken?
|
Re: Should I upgrade firmware, and if so which version to use?
All the large engineering projects I have worked on have had a "tool freeze" date. Once the software tools for the project have been chosen we update to the latest known good version, and then keep that version for the duration of the project. That way everyone has the same tool versions; all the tool bugs become quickly known, along with their workarounds; and no new bugs appear late in the program.
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Re: Should I upgrade firmware, and if so which version to use?
I have a NanoVNA H4. One thing I like about recent firmware updates is that, when you save a calibrated frequency range in the memory, it then actually displays the frequency range that is stored. Older versions didn't do that. Zack W9SZ On Tue, Jul 12, 2022 at 12:15 AM Jim Shorney <jimNU0C@...> wrote:
Of course you should still upgrade to the latest. You will get bug fixes,
performance improvements, and new features. FREE!
73
-Jim
NU0C
On Mon, 11 Jul 2022 10:50:32 -0700
m2walter@... wrote:
You're correct. I was thinking about it and tried it: the NanoVNA does go to 900 MHZ. And all this time I thought that since the default stop freq
that it 'boots up with' is 250 Mhz that it was not capable of going higher.
That will teach me to test before opening my mouth.
This makes me feel better: less worried 'bout changing firmware.
Mark Walter
<> Virus-free. www.avast.com <> <#DAB4FAD8-2DD7-40BB-A1B8-4E2AA1F9FDF2>
|
Re: Should I upgrade firmware, and if so which version to use?
"Can I upgrade the firmware and obtain additional functionality?"
Yes. You didn't say how old your NanoVNA is, or its firmware version - but, if you carefully make note of its current version, find, download and save that version, then you can install any newer version. Test any new ones, then, and you can still go back and re-install your current version.
If your current one is more than a year old, there will be many new features in newer versions.
You can 'swap around' firmware versions sort of like you can swap pairs of socks. Well, it will be harder the first time.
There's an old "AA" version that's nice for use testing antennas outdoors - it has an extra-large text font for much easier readability in brighter light. The "AA" seems to be for "Antenna Analyzer".
Be sure to read up about changing firmware, and maybe also watch some videos about doing it. The first time or two will seem a little tricky or difficult, but that's mostly just because it's something new (to you).
Good luck, and have even more fun with your Nano!
--
Doug, K8RFT
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Arie Kleingeld PA3A
Ho-Ro
Jim Shorney
David J Taylor
David Wilcox K8WPE
Douglas Butler