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Re: FT8 Ops in Unix

 

well, rick, you are correct with stating, that apps run best in the OS they are compiled for, and the rest. BUT HDR is such a teenywheeny application compared to some decent games. and they all run almost flawlessly. (my experience)

peter, OE6PLD
--
Disclaimer: May be opened and read by the NSA, CIA, GCHQ, KGB, BND, and whoever else it may NOT concern.


Am So., 19. Jan. 2025 um 19:50?Uhr schrieb k9ao via <k9ao=[email protected]>:

Actually, that is *not* true. But it may be for HRD which I have never
used. So I'll give you that as a user of this app in Linux (at least
today that is true based on what you told us). And that is useful
information.

But certainly my 50+ years of (yes I really do mean UNIX) and Linux
software (and kernel) development and administration experience and
hardware development count for something. There are many applications
that "sort of" run in emulation. But not *all* run flawlessly.

That is faulty thinking based on my own experience. Applications always
run best on the OS they are designed for. Someone should not enter into
the thought that all Windows applications will somehow magically run as
they do in Windows under emulation in Linux. They may run fine, they may
run acceptably with acceptable oddities, or they may not run well enough
at all. You would have to test each one yourself on your distro of
choice and using your preferred emulator to see. And fully test all of
the features, not just the ones that you use most of time. Test the
hidden ones that you need occasionally. Do a full system test on it.

I stand by my advice that if someone wants to let go of Windows, then do
it. I think that is a good move. See if you can find applications that
will work for what you need natively under Linux if you can. And
remember that there is no guarantee that something that works flawlessly
under emulation in Linux today will continue to do so as the developer
migrates to other development environments or uses new tools. Real
Windows yes, emulators no. And Windows developers will migrate as
Microsoft moves on. I know this because as a Windows developer too I
have been through this many times as Microsoft releases new upgraded
development environments and tools and re-distributable packages.

I have a Codeweavers Crossover subscription. That a a commercial
emulator. And, many applications can still be run using that on Linux (I
advocate for several), but not exactly as they do natively under
Windows. Pretty darned good though I have to say. The trouble is that
the cost of that subscription over say a 5 year period will exceed the
cost of a brand new Windows 11 PC. So the thinking there about economy
just does not wash. It would be better and cheaper to just get the new
Windows 11 PC and be done with it. Stuff will just run. Now if you are
going to switch to native Linux applications, then the economy does work
out. And things will run generally faster and better for you. That's why
I use Linux daily. I use Codeweavers because in the cases that
applications will run under emulation I can save myself a boot to
Windows from Linux? or firing up a VM quickly to use them. But I do have
a full Windows install available too.

As to Ham Radio Deluxe, the developers themselves recommend running it
on Mac or Linux in a VM. That of course is *not* emulation for one
application, but is a way to actually run a Windows operating system
(complete) using the virtualization capabilities of modern processors.
This is a different thing from emulation entirely. So from the
developers themselves, I'd take this to mean that they would not commit
to support emulation working indefinitely, or well, or at all. If it
does, I guess fine. But there are no guarantees that such will always be
the case. Hence my recommendation to just get off of Windows apps if you
can and if you can't stay with Windows. If you do go the emulation route
understand that there is a possibility that someday the application just
won't work or work right under emulation and you'll have to move on to a
native Linux application that'll do the job anyway, or move back to
Windows then if you want to stay with the original app.

As to cross platforming something like HRD, this is not as easy as some
might think. If it was developed in a Windows environment using
non-cross platform tools then I'm guessing it'd be about a complete
re-write from zero (been there, done that). And that will probably never
happen. It would not make economic sense to the developer. If it was
developed with a cross-platform model initially, then it is a smaller
job to get it running on other operating systems. Not trivial by any
means though since the way things work across the 3 main OS platforms is
different enough in many cases.

But again, think of what is there now in Linux. Not what might be, and
see if that any of that works for you.

Rick Kunath, K9AO






Re: FT8 Ops in Unix

 

Actually, that is *not* true. But it may be for HRD which I have never used. So I'll give you that as a user of this app in Linux (at least today that is true based on what you told us). And that is useful information.

But certainly my 50+ years of (yes I really do mean UNIX) and Linux software (and kernel) development and administration experience and hardware development count for something. There are many applications that "sort of" run in emulation. But not *all* run flawlessly.

That is faulty thinking based on my own experience. Applications always run best on the OS they are designed for. Someone should not enter into the thought that all Windows applications will somehow magically run as they do in Windows under emulation in Linux. They may run fine, they may run acceptably with acceptable oddities, or they may not run well enough at all. You would have to test each one yourself on your distro of choice and using your preferred emulator to see. And fully test all of the features, not just the ones that you use most of time. Test the hidden ones that you need occasionally. Do a full system test on it.

I stand by my advice that if someone wants to let go of Windows, then do it. I think that is a good move. See if you can find applications that will work for what you need natively under Linux if you can. And remember that there is no guarantee that something that works flawlessly under emulation in Linux today will continue to do so as the developer migrates to other development environments or uses new tools. Real Windows yes, emulators no. And Windows developers will migrate as Microsoft moves on. I know this because as a Windows developer too I have been through this many times as Microsoft releases new upgraded development environments and tools and re-distributable packages.

I have a Codeweavers Crossover subscription. That a a commercial emulator. And, many applications can still be run using that on Linux (I advocate for several), but not exactly as they do natively under Windows. Pretty darned good though I have to say. The trouble is that the cost of that subscription over say a 5 year period will exceed the cost of a brand new Windows 11 PC. So the thinking there about economy just does not wash. It would be better and cheaper to just get the new Windows 11 PC and be done with it. Stuff will just run. Now if you are going to switch to native Linux applications, then the economy does work out. And things will run generally faster and better for you. That's why I use Linux daily. I use Codeweavers because in the cases that applications will run under emulation I can save myself a boot to Windows from Linux? or firing up a VM quickly to use them. But I do have a full Windows install available too.

As to Ham Radio Deluxe, the developers themselves recommend running it on Mac or Linux in a VM. That of course is *not* emulation for one application, but is a way to actually run a Windows operating system (complete) using the virtualization capabilities of modern processors. This is a different thing from emulation entirely. So from the developers themselves, I'd take this to mean that they would not commit to support emulation working indefinitely, or well, or at all. If it does, I guess fine. But there are no guarantees that such will always be the case. Hence my recommendation to just get off of Windows apps if you can and if you can't stay with Windows. If you do go the emulation route understand that there is a possibility that someday the application just won't work or work right under emulation and you'll have to move on to a native Linux application that'll do the job anyway, or move back to Windows then if you want to stay with the original app.

As to cross platforming something like HRD, this is not as easy as some might think. If it was developed in a Windows environment using non-cross platform tools then I'm guessing it'd be about a complete re-write from zero (been there, done that). And that will probably never happen. It would not make economic sense to the developer. If it was developed with a cross-platform model initially, then it is a smaller job to get it running on other operating systems. Not trivial by any means though since the way things work across the 3 main OS platforms is different enough in many cases.

But again, think of what is there now in Linux. Not what might be, and see if that any of that works for you.

Rick Kunath, K9AO


Re: FT8 Ops in Unix

 

Unix/Linux
?
Linux: Is considered to be "Unix-like". Likely the only thing to change will be the logging application, rest of the commonly used digi apps have Linux versions/binaries/source code available.
?
Unix/Mac: macOS is a Unix based system, and the most widely used commercial Unix OS I would think today. Similar to Linux, likely only need to change the logging application, rest have macOS versions available.
?
I tend to use which ever hardware/OS config best solves the need or use I have (based on what I have), so I have a bit of everything. For Ham radio I run an late 2015 27" iMac (5K display), the applications and their setup/config I have - even for non-mac there may be useful info there as much the configuration is the same.
?
Each to their own, we have a lot of choices, find the setup that works best for you :-)
?
Lonney
K1LH


Re: #logging #ubuntu #logging #ubuntu

 

I gave up and built a dual boot Windows and Mint. My Dell Laptop now has two internal M.2 SSDs one for each operating system so they play nice.
?
73
Bob
KQ5DX


Re: FT8 Ops in Unix

 

Look into QLog - It runs on Linux, Mac, and Windows. ?It integrates very well with WSJT-X / WSJT-X Improved, and Grid Tracker when configured with multicast. ?QLog supports LoTW, eQSL, QRZ, etc. ?IMO I find QLog to better than CQRLog. ?QLog does not require setting up ?mySQL or MariaDB, it uses SQLite. ?Linux in the Ham Shack has a podcast episode about QLog - . ?Right now QLog displays the UTC clock in a 12-hour format and requires an environment variable to be set to display in the 24-hour format. ?It looks like there is some work being done to change the clock format without needing to set the environment variable in an upcoming version.
?
-Brian, KB3ORR


Re: FT8 Ops in Unix

 

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Thanx ALL.... 73 Fred


From: [email protected] <[email protected]> on behalf of Adrian Fewster, VK4TUX via groups.io <vk4tux@...>
Sent: Saturday, January 18, 2025 9:26 PM
To: [email protected] <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: [linuxham] FT8 Ops in Unix
?
I could not disagree more. HRD works great under many types of windows
emulators; wine, bottles, crossover.

All radio interface and port interactions with linux programs work as
well as they do in windows.

This is from someone that actually does it rather than having an
uninformed guess opinion...


73


vk4tux

On 19/1/25 15:20, k9ao via groups.io wrote:
> True words Glenn...
>
> I run Opensuse Tumbleweed Linux as my daily driver and I agree. If
> someone wants to go Linux, even though there are ways to run things
> that are Windows applications in virtual machines or using WINE or
> Codeweavers Crossover, you are best off switching over to native Linux
> equivalents.
>
> Honestly, if you are committed to HRD and it's only a Windows
> application, it is better and simpler to just stay with Windows. If
> you are open to change then welcome over to the light side and Linux.
> Windows applications under some adaption on Linux are possible. But
> they aren't going to be as reliable and as simple as they are under
> their native OS.
>
> I'm a huge Linux proponent. But switching has to make sense for what
> you are doing with the OS.
>
> Rick Kunath, K9AO
>
>
>
>
>






--
de Fred W0SP


Re: FT8 Ops in Unix

 

开云体育

Peter thanx...


From: [email protected] <[email protected]> on behalf of Peter Loeffler via groups.io <loepew@...>
Sent: Sunday, January 19, 2025 3:20 AM
To: [email protected] <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: [linuxham] FT8 Ops in Unix
?
there is no need to run an extra virtual maschine on linux/unix to have a windows-program running. the magic is called "wine" and let's say 99.9% of windows-applications can be run on ux*

wsjt-x and gridtracker are both available as linux programs. all the logging stuff works completely as you know from windows

73
OE6PLD, Peter
--
Disclaimer: May be opened and read by the NSA, CIA, GCHQ, KGB, BND, and whoever else it may NOT concern.

--
de Fred W0SP


Re: FT8 Ops in Unix

 

开云体育

Yes.... Thanx I'm looking into Wine... 73 Fred


From:[email protected] <[email protected]> on behalf of Peter Loeffler via groups.io <loepew@...>
Sent:?Sunday, January 19, 2025 3:20 AM
To:[email protected] <[email protected]>
Subject:?Re: [linuxham] FT8 Ops in Unix
?
there is no need to run an extra virtual maschine on linux/unix to have a windows-program running. the magic is called "wine" and let's say 99.9% of windows-applications can be run on ux*

wsjt-x and gridtracker are both available as linux programs. all the logging stuff works completely as you know from windows

73
OE6PLD, Peter
--
Disclaimer: May be opened and read by the NSA, CIA, GCHQ, KGB, BND, and whoever else it may NOT concern.

--
de Fred W0SP


Re: W1HKJ - url is redirected?

 

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Dave... Ill have a look .. On both counts... Thanx? 73 Fred


From: [email protected] <[email protected]> on behalf of Dave, G?WBX via groups.io <g8kbvdave@...>
Sent: Sunday, January 19, 2025 3:23 AM
To: [email protected] <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: [linuxham] W1HKJ - url is redirected?
?
FireFox can be configured not to "Enforce" HTTPS: only.? Look in the
settings pages.? It's all there.

Using FF 134.0 64 bit on LMDE 6.?? And I can go straight to
? each and every time without warnings or diversions. I
have it bookmarked too!

73.

Dave G0WBX




--
Created on and sent from a Unix like PC running and using open source software:







--
de Fred W0SP


Re: FT8 Ops in Unix

 

Re:-
Have you looked at CQRLOG in Linux?

Or FlLog?

Or Cloud Log????

Not entirely "Free", but the author (Pete 2E0SQL) is a good guy, and knows what he's doing.

73.

Dave G0WBX

--
Created on and sent from a Unix like PC running and using open source software:


Re: W1HKJ - url is redirected?

 

FireFox can be configured not to "Enforce" HTTPS: only.? Look in the settings pages.? It's all there.

Using FF 134.0 64 bit on LMDE 6.?? And I can go straight to www.w1hkj.com? each and every time without warnings or diversions. I have it bookmarked too!

73.

Dave G0WBX




--
Created on and sent from a Unix like PC running and using open source software:


Re: FT8 Ops in Unix

 

there is no need to run an extra virtual maschine on linux/unix to have a windows-program running. the magic is called "wine" and let's say 99.9% of windows-applications can be run on ux*

wsjt-x and gridtracker are both available as linux programs. all the logging stuff works completely as you know from windows

73
OE6PLD, Peter
--
Disclaimer: May be opened and read by the NSA, CIA, GCHQ, KGB, BND, and whoever else it may NOT concern.


Re: FT8 Ops in Unix

 

True words Glenn...

I run Opensuse Tumbleweed Linux as my daily driver and I agree. If someone wants to go Linux, even though there are ways to run things that are Windows applications in virtual machines or using WINE or Codeweavers Crossover, you are best off switching over to native Linux equivalents.

Honestly, if you are committed to HRD and it's only a Windows application, it is better and simpler to just stay with Windows. If you are open to change then welcome over to the light side and Linux. Windows applications under some adaption on Linux are possible. But they aren't going to be as reliable and as simple as they are under their native OS.

I'm a huge Linux proponent. But switching has to make sense for what you are doing with the OS.

Rick Kunath, K9AO


Re: #logging #ubuntu #logging #ubuntu

 

Thanks to everyone who replied.? I will try out some of the ideas and let you know how it worked.
73, Bill


Re: FT8 Ops in Unix

 

开云体育

Guys,

I run all environments, however, most of my hamming today is run from Linux (Ubuntu and Mint).

Trying to leverage Wine is a non-starter for most - while I have gotten it to work in many cases, it was worse than staying on Windows. ?I have volunteered to beta HRD on Linux - I am not holding my breath.

Hit my QRZ page - listing of SW that I use.

73’蝉



Glenn
WA6BJQ

From: [email protected] <[email protected]> on behalf of Fred Hollendorfer, W0SP via groups.io <phredyh@...>
Date: Saturday, January 18, 2025 at 2:14?PM
To: [email protected] <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: [linuxham] FT8 Ops in Unix

Thanx I’ll have a look…
Fred Hollendorfer, W0SP
Wheat Ridge, CO

> On Jan 18, 2025, at 15:10, k9ao via groups.io <k9ao@...> wrote:
>
> ?Have you looked at CQRLOG in Linux?
>
> Rick Kunath, K9AO
>
>
>
>
>



--
de Fred W0SP






Re: FT8 Ops in Unix

 

Thanx I’ll have a look…
Fred Hollendorfer, W0SP
Wheat Ridge, CO

On Jan 18, 2025, at 15:10, k9ao via groups.io <k9ao@...> wrote:

?Have you looked at CQRLOG in Linux?

Rick Kunath, K9AO




--
de Fred W0SP


Re: FT8 Ops in Unix

 

Have you looked at CQRLOG in Linux?

Rick Kunath, K9AO


Re: W1HKJ - url is redirected?

 

On Sat, 18 Jan 2025 17:02:45 -0500
"Harry Bloomberg, W3YJ via groups.io" <hbloomb@...>
wrote:

That's repeatable. Going to the https version of the site takes one
to the sundial URL. I also receive dire warnings about the SSL
certificate from Firefox.
Using Firefox 134.0.1 on Fedora 41 I get a secure site not available,
go to site.

Recent Firefox only allows unless one is prepared to click
through the warning.

--

Brian G8SEZ


Re: FT8 Ops in Unix

 

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Hi Adrian,

Can you provide specifics about what hamlib does not support. Maybe Mike can add these if they are not already in there.

Regards

Phil GM3ZZA


From: [email protected] <[email protected]> on behalf of Adrian Fewster, VK4TUX via groups.io <vk4tux@...>
Sent: 18 January 2025 9:49 PM
To: [email protected] <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: [linuxham] FT8 Ops in Unix
?
That's right, I use linux Gridtracker2 which now has autoupdate (On all
OS)? alongside HRD under bottles, and linux wsjtx.

HRD provides a realiable radio interface for some radios that hamlib and
other 3rd party interfaces do not, supporting rig split? etc,

better without issue.

For macOS I compile my own wsjtx, but have also tried windows wsjtx
under crossover in MacOS with very good results.



73


vk4tux

On 19/1/25 07:42, k9ao via groups.io wrote:
> GridTrracker will run natively on Linux. There is a Linux client for
> it already.
>
> It runs great.
>
> Same for Fldigi and it's family of apps. There are Linux versions.
>
> Rick Kunath, K9AO
>
>
>
>
>






Re: W1HKJ - url is redirected?

 

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that would possibly suggest a shared IP at the host, but one on port 80 and one on port 443

Peter M0PWX

On Sat, 18, 01, 2025 22:02, Harry Bloomberg, W3YJ via groups.io wrote:
That's repeatable.? Going to the https version of the site takes one to the sundial URL.? I also receive dire warnings about the SSL certificate from Firefox.

73,
Harry W3YJ

On Sat, Jan 18, 2025 at 5:00?PM Peter, M0PWX via <M0PWX=[email protected]> wrote:

working ok here in the UK , but if i got to it goes to the sundial site, so its only the SSL url thats going to wrong place

peter M0PWX


On Sat, 18, 01, 2025 21:52, Harry Bloomberg, W3YJ via wrote:
The same thing was happening to me last night!? Thanks for posting so I know I wasn't hallucinating.

73,
Harry Bloomberg W3YJ

On Sat, Jan 18, 2025 at 4:50?PM krisguy, KB0STG via <krisguy=[email protected]> wrote:
Dave (W1HKJ), having issues pulling up your site for any docs.
?
Can't tell if it's your hosting provider or Cloudflare or my ISP's DNS, but I'm getting anything to the w1hkj domain redirected to the British Sundial Society site. Anyone else seeing this? Any help to narrow it down would be good.
?
?
-- 
Peter

M0PWX

 
-- 
Peter

M0PWX