Re: Does KiCAD have something like Eagle's DRU and CAM files?

开云体育

Hi,

We've been using KiCad and Dorkbotpdx extensively for all or our open source projects (wyolum.com).

I haven't used Eagle (except to view projects), but I think Eagle CAM job file is equivalent to KiCad .drl file.

In KiCad, here's what we do :

In PCBNew, File > Plot
SELECT "Use proper filename extensions (.GBL, .GTL etc) - but I usually stick to the standard .pho file name extension.
SELECT and generate the required gerber files for the various layers.

Select GENERATE DRILL FILE
DRILL UNITS = inches
ZEROS FORMAT = Suppress leading zeros
PRECISION = 2:4
DRILL ORIGIN = Absolute
OPTIONS = Minimal header

Additionally, I generate a DRILL SHEET in Gerber (though not absolutely necessary)
and also a DRILL REPORT

This results in three files
1. project.drl = lists all used drill sizes, drill co-ordinates etc. It's important to include this file with your gerbers.
2. project-drl.pho = A gerber file showing drill sizes and locations visually. Not really important. I use it to verify that I got all the correct drill sizes for the footprints.
3. project-drl.rpt = plain text file reporting drill sizes, number of holes etc. This data is already included in the project-drl.pho file, and is redundant.

Finally, what goes to Drokbotpdx is the various the .pho files along with the project.drl file.

Best Regards,

Anool Mahidharia? (anool@...)
anool.m@...

On 6/6/2012 10:55 PM, Eric Thompson wrote:

Show quoted text

?

Eagle offers the options for PCB services to distribute design rule and CAM jobs files. I've been chatting with the person who runs the DorbotPDX PCB service??in hopes of getting KiCAD listed as an option on their website along with Eagle. I know they don't need specific instructions for KiCAD to work with the service, but I just figure if there are some KiCAD specific instructions out there it makes things easier for KiCAD users or for people considering KiCAD.

He asked me if KiCAD has anything like Eagle's design rule file and CAM jobs files??

From what I can tell the gerber file plot options are stored inside the PCB file under a section called "PcbPlotParams". So if nothing else I guess it would be possible to paste in or script in the settings for the plot options into a project.?

- Eric

Re: Pcbnew EAGLE plugin

#12204

I understand your position and wish you well with your new company. Regardless if you choose to disappear or not from the KiCad scene, I would like to use the opportunity and thank you and SoftPLC for all you did. I guess bunch of whiny users nagging about their problems and things they would like to see didn't help. Sorry about that (guilty!). I knew that money eventually has to come from somewhere even for an open source project but really had no idea what really goes on. Btw. I use PLCs (among other things) in my work and couple of days ago I was reading a bit more about SoftPLC. ?The CEO shares same last name so I guess it is a family business then?

Regards,

Ivica Kvasina

Show quoted text

From: dickelbeck
To: kicad-users@...
Sent: Wednesday, June 6, 2012 10:22:03 PM
Subject: [kicad-users] Re: Pcbnew EAGLE plugin

I am finished with the EAGLE_PLUGIN, and I am suspending my involvement with KiCad until my time can be funded.

This probably means goodbye, after 5 years and $310,000 donated by my employer, SoftPLC Corporation, to the project.

My suggestions to users of the project, is that you find a way to fund the work. And until that happens, be sure and give credit and thanks where it is due, not to some nebuluous "software dispenser in the sky" called "the developers". Name names, and understand that software is not free.

Each of you are the recipient of a portion of SoftPLC's donation. There are only about 3 or 4 major financial backers of this project, and I dare say that SoftPLC corporation was number 2.

In case you are curious about what I do in my day job, I write factory automation software, and do it very well. My company has about 5% of the U.S. electric power grid power production under control of our flagship product named SoftPLC Corporation. This is all hydroelectric power generation, and we recently were again selected to be the controller for a retrofit application for the largest power plant in the United States, also hydro. This is a complete replacement of all controllers and installation of SoftPLC controllers to run the entire Grand Coulee dam. It is now operational fully on SoftPLCs.

Additionally, I am starting a new company now:

which is going to sell quad-copters and drone technology. Naturally we will be all over the flight control software. Please please please watch the website over the next few weeks. And if you feel compelled to give back a little, buy something for yourself there, or your kid or grand-kids.

I wish I could say that I enjoyed contributing, but to be candid, I was always a fish out of water. I am a capitalist, not a communist doner, so the fit was never right. And I am hell to work and with, because of very high expectations relative to software designs, so maybe this is a good thing for the other developers and maybe the project as a whole.

Dick

Re: Pcbnew EAGLE plugin

dickelbeck

#12203

I am finished with the EAGLE_PLUGIN, and I am suspending my involvement with KiCad until my time can be funded.

This probably means goodbye, after 5 years and $310,000 donated by my employer, SoftPLC Corporation, to the project.

My suggestions to users of the project, is that you find a way to fund the work.  And until that happens, be sure and give credit and thanks where it is due, not to some nebuluous "software dispenser in the sky" called "the developers".  Name names, and understand that software is not free.  

Each of you are the recipient of a portion of SoftPLC's donation.  There are only about 3 or 4 major financial backers of this project, and I dare say that SoftPLC corporation was number 2.

In case you are curious about what I do in my day job, I write factory automation software, and do it very well.  My company has about 5% of the U.S. electric power grid power production under control of our flagship product named SoftPLC Corporation.  This is all hydroelectric power generation, and we recently were again selected to be the controller for a retrofit application for the largest power plant in the United States, also hydro.  This is a complete replacement of all controllers and installation of SoftPLC controllers to run the entire Grand Coulee dam.  It is now operational fully on SoftPLCs.

Additionally, I am starting a new company now:

which is going to sell quad-copters and drone technology.  Naturally we will be all over the flight control software.  Please please please watch the website over the next few weeks.  And if you feel compelled to give back a little, buy something for yourself there, or your kid or grand-kids.

I wish I could say that I enjoyed contributing, but to be candid, I was always a fish out of water.  I am a capitalist, not a communist doner, so the fit was never right.  And I am hell to work and with, because of very high expectations relative to software designs, so maybe this is a good thing for the other developers and maybe the project as a whole.

Dick

Re: kicad thermal/ ground stitching vias

#12202

this is exactly what I do, I find it kinda annoying... there should be better way.

i tried just stitching some vias without using trace and that was a bad idea. actually the idea was good but PCBNew didn't work as expected - vias placed this way didn't get the net assigned. as a result PCB was fine but if one had to reflow zone for example or just run DRC, all those vias would become orphans.

Show quoted text

From: Robert
To: kicad-users@...
Sent: Wednesday, June 6, 2012 9:51:32 AM
Subject: Re: [kicad-users] kicad thermal/ ground stitching vias

On 06/06/2012 14:26, aurelcristescu wrote:
> Hello.
>
> I am new to Kicad and I did not find a proper way to resolve these
> two things:
>
> 1) Place thermal vias under a component to transfer the heat to other
> plane layers (for example connect a QFN with GND pad underneath to an
> burrier GND plane)

> 2) Place ground stiching vias to connect TOP and
> BOTTOM GND layers (like in RF routing).

First create two ground zones as required. Then start laying a track
at any component pad that is connected to ground. At regular intervals
place a via and carry on tracking. The ground track will switch from
one layer to the other. Don't return to the start point. Finally
fill your zones (I usually just run the DRC to do this).

Regards,

Robert.

--
() Plain text email - safe, readable, inclusive.
/\

Re: Mac OS X after one week

Julie Porter

#12201

I built 3578-testing because that is what launchpad gave bazaar.

I do not want to be responsible as a maintainer due to lack of time. (My website an blog sadly neglected.)  I suppose I could put the binaries up on github.   There would still be a lot of manual stuff to do.  A lot of support files need to go into Library/Application Support/kicad/   Creating an installer script is way beyond my ability at the moment.   The binaries are 64 bit only and require 10.7 (Lion.)   Let me know if this is still of interest.

I did change the absolute paths for the applications from the usr/ tree to the Applications directory.  That may violate some design principles and invalidate some of the installation docs.   I did this as it is easier to debug where the apps can be found.   I also removed the place where the target name is passed to the tool.  This involves an extra step of having to enter the correct name into the save as dialog.

I undid the trackpad zoom patch from sharebrained.com.  I prefer the mouse wheel zoom.

I spent some more time looking into the corruption of m_dc.   Mostly I just comment it out.  There is a lot to do in this area.  I noticed some of the later revisions done in the last few weeks, have made changes to similar code in eeschema.   It may be that the same SIGABRT exists there.   Since each dialog inherits the draw context, there is no real global solution to the issue.   It may be that the developers are moving away from this and using refresh flags, rather than attempting to draw the parent window from the dialog box.

An issue unresolved is a wx tool called wxformbuilder.  Wasted a whole day attempting to build this.  I was unable to compile this under OS X (10.7.4) as the code checks for 32 bit architecture and aborts  the compile if ints are not 4 bytes.  I did get the code to compile as 32 bits but it would not link against the 64 bit libraries built for kicad.  I suspect these forms are built under the linux version of wxformbuilder.  Probably not vetted against Mac OS.

Most of the range check exceptions  on the form fields generate warning  dialogs on my system.  These can be canceled, and the warning only occurs once.  More evidence of issues building for 64 bits.

As for Cadence,  I noticed I have a trial offer CD I never installed.  Zuken is also offering 30 day online trial for CadStar.  My preference is for Altium, which I did get a month's trial on, so fully can relate to the license server stuff.  As it was I had to put a 100 GB drive into my XP laptop just to install the bloat.  Then by the time I got the tools installed and started on the tutorials, the month was up.

The real reason I want Altium is the close relationship with Atmel.  Specifically the tool that generates the Q-Touch sensor pads.  I suppose a similar tool could be done for kicad, although this would involve some sort of spice modeling of the capacitance of the traces and substrates.  It does look, that someone has made an antenna design plug in which probably works in a similar way.

Since I do everything from design to assembly and code,  I may use the layout tool for a few weeks, then move on to debugging firmware, Or 3D modeling.   Not sure how typical this is.

-julie

Show quoted text

Last OSX build I used was 3344, and as Rob, I'm not equiped to build my own. However, 3344 was pretty usable with only a few idiosyncracies that pushed me towards the Win version. Speed on my 13" MB seemed fine. I'm happy to give it another go. It did seem that recently there were a few people bravely pushing the OSX version forward and I appreciate Julie's exploration in that area. Julie, if you are interested in posting your binaries I for one would give 'em a try.

Kicad certainly doesn't, and isn't intended to, compete with Cadence, Mentor and such. But try this: with no prior experience in the tool, install Cadence, draw a schematic, route a board and send it off for fab, all before the end of the day. With Cadence you'll spend more time filling out the credit application. OK, it took me more than a day from first simple schematic to gerbers, and someone else did layout, but people spend months or full careers coming up to speed on the high end tools.

Also, KiCad does not require a team to maintain libs, track licenses, etc.

Kicad is no less serious than Cadence, it is just serious about different things.

Re: Pcbnew

JorgeF_Tech

#12200

开云体育

?

Hi

?

Probably because that’s almost impossible to match a good PCB routing to the logically organized schematic layout.

?

Best regards

?

Jorge

?

De: kicad-users@... [mailto:kicad-users@...] Em nome de John
Enviada: quarta-feira, 6 de Junho de 2012 23:00
Para: kicad-users@...
Assunto: Re: [kicad-users] Pcbnew

?

Is there a technical reason why pcbnew does not layout footprints with layout that generally matches the position of components in the schematic?

Re: Pcbnew

Peter Bennett

#12199

A couple of reasons that I can think of:

1. A schematic will frequently consist of several sheets - then "position on the schematic" is difficult to define, if not meaningless.

2. Many ICs have several units in a package (quad op-amp, quad logic gate, etc.)  The individual units may be scattered over the schematic sheet, or may even be on different schematic sheets, for a multi-sheet circuit, so, again "position on the schematic" is meaningless for these parts.

3. The usual netlist formats have no provision to show where a component is on the schematic (or even which sheet it is on, for a multi-sheet schematic.)

The commercial CAD systems I've used (most recently Protel/Altium) also did not attempt to place parts on the PCB following the schematic layout.

Although Protel did have an auto-place function, I never used it - it was apparently only included to appease the marketing department as the placement it produced was useless (and it required some initial manual placement of key parts to give it a bit of guidance.)

Show quoted text

On 6/6/2012 3:00 PM, John wrote:


Is there a technical reason why pcbnew does not layout footprints with
layout that generally matches the position of components in the schematic?

-- 
Peter Bennett, VE7CEI    Vancouver, B.C., Canada
GPS and NMEA info: 
Vancouver Power Squadron: 

Re: Comments About Eeschema

#12195

Hello Lawrence.

--Why are the X,Y coordinates upside down in the Y axis? When I learned Cartesian coordinates 
the abscissa (X axis) has positive values going to the right and negative values going 
to the left with the ordinate (Y axis) with positive values going up and negative values 
going down. Quadrant I would have the 0,0 point in the lower left corner. 
Do they teach this differently in Europe? It is very confusing to me.No, its the same in Europe. ;O)

I do not know the real reason, but i guess, it has to to with the
widgets and canvasses used in programming.
It is common, that they have there origin at the upper left corner.
So, if you try to keep your standart origin at the lower left corner,
you have some extra work with coordinate transformation.

This also could be the reason, why gerber files created by kicad have so
much negative values. ;O)

With best regards: Bernd Wiebus alias dl1eic

Re: Mac OS X after one week

applewiz2000

#12198

Hi Jeff,

I have V3411 which is now some way out of date methinks...

Off topic, Cadence is indeed a nightmare of a learning curve and the licence server is a pain in the a*se. But NI Design Suite ... it really is sweet. The schematic-layout linking is just click-thru simplicity. Never read the docs, don't need 'em. Do need ?1500 to buy unfortunately!!

~Rob

Re: Pcbnew

John

#12197

Is there a technical reason why pcbnew does not layout footprints with layout that generally matches the position of components in the schematic?

Re: Pcbnew

Peter Bennett

#12196

When you first load a netlist and spread out the modules, all desired connections will be shown by thin white (I think) "airlines".  DRC only sees copper tracks, and power and ground planes, as connections, so will report any airlines as "no connect".  When you place a track connecting the ends of an airline, the airline will vanish.

Two annoyances I found that caused hard-to-find no-connects are:

1. If you want to connect a straight row of pads together and just click on the first and last pads of the row, DRC will report the intermediate pads as not connected, even though the copper track would clearly make a connection.  As you place the track, you must click on the center of each pad to make a true connection.

2. When you place a right-angle bend in a track, PCBNew insists on replacing the 90 degree corner with a short 45 degree track segment (it may be possible to disable this action, but I couldn't find a way). PCBNew even does this when you place the 90 degree corner on a pad - this means that the track misses the pad, as far as DRC is concerned, so the pad will be reported as not connected.  To overcome this, you have to end one track on the pad, then start a new one from the same pad.

Show quoted text

On 6/6/2012 8:54 AM, tmortus wrote:


I'm slowly working my way in learning how to create a circuit board with
kicad. So far I have created the schematic, tested it and created a
netlist with eeschema and I've made some modules.and assigned them to
the corresponding component in eeschema.

I'm trying to now create a pcb. I have selected read netlist from the
pcb design screen, Everything looked OK to me, but, when I ran design
tools check it said a lot of the pads had no connection. I can see
though that they have lines going from them.

I then thought I should consult the tutorial
<>
. In the tutorial it says to click on "Dimensions" -> "Tracks and
Vias".. It shows this menu item between Preferences and Miscellaneous on
the menu bar. The menu bar I have has File, Edit, View, Place,
Preferences, Tools, Design Rules and Help.

Can someone tell me what the pads are unconnected means and how to fix
it and let me know there the Dimensons -> Tracks and Vias is located???

-- 
Peter Bennett, VE7CEI    Vancouver, B.C., Canada
GPS and NMEA info: 
Vancouver Power Squadron: 

Re: Pcbnew

Andy Eskelson

#12194

when you load the netlist you will get all the components in a pile in
the corner of the board. You have to move the components to the positions
you want, then you can start laying out the tracks 

I assume that you have got this far.

When you say that DRC said there were no connections in a lot of places,
that usually means that you need to place a junction to force the
connection. 


Other things that can cause problems is that you might "miss" the
conection point. If the pad and the track are not EXACTLY aligned you can
get this sort of problem.

Usually magnetic tracks is enabled which cures most of these types of
problem. 
preferences>general 
magnetic pads
magnetic tracks

enable for "when creating" this is the default.


If you are trying to find the place where different via sizes and tracks
are defined, then that has moved. select design rules from the main menu
bar and then on design rules  icon Select global design rules tab, and
there you can define whatever custom track and via sizes you want. Once
you do that, they will become available for use.


Hope that's what you were asking for.

If not a bit more info is needed.


Andy



On Wed, 06 Jun 2012 15:54:48 -0000
"tmortus" <tom_mort@...> wrote:

I'm slowly working my way in learning how to create a circuit board with
kicad.  So far I have created the schematic, tested it and created a
netlist with eeschema and I've made some modules.and assigned them to
the corresponding component in eeschema.
I'm trying to now create a pcb.  I have selected read netlist from the
pcb design screen,  Everything looked OK to me, but, when I ran design
tools check it said a lot of the pads had no connection.  I can see
though that they have lines going from them.
I then thought I should consult the tutorial
<;
ad_Tutorial.pdf&pli=1>  .  In the tutorial it says to click on
"Dimensions" -> "Tracks and Vias"..  It shows this menu
item between Preferences and Miscellaneous on the menu bar.  The menu
bar I have has File, Edit, View, Place, Preferences, Tools, Design Rules
and Help.
Can someone tell me what the pads are unconnected means and how to fix
it and let me know there the Dimensons -> Tracks and Vias is located???

Does KiCAD have something like Eagle's DRU and CAM files?

Eric Thompson

#12193

Eagle offers the options for PCB services to distribute design rule and CAM jobs files. I've been chatting with the person who runs the DorbotPDX PCB service??in hopes of getting KiCAD listed as an option on their website along with Eagle. I know they don't need specific instructions for KiCAD to work with the service, but I just figure if there are some KiCAD specific instructions out there it makes things easier for KiCAD users or for people considering KiCAD.

He asked me if KiCAD has anything like Eagle's design rule file and CAM jobs files??

From what I can tell the gerber file plot options are stored inside the PCB file under a section called "PcbPlotParams". So if nothing else I guess it would be possible to paste in or script in the settings for the plot options into a project.?

- Eric

Pcbnew

#12192

I'm slowly working my way in learning how to create a circuit board with kicad. ?So far I have created the schematic, tested it and created a netlist with eeschema and I've made some modules.and assigned them to the corresponding component in eeschema.

I'm trying to now create a pcb. ?I have selected read netlist from the pcb design screen, ?Everything looked OK to me, but, when I ran design tools check it said a lot of the pads had no connection. ?I can see though that they have lines going from them.

I then thought I should consult the??. ?In the tutorial it says to click on "Dimensions" -> "Tracks and Vias".. ?It shows this menu item between Preferences and Miscellaneous on the menu bar. ?The menu bar I have has File, Edit, View, Place, Preferences, Tools, Design Rules and Help.

Can someone tell me what the pads are unconnected means and how to fix it and let me know there the Dimensons -> Tracks and Vias is located???

Re: kicad thermal/ ground stitching vias

#12191

Regarding 2) a relevant post that outlines the problem and solution is at http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/kicad-users/message/10456. Here is the process I use based on the explanation above:

1. Route the board and define your zones as you always have.
2. Fill the zones as you always have.
3. Select "Add tracks and vias" from the toolbar on the right.
4. Click on an existing pad that’s connected to the zone’s net, drag the pointer a little bit to create a short track, then either (a) right-click and select "Place Via" or (b) type the 'V' shortcut.
5. To add more stitching vias, continue to drag the pointer and type 'V' where you want to drop vias (or right-click and select "Place Via").
6. When you are done placing vias, hit the 'End' key on your keyboard (or right click and select "End Track").

You can repeat this as many times as you want to create different clusters of stitches. When you refill zones, the vias will retain the connectivity information and work as expected.

-Mithat

Show quoted text

From: aurelcristescu
To: kicad-users@...
Sent: Wednesday, June 6, 2012 8:26 AM
Subject: [kicad-users] kicad thermal/ ground stitching vias

?

Hello.

I am new to Kicad and I did not find a proper way to resolve these two things:

1) Place thermal vias under a component to transfer the heat to other plane layers (for example connect a QFN with GND pad underneath to an burrier GND plane)
2) Place ground stiching vias to connect TOP and BOTTOM GND layers (like in RF routing).

For issue 1 I have tried to place in footprint definition extra pads on the QFN thermal pad (to simulate vias) but they are connecting to GND plane using thermal contours.

For issue 2 I have tried to select "Add trace" an then "Place via" and is ok (a GND via will place wherever I like) until I do a UNDO which will remove from all vias GND net association (vias will not have anymore a net associated with them).

Do you have any better recommandation for these problems?

Thanks in advance.

Re: Comments About Eeschema

#12190

LOL, well said!
(I am not a developer in this effort, but have been on others).? I've often wondered this myself.? Having seen this lack of attention to standards in other open src tools, I can guess at many reasons, ranging from ignorance to arrogance to cost (acquiring some of those standards requires real money). ?
In many cases, there is quite a lot of overlap between IEEE/ANSI/IEC/CENELEC? etc.
OTOH, I am thankful for the tool....
I am very interested in the response.....
-John

Show quoted text

On Wed, Jun 6, 2012 at 10:37 AM, Lawrence <lawrence_joy@...> wrote:

?

To developers of Kicad and others.
Comments about Eeschema.

--Why are the X,Y coordinates upside down in the Y axis? When I learned Cartesian coordinates the abscissa (X axis) has positive values going to the right and negative values going to the left with the ordinate (Y axis) with positive values going up and negative values going down. Quadrant I would have the 0,0 point in the lower left corner. Do they teach this differently in Europe? It is very confusing to me.

--Terminology for reference designators: A basic reference designator has a class designation letter(s) and a number. Class designation letters are 1, 2, or 3 letters, but if 3 letters are used the 1st letter will be X as in XDS or XAR. For the complete reference designator A1R7, the A1 is called the reference designator prefix and for the complete reference designator A1PS1C3, the A1PS1 are called reference designator prefixes. The Unit Numbering Method of assigning reference designators is covered by ANSI/ASME Y14.44-2008 (used to be ANSI/IEEE 200-1975).

--I have seen in many messages the term "multi-part component" used. The terminology I know is "mulple-element part" and is covered in ANSI/ASME Y14.44-2008, Clause 2.1.4 Suffix Letter.

--The terminology I know calls a listing of parts a "parts list (PL)" and is covered by ANSI/ASME Y14.34M-2008 Associated Lists. In this standard it is stated that "bill of material" is an obsolete term.

Just some ramblings.

Regards, Larry 9V1/WN8P

Comments About Eeschema

#12189

To developers of Kicad and others.
Comments about Eeschema.

--Why are the X,Y coordinates upside down in the Y axis? When I learned Cartesian coordinates the abscissa (X axis) has positive values going to the right and negative values going to the left with the ordinate (Y axis) with positive values going up and negative values going down. Quadrant I would have the 0,0 point in the lower left corner. Do they teach this differently in Europe? It is very confusing to me.

--Terminology for reference designators: A basic reference designator has a class designation letter(s) and a number. Class designation letters are 1, 2, or 3 letters, but if 3 letters are used the 1st letter will be X as in XDS or XAR. For the complete reference designator A1R7, the A1 is called the reference designator prefix and for the complete reference designator A1PS1C3, the A1PS1 are called reference designator prefixes. The Unit Numbering Method of assigning reference designators is covered by ANSI/ASME Y14.44-2008 (used to be ANSI/IEEE 200-1975).

--I have seen in many messages the term "multi-part component" used. The terminology I know is "mulple-element part" and is covered in ANSI/ASME Y14.44-2008, Clause 2.1.4 Suffix Letter.

--The terminology I know calls a listing of parts a "parts list (PL)" and is covered by ANSI/ASME Y14.34M-2008 Associated Lists. In this standard it is stated that "bill of material" is an obsolete term.

Just some ramblings.

Regards, Larry 9V1/WN8P

Re: kicad thermal/ ground stitching vias

#12188

On 06/06/2012 14:26, aurelcristescu wrote:
Hello.

I am new to Kicad and I did not find a proper way to resolve these
two things:

1) Place thermal vias under a component to transfer the heat to other
plane layers (for example connect a QFN with GND pad underneath to an
burrier GND plane)


2) Place ground stiching vias to connect TOP and
BOTTOM GND layers (like in RF routing).First create two ground zones as required.   Then start laying a track at any component pad that is connected to ground.   At regular intervals place a via and carry on tracking.   The ground track will switch from one layer to the other.   Don't return to the start point.   Finally fill your zones (I usually just run the DRC to do this).

Regards,

Robert.

-- 
() Plain text email - safe, readable, inclusive.
/&#92; 

kicad thermal/ ground stitching vias

aurelcristescu

#12187

Hello.

I am new to Kicad and I did not find a proper way to resolve these two things:

1) Place thermal vias under a component to transfer the heat to other plane layers (for example connect a QFN with GND pad underneath to an burrier GND plane)
2) Place ground stiching vias to connect TOP and BOTTOM GND layers (like in RF routing).

For issue 1 I have tried to place in footprint definition extra pads on the QFN thermal pad (to simulate vias) but they are connecting to GND plane using thermal contours.

For issue 2 I have tried to select "Add trace" an then "Place via" and is ok (a GND via will place wherever I like) until I do a UNDO which will remove from all vias GND net association (vias will not have anymore a net associated with them).

Do you have any better recommandation for these problems?

Thanks in advance.

Re: I would like to suggest a Feature enhancement-Schematic Sheet property addition

Andy Eskelson

#12186

Agreed 100%, one schematic = one board, by far the safest way to do
things.

You can put as many schematics and PCB's as you want into a project, so
there is no real issue. The problem is good working practice or lack
of. 

Andy

On Sun, 3 Jun 2012 00:22:56 -0700 (PDT)
Jeff Kaskey <jkaskey@...> wrote:

Careful what you ask for...

With the huge warning that this is purely my opinion, I can not imagine wanting multiple boards on a single schematic. Typically a schematic goes through many revs before a build, then often a few revs after that. If only one of the boards in a multi-board system needs changes, then it would be hard for someone looking at the schematics later to determine which board had been changed. All they would know is that the schematic had been revised sometime after the last build. Sure, you could manually put in good notes, and I'm sure that would be the intention, but it would be unlikely to happen consistently.?

It is sort of the opposite of how we develop software. It is possible, but a poor idea, to develop multiple programs all in one source file. Why use lots of little files when developing code? Because (partly) once something is locked down and working you don't want to open it up to change some unrelated thing. Likewise for a schematic. Why risk whacking something that is fine just because I am making a modification to a different board? Also, if you want to hand the schematic of one board off to another designer you either have to rip the schematic apart first (risking various errors) or you have two people working on different boards in the same schematic. That's an interesting change management problem!

OK, I can see in a single-person jack-of-all-trades, plays-poorly-with-others environment, you might be able to use such a feature, but it seems a very poor practice to encourage. I suspect there are higher priority features, usable by individuals and organizations, that would be larger bang for the buck.

-j

________________________________
 From: Paul Carew <paul@...>
To: kicad-users@...
Sent: Friday, June 1, 2012 7:36 PM
Subject: [kicad-users] I would like to suggest a Feature enhancement-Schematic Sheet property addition

?
I was thinking that it might be fairly straight fwd to enhance the hierarchy system to directly support multi board systems/projects.

I haven't waded into the code yet, but the hierarchy feature is pretty comprehensive. By adding a small extension, it may be possible to support documenting and laying ou a multi-board project.

I know this has been much discussed in the past, but thoughts/changes/suggestions are  welcome.

Details:
Aim: to enable KiCad to serve as a multi board system cad tool.

KiCad has a great and useful mechanisim for embedding hierarchical schematic sheets.

At the moment, all embedded sheets are rolled up into one top layer net list / pcb. It would be great to add a property to a schematic sheet to indicate that it is to be an independent board.

A root sheet would automaticically have this poroperty set.
By setting this property on a hiearchical sheet, we would be able to expand KiCad to also support both a multi card design and/or allow a schematic to have daughter cards.

When creating an embedded hierachical sheet, if the setting is not set (the default) then KiCad would operate as it does today and roll all hierarchical sheets into the top level PCB.

If a hierarchical sheet has the property set, a netlist generation+pcb would be constained to that sheet (and any additional hierarchical sheets contained within it).

This would allow a single project to be either a single board (as it is today), or a collection of boards (I.E. a system).