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?
Minor update.
Plate choke started to make? int popping noises in 2 x places on it's windings, when amp run at 3.3 kw out.
I Re-designed the plate choke.? Original choke was 52 uh with it's 1st series resonance @ 26.990 mhz.? Problem was, the 2nd series resonance was too close to 6m.
New choke is 7.784 uh? and wound with 16 ga thermalize magnet wire on a 1" teflon rod.? 22 turns....and resonates at 69.247 mhz.
(I since came up with a slightly better version still.? 9 uh, and wound on? 3/4" Teflon rod, 37 turns of 16 ga....and resonates at 73.114 mhz).
Also re-designed the safety choke that is in parallel with the vac load cap.? It's now just 7 uh.? (19 ga, wound on 1" teflon rod).?
The temp 240 vac line, used for testing was way too small a gauge, and > 50' long.? ?New? 100 amp breaker gets installed in abt 1 hr, with a real short (7-10')? 2 ga power cable,? from breaker to B+ supply.? We will find out pretty quickly today, if things have been optimized, and all minor bugs? out.
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7 to 10'. You must have a close by service panel??? I'm curious how you're getting that kind of power that close to your work bench. Bob W4JFA?
On Tue, Jul 25, 2023, 9:52 AM Jim VE7RF < jim.thom@...> wrote: ?
Minor update.
Plate choke started to make? int popping noises in 2 x places on it's windings, when amp run at 3.3 kw out.
I Re-designed the plate choke.? Original choke was 52 uh with it's 1st series resonance @ 26.990 mhz.? Problem was, the 2nd series resonance was too close to 6m.
New choke is 7.784 uh? and wound with 16 ga thermalize magnet wire on a 1" teflon rod.? 22 turns....and resonates at 69.247 mhz.
(I since came up with a slightly better version still.? 9 uh, and wound on? 3/4" Teflon rod, 37 turns of 16 ga....and resonates at 73.114 mhz).
Also re-designed the safety choke that is in parallel with the vac load cap.? It's now just 7 uh.? (19 ga, wound on 1" teflon rod).?
The temp 240 vac line, used for testing was way too small a gauge, and > 50' long.? ?New? 100 amp breaker gets installed in abt 1 hr, with a real short (7-10')? 2 ga power cable,? from breaker to B+ supply.? We will find out pretty quickly today, if things have been optimized, and all minor bugs? out.
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RF deck and HV supply was temp rolled over to the 200 amp main panel. Thank goodness it's on casters.? ?Scott (KB1SEL)? just sent pix of the new? 100 amp breaker...and more pix of 200 amp panel, with it's cover off.? ?Just got the pix 2 mins ago.? He's in a new home on 2 acres....with the new workshop.? So the power distribution is not optimum. (The old house had 400 amp service, and he had his own 50 kva pole pig on the utility pole on the street).??
Jim? ?VE7RF
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How nice! Let me know when we can see those pics. Bob W4JFA?
On Tue, Jul 25, 2023, 10:36 AM Jim VE7RF < jim.thom@...> wrote: RF deck and HV supply was temp rolled over to the 200 amp main panel. Thank goodness it's on casters.? ?Scott (KB1SEL)? just sent pix of the new? 100 amp breaker...and more pix of 200 amp panel, with it's cover off.? ?Just got the pix 2 mins ago.? He's in a new home on 2 acres....with the new workshop.? So the power distribution is not optimum. (The old house had 400 amp service, and he had his own 50 kva pole pig on the utility pole on the street).??
Jim? ?VE7RF
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What kind of antenna system for 6m is utilized for this amount of
power?
Andy? K9ATX
On 7/25/2023 9:36 AM, Jim VE7RF wrote:
RF deck and HV supply was temp rolled over to the 200 amp main
panel. Thank goodness it's on casters.? ?Scott (KB1SEL)? just sent
pix of the new? 100 amp breaker...and more pix of 200 amp panel,
with it's cover off.? ?Just got the pix 2 mins ago.? He's in a new
home on 2 acres....with the new workshop.? So the power
distribution is not optimum. (The old house had 400 amp service,
and he had his own 50 kva pole pig on the utility pole on the
street).??
Jim? ?VE7RF
--
"Where the Old Soo crossed the New Soo"
Duplainville, Wisconsin
Web page:
Youtube Channel:
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I wonder who has the license to use this high a power level on 6 meters.? The same goes for other bands. ? ? ?
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From: [email protected] < [email protected]> On Behalf Of DupyRail Sent: Tuesday, July 25, 2023 2:35 PM To: [email protected]Subject: Re: [ham-amplifiers] Update on 10kw 3CX-6000A7 6 Meter Ham Linear Amplifier ? What kind of antenna system for 6m is utilized for this amount of power?
Andy? K9ATX
On 7/25/2023 9:36 AM, Jim VE7RF wrote: RF deck and HV supply was temp rolled over to the 200 amp main panel. Thank goodness it's on casters.? ?Scott (KB1SEL)? just sent pix of the new? 100 amp breaker...and more pix of 200 amp panel, with it's cover off.? ?Just got the pix 2 mins ago.? He's in a new home on 2 acres....with the new workshop.? So the power distribution is not optimum. (The old house had 400 amp service, and he had his own 50 kva pole pig on the utility pole on the street).??
Jim? ?VE7RF
-- "Where the Old Soo crossed the New Soo" Duplainville, Wisconsin ? Web page:? ? Youtube Channel:?
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A ?ham can use any amplifier he or she wishes, just as long as he or she doesn’t exceed 1500 watts P.E.P.? (Where legal, bandwise.) [In the U.S.] ? Joe – W7RKN ? ? I wonder who has the license to use this high a power level on 6 meters.? The same goes for other bands. ?
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Ants are not rated for power per se.? They are rated for current and voltage.? 10 kw into 50 ohms =? 14.142 amps? and? 707 volts. (1000 V peak)? ?This assumes a 1:1 swr.?
It's average current that melts stuff.....and peak V that arcs stuff.?
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Designing and fabricating 6m ants to handle 10 kw is? a non issue.? But the proper connectors have to be used (7-16 DIN)? and also coax cable / heliax.? ?The flexible Times microwave SFT-600 works good, and is the Teflon version of LMR-600UF.
SFT-900 also works,..( Teflon version of? LMR-900).... as does 7/8" heliax, and also LMR-1200DB.?
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Stacked yagi's allow for power splitting.? IE:? 2 x yagi's with 1/2 power each.? ?Or 3 x yagi's with 1/3 power.....or 4 x yagi's? with 1/4 power.?
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This is all old news really.?
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On Tue, Jul 25, 2023 at 11:02 PM, <rahoelz@...> wrote:
I wonder who has the license to use this high a power level on 6 meters.? The same goes for other bands.
Who cares ?? 1.5 kw into stacked HF yagi's on? a 200' tower is..."ok"? but 5kw into a dipole up 50'? is a "no-no".? ? Gimme a break.? Who cares how anybody obtains their ERP.?
Anything goes on this amp group. Been like that since day 1.? Just look through all the previous postings and pix.??
Some of us like to...'boil oil'.?
?
The high power side of things has been going on since 1968, when I 1st discovered that folks were using some pretty big tubes.? ?You don't even wanna know the half of it.?
?
Here's some eye candy for you.? ? ? ? and? ? ? ? Scroll down on the bear-el site.? You can be there for hrs.?
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On 7/26/2023 3:00 PM, Jim VE7RF wrote:
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On Tue, Jul 25, 2023 at 11:02 PM, <rahoelz@...>
wrote:
I wonder who has the license to use this high a power
level on 6 meters.? The same goes for other bands.
Who cares ?? 1.5 kw into stacked HF yagi's on? a 200' tower
is..."ok"? but 5kw into a dipole up 50'? is a "no-no".? ? Gimme
a break.? Who cares how anybody obtains their ERP.?
Anything goes on this amp group. Been like that since day 1.?
Just look through all the previous postings and pix.??
Some of us like to...'boil oil'.?
?
The high power side of things has been going on since 1968,
when I 1st discovered that folks were using some pretty big
tubes.? ?You don't even wanna know the half of it.?
?
Here's some eye candy for you.? ?
? ? and? ? ? ?
Scroll down on the bear-el site.? You can be there for hrs.?
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Antennas by Eimac! ? Mod-U-Lator, Mike(y)/W3SLK ? ? ?
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From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Joe WB9SBD
Sent: Wednesday, July 26, 2023 7:17 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [ham-amplifiers] Update on 10kw 3CX-6000A7 6 Meter Ham Linear Amplifier? ? On 7/26/2023 3:00 PM, Jim VE7RF wrote: On Tue, Jul 25, 2023 at 11:02 PM, <rahoelz@...> wrote: I wonder who has the license to use this high a power level on 6 meters.? The same goes for other bands. Who cares ?? 1.5 kw into stacked HF yagi's on? a 200' tower is..."ok"? but 5kw into a dipole up 50'? is a "no-no".? ? Gimme a break.? Who cares how anybody obtains their ERP.? Anything goes on this amp group. Been like that since day 1.? Just look through all the previous postings and pix.?? Some of us like to...'boil oil'.? ? The high power side of things has been going on since 1968, when I 1st discovered that folks were using some pretty big tubes.? ?You don't even wanna know the half of it.? ? Here's some eye candy for you.? ? ? ? and? ? ? ? Scroll down on the bear-el site.? You can be there for hrs.?
?
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I do love tubes with handles…!!
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On 27 Jul 2023, at 10:04 am, Mike Sawyer via groups.io <w3slk@...> wrote:
? Antennas by Eimac! ? Mod-U-Lator, Mike(y)/W3SLK ? ? ? ? ? On 7/26/2023 3:00 PM, Jim VE7RF wrote: On Tue, Jul 25, 2023 at 11:02 PM, <rahoelz@...> wrote: I wonder who has the license to use this high a power level on 6 meters.? The same goes for other bands. Who cares ?? 1.5 kw into stacked HF yagi's on? a 200' tower is..."ok"? but 5kw into a dipole up 50'? is a "no-no".? ? Gimme a break.? Who cares how anybody obtains their ERP.? Anything goes on this amp group. Been like that since day 1.? Just look through all the previous postings and pix.?? Some of us like to...'boil oil'.? ? The high power side of things has been going on since 1968, when I 1st discovered that folks were using some pretty big tubes.? ?You don't even wanna know the half of it.? ? Here's some eye candy for you.? ? ? ? and? ? ? ? Scroll down on the bear-el site.? You can be there for hrs.?
?
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Great web site Jim! I wanna water cooled amp! Bob W4JFA?
On Wed, Jul 26, 2023, 4:12 PM Jim VE7RF < jim.thom@...> wrote: On Tue, Jul 25, 2023 at 11:02 PM, <rahoelz@...> wrote:
I wonder who has the license to use this high a power level on 6 meters.? The same goes for other bands.
Who cares ?? 1.5 kw into stacked HF yagi's on? a 200' tower is..."ok"? but 5kw into a dipole up 50'? is a "no-no".? ? Gimme a break.? Who cares how anybody obtains their ERP.?
Anything goes on this amp group. Been like that since day 1.? Just look through all the previous postings and pix.??
Some of us like to...'boil oil'.?
?
The high power side of things has been going on since 1968, when I 1st discovered that folks were using some pretty big tubes.? ?You don't even wanna know the half of it.?
?
Here's some eye candy for you.? ? ? ? and? ? ? ? Scroll down on the bear-el site.? You can be there for hrs.?
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BTW, these are all NEW tubes with just a few hours to check them out. ?
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From: Chuck ONeal [mailto:cdoneal@...]
Sent: Wednesday, July 26, 2023 11:13 PM
To: '[email protected]'
Subject: RE: [ham-amplifiers] Update on 10kw 3CX-6000A7 6 Meter Ham Linear Amplifier? Here you go, how about this tube?? I have a couple of these left over from a commercial project and I’ll let them go for $1500 each with chimneys and the original Eimac boxes.? It’s a bolt to the chassis tube so NO socket is nedded. ? I’d love to watch an evolution of an amplifer built with this tube as has been done here.? Most interesting.? This tube has very high gain but a rather low grid dissipation so protection would be advisable in any mismatch or overdrive condition that would exceed the grid dissipation. ? -Chuck K1KW ? ? ? ? ? On 7/26/2023 3:00 PM, Jim VE7RF wrote: On Tue, Jul 25, 2023 at 11:02 PM, <rahoelz@...> wrote: I wonder who has the license to use this high a power level on 6 meters.? The same goes for other bands. Who cares ?? 1.5 kw into stacked HF yagi's on? a 200' tower is..."ok"? but 5kw into a dipole up 50'? is a "no-no".? ? Gimme a break.? Who cares how anybody obtains their ERP.? Anything goes on this amp group. Been like that since day 1.? Just look through all the previous postings and pix.?? Some of us like to...'boil oil'.? ? The high power side of things has been going on since 1968, when I 1st discovered that folks were using some pretty big tubes.? ?You don't even wanna know the half of it.? ? Here's some eye candy for you.? ? ? ? and? ? ? ? Scroll down on the bear-el site.? You can be there for hrs.?
?
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Here you go, how about this tube?? I have a couple of these left over from a commercial project and I’ll let them go for $1500 each with chimneys and the original Eimac boxes.? It’s a bolt to the chassis tube so NO socket is nedded. ? I’d love to watch an evolution of an amplifer built with this tube as has been done here.? Most interesting.? This tube has very high gain but a rather low grid dissipation so protection would be advisable in any mismatch or overdrive condition that would exceed the grid dissipation. ? -Chuck K1KW ? ? ?
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From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Joe WB9SBD
Sent: Wednesday, July 26, 2023 7:17 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [ham-amplifiers] Update on 10kw 3CX-6000A7 6 Meter Ham Linear Amplifier? ? On 7/26/2023 3:00 PM, Jim VE7RF wrote: On Tue, Jul 25, 2023 at 11:02 PM, <rahoelz@...> wrote: I wonder who has the license to use this high a power level on 6 meters.? The same goes for other bands. Who cares ?? 1.5 kw into stacked HF yagi's on? a 200' tower is..."ok"? but 5kw into a dipole up 50'? is a "no-no".? ? Gimme a break.? Who cares how anybody obtains their ERP.? Anything goes on this amp group. Been like that since day 1.? Just look through all the previous postings and pix.?? Some of us like to...'boil oil'.? ? The high power side of things has been going on since 1968, when I 1st discovered that folks were using some pretty big tubes.? ?You don't even wanna know the half of it.? ? Here's some eye candy for you.? ? ? ? and? ? ? ? Scroll down on the bear-el site.? You can be there for hrs.?
?
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On Thu, Jul 27, 2023 at 09:16 AM, Chuck Neal wrote:
Here you go, how about this tube?? I have a couple of these left over from a commercial project and I’ll let them go for $1500 each with chimneys and the original Eimac boxes.? It’s a bolt to the chassis tube so NO socket is needed.
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I’d love to watch an evolution of an amplifer built with this tube as has been done here.? Most interesting.? This tube has very high gain but a rather low grid dissipation so protection would be advisable in any mismatch or overdrive condition that would exceed the grid dissipation.
?
-Chuck K1KW
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What tube is this ?? ?It looks like a 3CPX-15,000B7.? ? The YC-156 / YC-172 is the same tube as the 3CPX-15,000B7..... but has the smaller 4.94" OD cooler.....and they were used for MRI use.?
Electrically , all 3 x tubes are the same......but the 3CPX-15,000B7 has more anode to grid C.? ?Typ the YC-156/172 does 5 kw out with 100w of drive....and almost double that with 200w of drive. The bigger tube would be easier to cool, with it's much reduced back pressure.?
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Eimac also made a 3CPX-10,000B7.? ?At least with any of these tubes, no IPA is required...on? HF or 6m.? ?The old FT-2000? does any easy 250 watts out on 6m.? These tubes are ideal when used with any 200 watt HF? xcvr.....for HF use.? But not a lot of grid diss, so they need super fast, grid overcurrent protection.? Non issue, since we have that down to a fine art.?
They also can't be rebuilt.... which is a real drawback. But if it's new, it will last a lifetime..and then some.?
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Typ I don't recommend starting any amp project, unless you have either a new or rebuilt tube.? ?For oxide tubes like the 3CPX-10,000/15,000B7 series ( or YC-156/172)? you want good ones.?
Buddy who built the 80-10m? YC-156? amp u see on the pix pages of this group.... he bought 12 of them...and only 3 are any good.? They require a 8 min warmup.? ?After 5 mins, they developed the short...duds.? ?Problem was, the 11m ops get a hold of em, and drive the crap outa them...then sell em.? ? Dunno where K7RDX gets his 156/172's? from.? There are virtually no MRI machines left that use tubes.?
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The problem with that 4CX-15,000A7 is.... damned thing idles at 1 amp.? Scott already has a commercial amp using that tube.? Originally it came with a 4x10...idles at 500 ma.? ?I woulda left it alone.? ?With the 4x15 in there, and with the new screen supply (a lot higher screen V)..and the new bias supply,? I had to re-design? the grid / plate / screen? overcurrent circuits.....pita.? ?The socket for that tube? is very expensive.?
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Buddy in AZ has the asamoto 80-15m HF amp, grid driven, with the 4x10.? They were ALL? basket cases....with mile long leads. ( they all osc badly on 40-15m into any ant with a flat swr..and also a 50 ohm DL).? ?Once re-designed, and rebuilt, it works fine.? 10 kw with 100w? drive.? ?In it's original format, it only worked on 80m... and gain was real high. 15 kw out with 80 watts drive.? ?The cooling was a mess, and also had to be re-designed.?
IMO, tetrodes, whether grid or cathode driven, both work, and require just xcvr power to drive em..... BUT you pay a price for that? 'convenience'.? ?Added complexity of a regulated grid / screen supply, plus loads of protection, + neutralization in some cases.? IF you lose the B+.....and drive still applied, you will destroy the screen in short order, hence the screen over current protection.? Lose the cut off bias....and u will peg the plate current meter, same deal, more protection.?
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Yes, sorry forgot to mention the tube type.? Your guess is correct, it’s a 3CPX-15000B7.? I think it would be a decent choice for a quiet amplifier at 2 – 3 KW out with a very low air flow requirement, especially compared to a 8877.? No socket required and very solid grid to ground connectivity.? High gain also so only 50W of drive needed for the 2 – 3 KW out.? Both tubes I have are new.? The silver plating has tarnished a bit with age on them.? I’ll never get around to building an amp as originally planned years ago.? I’m now playing around with LDMOS amp designs. ?? ? Low heater power requirement as well BUT a long warm up time is needed ? ? -Chuck K1KW ?
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From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Jim VE7RF
Sent: Thursday, July 27, 2023 12:00 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [ham-amplifiers] Update on 10kw 3CX-6000A7 6 Meter Ham Linear Amplifier ? On Thu, Jul 27, 2023 at 09:16 AM, Chuck Neal wrote: Here you go, how about this tube?? I have a couple of these left over from a commercial project and I’ll let them go for $1500 each with chimneys and the original Eimac boxes.? It’s a bolt to the chassis tube so NO socket is needed. ? I’d love to watch an evolution of an amplifer built with this tube as has been done here.? Most interesting.? This tube has very high gain but a rather low grid dissipation so protection would be advisable in any mismatch or overdrive condition that would exceed the grid dissipation. ? -Chuck K1KW ? What tube is this ?? ?It looks like a 3CPX-15,000B7.? ? The YC-156 / YC-172 is the same tube as the 3CPX-15,000B7..... but has the smaller 4.94" OD cooler.....and they were used for MRI use.? Electrically , all 3 x tubes are the same......but the 3CPX-15,000B7 has more anode to grid C.? ?Typ the YC-156/172 does 5 kw out with 100w of drive....and almost double that with 200w of drive. The bigger tube would be easier to cool, with it's much reduced back pressure.? ? Eimac also made a 3CPX-10,000B7.? ?At least with any of these tubes, no IPA is required...on? HF or 6m.? ?The old FT-2000? does any easy 250 watts out on 6m.? These tubes are ideal when used with any 200 watt HF? xcvr.....for HF use.? But not a lot of grid diss, so they need super fast, grid overcurrent protection.? Non issue, since we have that down to a fine art.? They also can't be rebuilt.... which is a real drawback. But if it's new, it will last a lifetime..and then some.? ? Typ I don't recommend starting any amp project, unless you have either a new or rebuilt tube.? ?For oxide tubes like the 3CPX-10,000/15,000B7 series ( or YC-156/172)? you want good ones.? Buddy who built the 80-10m? YC-156? amp u see on the pix pages of this group.... he bought 12 of them...and only 3 are any good.? They require a 8 min warmup.? ?After 5 mins, they developed the short...duds.? ?Problem was, the 11m ops get a hold of em, and drive the crap outa them...then sell em.? ? Dunno where K7RDX gets his 156/172's? from.? There are virtually no MRI machines left that use tubes.?
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The 3CPX-15,000B7? has a 8.32" OD cooler.? ?That's a big tube...and eats up a lotta space on the chassis, once mating chimney is installed.?
It would be an easy / easier? tube to cool.?
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Bob
