Re: the WORST ham built amplifier?
From the looks of it, it appears the amp is only for 11 meters. With the small inductors and the caps missing plates, I bet it was designed with CB in mind. I also do not think that it has ever been fired up. Those chokes would have so many self-resonances they would be black. The markings on the front panel is an attempt to make it look legit. 73 ¨C Mike ? Mike B. Feher, N4FS 89 Arnold Blvd. Howell NJ 07731 908-902-3831 ?
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From: [email protected] < [email protected]> On Behalf Of Brandon DX via groups.io Sent: Wednesday, October 30, 2024 11:15 PM To: [email protected]Subject: [ham-amplifiers] the WORST ham built amplifier? ? I understand a chap in the UK has made the seller aware of the utter poor quality of this linear I wanted to know who built it with two plate chokes in series?? At least they knew to place them at right angles.... but why so much L?? ? hurry and see it before someone buys it ?? as my Scottish friend would say "Perish the thought!"
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the WORST ham built amplifier?
I understand a chap in the UK has made the seller aware of the utter poor quality of this linear
I wanted to know who built it with two plate chokes in series??
At least they knew to place them at right angles.... but why so much L?? ?
?
hurry and see it before someone buys it ?? as my Scottish friend would say "Perish the thought!"
Reid? W6MTF
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Re: Econco 3cx3000 Rebuild cost
Hi Jim
?
Thanks, I? will chase it up the costs with Econco. I just have to ship from outside the USA so can be a bit complicated when Econco has agents that they prefer to send you to which doubles the costs.
?
RFPARTS wont ship anything overseas? for what reason I dont really understand. I bought thousands from them now they dont want to know their overseas customers.
?
I might just try and do by taking a holiday there and then getting it done.
?
Loardes from Econoco did indicated that it was possible to convert the 3cx3000F1's to the A7 version since these are genuine Eimac it might be a good investment that will see me into the grave!
?
Henry
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Re: Electrical Improvements
Usually 120 is used for the clock and oven-light if there is one. ? Mod-U-Lator, Mike(y)/W3SLK ? ? ?
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From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Bob
Sent: Wednesday, October 30, 2024 8:35 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [ham-amplifiers] Electrical Improvements ? I wonder if one of the appliances had an open neutral? I know the range was probably 240 v but maybe it still used 120 v for some functions? ? The revised electical laws regarding grounding of appliances and not using their chassis¡¯ as a.c. returns hit home one day when I was cooking . ? I was stirring something on the electric stove with a stainless stirring spoon and reached for the ¡®fridge door so I could retrieve an ingredient, and there was some sort of fault and I got knocked on my ass. ? The fault voltage, later measured was 65 volts from the chassis of the electric stove to the chassis of the refrigerator. ? I showed this all to my LL¡¯s son and he took a chance on touching the pair of appliances at the same time, too. ? Sears was there the very next day with a new ¡®fridge and a new stove. ? Bless someone¡¯s heart¡. ? Hal Mandel
W4HBM ?
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Re: Electrical Improvements
I wonder if one of the appliances had an open neutral? I know the range was probably 240 v but maybe it still used 120 v for some functions?
Any opinions?
Bob W4JFA?
The revised electical laws regarding grounding of appliances and
not using their chassis¡¯ as a.c. returns hit home one day when I
was cooking .
?
I was stirring something on the electric stove with a stainless
stirring spoon and reached for the ¡®fridge door so I could retrieve
an ingredient, and there was some sort of fault and I got knocked
on my ass.
?
The fault voltage, later measured was 65 volts from the
chassis of the electric stove to the chassis of the refrigerator.
?
I showed this all to my LL¡¯s son and he took a chance on touching
the pair of appliances at the same time, too.
?
Sears was there the very next day with a new ¡®fridge and a new
stove.
?
Bless someone¡¯s heart¡.
?
Hal Mandel
W4HBM
?
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Re: Electrical Improvements
Eric,
?
Both the stove and the ¡®fridge were relics of the ¡®Fifties!
?
Hal
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Re: Electrical Improvements
Bonding the stove frame to neutral, or to the grounding wire, serves to cause a circuit breaker to open if a fault within the stove tries to energize the frame?
?
New (after the mid 1990s) stoves are set up, by default, for wiring to a new circuit that includes the two hot wires, a neutral and a grounding wire.
?
If, however, the stove is connected to an older circuit without that grounding wire, a bonding jumper must be connected between the stove frame and the neutral.? Without that jumper, a fault within the stove can energize the frame without opening the circuit breaker....and the only way the fault is found is when someone gets shocked.?
?
The stove works perfectly without that bonding jumper, so it is often overlooked/ignored...despite all the ever larger, ever brighter, ever more strident warning stickers.?
?
?
Eric
?
.
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Isolating the neutral and grounding systems within the amplifier shouldn't be too hard, and I haven't installed the 120/240VAC circuit in the garage, so I have no excuse.? :-)
?
Eric
?
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The revised electical laws regarding grounding of appliances and
not using their chassis¡¯ as a.c. returns hit home one day when I
was cooking .
?
I was stirring something on the electric stove with a stainless
stirring spoon and reached for the ¡®fridge door so I could retrieve
an ingredient, and there was some sort of fault and I got knocked
on my ass.
?
The fault voltage, later measured was 65 volts from the
chassis of the electric stove to the chassis of the refrigerator.
?
I showed this all to my LL¡¯s son and he took a chance on touching
the pair of appliances at the same time, too.
?
Sears was there the very next day with a new ¡®fridge and a new
stove.
?
Bless someone¡¯s heart¡.
?
Hal Mandel
W4HBM
?
|
By fixing I guess you would need to bring a ground to each receptacle and switch? Not so easy to do.
The electrical standards here have evolved over the years, but older installations do not need to be upgraded to comply with the newer standards unless there is a significant amount of work done to the old system. ? How the word significant is defined is subject to a lot of controversy. :-)
?
I could use the "it was compliant when it was constructed" argument and use the neutral as the grounding means with no GFCI/RCD system on that circuit? But, especially since it is so easy to bring it into compliance with modern standards....why not do so.... :-)
?
?
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The electrical standards here have evolved over the years, but older installations do not need to be upgraded to comply with the newer standards unless there is a significant amount of work done to the old system. ? How the word significant is defined is subject to a lot of controversy. :-)
?
I could use the "it was compliant when it was constructed" argument and use the neutral as the grounding means with no GFCI/RCD system on that circuit? But, especially since it is so easy to bring it into compliance with modern standards....why not do so.... :-)
?
?
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Re: Econco 3cx3000 Rebuild cost
Scott has had a few Eimac 3x3's rebuilt by Econco...as have other's over the years.
?
Phone / e-mail econco....and ask em what it will cost...... with u providing the dud.? I THINK it's aprx $800.00?
?
A new 3x3? from Penta is $997.00? ? ($1200.00? ?from DXE).? ?
?
IMO, if you can get the Eimac rebuilt for? $1400.00? or less..... I would go that route.?
Econco told me a while back that they could rebuild chinese tubes....and also Russian Svetlana tubes.? ?However, I would not spend $800.00? to rebuild a $997.00 chinese tube.?
I do have 2 x new Svetlana 3x3 tubes...and they are well constructed....and use a spiral mech fil.?
Jim? ?VE7RF
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Medium flat rate box is doable.? Let me know.? ?Mike
How much for one of the transformers?? I'm in US zipcode 85937 but live out far enough from town that UPS and FedEx nearly always get lost.
Eric WB6TIX
On Tue, Oct 29, 2024 at 2:13?PM mike repinski via <mikflathead= [email protected]> wrote:
Years ago i purchased 3 Henry power supplies from a surplus dealer. I think 2 of them had 240 to 120 transformers to run the low voltage items instead of a neutral. Still have the transformers if anyone could use them.
On Tuesday, October 29, 2024 at 05:08:48 PM EDT, Eric < vzwengr@...> wrote:
For this time of year, that outlet configuration, a 120V outlet wired for 220V is a "Halloween special"...as in scarey.? :-)
Eric
On Tue, Oct 29, 2024 at 12:52?PM mike repinski via <mikflathead= [email protected]> wrote:
I purchased a SB-220 at an estate sale that had a 120 volt plug but the jumpers in the amp were wired for 220. Hope the xyl did not plug the vacuum cleaner into that outlet :)
On Tuesday, October 29, 2024 at 03:29:29 PM EDT, Eric < vzwengr@...> wrote:
The 5-15P is wired so that the grounding "pin" is the neutral and the two blades are "hot".? My thought for the corresponding receptacle? is (considering it's Halloween) "spooky".? :-)
As near as I can tell, the 2K-4 does the now deprecated "neutral is also used as grounding" method.? I need/want to figure out how to isolate grounding and neutral inside the amp.
Eric
On Tue, Oct 29, 2024 at 11:51?AM Mahlon Haunschild via <k4oq.radio= [email protected]> wrote: Quick note... the 2K-4 needs a neutral as well as ground
During my move from the city to an extreme rural area, I had a Henry 2K-4, along with a spare set of 3-500Zs, gifted to me.? I'm presuming the 2K-3 is a more modern looking 2K-3 and I have a '7300, so the thread combining the 2K-3 relay update and the 7300 "tail" is interesting.
?
I am the 3rd keeper of the 2K-4 and was told it was bought after demonstrating its functionality, but "something happened on the way home".? I've looked it over closely and the only things I've found were a wolf spider that jumped onto my hand (I said a couple of bad words), a NEMA 5-15P (regular 125VAC plug) on the end of the power cord, the amplifier internally strapped for 240VAC and what seems like a decade of dust covering everything.? The dust is now gone, as is the wolf spider.? So my hope is that someone had a Halloween special regular outlet hooked up for 240VAC, but everyone else has just been plugging it into a correctly wired 125VAC outlet..
?
I have not powered up the 2K-4 due to a lack of a 240VAC circuit in the shack.? I have the stuff to add a 60A/240VAC sub-panel in the shack, but...other projects are taking priority.
?
Eric
WB6TIX
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$25.00 plus shipping at 20lbs. May fit in a medium flat rate box for $20.00? Mike
How much for one of the transformers?? I'm in US zipcode 85937 but live out far enough from town that UPS and FedEx nearly always get lost.
Eric WB6TIX
On Tue, Oct 29, 2024 at 2:13?PM mike repinski via <mikflathead= [email protected]> wrote:
Years ago i purchased 3 Henry power supplies from a surplus dealer. I think 2 of them had 240 to 120 transformers to run the low voltage items instead of a neutral. Still have the transformers if anyone could use them.
On Tuesday, October 29, 2024 at 05:08:48 PM EDT, Eric < vzwengr@...> wrote:
For this time of year, that outlet configuration, a 120V outlet wired for 220V is a "Halloween special"...as in scarey.? :-)
Eric
On Tue, Oct 29, 2024 at 12:52?PM mike repinski via <mikflathead= [email protected]> wrote:
I purchased a SB-220 at an estate sale that had a 120 volt plug but the jumpers in the amp were wired for 220. Hope the xyl did not plug the vacuum cleaner into that outlet :)
On Tuesday, October 29, 2024 at 03:29:29 PM EDT, Eric < vzwengr@...> wrote:
The 5-15P is wired so that the grounding "pin" is the neutral and the two blades are "hot".? My thought for the corresponding receptacle? is (considering it's Halloween) "spooky".? :-)
As near as I can tell, the 2K-4 does the now deprecated "neutral is also used as grounding" method.? I need/want to figure out how to isolate grounding and neutral inside the amp.
Eric
On Tue, Oct 29, 2024 at 11:51?AM Mahlon Haunschild via <k4oq.radio= [email protected]> wrote: Quick note... the 2K-4 needs a neutral as well as ground
During my move from the city to an extreme rural area, I had a Henry 2K-4, along with a spare set of 3-500Zs, gifted to me.? I'm presuming the 2K-3 is a more modern looking 2K-3 and I have a '7300, so the thread combining the 2K-3 relay update and the 7300 "tail" is interesting.
?
I am the 3rd keeper of the 2K-4 and was told it was bought after demonstrating its functionality, but "something happened on the way home".? I've looked it over closely and the only things I've found were a wolf spider that jumped onto my hand (I said a couple of bad words), a NEMA 5-15P (regular 125VAC plug) on the end of the power cord, the amplifier internally strapped for 240VAC and what seems like a decade of dust covering everything.? The dust is now gone, as is the wolf spider.? So my hope is that someone had a Halloween special regular outlet hooked up for 240VAC, but everyone else has just been plugging it into a correctly wired 125VAC outlet..
?
I have not powered up the 2K-4 due to a lack of a 240VAC circuit in the shack.? I have the stuff to add a 60A/240VAC sub-panel in the shack, but...other projects are taking priority.
?
Eric
WB6TIX
|
Econco 3cx3000 Rebuild cost
Anyone had any experience in getting a 3cx3000A7 rebuilt with a supplied Eimac Dud?
?
I would be curious if its worth the cost and what the cost is compared to buying? a new Penta 3cx3000.
?
I have a few 3cx3000A7 duds from Henry RF heaters as well as 3cx3000F1 ones which I am told Econco can rebuild as a 3000A7.
?
?
Henry
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Hi Eric If you grounded the neutral over here, none of your RCD/ELCB would work ! To say nothing of illegality¡ Cheers, John VK6JX
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On 30 Oct 2024, at 3:29?AM, Eric via groups.io <vzwengr@...> wrote:
? The 5-15P is wired so that the grounding "pin" is the neutral and the two blades are "hot".? My thought for the corresponding receptacle? is (considering it's Halloween) "spooky".? :-)
As near as I can tell, the 2K-4 does the now deprecated "neutral is also used as grounding" method.? I need/want to figure out how to isolate grounding and neutral inside the amp.
Eric
On Tue, Oct 29, 2024 at 11:51?AM Mahlon Haunschild via <k4oq.radio= [email protected]> wrote: Quick note... the 2K-4 needs a neutral as well as ground
During my move from the city to an extreme rural area, I had a Henry 2K-4, along with a spare set of 3-500Zs, gifted to me.? I'm presuming the 2K-3 is a more modern looking 2K-3 and I have a '7300, so the thread combining the 2K-3 relay update and the 7300 "tail" is interesting.
?
I am the 3rd keeper of the 2K-4 and was told it was bought after demonstrating its functionality, but "something happened on the way home".? I've looked it over closely and the only things I've found were a wolf spider that jumped onto my hand (I said a couple of bad words), a NEMA 5-15P (regular 125VAC plug) on the end of the power cord, the amplifier internally strapped for 240VAC and what seems like a decade of dust covering everything.? The dust is now gone, as is the wolf spider.? So my hope is that someone had a Halloween special regular outlet hooked up for 240VAC, but everyone else has just been plugging it into a correctly wired 125VAC outlet..
?
I have not powered up the 2K-4 due to a lack of a 240VAC circuit in the shack.? I have the stuff to add a 60A/240VAC sub-panel in the shack, but...other projects are taking priority.
?
Eric
WB6TIX
|
OK, I'm writing from a keyboard now instead of a smart phone.
First of all, that was a very nice gift indeed.
Now, I did exactly this power conversion with a 2K-4 many years ago.? As far as I can recall, everything I needed to connect to for 117/234 VAC operation (hot-hot-neutral) was already on the power supply terminal board.? I connected the power cord's green ground wire directly to the chassis using a terminal board mounting screw,?I believe.? Used a 12 AWG 4 cond power cord (class 2 insulation though, but it was At Hand) plus a Hubble L14-20 twist lock plug to keep that horse of a cord from coming out of the receptacle in the wall.
Keep in mind that the plate transformer is dual-primary 117/234 VAC, the control transformer is 234 VAC single primary (using the plate transformer as an autotransformer when using 117 VAC supply, I believe), and the blower is 117 VAC.??
A couple of other points:
-? You will need a T/R relay buffer for your Icom transceivers, but I'm sure that you already know that.
-? There is plenty of room on the back of the mercury relay bracket for unobtrusively mounting a step-start circuit.
Feel free to write off-list if you need more help.
Best regards
Mahlon - N4ZK
The 5-15P is wired so that the grounding "pin" is the neutral and the two blades are "hot".? My thought for the corresponding receptacle? is (considering it's Halloween) "spooky".? :-)
As near as I can tell, the 2K-4 does the now deprecated "neutral is also used as grounding" method.? I need/want to figure out how to isolate grounding and neutral inside the amp.
Eric
On Tue, Oct 29, 2024 at 11:51?AM Mahlon Haunschild via <k4oq.radio= [email protected]> wrote: Quick note... the 2K-4 needs a neutral as well as ground
During my move from the city to an extreme rural area, I had a Henry 2K-4, along with a spare set of 3-500Zs, gifted to me.? I'm presuming the 2K-3 is a more modern looking 2K-3 and I have a '7300, so the thread combining the 2K-3 relay update and the 7300 "tail" is interesting.
?
I am the 3rd keeper of the 2K-4 and was told it was bought after demonstrating its functionality, but "something happened on the way home".? I've looked it over closely and the only things I've found were a wolf spider that jumped onto my hand (I said a couple of bad words), a NEMA 5-15P (regular 125VAC plug) on the end of the power cord, the amplifier internally strapped for 240VAC and what seems like a decade of dust covering everything.? The dust is now gone, as is the wolf spider.? So my hope is that someone had a Halloween special regular outlet hooked up for 240VAC, but everyone else has just been plugging it into a correctly wired 125VAC outlet..
?
I have not powered up the 2K-4 due to a lack of a 240VAC circuit in the shack.? I have the stuff to add a 60A/240VAC sub-panel in the shack, but...other projects are taking priority.
?
Eric
WB6TIX
|
How much for one of the transformers?? I'm in US zipcode 85937 but live out far enough from town that UPS and FedEx nearly always get lost.
Eric WB6TIX
On Tue, Oct 29, 2024 at 2:13?PM mike repinski via <mikflathead= [email protected]> wrote:
Years ago i purchased 3 Henry power supplies from a surplus dealer. I think 2 of them had 240 to 120 transformers to run the low voltage items instead of a neutral. Still have the transformers if anyone could use them.
On Tuesday, October 29, 2024 at 05:08:48 PM EDT, Eric < vzwengr@...> wrote:
For this time of year, that outlet configuration, a 120V outlet wired for 220V is a "Halloween special"...as in scarey.? :-)
Eric
On Tue, Oct 29, 2024 at 12:52?PM mike repinski via <mikflathead= [email protected]> wrote:
I purchased a SB-220 at an estate sale that had a 120 volt plug but the jumpers in the amp were wired for 220. Hope the xyl did not plug the vacuum cleaner into that outlet :)
On Tuesday, October 29, 2024 at 03:29:29 PM EDT, Eric < vzwengr@...> wrote:
The 5-15P is wired so that the grounding "pin" is the neutral and the two blades are "hot".? My thought for the corresponding receptacle? is (considering it's Halloween) "spooky".? :-)
As near as I can tell, the 2K-4 does the now deprecated "neutral is also used as grounding" method.? I need/want to figure out how to isolate grounding and neutral inside the amp.
Eric
On Tue, Oct 29, 2024 at 11:51?AM Mahlon Haunschild via <k4oq.radio= [email protected]> wrote: Quick note... the 2K-4 needs a neutral as well as ground
During my move from the city to an extreme rural area, I had a Henry 2K-4, along with a spare set of 3-500Zs, gifted to me.? I'm presuming the 2K-3 is a more modern looking 2K-3 and I have a '7300, so the thread combining the 2K-3 relay update and the 7300 "tail" is interesting.
?
I am the 3rd keeper of the 2K-4 and was told it was bought after demonstrating its functionality, but "something happened on the way home".? I've looked it over closely and the only things I've found were a wolf spider that jumped onto my hand (I said a couple of bad words), a NEMA 5-15P (regular 125VAC plug) on the end of the power cord, the amplifier internally strapped for 240VAC and what seems like a decade of dust covering everything.? The dust is now gone, as is the wolf spider.? So my hope is that someone had a Halloween special regular outlet hooked up for 240VAC, but everyone else has just been plugging it into a correctly wired 125VAC outlet..
?
I have not powered up the 2K-4 due to a lack of a 240VAC circuit in the shack.? I have the stuff to add a 60A/240VAC sub-panel in the shack, but...other projects are taking priority.
?
Eric
WB6TIX
|
Years ago i purchased 3 Henry power supplies from a surplus dealer. I think 2 of them had 240 to 120 transformers to run the low voltage items instead of a neutral. Still have the transformers if anyone could use them.
For this time of year, that outlet configuration, a 120V outlet wired for 220V is a "Halloween special"...as in scarey.? :-)
Eric
On Tue, Oct 29, 2024 at 12:52?PM mike repinski via <mikflathead= [email protected]> wrote:
I purchased a SB-220 at an estate sale that had a 120 volt plug but the jumpers in the amp were wired for 220. Hope the xyl did not plug the vacuum cleaner into that outlet :)
On Tuesday, October 29, 2024 at 03:29:29 PM EDT, Eric < vzwengr@...> wrote:
The 5-15P is wired so that the grounding "pin" is the neutral and the two blades are "hot".? My thought for the corresponding receptacle? is (considering it's Halloween) "spooky".? :-)
As near as I can tell, the 2K-4 does the now deprecated "neutral is also used as grounding" method.? I need/want to figure out how to isolate grounding and neutral inside the amp.
Eric
On Tue, Oct 29, 2024 at 11:51?AM Mahlon Haunschild via <k4oq.radio= [email protected]> wrote: Quick note... the 2K-4 needs a neutral as well as ground
During my move from the city to an extreme rural area, I had a Henry 2K-4, along with a spare set of 3-500Zs, gifted to me.? I'm presuming the 2K-3 is a more modern looking 2K-3 and I have a '7300, so the thread combining the 2K-3 relay update and the 7300 "tail" is interesting.
?
I am the 3rd keeper of the 2K-4 and was told it was bought after demonstrating its functionality, but "something happened on the way home".? I've looked it over closely and the only things I've found were a wolf spider that jumped onto my hand (I said a couple of bad words), a NEMA 5-15P (regular 125VAC plug) on the end of the power cord, the amplifier internally strapped for 240VAC and what seems like a decade of dust covering everything.? The dust is now gone, as is the wolf spider.? So my hope is that someone had a Halloween special regular outlet hooked up for 240VAC, but everyone else has just been plugging it into a correctly wired 125VAC outlet..
?
I have not powered up the 2K-4 due to a lack of a 240VAC circuit in the shack.? I have the stuff to add a 60A/240VAC sub-panel in the shack, but...other projects are taking priority.
?
Eric
WB6TIX
|
For this time of year, that outlet configuration, a 120V outlet wired for 220V is a "Halloween special"...as in scarey.? :-)
Eric
On Tue, Oct 29, 2024 at 12:52?PM mike repinski via <mikflathead= [email protected]> wrote:
I purchased a SB-220 at an estate sale that had a 120 volt plug but the jumpers in the amp were wired for 220. Hope the xyl did not plug the vacuum cleaner into that outlet :)
On Tuesday, October 29, 2024 at 03:29:29 PM EDT, Eric < vzwengr@...> wrote:
The 5-15P is wired so that the grounding "pin" is the neutral and the two blades are "hot".? My thought for the corresponding receptacle? is (considering it's Halloween) "spooky".? :-)
As near as I can tell, the 2K-4 does the now deprecated "neutral is also used as grounding" method.? I need/want to figure out how to isolate grounding and neutral inside the amp.
Eric
On Tue, Oct 29, 2024 at 11:51?AM Mahlon Haunschild via <k4oq.radio= [email protected]> wrote: Quick note... the 2K-4 needs a neutral as well as ground
During my move from the city to an extreme rural area, I had a Henry 2K-4, along with a spare set of 3-500Zs, gifted to me.? I'm presuming the 2K-3 is a more modern looking 2K-3 and I have a '7300, so the thread combining the 2K-3 relay update and the 7300 "tail" is interesting.
?
I am the 3rd keeper of the 2K-4 and was told it was bought after demonstrating its functionality, but "something happened on the way home".? I've looked it over closely and the only things I've found were a wolf spider that jumped onto my hand (I said a couple of bad words), a NEMA 5-15P (regular 125VAC plug) on the end of the power cord, the amplifier internally strapped for 240VAC and what seems like a decade of dust covering everything.? The dust is now gone, as is the wolf spider.? So my hope is that someone had a Halloween special regular outlet hooked up for 240VAC, but everyone else has just been plugging it into a correctly wired 125VAC outlet..
?
I have not powered up the 2K-4 due to a lack of a 240VAC circuit in the shack.? I have the stuff to add a 60A/240VAC sub-panel in the shack, but...other projects are taking priority.
?
Eric
WB6TIX
|
Brandon DX
Bob
HaL Mandel