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Re: VM/370 Hercules Optimisation

 

Hi Greg,

You are missing the vm370r6-essentials archive.? It contains the following files:

??? dmkddr.aws??? ??? ??? (to restore the starter tapes)
??? dmkrio.assemble??? (supplied and tailored by Bob)
??? dmksys.assemble??? (supplied and tailored by Bob)
??? README.txt??? ??? ??? (starting instructions)
??? vm370rc.cnf??? ??? ??? (hercules configuration file)
??? release6.direct??? ??? (user direct file for vm/370 r6?? *** This is bad don't use)

You will also need manual GC20-1801-10 VM370_Sysgen_Rel_6_Jan80. I believe I found this on bitsavers.

During last year's discussion about automated re-creation of the VM/370 from scratch, Paul reported that Maint's 193 (or 194) minidisk got corrupted.? I traced it down to the release6.direct file supplied by Bob.? I ended up using the user direct file that can be punched out during the sysgen process and the Maint minidisk was intact.

Start by using either the README.txt or the sysgen manual.? I recommend using the sysgen manual as you end up there anyway.? I used 3330-11 dasd instead of standard 3330 dasd primarily in case I had to move one or more of Maint's minidisks to preserve the minidisk that was getting corrupted.? The sysgen has a step to install maintenance and you can use the supplied PTF tape.

It was fun and a trip down memory lane as well as a learning experience.? I had never installed VM/370, just used it and applied maintenance.? The college I worked at had a 4331 with 3370 A1/B1 dasd running VM/370 R6 and MUSIC 4.0 (maybe 5.1) and yes it has BSEPP/SEPP installed. A few years later it was upgraded to VM/SP R3 and MUSIC 5.2.? I used a 300 baud modem to dial into McGill to get patches using a TRS-80 and daisy wheel printer.

If you elect to use the 3330-11 configuration, you will need to make the appropriate changes to end cylinder numbers where necessary during the various steps including the user direct file.? Make sure you make backups along the way.? I didn't but then it also caused me to remember and understand the steps better, but then I'm a hard case.

Regards,

Gary

On 2/1/20 7:47 PM, Gregg Levine wrote:
Hello!
I said I knew it was out there, I did not miss one. If nothing I might
have definitely did so, it is because I did not download it
before.now. I just did. Can you describe completely the steps to do
all of that?

And please use simple language. I believe there are people following
our list who're just starting out on this, and do indeed need to know
stuff like this.

And all of this will become clear to the one also named Dave, who is
allowing a group of workers from Asia to run his shop/museum.
-----
Gregg C Levine gregg.drwho8@...
"This signature fought the Time Wars, time and again."

On Sat, Feb 1, 2020 at 7:30 PM Dave Wade <dave.g4ugm@...> wrote:
Gregg,
You missed one!



and there is an additional optional tape



You need to BUNZIP it ad then you can load the first file which is ABSTRACT ABSTRACT

I think you will find file 39 is stuff you need.
You need to create a user CPWATCH and load the file to its disk...

Dave

-----Original Message-----
From: [email protected] <[email protected]> On Behalf Of Gregg Levine
Sent: 02 February 2020 00:22
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [h390-vm] VM/370 Hercules Optimisation

Hello!
So its been added to the basic system regarding the 6 Pack series? I know
there's a Waterloo tape some place for the basic system and of course the
dreaded additional pack tape that we know how to install but I confess I do
not know how.

pi@raspberrypi:~ $ ls /media/memory0/h390/*.aws.*
/media/memory0/h390/base-source.aws.bz2
/media/memory0/h390/CPR6L0.ddr.aws.bz2
/media/memory0/h390/ptf-616.aws.bz2
/media/memory0/h390/starter-3330.aws.bz2
/media/memory0/h390/VMREL6.ddr.aws.bz2

For example up there is the base-source.aws.bz2 one, and then the CP tape
also packaged as an AWS one and compressed using Bzip2 and that PTF tape,
and the crazy one is marked starter-3330.aws.bz2. That's the one that's got
me a trifle peeved.

I understand making use of the two named as the system ones, as they were
restored a while back, I have kept complete decks or rather drive images.

So are the Waterloo things on those two ones, I've not restored? And how
would I go about bringing the starter one into the Bob set I use.
Of course I could go ahead and bring up next time the current but not Beta
six pack.
-----
Gregg C Levine gregg.drwho8@...
"This signature fought the Time Wars, time and again."

On Fri, Jan 31, 2020 at 4:10 AM Dave Wade <dave.g4ugm@...> wrote:
Gregg
Its an add-on so it is only in the "n--packs" The source is on the Waterloo
tape. It may need tweaking as it was originally written on sepp/bsepp.
Dave

-----Original Message-----
From: [email protected] <[email protected]> On Behalf Of Gregg
Levine
Sent: 31 January 2020 01:37
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [h390-vm] VM/370 Hercules Optimisation

Hello!
It does? Then why did I get this from a DIAL CPWATCH command string
on the original one, DIAL CPWATCH DMKDIA045E CPWATCH NOT
LOGGED ON
IND from the console not the 3270 shows what it is doing, CPWATCH
from the same place does not.

Does this mean it's a missing entry on the original Bob kit? This
will perfectly be obvious to everyone except the individual reading
this out loud to a crowd of Yeti. (Including one who smokes a brand
of smoking tobacco that's older than most of us.)
-----
Gregg C Levine gregg.drwho8@... "This signature fought the
Time Wars, time and again."

On Wed, Jan 29, 2020 at 9:00 AM Dave Wade <dave.g4ugm@...>
wrote:
Folks



CPWATCH reports paging rate.



Dave





From: [email protected] <[email protected]> On Behalf Of Bob
Polmanter
Sent: 29 January 2020 12:44
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [h390-vm] VM/370 Hercules Optimisation



Adrian,

In my experience, I doubt you are doing all that much paging.
First off, the
VM/370 CP IND command doesn't show paging stats like it did in later
releases, so it is difficult to know how much you are paging.
If you are a single user VM/370 system, running 16MB real, even if
you had
a 16MB user virtual machine, you would have to go some to cause much
paging beyond a very light amount. If you had several 16MB user
machines running simultaneously with large active working sets, then
maybe you could get the paging rate up to 5-10 pages per second.
With Hercules caching, it just isn't a problem.
Regards,
Bob
Re: VM/370 Hercules Optimisation

 

On 2/1/20 8:30 AM, Rhialto wrote:
On Wed 29 Jan 2020 at 04:15:04 -0800, adriansutherland67 wrote:
Thanks Dave

For memory paging - I was wondering if IBM had a paging memory device (clearly not - thanks). Therefore (1) I am going to go ahead with experimenting with a small DASD drive for paging.
Our university (second half of the 1980s) used some Japanese clone
called NAS I think, and they were proud of their "solid state paging
device". I think that is what we would call a RAM disk these days.
It probably been would have been a SSD.? A RAM disk would have been volatile? memory (and fact in various VM download pages include code to do such a thing.)
We had VM/SP (at some point we updated to the version with windows, but
it was disabled because people didn't like it enough, or it was too CPU
intensive, or something)
Full screen CMS was/is a awful hack -- all the native CM/SP line oriented output is intercepted using IUCV and redirected to the full screen environment.? And yes, because the output is written, intercepted, and? written again, it is a resource pig.

Full screen CMS also used command names that polluted the existing namespace.? For example in VM/SP 4 you simple could enter "HELP DEFINE" to get the information on the CP command to define virtual devices, but in VM/SP "HELP DEFINE" would return information on DEFINE WINDOW and DEFINE VSCREEN.? ("HELP CP DEFINE" was required for the old behavior.)

The first VM/SP version with full screen CMS is VM/SP 5. The LCM+L 4361 runs VM/SP 5, and yes, you can issue "SET FULLSCREEN ON" on it (may Ceiling Cat have mercy on your virtual CPU).

-ahd-
Re: VM/370 Hercules Optimisation

 

Hello!
I said I knew it was out there, I did not miss one. If nothing I might
have definitely did so, it is because I did not download it
before.now. I just did. Can you describe completely the steps to do
all of that?

And please use simple language. I believe there are people following
our list who're just starting out on this, and do indeed need to know
stuff like this.

And all of this will become clear to the one also named Dave, who is
allowing a group of workers from Asia to run his shop/museum.
-----
Gregg C Levine gregg.drwho8@...
"This signature fought the Time Wars, time and again."

On Sat, Feb 1, 2020 at 7:30 PM Dave Wade <dave.g4ugm@...> wrote:

Gregg,
You missed one!



and there is an additional optional tape



You need to BUNZIP it ad then you can load the first file which is ABSTRACT ABSTRACT

I think you will find file 39 is stuff you need.
You need to create a user CPWATCH and load the file to its disk...

Dave

-----Original Message-----
From: [email protected] <[email protected]> On Behalf Of Gregg Levine
Sent: 02 February 2020 00:22
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [h390-vm] VM/370 Hercules Optimisation

Hello!
So its been added to the basic system regarding the 6 Pack series? I know
there's a Waterloo tape some place for the basic system and of course the
dreaded additional pack tape that we know how to install but I confess I do
not know how.

pi@raspberrypi:~ $ ls /media/memory0/h390/*.aws.*
/media/memory0/h390/base-source.aws.bz2
/media/memory0/h390/CPR6L0.ddr.aws.bz2
/media/memory0/h390/ptf-616.aws.bz2
/media/memory0/h390/starter-3330.aws.bz2
/media/memory0/h390/VMREL6.ddr.aws.bz2

For example up there is the base-source.aws.bz2 one, and then the CP tape
also packaged as an AWS one and compressed using Bzip2 and that PTF tape,
and the crazy one is marked starter-3330.aws.bz2. That's the one that's got
me a trifle peeved.

I understand making use of the two named as the system ones, as they were
restored a while back, I have kept complete decks or rather drive images.

So are the Waterloo things on those two ones, I've not restored? And how
would I go about bringing the starter one into the Bob set I use.
Of course I could go ahead and bring up next time the current but not Beta
six pack.
-----
Gregg C Levine gregg.drwho8@...
"This signature fought the Time Wars, time and again."

On Fri, Jan 31, 2020 at 4:10 AM Dave Wade <dave.g4ugm@...> wrote:

Gregg
Its an add-on so it is only in the "n--packs" The source is on the Waterloo
tape. It may need tweaking as it was originally written on sepp/bsepp.
Dave

-----Original Message-----
From: [email protected] <[email protected]> On Behalf Of Gregg
Levine
Sent: 31 January 2020 01:37
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [h390-vm] VM/370 Hercules Optimisation

Hello!
It does? Then why did I get this from a DIAL CPWATCH command string
on the original one, DIAL CPWATCH DMKDIA045E CPWATCH NOT
LOGGED ON
IND from the console not the 3270 shows what it is doing, CPWATCH
from the same place does not.

Does this mean it's a missing entry on the original Bob kit? This
will perfectly be obvious to everyone except the individual reading
this out loud to a crowd of Yeti. (Including one who smokes a brand
of smoking tobacco that's older than most of us.)
-----
Gregg C Levine gregg.drwho8@... "This signature fought the
Time Wars, time and again."

On Wed, Jan 29, 2020 at 9:00 AM Dave Wade <dave.g4ugm@...>
wrote:

Folks



CPWATCH reports paging rate.



Dave





From: [email protected] <[email protected]> On Behalf Of Bob
Polmanter
Sent: 29 January 2020 12:44
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [h390-vm] VM/370 Hercules Optimisation



Adrian,

In my experience, I doubt you are doing all that much paging.
First off, the
VM/370 CP IND command doesn't show paging stats like it did in later
releases, so it is difficult to know how much you are paging.

If you are a single user VM/370 system, running 16MB real, even if
you had
a 16MB user virtual machine, you would have to go some to cause much
paging beyond a very light amount. If you had several 16MB user
machines running simultaneously with large active working sets, then
maybe you could get the paging rate up to 5-10 pages per second.
With Hercules caching, it just isn't a problem.

Regards,
Bob
Re: VM/370 Hercules Optimisation

 

Gregg,
You missed one!



and there is an additional optional tape



You need to BUNZIP it ad then you can load the first file which is ABSTRACT ABSTRACT

I think you will find file 39 is stuff you need.
You need to create a user CPWATCH and load the file to its disk...

Dave

-----Original Message-----
From: [email protected] <[email protected]> On Behalf Of Gregg Levine
Sent: 02 February 2020 00:22
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [h390-vm] VM/370 Hercules Optimisation

Hello!
So its been added to the basic system regarding the 6 Pack series? I know
there's a Waterloo tape some place for the basic system and of course the
dreaded additional pack tape that we know how to install but I confess I do
not know how.

pi@raspberrypi:~ $ ls /media/memory0/h390/*.aws.*
/media/memory0/h390/base-source.aws.bz2
/media/memory0/h390/CPR6L0.ddr.aws.bz2
/media/memory0/h390/ptf-616.aws.bz2
/media/memory0/h390/starter-3330.aws.bz2
/media/memory0/h390/VMREL6.ddr.aws.bz2

For example up there is the base-source.aws.bz2 one, and then the CP tape
also packaged as an AWS one and compressed using Bzip2 and that PTF tape,
and the crazy one is marked starter-3330.aws.bz2. That's the one that's got
me a trifle peeved.

I understand making use of the two named as the system ones, as they were
restored a while back, I have kept complete decks or rather drive images.

So are the Waterloo things on those two ones, I've not restored? And how
would I go about bringing the starter one into the Bob set I use.
Of course I could go ahead and bring up next time the current but not Beta
six pack.
-----
Gregg C Levine gregg.drwho8@...
"This signature fought the Time Wars, time and again."

On Fri, Jan 31, 2020 at 4:10 AM Dave Wade <dave.g4ugm@...> wrote:

Gregg
Its an add-on so it is only in the "n--packs" The source is on the Waterloo
tape. It may need tweaking as it was originally written on sepp/bsepp.
Dave

-----Original Message-----
From: [email protected] <[email protected]> On Behalf Of Gregg
Levine
Sent: 31 January 2020 01:37
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [h390-vm] VM/370 Hercules Optimisation

Hello!
It does? Then why did I get this from a DIAL CPWATCH command string
on the original one, DIAL CPWATCH DMKDIA045E CPWATCH NOT
LOGGED ON
IND from the console not the 3270 shows what it is doing, CPWATCH
from the same place does not.

Does this mean it's a missing entry on the original Bob kit? This
will perfectly be obvious to everyone except the individual reading
this out loud to a crowd of Yeti. (Including one who smokes a brand
of smoking tobacco that's older than most of us.)
-----
Gregg C Levine gregg.drwho8@... "This signature fought the
Time Wars, time and again."

On Wed, Jan 29, 2020 at 9:00 AM Dave Wade <dave.g4ugm@...>
wrote:

Folks



CPWATCH reports paging rate.



Dave





From: [email protected] <[email protected]> On Behalf Of Bob
Polmanter
Sent: 29 January 2020 12:44
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [h390-vm] VM/370 Hercules Optimisation



Adrian,

In my experience, I doubt you are doing all that much paging.
First off, the
VM/370 CP IND command doesn't show paging stats like it did in later
releases, so it is difficult to know how much you are paging.

If you are a single user VM/370 system, running 16MB real, even if
you had
a 16MB user virtual machine, you would have to go some to cause much
paging beyond a very light amount. If you had several 16MB user
machines running simultaneously with large active working sets, then
maybe you could get the paging rate up to 5-10 pages per second.
With Hercules caching, it just isn't a problem.

Regards,
Bob
Re: VM/370 Hercules Optimisation

 

Hello!
So its been added to the basic system regarding the 6 Pack series? I
know there's a Waterloo tape some place for the basic system and of
course the dreaded additional pack tape that we know how to install
but I confess I do not know how.

pi@raspberrypi:~ $ ls /media/memory0/h390/*.aws.*
/media/memory0/h390/base-source.aws.bz2
/media/memory0/h390/CPR6L0.ddr.aws.bz2
/media/memory0/h390/ptf-616.aws.bz2
/media/memory0/h390/starter-3330.aws.bz2
/media/memory0/h390/VMREL6.ddr.aws.bz2

For example up there is the base-source.aws.bz2 one, and then the CP
tape also packaged as an AWS one and compressed using Bzip2 and that
PTF tape, and the crazy one is marked starter-3330.aws.bz2. That's the
one that's got me a trifle peeved.

I understand making use of the two named as the system ones, as they
were restored a while back, I have kept complete decks or rather drive
images.

So are the Waterloo things on those two ones, I've not restored? And
how would I go about bringing the starter one into the Bob set I use.
Of course I could go ahead and bring up next time the current but not
Beta six pack.
-----
Gregg C Levine gregg.drwho8@...
"This signature fought the Time Wars, time and again."

On Fri, Jan 31, 2020 at 4:10 AM Dave Wade <dave.g4ugm@...> wrote:

Gregg
Its an add-on so it is only in the "n--packs" The source is on the Waterloo tape. It may need tweaking as it was originally written on sepp/bsepp.
Dave

-----Original Message-----
From: [email protected] <[email protected]> On Behalf Of Gregg Levine
Sent: 31 January 2020 01:37
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [h390-vm] VM/370 Hercules Optimisation

Hello!
It does? Then why did I get this from a DIAL CPWATCH command string on
the original one, DIAL CPWATCH DMKDIA045E CPWATCH NOT LOGGED ON
IND from the console not the 3270 shows what it is doing, CPWATCH from
the same place does not.

Does this mean it's a missing entry on the original Bob kit? This will perfectly
be obvious to everyone except the individual reading this out loud to a crowd
of Yeti. (Including one who smokes a brand of smoking tobacco that's older
than most of us.)
-----
Gregg C Levine gregg.drwho8@...
"This signature fought the Time Wars, time and again."

On Wed, Jan 29, 2020 at 9:00 AM Dave Wade <dave.g4ugm@...>
wrote:

Folks



CPWATCH reports paging rate.



Dave





From: [email protected] <[email protected]> On Behalf Of Bob
Polmanter
Sent: 29 January 2020 12:44
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [h390-vm] VM/370 Hercules Optimisation



Adrian,

In my experience, I doubt you are doing all that much paging. First off, the
VM/370 CP IND command doesn't show paging stats like it did in later
releases, so it is difficult to know how much you are paging.

If you are a single user VM/370 system, running 16MB real, even if you had
a 16MB user virtual machine, you would have to go some to cause much
paging beyond a very light amount. If you had several 16MB user machines
running simultaneously with large active working sets, then maybe you could
get the paging rate up to 5-10 pages per second. With Hercules caching, it
just isn't a problem.

Regards,
Bob
Re: VM/370 Hercules Optimisation

 

¿ªÔÆÌåÓý

Folks,

Sorry I misread the question. In VM370R6 minidisks are always CKD blocked 800 bytes. In later releases minidisks can be blocked 512/1024/2048/4096. These can be on CKD or FBA but as George says there is no emulation¡­

Dave

?

From: [email protected] <[email protected]> On Behalf Of Joe Monk
Sent: 01 February 2020 21:42
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [h390-vm] VM/370 Hercules Optimisation

?

"The?disks are formatted?into 800-byte?physical records,?called?blocks. Logical records,?which may be?fixed-length or variable-length, are?imposed on?constant physical blocks. Space required for?files is?automatically allocated?by CMS. As a?file?grows,?its?space?is?expanded,?and?it?is?contracted as?its?space requirements are reduced."

?

Also, according to the chart on page 27, only CKD disks are supported for VM/370.

?

?

Joe

?

?

?

On Sat, Feb 1, 2020 at 3:12 PM George Shedlock <gshedlock352@...> wrote:

Steven,

If you are referring to VM minidisks (such as those available to a cms user), I believe that the device type is always the same as what the VM operating system thinks they are. So if VM thinks the "real" device is ckd, then the cms minidisk is also ckd.

?

George Shedlock

?

On 2/1/2020 4:02 PM, Dave Wade wrote:

Steven,

I haven¡¯t looked at the code, but VM/370R6 only uses 800byte blocks so CKD for minidisks. I don¡¯t know how this is mapped to clusters on windows or linux, but its possible it overlaps two physical sectors¡­

Later versions of CMS use 512/1024/2048/4096 (I think) block sizes which could map to physical sectors, but I bet there is some overhead. On an SSD its probably very low.

Dave

?

From: [email protected] <[email protected]> On Behalf Of Steven Fosdick
Sent: 01 February 2020 20:18
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [h390-vm] VM/370 Hercules Optimisation

?

Related to this discussion of performance is the virtual device associated with a minidisc always the same type of device (CKD or FBA) as the underlying device or can it be different.? If it can be different is there a performance penalty for conversion?

?

Virus-free.

?
Re: VM/370 Hercules Optimisation

 

"The?disks are formatted?into 800-byte?physical records,?called?blocks. Logical records,?which may be?fixed-length or variable-length, are?imposed on?constant physical blocks. Space required for?files is?automatically allocated?by CMS. As a?file?grows,?its?space?is?expanded,?and?it?is?contracted as?its?space requirements are reduced."

Also, according to the chart on page 27, only CKD disks are supported for VM/370.



Joe



On Sat, Feb 1, 2020 at 3:12 PM George Shedlock <gshedlock352@...> wrote:
Steven,
If you are referring to VM minidisks (such as those available to a cms user), I believe that the device type is always the same as what the VM operating system thinks they are. So if VM thinks the "real" device is ckd, then the cms minidisk is also ckd.

George Shedlock

On 2/1/2020 4:02 PM, Dave Wade wrote:

Steven,

I haven¡¯t looked at the code, but VM/370R6 only uses 800byte blocks so CKD for minidisks. I don¡¯t know how this is mapped to clusters on windows or linux, but its possible it overlaps two physical sectors¡­

Later versions of CMS use 512/1024/2048/4096 (I think) block sizes which could map to physical sectors, but I bet there is some overhead. On an SSD its probably very low.

Dave

?

From: [email protected] <[email protected]> On Behalf Of Steven Fosdick
Sent: 01 February 2020 20:18
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [h390-vm] VM/370 Hercules Optimisation

?

Related to this discussion of performance is the virtual device associated with a minidisc always the same type of device (CKD or FBA) as the underlying device or can it be different.? If it can be different is there a performance penalty for conversion?


Virus-free.


Re: VM/370 Hercules Optimisation

George Shedlock
 

¿ªÔÆÌåÓý

Steven,
If you are referring to VM minidisks (such as those available to a cms user), I believe that the device type is always the same as what the VM operating system thinks they are. So if VM thinks the "real" device is ckd, then the cms minidisk is also ckd.

George Shedlock

On 2/1/2020 4:02 PM, Dave Wade wrote:

Steven,

I haven¡¯t looked at the code, but VM/370R6 only uses 800byte blocks so CKD for minidisks. I don¡¯t know how this is mapped to clusters on windows or linux, but its possible it overlaps two physical sectors¡­

Later versions of CMS use 512/1024/2048/4096 (I think) block sizes which could map to physical sectors, but I bet there is some overhead. On an SSD its probably very low.

Dave

?

From: [email protected] <[email protected]> On Behalf Of Steven Fosdick
Sent: 01 February 2020 20:18
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [h390-vm] VM/370 Hercules Optimisation

?

Related to this discussion of performance is the virtual device associated with a minidisc always the same type of device (CKD or FBA) as the underlying device or can it be different.? If it can be different is there a performance penalty for conversion?


Virus-free.


Re: VM/370 Hercules Optimisation

 

¿ªÔÆÌåÓý

Steven,

I haven¡¯t looked at the code, but VM/370R6 only uses 800byte blocks so CKD for minidisks. I don¡¯t know how this is mapped to clusters on windows or linux, but its possible it overlaps two physical sectors¡­

Later versions of CMS use 512/1024/2048/4096 (I think) block sizes which could map to physical sectors, but I bet there is some overhead. On an SSD its probably very low.

Dave

?

From: [email protected] <[email protected]> On Behalf Of Steven Fosdick
Sent: 01 February 2020 20:18
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [h390-vm] VM/370 Hercules Optimisation

?

Related to this discussion of performance is the virtual device associated with a minidisc always the same type of device (CKD or FBA) as the underlying device or can it be different.? If it can be different is there a performance penalty for conversion?
Re: VM/370 Hercules Optimisation

 

Related to this discussion of performance is the virtual device associated with a minidisc always the same type of device (CKD or FBA) as the underlying device or can it be different.? If it can be different is there a performance penalty for conversion?
Re: Writing / reading text files with tapes

 

¿ªÔÆÌåÓý

Thanks for posting that link to the homerow site. ?The precompiled vma and vmagui utilities work excellently on my Win10 system.

?

I contributed code changes many years ago to the assembler implementation of VMARC maintained by Ross Paterson after he took over from John Fischer (the original author) to allow it to run on VM/370 under Herc.? I went searching for Ross Paterson¡¯s geocities site, which is sadly only available at the oocities archive site now.

?

?

The ¡°full download¡± of the VMARC assembler implementation is still available on that archive in base64 format.

?

?

On Win10 systems you can use the builtin certutil command to convert the base64 text to a file usable with the vma or vmagui utilities.

?

C:\VMARC>certutil -decode vmarc.txt vmarc.vma

?

I think the linux base64 command will do the same conversion for you but I didn¡¯t try it myself yet.

?

I haven¡¯t looked, but I would assume the VM/370 six-pack system already includes this code, but it is nice to know the original is still available for reference.

?

Peter

?

From: [email protected] <[email protected]> On Behalf Of Steven Fosdick
Sent: Saturday, February 1, 2020 4:40 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [h390-vm] Writing / reading text files with tapes

?

On Fri, 31 Jan 2020 at 23:46, Peter Coghlan <groups@...> wrote:

VMA is available as C source which can be compiled on any reasonable system
with a functioning C compiler.? I have compiled it on my OpenVMS system, I
think most others use it on Windows or Linux.? The purpose of VMA is to
read write and list VMARC format archive files on systems other than VM/CMS.

?

Thanks to Ren¨¦ for e-mailing me a link to a video that describes searching for the source with "vma utility homerow" which leads to

?

I did try searching before to find a portable implementation of the amarc format but even hearing the utility is called vma didn't seem?to be enough to find it.


> The previous discussion may have been the one I started - I was able to get
> IND$FILE working and also send files to the real punch but I think the
> current question is more about being able to transfer a number of files at
> a time,

I think VMARC is ideal for this purpose but we seem to keep heading off in
the direction of emulated tapes or newly invented archive formats both of
which I think are not so ideal.

?

I think it's quite common to start to solve a problem yourself, get to a point where you're stuck and ask for help on the thing your stuck on.? Helping you with that specific point can lead to a solution but sometimes, if someone persuades you to rewind to the problem you started out with it turns out there is a better solution.?

?
Re: VM/370 Hercules Optimisation

 

On Wed 29 Jan 2020 at 04:15:04 -0800, adriansutherland67 wrote:
Thanks Dave

For memory paging - I was wondering if IBM had a paging memory device (clearly not - thanks). Therefore (1) I am going to go ahead with experimenting with a small DASD drive for paging.
Our university (second half of the 1980s) used some Japanese clone
called NAS I think, and they were proud of their "solid state paging
device". I think that is what we would call a RAM disk these days.

We had VM/SP (at some point we updated to the version with windows, but
it was disabled because people didn't like it enough, or it was too CPU
intensive, or something) and we could have up to around 250 users on it.
I think many would be writing their thesis using Script, but us CS
students used FLACC (the Full Language Algol68 Checkout Compiler) for
our assignments. But we were in the minority.

-Olaf.
--
Olaf 'Rhialto' Seibert -- rhialto at falu dot nl
___ Anyone who is capable of getting themselves made President should on
\X/ no account be allowed to do the job. --Douglas Adams, "THGTTG"
Re: Writing / reading text files with tapes

 

On Sat, Feb 1, 2020 at 10:30 AM, adriansutherland67 wrote:
so I will plough my lonely furrow
To that end - I have renamed it to SPLCON to YATA "Yet Another Text Archive", and will never mention it again! (probably)
Re: Writing / reading text files with tapes

 

On Sat, Feb 1, 2020 at 09:39 AM, Steven Fosdick wrote:
Thanks to Ren¨¦ for e-mailing me a link to a video that describes searching for the source with "vma utility homerow" which leads to
?
Good - and it certainly seems to meets all needs

For me it is a bit heavy weight - I just want something as a text file transport: ASCII/EBCDIC can be done by Hercules/IND$FILE, I don't care about compression, and don't want to worry about long term storage - so I will plough my lonely furrow; everyone can use what tools they will!?:-)
Re: Writing / reading text files with tapes

 

And there is the fantastic VMAGUI that runs on various platforms.? I use it very frequently on Windows 10 to look at the contents of my VM stuff that I save on my laptop as VMARC files.
I even allows to add members to a VMARC file, something I didn't dare yet (all my VMARC files are built on VM; I treat them as R/O files on my laptop).
--
Kris Buelens
Re: Writing / reading text files with tapes

 

On Fri, 31 Jan 2020 at 23:46, Peter Coghlan <groups@...> wrote:
VMA is available as C source which can be compiled on any reasonable system
with a functioning C compiler.? I have compiled it on my OpenVMS system, I
think most others use it on Windows or Linux.? The purpose of VMA is to
read write and list VMARC format archive files on systems other than VM/CMS.

Thanks to Ren¨¦ for e-mailing me a link to a video that describes searching for the source with "vma utility homerow" which leads to

I did try searching before to find a portable implementation of the amarc format but even hearing the utility is called vma didn't seem?to be enough to find it.

> The previous discussion may have been the one I started - I was able to get
> IND$FILE working and also send files to the real punch but I think the
> current question is more about being able to transfer a number of files at
> a time,

I think VMARC is ideal for this purpose but we seem to keep heading off in
the direction of emulated tapes or newly invented archive formats both of
which I think are not so ideal.

I think it's quite common to start to solve a problem yourself, get to a point where you're stuck and ask for help on the thing your stuck on.? Helping you with that specific point can lead to a solution but sometimes, if someone persuades you to rewind to the problem you started out with it turns out there is a better solution.?
?
Re: Writing / reading text files with tapes

 


Is the format of the archive used by vmarc documented anywhere?
I don't know. It probably is. I've never found any need to delve into
the format any more than knowing that it is in 80 column card image format
which can readily be sent through a punch / card reader combination or over
an NJE link and each file starts with a header like this (in EBCDIC):

:CFF FNAME FTYPE FM

and that VMARC doesn't mind if there is garbage in the archive file (such as
USERID or :READ for example) before the first valid file header. The actual
file contents could be compressed with LZW compression and I never found any
compelling reason to know how that works.


if one
were to use the pack function to put a number of CMS files into an archive
file and then transfer this to another system, for example by IND$FILE, are
there likely to be utilities to unpack the archive? Likewise can one pack
files into an archive on another system and unpack onto CMS with vmarc?
This is exactly what VMARC was designed for. VMARC is available as S/370
assembler source which can be built on anything from VM/370 CMS to z/VM CMS.
I've done a mod which enables a limited VMARC version to be built on MUSIC.
I wouldn't be surprised if someone else tweaked it to make it buildable on
MVS and other mainframe operating systems.

If you have a Sixpack system up and running, log in to some CMS userid and
type VMARC370 and you should get brief usage details.

VMA is available as C source which can be compiled on any reasonable system
with a functioning C compiler. I have compiled it on my OpenVMS system, I
think most others use it on Windows or Linux. The purpose of VMA is to
read write and list VMARC format archive files on systems other than VM/CMS.


The previous discussion may have been the one I started - I was able to get
IND$FILE working and also send files to the real punch but I think the
current question is more about being able to transfer a number of files at
a time,
I think VMARC is ideal for this purpose but we seem to keep heading off in
the direction of emulated tapes or newly invented archive formats both of
which I think are not so ideal.

Regards,
Peter Coghlan.
Re: Writing / reading text files with tapes

 

On Fri, Jan 31, 2020 at 09:56 PM, Steven Fosdick wrote:
?? if one were to use the pack function to put a number of CMS files into an archive file and then transfer this to another system, for?example by IND$FILE, are there likely to be utilities to unpack the archive?
This is the hack I produced to do that ...?



Given no alternatives I will clean it up and make it produce an archive with 80 char lines ...?
Re: Writing / reading text files with tapes

 

On Fri, 31 Jan 2020 at 21:00, George Shedlock <gshedlock352@...> wrote:
VMARC and friends can handle any type of file format or record size and restore to same.

Is the format of the archive used by vmarc documented anywhere?? if one were to use the pack function to put a number of CMS files into an archive file and then transfer this to another system, for?example by IND$FILE, are there likely to be utilities to unpack the archive?? Likewise can one pack files into an archive on another system and unpack onto CMS with vmarc?

The previous discussion may have?been the one I started - I was able to get IND$FILE working and also send files to the real punch but I think the current question is more about being able to transfer a number of files at a time,
Re: Writing / reading text files with tapes

 

On 1/31/20 11:36 AM, adriansutherland67 wrote:
Before I go down the route of punching files etc. is there a simple tool to read and add ASCII files, at the pc end, to tapes, covering to ebcdic and so on. I have looked but can't find much although I had assumed this was key functionality.

Sorry if this is a stupid question!
What are you trying actually to do?? Load files onto VM?? Get files off?
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