On Tue, Jul 7, 2020 at 07:08 PM, <gpcramins@...> wrote:

I don't know the back story on this, but I agree, and the latest I observed the behavior, it was a much smaller sum of money than being discussed here. Seen this a few times....

Die broke, that's my plan, and I am well on track!

To perhaps paraphase Greg (perhaps not) ...

Who are you and what are you talking about?

-ahd-

--

Drew Derbyshire

Hello!
Do me a favor please. And do the others one also. Please elaborate.
What are you getting at? (I believe the one who's reading this outloud
to his audience will agree with me.) Oh and please include your full
name as part of your signature line. One of us prefers that.
-----
Gregg C Levine gregg.drwho8@...
"This signature fought the Time Wars, time and again."

On Tue, Jul 7, 2020 at 10:08 PM <gpcramins@...> wrote:

I don't know the back story on this, but I agree, and the latest I observed the behavior, it was a much smaller sum of money than being discussed here. Seen this a few times....

Die broke, that's my plan, and I am well on track!

________________________________

And this space is reserved for the Rebel Alliance to Restore the
Republic because Crait is too salty to properly work on and inside.

I don't know the back story on this, but I agree, and the latest I observed the behavior, it was a much smaller sum of money than being discussed here. Seen this a few times....

Die broke, that's my plan, and I am well on track!

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On Fri, 3 Jul 2020 at 22:02, Dave McGuire <mcguire@...> wrote:

? The passing of a person with money brings out the very worst of
humanity.? I've seen this with my own eyes, when only a little bit of
money was involved.? This was a LOT of money.

? Of course nobody knows what actually happened, but it really doesn't
look good, and it looks very familiar.

Could someone provide a brief background on what has happened here? The first I heard is the very first post in this thread, and I feel I came in part way through the conversation.

Not much to say.?

Remember that Seattle & the Puget Sound was one of the first US hot spots of Coronavirus.? The LCM+L building closed in March and ceased all virtually operations (such as most online access) at end of June. The entire division is shutdown:

Paul Allen had many eclectic (even eccentric) interests combined with lots of civil pride.? It appears his heirs do not have the same interests.

-ahd-

p.s. My usual LCM+L related disclaimers apply.?

-- 
Drew Derbyshire

"Today, I consider myself the luckiest man on the face of the earth,"
                                 -- "The Pride of the Yankees"

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Alex,

More Info here:-

?

?

for Info I was a “Systems Programme” on Honeywell L66 systems with GCOS 3 from around 1977 to 1985 when I moved onto VM/CMS on a 4381.

First at Refuge Assurance where we had a L66/10 mostly running batch with some transaction processing. Almost all Cobol.

Later at NERC Bidston at what was “The Institute of Tides and Coastal Oceanography” where it was almost all time sharing and Fortran.

We had a L66/60 that was upgraded to DPS300 so basically a dual CPU L66.

Very different systems…

?

Dave

?

?

DPS 6 or I think here in the US Level 6 was more of a mini.? The group that did the software in the late 70s had fallen in love with Multics and implemented a lot of their OS utilities inspired by Multics.

I worked for a company, Ultimate that eventually sold more DPS 6 hardware than for any other segment of use for the hardware.? It ran a version of the Pick OS, starting with a WCS version which ran the same Pick assembly, and later hosted a couple of 16 and then 32 bit co-processors running the Pick code with the Level 6 hosting I/O.

But when the fellow doing the firmware for the WCS initial version was working, he had a development system with GCOS running to run an assembler and other Honeywell supplied utilities, and cussed it up one way and down the other.? When I got with him, and having Multics experience I looked at the command line utilities and editor, and it turned out that at the time they'd copied Tom Van Vleck's TED and had a lot of the same utilities for OS functions as Multics did.?

Helped him quite a bit figuring out things, as my Multics "muscle memory" was good to go.

I also heard that as far as Multics and Level 6 here in the US with GCOS, Ford bought a large Multics system, and also planned to use Level 6 extensively.? I understand also that didn't pan out as expected, but involved a lot of hardware and software.

The Multics processor as I understand it was a mostly Honeywell extension of the GE 645 with extra hardware to support Multics Processor functions.? It ran GCOS for the 6000 series processor users, and with an extra box of hardware ran Multics.? Multics also was made to be able to run a GCOS partition to run batch GCOS, and I know on the system we had at USL was used for Cobol classes t the university.

Thanks
Jim

From: [email protected] <[email protected]> On Behalf Of Dave Wade via groups.io
Sent: 04 July 2020 13:09
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [h390-vm] vm/sp 5.5 living computer museum

?

Alex,

?

Oh to be in Spain!

?

I don’t think the DPS6 CPUs have any relationship to Multics. DPS6 was a new mini developed in Ireland I think with a 32bit word

?

They are related to the DPS8. The original Multics CPU was derived from the GE600 CPU but heavily modified to provide protection rings and I believe virtual memory support.

When Honeywell bought GE the GE600 was basically re-badged as the H6000 and core memory replaced with semi-conductor RAM

The Multics version was re-badged the 6180 and some components changed.. I believe not that much of the 6000 CPU was left….

Later it the range was again re-badged L66 with the multics box being L68. The other Honeywell machines were named try and make them feel like a range, but in practice they weren’t.

The DPS 8 was I believe “yet another re-badging of the same CPU” and a change of case.

?

So I understand MULTICS includes some GECOS emulation and will run L66/DPS8 programs.

?

Dave

?

?

?

From: [email protected] <[email protected]> On Behalf Of Alex Garcia via groups.io
Sent: 04 July 2020 12:41
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [h390-vm] vm/sp 5.5 living computer museum

?

Hi Jim,

About Multics and Honeywell, do you know if GCOS8 of DPS8 and/or GCOS6 of DPS6 cpus from HONEYWELL BULL had any relation with Multics?
I worked as system programmer with GCOS6 in the 80s.
Thankyou.
Alex G
Barcelona

On the late eighties DPS8 was a common mainframe in Spain and France.
In 1982, DPS6? was a lower level and in fact there were a 32 bits running GCOS6, and a low end 16 bit cpu with only 1 MB addressable without virtual memory, in other words, equal to a 8086 Intel, but a lot more expensive...

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Hi Jim,

About Multics and Honeywell, do you know if GCOS8 of DPS8 and/or GCOS6 of DPS6 cpus from HONEYWELL BULL had any relation with Multics?
I worked as system programmer with GCOS6 in the 80s.
Thankyou.
Alex G
Barcelona

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thats not completely true...

ssh to menu@...:

[-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-]

?? -+-? living computers? museum + labs ? REMOTE ACCESS? -+-

[-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-]

[a] multics ? ? ? ? ? ? Multics MR12.6f ? ? ? ? Honeywell 6180

[b] toad-2? ? ? ? ? ? ? TOPS-20 7(110131)-1 ? ? XKL TOAD-2

[c] lcm3b2? ? ? ? ? ? ? UNIX SVR3.2.3 ? ? ? ? ? AT&T 3B2/1000-70

[d] cdc6500 ? ? ? ? ? ? NOS 1.3 ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? CDC-6500

[e] lc? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ITS ver 1648? ? ? ? ? ? KA/PDP-6 sn 4

[z] bitzone ? ? ? ? ? ? NetBSD BBS? ? ? ? ? ? ? AMD64

(main) Your choice? (q to quit):?

So ... some systems are running there.

I (very cheerfully) stand corrected.

-- 
Drew Derbyshire

"mad, bad, and dangerous to know"
                        -- Lady Caroline Lamp, referring to Lord Byron

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So ... some systems are running there.

Joe

The people I know aren't.

very sad.

Multics never answered.? That is a beautiful machine.?

It all would be great with the people there to run the place.

thanks
Jim

On 7/3/20 9:57 AM, James Stephens wrote:

The LCM went completely dark with the last staff locked out and
permanently laid off on 7/1.

Pretty much a funeral for it.? No word or indication about what Vulcan
is doing with any such operation it didn't spin off with its own endowment.

If other handling is any indication, the prognosis is grim.

Wish Paul had had some words explicitly in his provisions for some of
this.? His heirs seem to be acting like bean counters rather than
looking after his and the heritage of these institutions.

The passing of a person with money brings out the very worst of
humanity. I've seen this with my own eyes, when only a little bit of
money was involved. This was a LOT of money.

Of course nobody knows what actually happened, but it really doesn't
look good, and it looks very familiar.

-Dave

--
Dave McGuire, AK4HZ
New Kensington, PA

". . .There are not many who remember
They say a handful still survive
To tell the world about
The way the lights went out
And keep the memory alive"
-- Billy Joel

On 7/3/20 6:57 AM, James Stephens wrote:

The LCM went completely dark with the last staff locked out and permanently laid off on 7/1.

Pretty much a funeral for it.? No word or indication about what Vulcan is doing with any such operation it didn't spin off with its own endowment.

If other handling is any indication, the prognosis is grim.

Wish Paul had had some words explicitly in his provisions for some of this.? His heirs seem to be acting like bean counters rather than looking after his and the heritage of these institutions.

ICYMI, the entire division is shut down including (the far better known and popular) Cinerama:



The LCM+L IBM 4361 telnet connection was flaky the last two weeks of June, and as noted above there is no one left to kick it.? Sad, indeed.

More importantly, I see that tty.livingcomputers.org is prompting for SSH passwords for the other (more reliable) systems' gateways.? That looks like an final explicit action to prevent vandalism.

We can only hope the CHM, LSSM, or other someone else adopts some of the orphans.

-ahd-

p.s. (Possibly for the last time) yes, my usual LCM+L disclaimer applies.

--
Drew Derbyshire

"Why do I do this? Three reasons: the pay is good, the scenery changes,
and they let me use explosives." -- "Armageddon"

The LCM went completely dark with the last staff locked out and permanently laid off on 7/1.

Pretty much a funeral for it.? No word or indication about what Vulcan is doing with any such operation it didn't spin off with its own endowment.

If other handling is any indication, the prognosis is grim.

Wish Paul had had some words explicitly in his provisions for some of this.? His heirs seem to be acting like bean counters rather than looking after his and the heritage of these institutions.

I believe it's offline during the pandemic.