Tom, nowhere did I say it could NOT be done.? I was only pointing
out a critical need for the project.? But, you already figured
that out.? That is a good sign.
You should familiarize yourself, if not already, with the CTC
component description.? bitsavers will have those.
There are two approaches you can use to the interface.
- provide an assembler interface callable by the C logic.?
Assumption is that in-line assembler is available.
- make the interface look like a one or more C functions so no
in-line assembler is required.
The advantage of 1 is that it could be reused directly by some
other assembler program in the future.
The advantage of 2 is that it isolates the assembler piece
completely from the C program, however any other program, say in
assembler, must use the same calling conventions to the reusable
logic.
Also, if 2, one of the prerequisites to use of the CTC interface
is that it be compatible with whatever C compiler you are using.?
There are actually more than one floating around.
Very interesting effort.? And it will have some advantages for
the next person wanting to use CTC adapters.
Harold Grovesteen
On 6/22/24 09:57, Tom Chandler wrote:
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
Sir,
Totally agree with you.? I was hoping to create a txtlib of
some type that I could link
my c to for the assemble requirements.? Again, just
starting as a rookie,
but to learn, even if it is you can't do this.
Thank you for your comments and direction.
/cheers
/tomc
On Sat, Jun 22, 2024 at
9:16?AM Harold Grovesteen via <h.grovsteen= [email protected]>
wrote:
At the bottom of the software stack, assembler is
required to initiate the I/O operations.? I know nothing
about what you are trying to do and whether the software
stack you are planning to use can do that.? It will also
need to intercept I/O interruptions triggered by the CTC
device.? And if your software has access to those
capabilities but say SVC's are required.? Again, you hit
assembler.
Above and beyond all of that is a lot of "C" work.? But
without assembler at the bottom it will not work.
It would be nice if there was a high-level interface to
CTC devices.? I am personally unaware of such a solution.?
Use of CTC devices tends to be roll-your-own for each
solution that uses them.? At least that is my experience.?
Anyone else, jump in with more info, please.
Harold Grovesteen
On 6/22/24 08:46, Tom Chandler wrote:
Sir,
I can not answer that as I am just getting
started.? I am trying to using "C" to
communicate with a ctci port.? The ctcsample, gives
some ideas, but leaves
a lot of "holes".
/cheers
/tomc
On Fri, Jun 21, 2024
at 4:21?PM Bertram Moshier via
<herc370390vm= [email protected]>
wrote:
What is the difference between CTCA
and CTCI?
I'm asking as I bought Fish's CTCI
program.? My goal is to allow for offsite backups
using CTCA devices.? They would use Fish's product
to connect the two VM/CE systems via the Internet
or Intranet.
Bertram Moshier?
WB8ERT?
I
downloaded the ctcisample.zip.? Tried to compile
under VM and making
a couple of corrections it compiled.? Does anyone
have sample code
using ctci under VM370.? This is a learning task
for me.
Thank you for any help.
cheers
/tom c
|
Sir, Totally agree with you.? I was hoping to create a txtlib of some type that I could link my c to for the assemble requirements.? Again, just starting as a rookie, but to learn, even if it is you can't do this.
Thank you for your comments and direction.
/cheers /tomc
On Sat, Jun 22, 2024 at 9:16?AM Harold Grovesteen via <h.grovsteen= [email protected]> wrote:
At the bottom of the software stack, assembler is required to
initiate the I/O operations.? I know nothing about what you are
trying to do and whether the software stack you are planning to
use can do that.? It will also need to intercept I/O interruptions
triggered by the CTC device.? And if your software has access to
those capabilities but say SVC's are required.? Again, you hit
assembler.
Above and beyond all of that is a lot of "C" work.? But without
assembler at the bottom it will not work.
It would be nice if there was a high-level interface to CTC
devices.? I am personally unaware of such a solution.? Use of CTC
devices tends to be roll-your-own for each solution that uses
them.? At least that is my experience.? Anyone else, jump in with
more info, please.
Harold Grovesteen
On 6/22/24 08:46, Tom Chandler wrote:
Sir,
I can not answer that as I am just getting started.? I am
trying to using "C" to
communicate with a ctci port.? The ctcsample, gives some
ideas, but leaves
a lot of "holes".
/cheers
/tomc
On Fri, Jun 21, 2024 at
4:21?PM Bertram Moshier via <herc370390vm= [email protected]>
wrote:
What is the difference between CTCA and CTCI?
I'm asking as I bought Fish's CTCI program.?
My goal is to allow for offsite backups using CTCA
devices.? They would use Fish's product to connect the two
VM/CE systems via the Internet or Intranet.
Bertram Moshier?
WB8ERT?
I
downloaded the ctcisample.zip.? Tried to compile under VM
and making
a couple of corrections it compiled.? Does anyone have
sample code
using ctci under VM370.? This is a learning task for me.
Thank you for any help.
cheers
/tom c
|
At the bottom of the software stack, assembler is required to
initiate the I/O operations.? I know nothing about what you are
trying to do and whether the software stack you are planning to
use can do that.? It will also need to intercept I/O interruptions
triggered by the CTC device.? And if your software has access to
those capabilities but say SVC's are required.? Again, you hit
assembler.
Above and beyond all of that is a lot of "C" work.? But without
assembler at the bottom it will not work.
It would be nice if there was a high-level interface to CTC
devices.? I am personally unaware of such a solution.? Use of CTC
devices tends to be roll-your-own for each solution that uses
them.? At least that is my experience.? Anyone else, jump in with
more info, please.
Harold Grovesteen
On 6/22/24 08:46, Tom Chandler wrote:
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
Sir,
I can not answer that as I am just getting started.? I am
trying to using "C" to
communicate with a ctci port.? The ctcsample, gives some
ideas, but leaves
a lot of "holes".
/cheers
/tomc
On Fri, Jun 21, 2024 at
4:21?PM Bertram Moshier via <herc370390vm= [email protected]>
wrote:
What is the difference between CTCA and CTCI?
I'm asking as I bought Fish's CTCI program.?
My goal is to allow for offsite backups using CTCA
devices.? They would use Fish's product to connect the two
VM/CE systems via the Internet or Intranet.
Bertram Moshier?
WB8ERT?
I
downloaded the ctcisample.zip.? Tried to compile under VM
and making
a couple of corrections it compiled.? Does anyone have
sample code
using ctci under VM370.? This is a learning task for me.
Thank you for any help.
cheers
/tom c
|
Sir, I can not answer that as I am just getting started.? I am trying to using "C" to communicate with a ctci port.? The ctcsample, gives some ideas, but leaves a lot of "holes".
/cheers /tomc
On Fri, Jun 21, 2024 at 4:21?PM Bertram Moshier via <herc370390vm= [email protected]> wrote: What is the difference between CTCA and CTCI?
I'm asking as I bought Fish's CTCI program.? My goal is to allow for offsite backups using CTCA devices.? They would use Fish's product to connect the two VM/CE systems via the Internet or Intranet.
Bertram Moshier? WB8ERT?
I downloaded the ctcisample.zip.? Tried to compile under VM and making
a couple of corrections it compiled.? Does anyone have sample code
using ctci under VM370.? This is a learning task for me.
Thank you for any help.
cheers
/tom c
|
What is the difference between CTCA and CTCI?
I'm asking as I bought Fish's CTCI program.? My goal is to allow for offsite backups using CTCA devices.? They would use Fish's product to connect the two VM/CE systems via the Internet or Intranet.
Bertram Moshier? WB8ERT?
I downloaded the ctcisample.zip.? Tried to compile under VM and making
a couple of corrections it compiled.? Does anyone have sample code
using ctci under VM370.? This is a learning task for me.
Thank you for any help.
cheers
/tom c
|
I downloaded the ctcisample.zip.? Tried to compile under VM and making
a couple of corrections it compiled.? Does anyone have sample code
using ctci under VM370.? This is a learning task for me.
Thank you for any help.
cheers
/tom c
|
Re: two quick VM questions
A 'full-blown' GCS comes with a recovery virtual machine, often named 'GCS'.? It is supposed to perform storage cleanup if VTAM would abend.? If your GCS is generated this way, one must start the recovery machine first, other GCS members will refuse to start (probably what you see).? And, in such a case it would be common to have GCS perform the XAUTOLOG RSCS from its PROFILE GCS (and if working with VTAM, that PROFILE would start VTAM before RSCS, or maybe a CP SLEEP in the PROFILE GCS of RSCS so that VTAM is ready when RSCS tries to communicate with it.? A SLEEP i steh PROFILE GCS of GCS isn't a good idea I think: it would be unable to perform work during that time).
Another solution, for systems with RSCS and without VTAM, is to generate a "single member GCS group", only used by RSCS then.? No recovery machine required then.? I don't know by heart how to generate it.? The GCS manual will tell I guess.
As for RSCS console: it depends how ons issues the CP SPPOL CONS START.? If there is no TO xxxx parameter, the console is in the RSCS PRT queue: from MAINT: CP Q PRT RSCS ALL and then TRANS RSCS PRT nnnn TO *
Or get my LISTS package from the download library, there you'll find an URLIST EXEC what gives you a kind of RDRLIST for class D users; makes it easy to overlook the whole spool.? For example URLIST RSCS will display all file in RSCS' RDR, PUN and PRT queues.? You'd enter a TRANS / TO * to get the file in your RDR.
--
Kris Buelens
|
Re: two quick VM questions
On 6/16/24 20:37, Jeff Henry wrote: In SYSTEM CONFIG, you can specify (from memory):
DEVICES Offline_at_IPL addresses
to keep devices offline. Ah-HA! That's what I needed, thank you! Do you have the console log from RSCS? That might have some clues as you why it didn't start up properly. I don't know how to find that log. Is it being accumulated somewhere that's accessible? Thanks, -Dave -- Dave McGuire, AK4HZ New Kensington, PA
|
Re: two quick VM questions
I don't think that's what's happening. GCS is IPLed from autolg exec with the sync keyword, so GCS's IPL will be complete before that command returns. The RSCS IPL comes after (though not directly after) the sync IPL of GCS.
-Dave
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
On 6/16/24 21:40, Matthew T. Kromer wrote: I wonder if he¡¯s auto logging rscs before gcs is up¡
Do you have the console log from RSCS? That might have some clues as you why it didn't start up properly.
On Sun, Jun 16, 2024, 1:29?PM Dave McGuire via groups.io <> <mcguire@... <mailto:[email protected]>> wrote:
? ?Hi folks.? Under VM/ESA, is there a way to effectively do a
"disable
<addr>" at IPL time?? I was thinking of putting it in OPERATOR's
profile
exec, but I have a feeling that there should be a cleaner way.? I'm
trying to disable a 3270-attached printer, if that matters, but I
think
it shouldn't.
? ?Also, I am trying to start RSCS from autolg exec.? This seems
simple
enough, and the entry was already there in the distribution, just
commented out, so it seems plausible to start it that way.? But
when I
do, it refuses messages sent by smsg, saying "RSCS not receiving,
SMSG
off".? But after that, if I "FORCE RSCS" and then "XAUTOLOG RSCS", it
comes up fine.? What gives?
? ?I hope someone can point me in the right direction; I think I'm
missing something simple in both of these issues.
? ? ? ? ? ? ? Thanks,
? ? ? ? ? ? ? -Dave
--
Dave McGuire, AK4HZ
New Kensington, PA
--
Dave McGuire, AK4HZ
New Kensington, PA
|
Re: two quick VM questions
I wonder if he¡¯s auto logging rscs before gcs is up¡
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
Do you have the console log from RSCS? That might have some clues as you why it didn't start up properly.
? ?Hi folks.? Under VM/ESA, is there a way to effectively do a "disable
<addr>" at IPL time?? I was thinking of putting it in OPERATOR's profile
exec, but I have a feeling that there should be a cleaner way.? I'm
trying to disable a 3270-attached printer, if that matters, but I think
it shouldn't.
? ?Also, I am trying to start RSCS from autolg exec.? This seems simple
enough, and the entry was already there in the distribution, just
commented out, so it seems plausible to start it that way.? But when I
do, it refuses messages sent by smsg, saying "RSCS not receiving, SMSG
off".? But after that, if I "FORCE RSCS" and then "XAUTOLOG RSCS", it
comes up fine.? What gives?
? ?I hope someone can point me in the right direction; I think I'm
missing something simple in both of these issues.
? ? ? ? ? ? ? Thanks,
? ? ? ? ? ? ? -Dave
--
Dave McGuire, AK4HZ
New Kensington, PA
|
Re: two quick VM questions
Dave,? In SYSTEM CONFIG, you can specify (from memory):
DEVICES Offline_at_IPL addresses
to keep devices offline. Do you have the console log from RSCS? That might have some clues as you why it didn't start up properly.
? ?Hi folks.? Under VM/ESA, is there a way to effectively do a "disable
<addr>" at IPL time?? I was thinking of putting it in OPERATOR's profile
exec, but I have a feeling that there should be a cleaner way.? I'm
trying to disable a 3270-attached printer, if that matters, but I think
it shouldn't.
? ?Also, I am trying to start RSCS from autolg exec.? This seems simple
enough, and the entry was already there in the distribution, just
commented out, so it seems plausible to start it that way.? But when I
do, it refuses messages sent by smsg, saying "RSCS not receiving, SMSG
off".? But after that, if I "FORCE RSCS" and then "XAUTOLOG RSCS", it
comes up fine.? What gives?
? ?I hope someone can point me in the right direction; I think I'm
missing something simple in both of these issues.
? ? ? ? ? ? ? Thanks,
? ? ? ? ? ? ? -Dave
--
Dave McGuire, AK4HZ
New Kensington, PA
|
Hi folks. Under VM/ESA, is there a way to effectively do a "disable <addr>" at IPL time? I was thinking of putting it in OPERATOR's profile exec, but I have a feeling that there should be a cleaner way. I'm trying to disable a 3270-attached printer, if that matters, but I think it shouldn't.
Also, I am trying to start RSCS from autolg exec. This seems simple enough, and the entry was already there in the distribution, just commented out, so it seems plausible to start it that way. But when I do, it refuses messages sent by smsg, saying "RSCS not receiving, SMSG off". But after that, if I "FORCE RSCS" and then "XAUTOLOG RSCS", it comes up fine. What gives?
I hope someone can point me in the right direction; I think I'm missing something simple in both of these issues.
Thanks,
-Dave
--
Dave McGuire, AK4HZ
New Kensington, PA
|
Re: 3270 printers under VM
I searched for the first version yesterday, but could find it.? I didn't save all my stuff from IECVM1/BRUVMIS1
GUITELL though, that can still be found on VM's download library, or I can send it.? But, I read not too long ago that the CMS/GUI stuff shall be/was removed from CMS.
?https://www.vm.ibm.com/download/packages/descript.cgi?GUITELL
--
Kris Buelens
|
Re: 3270 printers under VM
On June 12, 2024 2:23:43 PM kris.buelens@... wrote: I also created some chatting-like function under CMS, using CMS fullscreen. This way I could chat with my wife while writing a redbook in Poughkeepsie.
And yes (shtt, IBM wasn't aware) I made her logon to IECVM1, while I used a WTSC VM system. Around 1995?
Later, when CMSGUI arrived, during that redbook project, I created a chatting-like thing with CMSGUI to chat with her. 1996, GUITELL Do you still have that code? -Dave -- Dave McGuire, AK4HZ New Kensington, PA
|
Re: 3270 printers under VM
I also created some chatting-like function under CMS, using CMS fullscreen.? This way I could chat with my wife while writing a redbook in Poughkeepsie.
And yes (shtt, IBM wasn't aware) I made her logon to IECVM1, while I used a WTSC VM system.? Around 1995?
Later, when CMSGUI arrived, during that redbook project, I created a chatting-like thing with CMSGUI to chat with her. 1996, GUITELL
--
Kris Buelens
|
Re: 3270 printers under VM
On Tue 11 Jun 2024 at 16:38:24 +0200, Mike Beer wrote: And by adding a comma you could also start to chat
Tell user at IECVM1 hi,
Very long before the internet ?invented? chatting.. Of course, the name "Internet Relay Chat" is fairly obviously a rehash of the "Interchat Relay Network", also known as Relay. A fellow student created a CMS nucleus extension to make chatting via messages a lot nicer. On the one hand it simplified the syntax for sending messages, and on the other hand it captured the received messages and made them print nicer and more compact. -Olaf. -- ___ Olaf 'Rhialto' Seibert <rhialto/at/falu.nl> \X/ There is no AI. There is just someone else's work. --I. Rose
|
Re: 3270 printers under VM
And by adding a comma you could also start to chat ? Tell user at IECVM1 hi, ? Very long before the internet ¡°invented¡± chatting.. ? Kind regards Mike ?
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
From: [email protected] <[email protected]> On Behalf Of kris.buelens@...
Sent: Dienstag, 11. Juni 2024 15:49
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [h390-vm] 3270 printers under VM? There wasn't a use for @ in addresses at the time.? IIRC the @ sign was even defined as chardel, in linemode that is.? Dates from typewrite times.? When you'd type an @, the preceding character was ignored.? In some release the default SYSTEM CONFIG turned LINEDEL and CHARDEL OFF
One could send a message to another VM system using the TELL EXEC? ?
? ?TELL myfriend AT otherVM hello
Or, use the native RSCS commands
? ?CP SMSG RSCS MSG otherVM myfriend hello
The TELL EXEC consulted also "userid NAMES" so your addressee could even be a list of people or a nickname; transparently on the same VM system or via RSCS to a remote VM system
--
Kris Buelens
|
Re: 3270 printers under VM
There wasn't a use for @ in addresses at the time.? IIRC the @ sign was even defined as chardel, in linemode that is.? Dates from typewrite times.? When you'd type an @, the preceding character was ignored.? In some release the default SYSTEM CONFIG turned LINEDEL and CHARDEL OFF
One could send a message to another VM system using the TELL EXEC? ?
? ?TELL myfriend AT otherVM hello
Or, use the native RSCS commands
? ?CP SMSG RSCS MSG otherVM myfriend hello
The TELL EXEC consulted also "userid NAMES" so your addressee could even be a list of people or a nickname; transparently on the same VM system or via RSCS to a remote VM system
--
Kris Buelens
|
Re: 3270 printers under VM
On 6/10/24 16:41, Tony Harminc wrote: Speaking of VMS (not a typo) and RSCS, whatever happened to JNET from Joiner Associates? It ran on VMS and talked NJE to RSCS (or JES2 NJE). Does the company or the product still exist - surely not...? Looks as though there is some doc on the moshix github claiming in 1992 it was from "Wingra Technologies", which I'd never heard of.
Of course I realize there have been several modern implementations of the NJE protocols for various platforms, but is there one for VMS? There were several implementations for VMS. JNET in particular has been recovered, and some people have succeeded, recently, in getting it running. We'll be working on it at LSSM likely later this week. FWIW I'd never heard of Wingra Technologies either, but that name is what's in the JNET documentation, for at least v3.5. There was another implementation, by a university in Israel. That one has been recovered as well. The redoubtable Moshix has ported it to Linux. I've not yet tried it out. Definitely interesting stuff. -Dave -- Dave McGuire, AK4HZ New Kensington, PA
|
Re: 3270 printers under VM
? ?Whereas I, coming from other areas of the industry (DEC, Cray, Sun)
am just now learning these simple things in the IBM world.? Man RSCS is
powerful.
? ?You can always come over to LSSM to "scratch the itch" if you like.
Real iron, up and running.
? ?I see below that I mentioned "get VMS to be able to print"...So that
was probably my fingers autocorrecting CMS to VMS, as I type "VMS" a lot
more often than I type "CMS"!? There should've been laws against
products in the industry with such similar names. ;)
Speaking of VMS (not a typo) and RSCS, whatever
happened to JNET from Joiner Associates? It ran on VMS and talked NJE
to RSCS (or JES2 NJE). Does the company or the product still exist -
surely not...? Looks as though there is some doc on the moshix github
claiming in 1992 it was from "Wingra Technologies", which I'd never
heard of.
Of course I realize there have been
several modern implementations of the NJE protocols for various
platforms, but is there one for VMS?
Tony H.?
|
Dave McGuire