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Re: Configuration for converting 1963 Mercury outboard to electric?

Let's assume 24hp is good for 'cruising speed'? That's 18kW at the prop, but considering drivetrain losses, let's go with 20kW input.? The real number is probably higher.

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So 20kWh of battery will get you that one hour of cruising.? Using LFP chemistry, your battery weight will be around 250lb.

Configuration for converting 1963 Mercury outboard to electric?

#32739

I’m in the process of building a combination hydroplane/jetski (1988 Popular Mechanics plans) which calls for a 35 hp outboard maximum. ?I have an old outboard which needs work so I thought I’d look at converting it to electric. ?Space and weight capacity are at a premium because it is a small boat. ?I’m looking at a ME1616 from Thunderstruck as the motor but have not committed to this. ?Trying to also figure the minimum battery configuration to be able to plane and run for say an hour. ?Input appreciated. ?Is this even feasible given current technology? ?Thanks.

Re: I just bought a battery capacity/load tester

#32738

Peter,

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I send you a longer reply directly. ?Don't know why you can't find me, 'cause I've been mostly lurking here for years.

My short answer is that the little, inexpensive device will work, even at 150 watts, but with that, the discharge rate is *much* lower than the EVE-specified standard test discharge rate of 1/2 C. ?Testing each cell will end up taking nearly 7 hours with your device, so you'll need a lot of patience.

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I used devices and software from WestMountinRadio.com that enabled me to test at 1/2C and give me a cool chart for each cell showing the discharge profile. ?It's remarkable how long LiFePO4 cells sit at right around 3.3v to 3.2v while discharging, showing steep drops at the start and end of the discharge cycle.

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Best of luck with your project!

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[-tv]

Re: I just bought a battery capacity/load tester

#32737

Hi Thomas,? I absolutely would be very interested in the specifics. Unfortunately, don't know your email address and can't find you in the "Directory". Can you reply with your email address, or, here is mine (pqknowlton@...) and you can send it directly to me. Thanks so much. Peter?

Re: I just bought a battery capacity/load tester

#32736

I bought one of those too, a while back.

It will NOT do what I understand you're wanting to do with it.? More specially, it will work, but it will take waaaaay too long per cell.

Email me directly if you want specifics on how I individually capacity tested my pack of 16 EVE 280ah battery cells.

[-tv]

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I just bought a battery capacity/load tester

#32735

Just bought attached battery capacity/load tester. However, just noticed that it says:

Two power supply methods: 1. DC6-12V DC5.0 power supply; 2. DC6-12V Micro USB power supply.The body discharge power cannot exceed 150W, otherwise there is a risk of burnout.

I am a novice so I have to ask this question but only need a short answer: Will this accurately test 3.2v Eve cells?

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Thanks.

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Peter

Re: throttle control

#32734

I have used a number of alltrax ?controllers in golf carts and they can be set up to use a 0-5k ohm potentiometer, or other throttle setups but that is the most common and lowest tech.

You should be able to find the info on the Alltrax instructions, they used to have extensive documentation on their website.?

you would simply hook your throttle up to the proper terminals on the controller and a separate switch for forward/reverse.?

making your throttle run like a boat with a center off, forward by moving the lever forward of center and reverse by moving the lever back of center would probably be a complicated project. ?Doable but I don’t know how off the top of my head.?

Re: controller for torqueedo crusie 2.0 motor

#32733
Edited

"The electronics on my Torqeedo Cruise 2.0? suddenly died--that is the display on the throttle went dead. The battery is fully charged, and I checked all the connections. I hope the motor itself still works, so I'd like to buy a new controller. Does anyone know what kind of motor it is? There are only two power cables going into the motor. Does that mean it is a DC motor?"

What year is your Cruise 2.0? I think for all years, the display on the throttle is not the controller, It's just the throttle, and a display to show you info from the head of the outboard assembly, which has the GPS in it which tells you the speed etc. The actual motor controller in down in the pod with the motor.?

Therefore, the two big wires going down to the motor and controller in the pylon ( that's what torqeedo calls the motor pod) carry the 29.6v from the battery down to the controller, which then controls the motor. On my (really old) 2.0, it has another wire from the throttle down to the controller that gives it the speed asked for by the throttle.?

The controller is built into the pylon, so that it carries heat out to the water by way of the aluminum part of the pylon that holds the motor, gearbox and controller.?
The motor is a 3-phase permanent magnet brushless DC motor. In this style of motor, the controller uses the DC voltage to make a 3-phase sine wave that varies its frequency to make the motor go different speeds. You cannot just give the big wires more or less voltage, that motor will not work that way, it has to have a sophisticated controller.?

That said, if your display is not showing anything, it is more likely that you have a bad connection than anything else. Unfortunately I do not know these motors well enough to effectively diagnose one, especially over email.?
If you can find someone with a similar motor, maybe you can swap out the theottle, or maybe you can clean the contacts for the plug, or if you're bold you can even disassemble things a bit to test if there is a broken wire in the cable.?
If yours is the mid-age model, Torqeedo will likely still be able to help you with it, they have service centers around the country who could probably diagnose it. Mine is too old, they don't have parts and won't even talk to me about giving me service information about it. As such, I have taken it apart and am planning on replacing the controller with one that I can get parts for. It will be large and therefore will have to be mounted up top of the motor instead of inside the pylon, possibly with a cooling fan. I got a generic controller from Kelly Controller, but you might have success with one built for a radio controlled airplane motor. The biggest hurdle so far is figuring out where and how to wire in the position sensors, the ones in the stock controller are too built in and are impossible to access and use. There are controllers that don’t use sensors and they can work but I’m not sure if the trade offs.?

If you poke around on the internet a bit you can find people who have had the same problem and may have some useful tricks to use to diagnose and clean/repair the connections. There is a torqeedo group on Facebook that has some smart people on it.?
Sorry I don't have better news.?

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Anton

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controller for torqueedo crusie 2.0 motor

#32732

The electronics on my Torqeedo Cruise 2.0? suddenly died--that is the display on the throttle went dead. The battery is fully charged, and I checked all the connections.

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I hope the motor itself still works, so I'd like to buy a new controller. Does anyone know what kind of motor it is? There are only two power cables going into the motor. Does that mean it is a DC motor?

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PS I would recommend not buying Torqeedo products. Mine has been nothing but trouble. The original motor had a leak and water got in. Torqeedo replaced it after a year of arguing. Then the electronics died. I got maybe 10-20 hours of total use from the motor.

Re: Cells seem to have stopped increasing voltage when balancing

#32731

Thanks Bob. I will check that out.

Re: Cells seem to have stopped increasing voltage when balancing

#32730

Peter.

You're balancing a batch if cells identical to the ones I recently finished capacity testing, recharging, and balancing as my new pack.

My ThunderStruck chargers and related monitoring gear were already installed on the boat, so on my test/work bench at home, all I had to use to recharge each cell after drawing it down were a 300 watt variable voltage power supply, and a 12vdc, 30 amp Lipo charger.

My target pre-install balance voltage for each cell was 3.55v starting from just under 3.00v.

My work flow for each cell was to do a discharge test (end state of ~2.7v recovering to ~3.0v) and use the variable power supply to bring the cell up 3.2v or so while the next cell was being discharged.? As each cell completed that cycle, I connected it in parallel with the previous cell such that I had 4 cells at roughly the same 3.2v.? After the four cells had some time to balance to one another (checking each cell with a good multimeter), I reconnected them into 12v series and attached my 30amp, 12v Lipo charger.? The 30a charger pumped more watts per cell than my 300 watt variable power supply could.

Once the cells were just over my target voltage, I took the 4-pack apart and reconnected them in parallel once more.? The next 4 cells went the same way, then I had 8 cells in parallel at my target, and so on thru the 16 cells.

If you don't have access to a 30+amp charger running at 48+volts, and are limited as I was to a low-watts power supply, or a 12v 30amp charger, then grouping them into 12v packs can take less time.

Whether discharging or charging, these cells will sit at around 3 3vdc for most of the cycle.? The like all Lipo cells, the discharge curve is quite flat between about 15% SOC and 90% SOC.

It's important to closely monitor each cell individually while charging to avoid exceeding 3.65v.? Once they get to ~3.55v they can climb pretty quickly to max allowable.

The equipment you're using is different than mine, and it seems youbare starting from a higher SOC for each cell than I was in my process.? So you'll have to make appropriate adjustments.

Be safe; have fun!!

[-tv]

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Re: Cells seem to have stopped increasing voltage when balancing

#32729

A FLIR infrared cam on your smartphone could easily show temperature differences during charging.

I have a small thing called FLIRONE PRO. Very efficient, very useful. Snaps into the USB-C gate on your phone.

On Monday, 14 October 2024 at 06:11:26 CEST, bobkart <couch45@...> wrote:

It doesn't seem like that will speed things up.? The same amount of energy needs to go into the battery with either approach.? Sure, you'll see one four-pack get there more quickly.? But getting all sixteen cells full will not go more quickly.? It will go a bit more slowly due to the regrouping of cells (and self-discharge on four-packs not being charged).

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I suspect you could use more power.? In the other thread, I suggested MeanWell's RSP-500-4.? Yes it costs more.? It's a spend-more or wait-longer tradeoff.? Not counting delivery time for the better charger.

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Another possibility is that you have damaged-cell issues.? You may want to check for one or more cells being warmer than the others.? They could be 'sinking' current.? Although at the low level you're charging, you might not be able to tell the difference just by touching them.? At 100A the difference would be more obvious.

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Re: Cells seem to have stopped increasing voltage when balancing

#32728

It doesn't seem like that will speed things up.? The same amount of energy needs to go into the battery with either approach.? Sure, you'll see one four-pack get there more quickly.? But getting all sixteen cells full will not go more quickly.? It will go a bit more slowly due to the regrouping of cells (and self-discharge on four-packs not being charged).

?

I suspect you could use more power.? In the other thread, I suggested MeanWell's RSP-500-4.? Yes it costs more.? It's a spend-more or wait-longer tradeoff.? Not counting delivery time for the better charger.

?

Another possibility is that you have damaged-cell issues.? You may want to check for one or more cells being warmer than the others.? They could be 'sinking' current.? Although at the low level you're charging, you might not be able to tell the difference just by touching them.? At 100A the difference would be more obvious.

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Re: Cells seem to have stopped increasing voltage when balancing

#32727

After doing this balancing for about 10 days and still a long way from 3.65v , and doing some more research, I am wondering about splitting the 16 batteries up into groups of 4 and then charging them, with a 12v LifePo4 charger,  to 3.55v, which will take about an hour or two for each group of 4, which are now at 3.310. Then top balancing them to 3.65v. From what I have read LiFePo4 batteries flatline and increase a tiny bit at a time, until they get close to the target voltage, 3.65v, and then the balancing happens a lot quicker. The batteries are at 3.310 now, and they were at 3.27v ten days ago. If charging them in groups of 4 to 3.55v and then putting the 16  back in parallel to balance to 3.65 is an acceptable method I will do it and it will save me a lot of time and accomplish the same thing. I hope. Whatever thoughts you have would be appreciated.  Thanks in advance.

Peter

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