Re: vacuum chamber advice
Ah yes, thanks Drew, I see the difference in that flange. The second one I posted last night looks a bit simpler and has an 8" CF on each end. It's this one:
I would probably want to put a blank on one end and use that for the bottom, and a view port on the top, then plumb the 2.75" CF on the side down to the pumping system.
What do you think?
Thanks,
-Dave
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
On 6/16/22 11:34, eosraptor1 wrote: It looks ok except for that top most interface.? with only 4 bolts across what looks to be 6" dia I am not sure that is a "fitting" interface.? It may be expecting to be bolted down to a thick plate like the top of a cart that holds your vacuum system.
I will look thru my collection of stuff for that flange in case you get that thing.
Drew
On Thu, Jun 16, 2022 at 12:11 AM Dave McGuire <mcguire@... <mailto:mcguire@...>> wrote:
? ?Hello learned colleagues, I'm hoping to pick your brains for a
little
advice.? I am trying to put together a small vacuum system for basic
experimentation/exploration/education with plasmas of various sorts.? I
have a line on a small molecular drag pump with some accessories,
and am
now looking for a suitable chamber.? I just found this on eBay:
<>
? ?With its various flanges and such, it looks to be flexible
enough for
my very basic needs.? I would, of course, try to talk the seller
down a bit.
? ?However, I am a neophyte when it comes to chambers, fittings,
etc.? I
know just enough to get into trouble.? I see what appears to be at
least
one conflat fitting, etc.? What I'm looking for here is a basic "yes,
that'll do" or "no, don't buy this".? Like "you'll never find something
to fit that flange", etc type of real-world advice.
? ?I'd like to plumb some pumps into it, put in a couple of electrical
feed-throughs, that sort of thing.
? ?Opinions?
? ? ? ? ? ?Thanks,
? ? ? ? ? ?-Dave
--
Dave McGuire, AK4HZ
New Kensington, PA
--
Dave McGuire, AK4HZ
New Kensington, PA
|
Re: vacuum chamber advice
Dave,
It looks ok except for that top most interface.? with only 4 bolts across what looks to be 6" dia I am not sure that is a "fitting" interface.? It may be expecting to be bolted down to a thick plate like the top of a cart that holds your vacuum system.??
I will look thru my collection of stuff for that flange in case you get that thing.??
Drew?
On Thu, Jun 16, 2022 at 12:11 AM Dave McGuire < mcguire@...> wrote:
? ?Hello learned colleagues, I'm hoping to pick your brains for a little
advice.? I am trying to put together a small vacuum system for basic
experimentation/exploration/education with plasmas of various sorts.? I
have a line on a small molecular drag pump with some accessories, and am
now looking for a suitable chamber.? I just found this on eBay:
? ?
? ?With its various flanges and such, it looks to be flexible enough for
my very basic needs.? I would, of course, try to talk the seller down a bit.
? ?However, I am a neophyte when it comes to chambers, fittings, etc.? I
know just enough to get into trouble.? I see what appears to be at least
one conflat fitting, etc.? What I'm looking for here is a basic "yes,
that'll do" or "no, don't buy this".? Like "you'll never find something
to fit that flange", etc type of real-world advice.
? ?I'd like to plumb some pumps into it, put in a couple of electrical
feed-throughs, that sort of thing.
? ?Opinions?
? ? ? ? ? ?Thanks,
? ? ? ? ? ?-Dave
--
Dave McGuire, AK4HZ
New Kensington, PA
|
Re: vacuum chamber advice
Hello Dave, funny you mention this...? I finally got my cart (old Beckman ultracentrifuge over to TX from NM.? Yeah, it's still on the trailer, but I have to clean it off to haul back there at the mighty 4th to try and finish my move to San Antonio and sell the house (it's only been since Aug 2017 that I started moving).? Super heavy duty cart.? Even after I removed the reefer unit and drive motor assembly (bearing had failed and leaked oil all over), roughing pump, diff pump, control panel/top, top sliding door plate assembly, electronics, the thing still weighs over 400#.? I think I am going to try to block off the hole in the bottom of the chamber and reassemble it to use as a vacuum chamber.? The outer ring has a Hastings type TC gauge in it already.? Probably don't need the 1.5" thick explosion shield ring that sits inside that but until I need it for something else I think it will be just fine where it sits now.? I plan to reinstall the Welch Duo-Seal (1 of 3 I have) as the roughing pump or use the Edwards RV one I have, and then use a small turbo setup I picked up off ebay (if it works).? Have a couple of MKS Loadlock pressure sensors for the system, and a few KF25 valves.?
I bought (I think) a nice TC gauge with a bunch of tubes at auction from Bentley's in Albuquerque along with a ~30L dewar, about fifty 5C collets and around 50 slitting saws.? A friend picked them up for me and I plan to drive up there from Las Cruces week of the 4th to pick it all up.
Diff pump was assembled to the housing with a flange and o-ring with thumb screws which I will need to adapt to the ISO63 (?) flange on the turbo.? Was looking at a cross that is ISO/KF63 straight through and a couple of KF25 on the side.? But there is no window in the top plate, which I'd like to have but might interfere with being able to use the slide mechanism to open and close it (assuming I am able to reassemble what I took apart before).
I mostly want a system to pump down tubes for lasers, neon and maybe in some crazy time try my hand at vac tubes or nixies.? And eventually maybe a fusor.? Still need to test the newer mill, Bridgeport 2J2 but I now have a horizontal attachment for it.
What I've been advised is to go with KF type fittings using centering rings and o-rings instead of conflat, as they are reusable versus the conflat copper washers.
On Wed, Jun 15, 2022 at 11:11 PM Dave McGuire < mcguire@...> wrote:
? ?Hello learned colleagues, I'm hoping to pick your brains for a little
advice.? I am trying to put together a small vacuum system for basic
experimentation/exploration/education with plasmas of various sorts.? I
have a line on a small molecular drag pump with some accessories, and am
now looking for a suitable chamber.? I just found this on eBay:
? ?
? ?With its various flanges and such, it looks to be flexible enough for
my very basic needs.? I would, of course, try to talk the seller down a bit.
? ?However, I am a neophyte when it comes to chambers, fittings, etc.? I
know just enough to get into trouble.? I see what appears to be at least
one conflat fitting, etc.? What I'm looking for here is a basic "yes,
that'll do" or "no, don't buy this".? Like "you'll never find something
to fit that flange", etc type of real-world advice.
? ?I'd like to plumb some pumps into it, put in a couple of electrical
feed-throughs, that sort of thing.
? ?Opinions?
? ? ? ? ? ?Thanks,
? ? ? ? ? ?-Dave
--
Dave McGuire, AK4HZ
New Kensington, PA
|
Or perhaps:
That one seems a bit simpler. I see 8" conflat blanks and gaskets aren't absurdly expensive.
-Dave
--
Dave McGuire, AK4HZ
New Kensington, PA
|
Hello learned colleagues, I'm hoping to pick your brains for a little advice. I am trying to put together a small vacuum system for basic experimentation/exploration/education with plasmas of various sorts. I have a line on a small molecular drag pump with some accessories, and am now looking for a suitable chamber. I just found this on eBay:
With its various flanges and such, it looks to be flexible enough for my very basic needs. I would, of course, try to talk the seller down a bit.
However, I am a neophyte when it comes to chambers, fittings, etc. I know just enough to get into trouble. I see what appears to be at least one conflat fitting, etc. What I'm looking for here is a basic "yes, that'll do" or "no, don't buy this". Like "you'll never find something to fit that flange", etc type of real-world advice.
I'd like to plumb some pumps into it, put in a couple of electrical feed-throughs, that sort of thing.
Opinions?
Thanks,
-Dave
--
Dave McGuire, AK4HZ
New Kensington, PA
|
On 5/22/22 11:53, eosraptor1 wrote: you work too much bud...... No argument there, but I have little choice. I have proof the universal electronics gremlins?hate me..... right now I am seeing my warp drive thruster suck power out of a digital HV power supply that is turned off and powered down.? So either a turned off thruster is generating power while still somehow making thrust or there are a bunch of electrical gremlins?laughing their butts off at me from inside the chamber. ?Either way I got no explanation for what is going on.? I used to think making propellantless thrust was going to be the hardest thing to do.... turns out that turning the damn thing off is way more difficult.? I sooooooo hate electronics stuff. Oh you could so master it if you felt like it. Sounds like you're having serious fun, though! -Dave -- Dave McGuire, AK4HZ New Kensington, PA
|
you work too much bud...... I have proof the universal electronics gremlins?hate me..... right now I am seeing my warp drive thruster suck power out of a digital HV power supply that is turned off and powered down.? So either a turned off thruster is generating power while still somehow making thrust or there are a bunch of electrical gremlins?laughing their butts off at me from inside the chamber.? ?Either way I got no explanation for what is going on.? I used to think making propellantless thrust was going to be the hardest thing to do.... turns out that turning the damn thing off is way more difficult.? I sooooooo hate electronics stuff.? ?
On Sun, May 22, 2022 at 11:41 AM Dave McGuire < mcguire@...> wrote: On 5/22/22 11:38, eosraptor1 wrote:
> if you get bored and want a commission, I will buy it off you once you
> get it working :_)))))
? ?I run two companies and a public museum...I never get bored.
Exhausted, pretty much all the time, but never bored.? I took on the
Amray 1200 restoration project because I was desperate for a change of pace.
? ?The one I'd like to re-home is an ETEC Autoscan.? It's a wonderful
instrument, and I had it running years ago, but it's fairly large and my
lab is full.
> I really do not like electronics as they hate me.
? ?Nah, electronics loves you! :-)
? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?-Dave
--
Dave McGuire, AK4HZ
New Kensington, PA
|
On 5/22/22 11:38, eosraptor1 wrote: if you get bored and want a commission, I will buy it off you once you get it working :_))))) I run two companies and a public museum...I never get bored. Exhausted, pretty much all the time, but never bored. I took on the Amray 1200 restoration project because I was desperate for a change of pace. The one I'd like to re-home is an ETEC Autoscan. It's a wonderful instrument, and I had it running years ago, but it's fairly large and my lab is full. I really do not like electronics as they hate me. Nah, electronics loves you! :-) -Dave -- Dave McGuire, AK4HZ New Kensington, PA
|
if you get bored and want a commission, I will buy it off you once you get it working :_)))))
I really do not like electronics as they hate me.??
Drew?
On Sun, May 22, 2022 at 10:44 AM Dave McGuire < mcguire@...> wrote:
? I do have another one that I'd like to send on to a new home, but it probably needs more electronics work than you'd be up for, if I remember your aversion to "sparkies" correctly! ;)
? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? -Dave
On May 20, 2022 3:43:56 PM "eosraptor1" <eosraptor@...> wrote:
> very cool.? Now I want one :_)))))
>
> On Fri, May 20, 2022 at 1:02 PM Dave McGuire <mcguire@...> wrote:
>
>> On 4/23/22 18:32, Dave McGuire wrote:
>>> Besides, this is a bit of an antique instrument, and I'd really like
>>> to get it working in its original configuration.? And further, I've
>>> never used a turbo pump before, so there's that "n00b factor" too...I
>>> don't even really know how to shop for one.
>>
>> Just following up on this (in bad form replying to my own message
>> ;))...The attached photo tells the story!
>>
>>? ? ? ? -Dave
>>
>> --
>> Dave McGuire, AK4HZ
>> New Kensington, PA
>
>
>
--
Dave McGuire, AK4HZ
New Kensington, PA
|
I do have another one that I'd like to send on to a new home, but it probably needs more electronics work than you'd be up for, if I remember your aversion to "sparkies" correctly! ;) -Dave On May 20, 2022 3:43:56 PM "eosraptor1" <eosraptor@...> wrote: very cool. Now I want one :_)))))
On Fri, May 20, 2022 at 1:02 PM Dave McGuire <mcguire@...> wrote:
On 4/23/22 18:32, Dave McGuire wrote:
Besides, this is a bit of an antique instrument, and I'd really like
to get it working in its original configuration. And further, I've
never used a turbo pump before, so there's that "n00b factor" too...I
don't even really know how to shop for one. Just following up on this (in bad form replying to my own message
;))...The attached photo tells the story!
-Dave
--
Dave McGuire, AK4HZ
New Kensington, PA
-- Dave McGuire, AK4HZ New Kensington, PA
|
Thanks! It's been tedious, but worthwhile. Now for a hundred little adjustments and optimizations. -Dave On May 20, 2022 3:22:38 PM "Dave" <dgrove@...> wrote: It's alive, nicely done!
----- Original Message -----
From: "Dave McGuire" <mcguire@...>
To: [email protected]
Sent: Friday, May 20, 2022 10:02:08 AM
Subject: Re: [VacuumX] vacuum wax help?
On 4/23/22 18:32, Dave McGuire wrote:
Besides, this is a bit of an antique instrument, and I'd really like
to get it working in its original configuration. And further, I've
never used a turbo pump before, so there's that "n00b factor" too...I
don't even really know how to shop for one. Just following up on this (in bad form replying to my own message
;))...The attached photo tells the story!
-Dave
--
Dave McGuire, AK4HZ
New Kensington, PA
-- Dave McGuire, AK4HZ New Kensington, PA
|
very cool.? Now I want one :_)))))
On Fri, May 20, 2022 at 1:02 PM Dave McGuire < mcguire@...> wrote: On 4/23/22 18:32, Dave McGuire wrote:
>? ? Besides, this is a bit of an antique instrument, and I'd really like
> to get it working in its original configuration.? And further, I've
> never used a turbo pump before, so there's that "n00b factor" too...I
> don't even really know how to shop for one.
? ?Just following up on this (in bad form replying to my own message
;))...The attached photo tells the story!
? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? -Dave
--
Dave McGuire, AK4HZ
New Kensington, PA
|
It's alive, nicely done!
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
----- Original Message ----- From: "Dave McGuire" <mcguire@...> To: [email protected]Sent: Friday, May 20, 2022 10:02:08 AM Subject: Re: [VacuumX] vacuum wax help? On 4/23/22 18:32, Dave McGuire wrote: ? Besides, this is a bit of an antique instrument, and I'd really like
to get it working in its original configuration.? And further, I've
never used a turbo pump before, so there's that "n00b factor" too...I
don't even really know how to shop for one. Just following up on this (in bad form replying to my own message ;))...The attached photo tells the story! -Dave -- Dave McGuire, AK4HZ New Kensington, PA
|
On 4/23/22 18:32, Dave McGuire wrote: ? Besides, this is a bit of an antique instrument, and I'd really like to get it working in its original configuration.? And further, I've never used a turbo pump before, so there's that "n00b factor" too...I don't even really know how to shop for one. Just following up on this (in bad form replying to my own message ;))...The attached photo tells the story! -Dave -- Dave McGuire, AK4HZ New Kensington, PA
|
Re: TIF 9100V Vacuum Pump Problem
Hello? Christopher, I think your in the right place.?My next project is a vacuum chamber for putting the aluminum coating on amateur telescope mirrors. I have (2) old Varian pumps,? a 1400 and 700, several defusion pumps.? For the chamber I have an old water tank,? it's about 44 inches across. ?I'm just just so busy,? I've been gathering parts for over a year.? Thanks Charles Cline?
On Sun, Apr 24, 2022 at 11:20 AM, Brian Whatcott <betwys1@...> wrote:
It is easy to suppose that the inlet valve is leaking. This may be a spring steel flap? valve, where some dust particle might hold it off from sealing. I don't see an alternative to inspecting this valve surface, unfortunately.? A person skilled in that art might know a way to penetrate a solvent into the area, then thoroughly drain it, so as to flush out particles.
Good luck!
Brian Whatcott? Altus OK
On Sunday, April 24, 2022, 03:35:29 AM CDT, ebrucehunter via groups.io <brucekareen@...> wrote:
As a retired electronic engineer, I have had at least a casual interest in both high-vacuum and mechanically-pumped vacuum techniques.
?
Recently I ran into a vacuum problem with my TIF 9100V vacuum pump while pumping down the air-conditioning system of a Volvo.? Rather than the fault being in the pump, it seems to be a leak between the isolation valve and vacuum port of the system, as when the vacuum port is capped and the isolation valve closed, the six vacuum led indicators rather quickly go out (the vacuum gauge is connected between the valve and port).
?
As this pumping system is mechanically complex to disassemble, I thought it wise to ask an appropriate interest group if members have encountered, diagnosed, and solved this problem.? But searching , I could not locate any professional HVAC groups.? Thus I was led to your vacuum group.? I hope this is not off-topic for this group
?
Regards,
?
Bruce Hunter
Mill Valley, CA
|
Re: TIF 9100V Vacuum Pump Problem
It is easy to suppose that the inlet valve is leaking. This may be a spring steel flap? valve, where some dust particle might hold it off from sealing. I don't see an alternative to inspecting this valve surface, unfortunately.? A person skilled in that art might know a way to penetrate a solvent into the area, then thoroughly drain it, so as to flush out particles.
Good luck!
Brian Whatcott? Altus OK
On Sunday, April 24, 2022, 03:35:29 AM CDT, ebrucehunter via groups.io <brucekareen@...> wrote:
As a retired electronic engineer, I have had at least a casual interest in both high-vacuum and mechanically-pumped vacuum techniques.
?
Recently I ran into a vacuum problem with my TIF 9100V vacuum pump while pumping down the air-conditioning system of a Volvo.? Rather than the fault being in the pump, it seems to be a leak between the isolation valve and vacuum port of the system, as when the vacuum port is capped and the isolation valve closed, the six vacuum led indicators rather quickly go out (the vacuum gauge is connected between the valve and port).
?
As this pumping system is mechanically complex to disassemble, I thought it wise to ask an appropriate interest group if members have encountered, diagnosed, and solved this problem.? But searching , I could not locate any professional HVAC groups.? Thus I was led to your vacuum group.? I hope this is not off-topic for this group
?
Regards,
?
Bruce Hunter
Mill Valley, CA
|
Re: TIF 9100V Vacuum Pump Problem
Christopher and other members of this group,
I apologize for sending my stumbling inquiry about an A/C pump to this group.? I did so only because the group's core interest was not obvious from the masthead.
Nevertheless, I've had an interest in high vacuum techniques beginning as a youngster when constructing apparatus to generate microwaves at 100 GHz on a hobby basis.? In the late 1950's a researcher at Bell Laboratories developed an improved silicon material for diode frequency multipliers operating in that range.? I wrote and tried to beg a sample, but was told Bell Labs policies limited such distributions to educational institutions.? However, the researcher provided a detailed procedure for how I could create my own by evaporating a molecular layer of phosphorus on a silicon substrate.? I was in the midst of trying to figure out how to assemble the apparatus to do this when I was offered another position that totally consumed my free time and thought.
Later, my career later led to an involvement with high power transmitting vacuum tubes costing in the $100k range where vacuum maintenance was very important.? An interesting recollection was that one manufacturer shared their cost for electrical power to bake out one such type for months was in the $10k range.? This tube sold for about $100k.?
Now at 84, I probably will probably not be utilizing high-vacuum apparatus; however, I enjoy reading about the adventures and accomplishments of others.? So, thanks for allowing me to join this group.
Bruce Hunter
Mill Valley, California
|
Re: TIF 9100V Vacuum Pump Problem
On 24/4/22 6:40 pm, Christopher Erickson wrote: I am not sure this group is an ideal fit. Here we are fixated on vacuum?chambers for metal coating processes of telescope mirrors and such. MUCH higher vacuum levels than what AC units need. For anyone in Australia, i've got a vacuum chamber with thermostat heating (vacuum drying chamber with hinged door and glass window), and 2 or 3 vane pumps surplus. Can give more details.
|
Re: TIF 9100V Vacuum Pump Problem
At least you can replace your pump for around $150. Our pumps are more in the multiple thousands or even tens-of-thousands range. "Always take the high road. There's less traffic."
-Christopher EricksonObservatory Engineer Summit Kinetics Waikoloa, Hawaii On Sat, Apr 23, 2022 at 10:40 PM Christopher Erickson via <christopher.k.erickson= [email protected]> wrote:
I am not sure this group is an ideal fit. Here we are fixated on vacuum?chambers for metal coating processes of telescope mirrors and such. MUCH higher vacuum levels than what AC units need. "Always take the high road. There's less traffic."
-Christopher EricksonObservatory Engineer Summit Kinetics Waikoloa, Hawaii
On Sat, Apr 23, 2022 at 10:35 PM ebrucehunter via <Brucekareen= [email protected]> wrote: As a retired electronic engineer, I have had at least a casual interest in both high-vacuum and mechanically-pumped vacuum techniques.
?
Recently I ran into a vacuum problem with my TIF 9100V vacuum pump while pumping down the air-conditioning system of a Volvo.? Rather than the fault being in the pump, it seems to be a leak between the isolation valve and vacuum port of the system, as when the vacuum port is capped and the isolation valve closed, the six vacuum led indicators rather quickly go out (the vacuum gauge is connected between the valve and port).
?
As this pumping system is mechanically complex to disassemble, I thought it wise to ask an appropriate interest group if members have encountered, diagnosed, and solved this problem.? But searching , I could not locate any professional HVAC groups.? Thus I was led to your vacuum group.? I hope this is not off-topic for this group
?
Regards,
?
Bruce Hunter
Mill Valley, CA
|
Re: TIF 9100V Vacuum Pump Problem
I am not sure this group is an ideal fit. Here we are fixated on vacuum?chambers for metal coating processes of telescope mirrors and such. MUCH higher vacuum levels than what AC units need. "Always take the high road. There's less traffic."
-Christopher EricksonObservatory Engineer Summit Kinetics Waikoloa, Hawaii
On Sat, Apr 23, 2022 at 10:35 PM ebrucehunter via <Brucekareen= [email protected]> wrote: As a retired electronic engineer, I have had at least a casual interest in both high-vacuum and mechanically-pumped vacuum techniques.
?
Recently I ran into a vacuum problem with my TIF 9100V vacuum pump while pumping down the air-conditioning system of a Volvo.? Rather than the fault being in the pump, it seems to be a leak between the isolation valve and vacuum port of the system, as when the vacuum port is capped and the isolation valve closed, the six vacuum led indicators rather quickly go out (the vacuum gauge is connected between the valve and port).
?
As this pumping system is mechanically complex to disassemble, I thought it wise to ask an appropriate interest group if members have encountered, diagnosed, and solved this problem.? But searching , I could not locate any professional HVAC groups.? Thus I was led to your vacuum group.? I hope this is not off-topic for this group
?
Regards,
?
Bruce Hunter
Mill Valley, CA
|
Dave McGuire
Nick Andrews
Dave
ebrucehunter
Christopher Erickson