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Re: Intermittent electrical power issue on my Obsession (20" f/4, circa 2020) with ServoCat and ArgoNavis
Looking closely at your pic it looks like some sort of black covered cable is barely running under the corner of the spring loaded plate. Yes, it can still snap down like you say but is it really down at that corner too or is it being blocked up a bit ?
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Re: Is it possible to reverse position of the servocat altitude motor ?
¿ªÔÆÌåÓýJust place it on the inside of the opposite altitude bearing. This will give the same direction of rotation.
Joel M. Moskowitz, M.D. 21 (total)solar eclipses and counting 2 Venus transits 1 Mercury transit AND 4 WONDERFUL GRANDCHILDREN! |
Re: Is it possible to reverse position of the servocat altitude motor ?
Hello Rapha?l, I hope everything is going well for you. Yes, of course, you can mount it upside down; just declare it in the software.? Remember, though, to provide solid protection for the gearbox/motor assembly, which will be more exposed to frontal impacts. Best regards,Michel Boissel
Le lundi 2 juin 2025 ¨¤ 23:09:11 UTC+2, Raphael Guinamard via groups.io <rguinamard@...> a ¨¦crit :
Dear all,
On the big dob below, there are huge altitude bearings.
The mirror box is located at a higher position than usual and so there is space of the other side of the motor.
In this case, my feeling is that it is possible to mount the motor internally of the scope to save space.
I? then just need to reverse the sign of motor in the track direction of the Servocat sky software.
Do you agree, or is there something I don't think about ? ?
This is to reduce width of scope as I have a door to pass that is not that wide.
Regards
Rapha?l
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Is it possible to reverse position of the servocat altitude motor ?
Dear all,
On the big dob below, there are huge altitude bearings.
The mirror box is located at a higher position than usual and so there is space of the other side of the motor.
In this case, my feeling is that it is possible to mount the motor internally of the scope to save space.
I? then just need to reverse the sign of motor in the track direction of the Servocat sky software.
Do you agree, or is there something I don't think about ? ?
This is to reduce width of scope as I have a door to pass that is not that wide.
Regards
Rapha?l
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Re: Intermittent electrical power issue on my Obsession (20" f/4, circa 2020) with ServoCat and ArgoNavis
Give that a try... if it still cuts out check out the other potential causes in that list I sent.? The current draw during acceleration can be as high as 3.5 - 5A depending on the size of the scope and the installation mechanics, if, for example the AZ is difficult to move because a properly installed center piece of Teflon isn't there. It is very brief - BUT if the power supply limits the current by either cutting out or reducing the voltage (which in itself can cause a drop out).? g. ------ Original Message ------
From "Mike Greenhill-Hooper via groups.io" <sally.greenhill@...>
Date 6/2/2025 9:32:10 AM
Subject Re: [ServoCAT] Intermittent electrical power issue on my Obsession (20" f/4, circa 2020) with ServoCat and ArgoNavis
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Re: Intermittent electrical power issue on my Obsession (20" f/4, circa 2020) with ServoCat and ArgoNavis
Hi Gary,
?I tightened down by a couple of mm only the central screw and enclose a new photo of the plate and screws.? It behaves ok, i.e., I can raise the plate by holding both ends and it then snaps down again and looks level to me.? I have not adjusted the outer two screws (with hex tops), but they do seem to be able to move freely unlike the central screw which required more force to turn it.? With the power on to the ServoCat and AN I was able to perform jogs without a power interruption and also manually move the scope in AZ, when not engaged also without interruption.? I run a fan also from the power board and this remained on also throughout this test.? So perhaps just adjusting the center screw is all that will be necessary?
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I use a power unit that takes mains electricity and steps it down to 13.8v and can provide 3A constant current.? When I had everything powered up but the scope is stationary with the fan on the meter reads 0.5A, when I perform a jog in AZ or Alt it rises to 1A, but no more then this. I only ever connect the scope to this step-down transformer.
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Regards,
Mike GH |
Re: Servocat unit not responding
Hi Rajeev,
?
Check your junk folder. I think my emails to you might be landing there.
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I emailed details to you on how to ship your Argo Navis for inspection on 16 May 2025.
I forwarded that email again to you today and left a phone message.
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--
Gary Kopff
Managing Director
Wildcard Innovations Pty. Ltd.
20 Kilmory Place
Mount Kuring-Gai NSW 2080
Australia
Phone +61-2-9457-9049
sales@...
https://www.wildcard-innovations.com.au |
Re: Intermittent electrical power issue on my Obsession (20" f/4, circa 2020) with ServoCat and ArgoNavis
Mike, That center screw definitely looks like its not in far enough. I'd screw it down another 3/32" (0.1") or so. You should still be able to lift up the plate and if you do so evenly at both ends and let it go evenly it should drop down without hanging up at a tilt. If it is tilted it is because it is jammed on one of the bushings. If that is the case you will want to do the drilling suggesting in my instructions. If you are hearing the AN beep it is because indeed the ServoCAT is cycling power (losing power) ... the AN on batteries would 'ride through' this very short drop out.? What is the amperage rating of the power supply? And its voltage output?? g. ------ Original Message ------
From "Mike Greenhill-Hooper via groups.io" <sally.greenhill@...>
Date 6/1/2025 9:32:48 AM
Subject Re: [ServoCAT] Intermittent electrical power issue on my Obsession (20" f/4, circa 2020) with ServoCat and ArgoNavis
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Re: Intermittent electrical power issue on my Obsession (20" f/4, circa 2020) with ServoCat and ArgoNavis
Hi,
thanks everyone for your fast reaction and insightful suggestions. I have taken a look at the cantilevered plate (is this the same as the contact plate referred to later in your message Gary?). I enclose a photo. The center screw is not loose and the plate has some movement, although it seems just to rock up and down on the left and right sides along the long axis and returns to resting position by the action of the spring. The other two screws look to be in place vertically and also are not loose.
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I should also say that the power cable I use (supplied with the scope) is 2.5 meters long and also sometimes a GOTO manoeuvre stops before it reaches the target and I have to press GOTO again for it to complete the move and settle on the object with beeps.? I assume this might also be a clue.
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Would it be useful for me to refer to the CD Rom supplied to visualize better the various components you describe that might need to be checked, Gary?? I do hope solving the problem is not too complex as my skill set here is rather limited.?
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Cheers,
Mike GH? |
Re: Intermittent electrical power issue on my Obsession (20" f/4, circa 2020) with ServoCat and ArgoNavis
¿ªÔÆÌåÓýMike, ? I was having a similar problem where I would lose power in azimuth ¨C whether during a manual slew or in a motor-driven one.? I cleaned and adjusted all of the various parts of the PGB where corrosion or debris could possibly get in and interfere with the circuit, but that didn¡¯t do anything to improve the reliability of the platform long term.? Eventually, I found out that many people were using a spring that went around the central (positive?) post that fit into the bushing in the center of the PGB.? My older (2005) platform did not have this spring. ? I ordered this spring from Bill at ServoCAT and, with the help of a friend, expanded the central hole that accommodates this post and bushing from ?¡± to 1¡± so it would all fit.? This wasn¡¯t trivial, but with the right tools, wasn¡¯t that difficult, either.? Once it was all fitted, we tested and things seemed to work well with no power drops.? A few days later, I was at the Texas Star Party and the spring worked flawlessly. ? Go through the steps Gary outlined below, that will get you to what might be ailing you.? For me, it was ultimately the lack of a spring that was the main culprit and adding one of those seems to have made all the difference in eliminating power drops. ? Good luck! ? Joe Khalaf ? From:
[email protected] <[email protected]> on behalf of K9RX - Gary via groups.io <amateurK9RX@...> Hello Mike.? ? Ok... so its not common but it does happen at times. What Steve said would apply if indeed you are drawing a decent amount of current and the line cord were smaller than 18 ga (or very long).? ? However usually this can be attributed to issues with the PGB.? ? Here's the blurb that I would send out... I think this should take care of it. Two things stand out: there is a spring loaded cantilevered plate near the center of the floor of the rocker. It has one center flat blade screw. It might be too loose (it can over time work its way out). Do not overtighten it however - if you grab the outer edges and lift it should SNAP back down. The nominal lift distance is about 1/8" or so.? ? The other are the 2 bushings that the contact rods - from the bottom of that plate - go through. I discuss that below.? ? ? g. ? ? ok... first off do you have other items connected to the power rail ¨C the Argo (go to MODE STATUS, ENTER, and see if it says EXT for external or
MAINTENANCE: ------ Original Message ------
From "Mike Greenhill-Hooper via groups.io" <sally.greenhill@...> Date 5/31/2025 10:40:54 AM Subject [ServoCAT] Intermittent electrical power issue on my Obsession (20" f/4, circa 2020) with ServoCat and ArgoNavis ?
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Re: Intermittent electrical power issue on my Obsession (20" f/4, circa 2020) with ServoCat and ArgoNavis
Hello Mike.? Ok... so its not common but it does happen at times. What Steve said would apply if indeed you are drawing a decent amount of current and the line cord were smaller than 18 ga (or very long).? However usually this can be attributed to issues with the PGB.?
Here's the blurb that I would send out... I think this should take care of it. Two things stand out: there is a spring loaded cantilevered plate near the center of the floor of the rocker. It has one center flat blade screw. It might be too loose (it can over time work its way out). Do not overtighten it however - if you grab the outer edges and lift it should SNAP back down. The nominal lift distance is about 1/8" or so.? The other are the 2 bushings that the contact rods - from the bottom of that plate - go through. I discuss that below.? g. ok... first off do you have other items
connected to the power rail ¨C the Argo (go to MODE STATUS, ENTER, and see if it
says EXT for external or
BATtery), fan, etc? And if so do any of these go out when the ServoCAT¡¯s lights are out? If they do proceed ¨C if they do not then the problem is inside the scope and not the PGB system at the center of the rocker ¨C i.e. the part that brings power in. It may be the power rail or just cabling. Does it do it at a particular spot? -check to be sure the cable in the center back of the ServoCAT, RCA/Phono plug, is plugged in firmly. Also check that it is plugged into the power distribution rail inside the rocker. -An intermittent or "resistive" switch in the power rail might cause this - move the ServoCAT power jack so that it is under a different switch. This is more common with older PGB power rails (with old fashion metal bat switches). If not these things than more than likely this is an improperly installed PGB system. When installed properly and maintained the system will never drop out (see maintenance below). Some of the things I have seen: -There are 2 wires, splitting off from a cable inside the rocker floor - one goes into the hole where the pivot post is (under the encoder) and it will be difficult to tell if it is loose - but put a little tension on it with everything powered up and see if you can make the system drop power. There is also one that goes to the '-' terminal contact plate which is a stainless plate that is spring loaded...this one is obvious - see if it is loose. [Note: if you wiggle this one it might break the connection. This is not necessarily an indication of a problem as these dual contacts are spring loaded and indeed if you lift the pair it will break contact.] -next see if the negative terminal contact plate is properly put in place - grab it by the ends and lift up evenly, you should be able to get 1/8¡± -3/16" upward movement before it stops, no more. Lifting it WILL break the connection! Then it should spring snap back down. Note that we've seen a number of these that were improperly installed ¨C the 2 brushes (for redundancy) have to be vertical to the floor - if one (or both)is (are) cocked or if they are not properly spaced it can hang up and not provide redundancy and lock up the plate which is designed to be free-floating. I've only seen this on bigger scopes - but I've seen and heard of it multiple times. One can remove brush contact plate ( be careful not to lose the spring/center screw!), remove the 2 brushes and redrill these holes with a 25/64¡± drill bit to provide a small amount of ¡®slop¡¯ allowing any issues with them being too close/far apart and/or not vertical to correct itself. This has been noted on several systems. Reassemble these parts and check. Now it gets a little more difficult ... you'll need to somehow lift the scope off the ground. One way to do this is to get some blocks (2x3 or 2x4 cut into 3" lengths ¨C 8 of these for example) and put these under the body of the rocker at each corner - NOT the ground board feet. If using the 2x3's place one under one corner of the scope, then another then the last then repeat with a second one to go a little higher - be careful you don't tip it over!!!!! This will raise the scope enough to allow the ground board to hang down on the pivot post producing a gap between the top of the ground board and the bottom of the rocker. -there is a redundancy spring that fits over the pivot post (the post that goes up from the ground board and that the scope turns on)... if this is missing you may get, over time, intermittent contact. This is hard to see but sometimes can be seen without taking it apart. Use a flash light and shine it under the floor of the rocker, along the plane of the floor and into the gap between the rocker and the ground board - you should see the reflection from the pivot post (shiny stainless steel) and if careful the "wrap" of the spring around it. If it is not there or you can't tell then you'll have to remove the ground board to check for sure...but first... -there is a plate at the center of the bottom of the ground board - this is where the pivot post attaches to the ground board. In the center of this plate (not the outside edges) there are 2 screws. We recommend in our instructions that these be installed using loctite - those instructions are often missed by installers. See if these screws are loose. If so that could very well be the problem. Also there is a cable that goes from the connection foot connector to this plate. It connects to it and to a small plate with studs near it... the large pivot post plate is the '+' contact, the smaller plate with studs is the '-' terminal plate. See if either of these are loose. When we build a ground board we put silicone (not caulk) on these to prevent them from corroding and from coming loose. Last if all else fails you need to remove the ground board and see if the spring is there. For smaller scopes you can remove the mirror box and turn the rocker on its side. For larger ones you can possibly get your hand in there with a hex wrench to remove the 2 screws that hold the pivot post, have the ground board "fall" onto your arm when the last thread is removed and then carefully remove the ground board... this is difficult and even more so to get it back on - but I've done it a number of times and it can be done. We do have a separate document for removing the ground board ¨C please ask for it if you are going to go through this process. [note the ¡®spring¡¯ was added in about late 2005 or early 2006 I believe... and I had faulty instructions on it as I had forgotten to tell people to enlarge the whole in the ground board to allow the spring to do its thing ¨C if that hole isn¡¯t 1¡±, which it has to be ¨C the spring could easily get hung up and not do its proper contact (adding redundancy ¨C as designed)] MAINTENANCE: -some things that might want to be inspected: -you can remove the brush assembly, this is the plate that has the 2 screws/brushes and a center screw. Assuming you've checked the above items. You can remove the connection wire, be careful the lug is not twisted. Then remove the center screw - be CAREFUL not to let this go - as it I spring loaded! Keep this all together (you can use a wire tie on the bottom of that center screw so that the screw isn't propelled out by the spring). Inspect the brushes. They should be clean at the bottom. Use fine sand paper to clean the ends if they are not. If the sides are not clean and possibly they are causing them to stick in the brushes then clean this as well and if so you might want to remove the bushings in the floor and clean inside them. -If you have removed the ground board you can inspect the top of the stainless contact plate. It is normal for a ring to be seen where the brushes have been contacting it - but it should not be dirty. Clean if necessary. -Make sure the pivot post, the main 3/4" diameter stainless steel post that goes up the center, is very clean - no oil or dirt. Use as a minimum soapy water to clean it (this will clean off any oil residue from the inside of the bushing). -clean the inside of the main bushing in the center of the floor of the rocker. Use soapy water - be sure it is CLEAN.? ------ Original Message ------
From "Mike Greenhill-Hooper via groups.io" <sally.greenhill@...>
Date 5/31/2025 10:40:54 AM
Subject [ServoCAT] Intermittent electrical power issue on my Obsession (20" f/4, circa 2020) with ServoCat and ArgoNavis
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Re: Intermittent electrical power issue on my Obsession (20" f/4, circa 2020) with ServoCat and ArgoNavis
¿ªÔÆÌåÓýHI Mike, We had a similar problem of losing power during a slew. It was determined that the power source / power brick was too far away from the scope because of? a long cord. When we removed the long cord and moved the power brick closer to the scope, no more slew problems. ? Just a thought. Steve Goldberg ? From: [email protected] <[email protected]> On Behalf Of Mike Greenhill-Hooper via groups.io
Sent: Saturday, May 31, 2025 9:41 AM To: [email protected] Subject: [ServoCAT] Intermittent electrical power issue on my Obsession (20" f/4, circa 2020) with ServoCat and ArgoNavis ? Hi, a couple of times recently when the scope is being moved along its axes, either manually with the motor / clutches disengaged? (e.g. during 2-star alignment) or even during execution of a GOTO command I lose power.? In the first case I hear bleeping (presumably power was lost somewhere and communication is restored when it comes back?). Fortunately as I also keep batteries in the AN unit any alignment / positioning data seems to have been stored and preserved so I can carry on.? When I lose power during a GOTO if I waggle the cables and check the various connections on the ground board the power is restored.? I think I tend to lose power when the scope is moving on the Azimuth axis. When it cut out recently during the GOTO I noticed that the cooling fan had also stopped.? Once the scope is on the target I have no problems with sending guide or jog commands via the hand controller and the object is well tracked. I don't think there is a fault with the power supply going into the telescope. ? Is this a common problem and does anyone know what might be the cause, please? ? Mike GH ? ? |
Intermittent electrical power issue on my Obsession (20" f/4, circa 2020) with ServoCat and ArgoNavis
Hi,
a couple of times recently when the scope is being moved along its axes, either manually with the motor / clutches disengaged? (e.g. during 2-star alignment) or even during execution of a GOTO command I lose power.? In the first case I hear bleeping (presumably power was lost somewhere and communication is restored when it comes back?). Fortunately as I also keep batteries in the AN unit any alignment / positioning data seems to have been stored and preserved so I can carry on.? When I lose power during a GOTO if I waggle the cables and check the various connections on the ground board the power is restored.? I think I tend to lose power when the scope is moving on the Azimuth axis. When it cut out recently during the GOTO I noticed that the cooling fan had also stopped.? Once the scope is on the target I have no problems with sending guide or jog commands via the hand controller and the object is well tracked. I don't think there is a fault with the power supply going into the telescope.
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Is this a common problem and does anyone know what might be the cause, please?
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Mike GH
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Re: Servocat unit not responding
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Due to work and travel, I only got back to debugging this recently.? I sent in my new ServoCAT unit to Bill and he ended up having to replace the mainboard (he did this under warranty, which I really appreciate).
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I also tried replacing the lithium battery in the Argo Navis, but the display still doesn't come on.? I've tried both with batteries and with two different 12v external power supplies.? Anyone know where I can get someone to take a look at the unit to see if it can be repaired?? I've tried contacting Wildcard Innovations, but haven't been successful,
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Cheers,
- Rajeev
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Locked
Re: LiFePO4 battery
The description is how to use the system and how to change the settings for optimal use. It is not a detailed technical description.? |
Locked
Re: LiFePO4 battery
I agree. This should be given in the description. That there is not only a gearbox backlash, but also an uncontrolled cable backlash. |
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Re: LiFePO4 battery
Its not a perfect system! It is afterall a retrofittable kit on an EXISTING telescope! Yes it can vary. If you want to always optimize you can figure out what counterweight is needed for each eyepiece. I use a digital luggage scale to measure the force needed to move the scope up or down at various positions.? ...but most people just choose to use their scope ------ Original Message ------
From "alg via groups.io" <alg@...>
Date 5/29/2025 8:17:06 AM
Subject Re: [ServoCAT] LiFePO4 battery
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Locked
Re: LiFePO4 battery
And one more thing. You can load the telescope with a heavy eyepiece with paracorr ~1.5 kg, or with a light plossl. The backlash will be different. |