Re: The latest storm of chaos from a Microsoft Announcement of changes to the default M365 Personal and Family Plans to include Copilot Functionality in the Office Programs
Brian,
?
OK, helpful. My annual family subscription does not expire until sometime in December of this year, I believe it is the 9th. So, since I’m not interested in this, when should I follow your downgrade
instructions so I’m sure not to get charged in December?
?
Alan
?
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
From: [email protected] <[email protected]>
On Behalf Of Brian Vogel via groups.io
Sent: Tuesday, January 21, 2025 12:06 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [M365-Accessibility] The latest storm of chaos from a Microsoft Announcement of changes to the default M365 Personal and Family Plans to include Copilot Functionality in the Office Programs
?
Another note about M365 subscriptions, you cannot change level, and I mean actually have the change take effect, in the middle of an existing subscription run, at least for a downgrade in level.? Changes only occur in actual service level
at your renewal date.
So, if you're a monthly subscriber, and change from one level to another on the 15th of the month, you will not actually get that service level until the first of the next month, and your billing will be adjusted accordingly.
The same applies if you're a yearly subscriber.? When you paid at your subscription date, you paid for a full year and will have that service level for the full year term.? If you downgrade 5 months in that change will not take effect until
the next renewal date.? Most "upgrades" up until now have involved add-on services (which Copilot was) that were side attachments to core M365 functionality and handled as their own things with their own subscription.? Now that Copilot is being integrated
with M365 Family and Personal, it becomes a part of that core subscription.
Brian?
·
♂?
·
????
·
?Virginia, USA?-
Windows 11 Pro, Version 24H2, Build 26100; M365 Family;
Android 13 (Xiaomi HyperOS 1.0.10.0)
It is much easier to be critical than to be correct.
?????? ~ Benjamin Disraeli, 1804-1881
|
Re: what exactly can, and can't, I do with Copilot in office?
Dean,
?
Please read the still currently active topic, A Question Regarding Copilot in MS 365 Please, specifically my message, #9897, but at the very least the beginning 10 or so messages.? This was just asked and answered as well as anyone can answer it in that topic. ?
This is in such early days that, other than Microsoft's own documentation and input from a few early adopters, there's really no existing knowledge base to go on.? We're all in the, "read the documentation, play with it, and see what we find" stage of the game.
--
Brian? · ♂? · ???? · ?Virginia, USA?- Windows 11 Pro, Version 24H2, Build 26100; M365 Family; Android 13 (Xiaomi HyperOS 1.0.10.0)
It is much easier to be critical than to be correct.
?????? ~ Benjamin Disraeli, 1804-1881
|
what exactly can, and can't, I do with Copilot in office?
I’m sort of paralyzed as to how to research all this. My impression is that, for me, a lot of the freely available AI features consist of things I never thought of needing, and likely still don’t need. So what do I gain? Will copilot extend Word’s language translation ability so that one can translate longer documents? Will it create transcripts of audio files, and if so, of what length? If I paste a chapter of a published book, will it summarize it? If so, how long can the chapter be? (I don’t have to tell it that the textcomes from a published book.) If I have a Copilot pc whose Copilot capabilities I haven’t tapped, what will Copilot for Office add to its capabilities? ? And so fofrth …? ? Dean ? Encouraging and thought-provoking reading https://bahaiteachings.org ?
|
Re: The latest storm of chaos from a Microsoft Announcement of changes to the default M365 Personal and Family Plans to include Copilot Functionality in the Office Programs
Another note about M365 subscriptions, you cannot change level, and I mean actually have the change take effect, in the middle of an existing subscription run, at least for a downgrade in level.? Changes only occur in actual service level at your renewal date.
?
So, if you're a monthly subscriber, and change from one level to another on the 15th of the month, you will not actually get that service level until the first of the next month, and your billing will be adjusted accordingly.
?
The same applies if you're a yearly subscriber.? When you paid at your subscription date, you paid for a full year and will have that service level for the full year term.? If you downgrade 5 months in that change will not take effect until the next renewal date.? Most "upgrades" up until now have involved add-on services (which Copilot was) that were side attachments to core M365 functionality and handled as their own things with their own subscription.? Now that Copilot is being integrated with M365 Family and Personal, it becomes a part of that core subscription.
--
Brian? · ♂? · ???? · ?Virginia, USA?- Windows 11 Pro, Version 24H2, Build 26100; M365 Family; Android 13 (Xiaomi HyperOS 1.0.10.0)
It is much easier to be critical than to be correct.
?????? ~ Benjamin Disraeli, 1804-1881
|
Re: The latest storm of chaos from a Microsoft Announcement of changes to the default M365 Personal and Family Plans to include Copilot Functionality in the Office Programs
Thanks, I'll check again, but I only saw options for 365 personal and family and no classic anywhere.
|
Re: A Question Regarding Copilot in MS 365 Please.
Quote as I have no idea if M365 Educational is involved, either)
Unquote ? I have a vague recollection of reading that school exchange accounts could also access 15 free credits per month. ? Cheers, Leo Bado. ? "Beware of he who would deny you access to information, for in his heart he dreams himself your master." Pravin Lal. ? ? On Mon, Jan 20, 2025 at 07:54 PM, Leo Bado wrote: It's precisely what just got integrated into M365 Personal and Family, as far as I can tell.? It was probably available as an "add-on" of sorts prior to this trial of Copilot integration for all non-business users (possibly only M365 Personal and Family, as I have no idea if M365 Educational is involved, either). Brian? · ♂? · ???? · ?Virginia, USA?- Windows 11 Pro, Version 24H2, Build 26100; M365 Family; Android 13 (Xiaomi HyperOS 1.0.10.0) It is much easier to be critical than to be correct. ?????? ~ Benjamin Disraeli, 1804-1881
|
Re: JAWS freezing with long messages much better in New Outlook
If there are settings we could change in Outlook or with our screen-readers that would mean we had a better experience reading emails that contain lots of different things, it would be good to know.
I consider myself a confident user of Outlook. I know how to use various features. Yet there are emails that JAWS and NVDA don't like. I am a confident user of both those screen-readers.
| Wayne Senior, Dewsbury, England
On Monday, 20 January 2025 at 14:31:16 GMT, Leo Bado via groups.io <leobado1982@...> wrote:
I have never experienced almost the totality of all the issues continuously reported in this mailing list or other forums using Outlook classic, e.g., issues synchronizing Gmail accounts, attaching files from explorer, messages containing links, images, tables, incoming messages not syncing as expected, clumsiness navigating lists of messages, client sending legit messages into the junk folder, and a long etc. Question that rises up is why? Hmm, got a few ideas, but I’ll reserve my opinion. ? Cheers, Leo Bado. ? "Beware of he who would deny you access to information, for in his heart he dreams himself your master." Pravin Lal. ?
From: [email protected] <[email protected]> On Behalf Of Jason White via groups.io
Sent: Monday, January 20, 2025 7:20 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [M365-Accessibility] JAWS freezing with long messages much better in New Outlook ? I don’t use Windows a lot, but when I do, I don’t want to experience these stability issues while simply trying to read incoming mail. Like you, I encountered them in Outlook Classic, but the New Outlook for Microsoft 365 has resolved them. Outlook Classic also used to become completely unresponsive at times while reading message lists, although I hadn’t experienced that issue recently. In any case, this isn’t a problem with the New Outlook either. In summary, I’m not going back to Outlook Classic. ? With the chance to try Copilot in the New Outlook, I went ahead and switched from Outlook Classic to New Outlook. One thing I've noticed is?that the issue where JAWS, NVDA and Narrator hang on messages with a lot of links, tables and more is pretty much non-existent with the New Outlook. -- Christopher (AKA CJ) =>÷ Chaltain at Outlook, USA ?
-- |
Regards,
Wayne Senior
Latest stable versions of NVDA, JAWS and Narrator.
|
Re: A Question Regarding Copilot in MS 365 Please.
On Mon, Jan 20, 2025 at 07:54 PM, Leo Bado wrote:
-
It's precisely what just got integrated into M365 Personal and Family, as far as I can tell.? It was probably available as an "add-on" of sorts prior to this trial of Copilot integration for all non-business users (possibly only M365 Personal and Family, as I have no idea if M365 Educational is involved, either).
--
Brian? · ♂? · ???? · ?Virginia, USA?- Windows 11 Pro, Version 24H2, Build 26100; M365 Family; Android 13 (Xiaomi HyperOS 1.0.10.0)
It is much easier to be critical than to be correct.
?????? ~ Benjamin Disraeli, 1804-1881
|
Re: A Question Regarding Copilot in MS 365 Please.
Well that would be something at least.? I hope someone can actually check it out. On the other hand, I have noticed a new app on Microsoft Store that it is getting updated now, it is called Microsoft 365 ?Copilot and it is a stand alone app different from Copilot although I don’t know exactly what it does. So, do you think this app is just a kind of protocol sending data to external servers or it actually handles some encrypted AI algorithms? ? Cheers, Leo Bado. ? "Beware of he who would deny you access to information, for in his heart he dreams himself your master." Pravin Lal. ?
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
From: [email protected] <[email protected]> On Behalf Of Brian Vogel via groups.io
Sent: Monday, January 20, 2025 4:44 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [M365-Accessibility] A Question Regarding Copilot in MS 365 Please.? On Mon, Jan 20, 2025 at 11:51 AM, Leo Bado wrote: I thought this could change in the future , but apparently Microsoft thinks otherwise.
I am not going to test it right now, but it probably has, or will, in New Outlook. Microsoft does not have direct access to any of your email data stores under the Outlook Classic IMAP access method, particularly not to summarize content.? New Outlook hosts all email in an "intermediate holding tank" on Microsoft servers to allow Copilot access for those who choose to use it.? IMAP is not "bi-directional" in terms of RW access to existing email messages.? They can be snagged, one at a time, for downloading purposes. For any Microsoft owned email service, they've got carte blanche as far as read-write access for something like Copilot when the user requests it.? It's all on their servers to begin with. Brian? · ♂? · ???? · ?Virginia, USA?- Windows 11 Pro, Version 24H2, Build 26100; M365 Family; Android 13 (Xiaomi HyperOS 1.0.10.0) It is much easier to be critical than to be correct. ?????? ~ Benjamin Disraeli, 1804-1881
|
Re: A Question Regarding Copilot in MS 365 Please.
On Mon, Jan 20, 2025 at 11:51 AM, Leo Bado wrote:
I thought this could change in the future , but apparently Microsoft thinks otherwise.
-
I am not going to test it right now, but it probably has, or will, in New Outlook.
?
Microsoft does not have direct access to any of your email data stores under the Outlook Classic IMAP access method, particularly not to summarize content.? New Outlook hosts all email in an "intermediate holding tank" on Microsoft servers to allow Copilot access for those who choose to use it.? IMAP is not "bi-directional" in terms of RW access to existing email messages.? They can be snagged, one at a time, for downloading purposes.
?
For any Microsoft owned email service, they've got carte blanche as far as read-write access for something like Copilot when the user requests it.? It's all on their servers to begin with.
--
Brian? · ♂? · ???? · ?Virginia, USA?- Windows 11 Pro, Version 24H2, Build 26100; M365 Family; Android 13 (Xiaomi HyperOS 1.0.10.0)
It is much easier to be critical than to be correct.
?????? ~ Benjamin Disraeli, 1804-1881
|
Re: The latest storm of chaos from a Microsoft Announcement of changes to the default M365 Personal and Family Plans to include Copilot Functionality in the Office Programs
On Mon, Jan 20, 2025 at 11:26 AM, JinYoun wrote:
when I follow the instructions, there is no option to downgrade.
-
Have you looked around once you are on this page?: ?
?
You get there after having done the Hit Alt + F, D, Y 3, and choosing Cancel Subscription from the menu of options.
?
These things do sometimes vary by region, but I can't imagine the one in Canada is not the same as the US.? For me, that page toward the bottom has a Switch Plan button if I want to switch to M365 Family Classic.? That is the downgrade, as straight M365 Personal or Family will keep Copilot AI with a $30/year cost increase as of the date of your next renewal.
--
Brian? · ♂? · ???? · ?Virginia, USA?- Windows 11 Pro, Version 24H2, Build 26100; M365 Family; Android 13 (Xiaomi HyperOS 1.0.10.0)
It is much easier to be critical than to be correct.
?????? ~ Benjamin Disraeli, 1804-1881
|
Re: The latest storm of chaos from a Microsoft Announcement of changes to the default M365 Personal and Family Plans to include Copilot Functionality in the Office Programs
Diana,
?
Several basic points:
?
1. One can move between subscription levels (for lack of a better way of putting it) in M365 Personal or Family at will.? It's unfortunate that the method used to do so involves canceling one's current subscription and picking up another, as that does imply an interruption in service, but there is no interruption of service.? Only if you cancel - just cancel - and don't pick up a different subscription level will you lose service.? If you follow the previously posted instructions to cancel your existing M365 service, and during that process enroll in the Classic level, then things just stay as they are and your billing will remain as it is, with the same services as you currently have, at the point of your next renewal date.? Ahead of that date the main subscriber still has the free trial.
?
2. M365 Personal and Family, even if they expire, allow 30 days (as of this writing) of access to OneDrive for the now-expired subscription in read-only mode so that existing data can be downloaded.? After that 30 days passes, it's gone.? If you re-up during that 30 days, you just have read-write access to OneDrive restored.
--
Brian? · ♂? · ???? · ?Virginia, USA?- Windows 11 Pro, Version 24H2, Build 26100; M365 Family; Android 13 (Xiaomi HyperOS 1.0.10.0)
It is much easier to be critical than to be correct.
?????? ~ Benjamin Disraeli, 1804-1881
|
Re: A Question Regarding Copilot in MS 365 Please.
When I checked on the sub, it appears to only be for the new subscription price, not classic.? I only saw two listed, one for family and one for personal. ?
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
From: [email protected] <[email protected]> On Behalf Of enes saribas via groups.io
Sent: Monday, January 20, 2025 1:05 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [M365-Accessibility] A Question Regarding Copilot in MS 365 Please.? Hi William, I did sign up for it, but looks like I lost the discounted rate because it says I will be charged $69 in 2025 for personal.? Can you confirm you lose it when switching to O365 personal classic? ? ? I would like to add a couple things to what David said. ? Besides the new CoPilot working with the new Outlook, it only works with Microsoft addresses.? Hotmail.com, outlook.com, msn.com, live.com. ? Second, if you have an agreement between your employer and Microsoft, I would recommend signing up for the ? My employer offers this and you get 30% off M365 subs.? This would take your family sub down to $90 annually, so you would actually be paying a bit less than you did before the price hike. ? ? Hi all, A couple of points. First, as I understand, Copilot only works with the New Outlook, not Classic. Second, regarding Word, yes you? can give it prompts to create documents, but you can create similar prompts with a whole bunch of free AI apps. You can then copy results to the clipboard and paste into Word. You will have to touch up formatting using one of these, while Word with Copilot does a good job of formatting, including inserting headings. But if you are comfortable formatting Word docs, this is not much extra work. Regarding a number of things Copilot can purportedly do with Excel and PowerPoint, no free AI app has the capability to do most of this. My first two points are not meant to disparage Copilot. I have MS 365, like the integration they have introduced, and personally, will have no problem paying the extra $30 when my subscription renews. David ? ?
|
Re: The latest storm of chaos from a Microsoft Announcement of changes to the default M365 Personal and Family Plans to include Copilot Functionality in the Office Programs
I am not the owner of our family subscription, my husband is. I don't mind that I won't have access to copilot. We haven't started the process, but I want to have all my ducks accounted for before I do. If we cancel our subscription, in order to downgrade to Classic, I assume we will lose everything in our separate OneDrives, so we need to back them up somewhere first, correct? Also, if my husband does do process first, I will lose my access at that time and he will need to add me on to the new account, yes? I pologize if these seem obvious questions, i just want to have thought this through before we go into it. Thanks for any clarifications you can provide.?
?
Diana Brent
|
Re: A Question Regarding Copilot in MS 365 Please.
Quote it appears this only works from within Microsoft email accounts
Unquote ? Yes David, you’re right! In my case it only works in my main Hotmail.com? account, a year ago I thought this could change in the future , but apparently Microsoft thinks otherwise. ? Cheers, Leo Bado. ? "Beware of he who would deny you access to information, for in his heart he dreams himself your master." Pravin Lal. ? ? Hi all, I stand corrected on my comment that Copilot only works with the New Outlook. But it appears this only works from within Microsoft email accounts such as outlook.com. If I am right this time, it seems to be of limited value if your primary email account is Gmail or something other than an MS account. When I tried to start up Copilot from my Gmail account, nothing happened. When I asked it to summarize my Gmail messages from within my Outlook email account, it said this was not possible. I can still draft messages from my Outlook.com account and send from another of my email accounts, so this is useful.? David
|
Re: The latest storm of chaos from a Microsoft Announcement of changes to the default M365 Personal and Family Plans to include Copilot Functionality in the Office Programs
Not sure if it is because I'm in Canada, when I follow the instructions, there is no option to downgrade.
|
Re: A Question Regarding Copilot in MS 365 Please.
On the subject of subscription rates:? Most of us can only comment on Microsoft's rates for "the general public" based on our place of residence.? Programs like the mentioned by William James are negotiated between the employer and Microsoft and are supposed to be (in theory, anyway) only available to employees.? I say in theory mostly because most who subscribe through these do not terminate their own subscription through such arrangements if they change jobs, and I've never know of one to be terminated by Microsoft or the now-former employer.
?
If you've got a rate below what's offered to the general public through any of Microsoft's discount programs I'd await some sort of communication from Microsoft about what rate changes, if any, will occur at your next renewal date and/or whether or not Copilot will become part of your subscription.? Since Copilot remains a "per seat" subscription for business, I am doubting that the subscriptions offered through Workplace Discount are going to have Copilot AI integration, as it would probably still be an add-on.
--
Brian? · ♂? · ???? · ?Virginia, USA?- Windows 11 Pro, Version 24H2, Build 26100; M365 Family; Android 13 (Xiaomi HyperOS 1.0.10.0)
It is much easier to be critical than to be correct.
? ? ? ?~ Benjamin Disraeli, 1804-1881
|
Re: A Question Regarding Copilot in MS 365 Please.
Hi all,
I stand corrected on my comment that Copilot only works with the New Outlook. But it appears this only works from within Microsoft email accounts such as outlook.com. If I am right this time, it seems to be of limited value if your primary email account is Gmail or something other than an MS account. When I tried to start up Copilot from my Gmail account, nothing happened. When I asked it to summarize my Gmail messages from within my Outlook email account, it said this was not possible. I can still draft messages from my Outlook.com account and send from another of my email accounts, so this is useful.?
David
|
Re: JAWS freezing with long messages much better in New Outlook
I have never experienced almost the totality of all the issues continuously reported in this mailing list or other forums using Outlook classic, e.g., issues synchronizing Gmail accounts, attaching files from explorer, messages containing links, images, tables, incoming messages not syncing as expected, clumsiness navigating lists of messages, client sending legit messages into the junk folder, and a long etc. Question that rises up is why? Hmm, got a few ideas, but I’ll reserve my opinion. ? Cheers, Leo Bado. ? "Beware of he who would deny you access to information, for in his heart he dreams himself your master." Pravin Lal. ?
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
From: [email protected] <[email protected]> On Behalf Of Jason White via groups.io
Sent: Monday, January 20, 2025 7:20 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [M365-Accessibility] JAWS freezing with long messages much better in New Outlook? I don’t use Windows a lot, but when I do, I don’t want to experience these stability issues while simply trying to read incoming mail. Like you, I encountered them in Outlook Classic, but the New Outlook for Microsoft 365 has resolved them. Outlook Classic also used to become completely unresponsive at times while reading message lists, although I hadn’t experienced that issue recently. In any case, this isn’t a problem with the New Outlook either. In summary, I’m not going back to Outlook Classic. ? With the chance to try Copilot in the New Outlook, I went ahead and switched from Outlook Classic to New Outlook. One thing I've noticed is?that the issue where JAWS, NVDA and Narrator hang on messages with a lot of links, tables and more is pretty much non-existent with the New Outlook. -- Christopher (AKA CJ) =>÷ Chaltain at Outlook, USA ?
|
Re: JAWS freezing with long messages much better in New Outlook
I don’t use Windows a lot, but when I do, I don’t want to experience these stability issues while simply trying to read incoming mail. Like you, I encountered them in Outlook Classic, but the New Outlook for
Microsoft 365 has resolved them.
Outlook Classic also used to become completely unresponsive at times while reading message lists, although I hadn’t experienced that issue recently. In any case, this isn’t a problem with the New Outlook either.
In summary, I’m not going back to Outlook Classic.
?
With the chance to try Copilot in the New Outlook, I went ahead and switched from Outlook Classic to New Outlook. One thing I've noticed is?that the issue where JAWS, NVDA and Narrator hang on messages with a lot
of links, tables and more is pretty much non-existent with the New Outlook.
--
Christopher (AKA CJ) =>÷
Chaltain at Outlook, USA
?
|
Brian Vogel