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Re: [www.Kresy-Siberia.org] Introducing New member Claire Turenne Sjolander from Ottawa Canada

 

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Claire welcome to group, it is our gain to have you on the team, joining our already multitalented administration members, thank you for your support.

Warmest regards,

Lenarda, Sydney, Australia

?

From: Kresy-Siberia@... [mailto:Kresy-Siberia@...] On Behalf Of Helen Bitner
Sent: Wednesday, 24 April, 2013 4:00 AM
To: Kresy-Siberia@...
Subject: [www.Kresy-Siberia.org] Introducing New member Claire Turenne Sjolander from Ottawa Canada

?

?

Dear group?

Please welcome Claire as a new member. Claire??is very interested in our work, and has helped with the People of the Polish Second Corps exhibit, as well as with the booklist, and other tasks on the KSVM over the past few years.? Claire ?has also agreed to join the Board of Kresy-Siberia (Canada) Inc. in order to assist us further in our work.

?

She has been following the posts online for some time now, but wants to continue to do so as a full-fledged member.

A warm welcome to you Claire and a big thanks for your?help over the years

Kind regards

Helen Bitner

Colchester UK
Is KS anti-Holocaust?

John Halucha
 

The following excerpt is from
http://www.jpost.com/Opinion/Op-EdContributors/Article.aspx?id=309270

Reminiscent of the most recent BBC complaint, the writer lumps "Poland" in with others gratuitously and never backs up the assertion. He briefly refers to crimes in and by other nations, but blames Poles and Poland only by geographical association.
Directly connected to our own quest for better understanding of our community's experience under the Soviets in eastern Poland, the writer seems to be saying that we are wrong to speak of oppression of other people in the same breath as oppression of the Jews. It appears that in his eyes, our inclusiveness is anti-Semitic.
An argument I find particularly of concern is about efforts to "classify Communist crimes as genocide, which would help weaken Jewish accusations regarding Holocaust crimes in these countries, since that would mean that Jews too had committed genocide (in the service of the Communists)". Does this mean that denouncing the Katyn murders by the NKVD as genocide is seen as an attempt to distort and reduce the horror of the Holocaust of Jews? Is it OK to talk about members of other communities committing atrocities (as he does), but necessary to remain silent if the perpetrator happened to be Jewish?
I post this only FYI and as a warning about how our well-meaning inquiries and sharing of experiences might be viewed by some. It is not my purpose to begin a debate here. As far as I am concerned, the inclusiveness of the KS goals is commendable and a model for others.

John Halucha
Sault Ste Marie, Canada

... efforts of various Eastern European countries to rewrite the history of the Shoah with two ulterior motives. The first is to minimize, or even hide, the role played by their nationals in Holocaust crimes. The second is to convince the world that the crimes of Communism are at least equivalent, if not worse, than those of the Nazis.

In order to fully understand the importance of this issue and the insidious anti-Semitic nature of this campaign, the uniquely lethal nature of the collaboration with the Nazis in Eastern Europe must be explained.

Unlike the situation elsewhere, where local Nazi collaborators helped implement the initial stages of the Final Solution – definition, Aryanization, concentration and deportation of the Jews – but did not carry out their mass murder themselves, the Nazis integrated the local collaborators in Eastern Europe in the killing operations and these forces played a highly significant role in the annihilation of the Jews in the Baltics, Ukraine, Belarus, Poland and Croatia.

After World War II, all of these countries were either part of the Soviet Union or ruled by Communist parties and it was only slightly more than two decades ago that they made the transition to democracy and were able for the first time to deal with their Holocaust history openly and honestly. The results to date have, to put it mildly, been terrible.

Instead of telling the truth about local active participation in the murders and trying to make amends by prosecuting unpunished Nazi collaborators, the blame for the annihilation of the Jewish communities was attributed exclusively to the German and Austrian Nazis. The Nazis undoubtedly bear major responsibility, but could never have succeeded to the extent that they did in these countries without the massive assistance of their local helpers, and almost no local killers were ever successfully brought to justice. Even worse, some of the most notorious criminals are being glorified for their patriotism and resistance to Communism, ignoring their role in Holocaust crimes.

In 2008, this campaign was accelerated by the publication of the Prague Declaration, which besides promoting the canard of historical equivalency between Communism and Nazism, called for practical measures which if implemented would undermine the current status of the Shoah as a unique case of genocide. Among its demands were the creation of a joint memorial day for all the victims of totalitarian regimes (which would ultimately replace Holocaust Memorial Day), and the rewriting of all textbooks to reflect the supposed equality of the Nazi and Communist regimes, which would negatively revolutionize the teaching of European history.

Behind these steps was the desire to be able to classify Communist crimes as genocide, which would help weaken Jewish accusations regarding Holocaust crimes in these countries, since that would mean that Jews too had committed genocide (in the service of the Communists). If everyone is guilty, then of course no one is.

...?During the past year, for example, Israel remained silent as Lithuania reburied with full honors the leader of the provisional Lithuanian government established after the Nazi invasion of June 1941, which fully supported the Third Reich and who signed orders facilitating the persecution and murder of Lithuania’s Jewish citizens. It preferred not to protest neo-Nazi marches on Lithuanian independence day down the main avenues of Vilnius (Vilna) and Kaunas (Kovno), or parades in the center of Riga honoring the Latvian Waffen- SS units which fought for a victory of the Third Reich. Even worse, official Israeli institutions maintain a level of cooperation with the group in Lithuania which actively promotes the Prague Declaration, since it is they who control Holocaust education and commemoration in that country.

...?With countries like Lithuania and Latvia, who are among the main culprits in this regard, poised to take over the presidency of the European Union in the coming year, it is high time that Israel minimize the gap between Holocaust rhetoric and practical action on Shoah-related issues, and begin to take the threat of Holocaust distortion seriously.
Introducing New member Claire Turenne Sjolander from Ottawa Canada

Helen Bitner
 

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Dear group?
Please welcome Claire as a new member. Claire??is very interested in our work, and has helped with the People of the Polish Second Corps exhibit, as well as with the booklist, and other tasks on the KSVM over the past few years.? Claire ?has also agreed to join the Board of Kresy-Siberia (Canada) Inc. in order to assist us further in our work.
?
She has been following the posts online for some time now, but wants to continue to do so as a full-fledged member.
A warm welcome to you Claire and a big thanks for your?help over the years
Kind regards
Helen Bitner
Colchester UK
Re: [www.Kresy-Siberia.org] BBC Complaints - Case number CAS-2059681-D32RXL

John Halucha
 

Bravo, everyone who challenged the BBC on this latest historical revisionism. I was unable to hear the publication (puzzling, since so many of you outside Britain appear to have had no problem) and did not write myself. It sounds as though I would have been lucky to get a response at all, even this tired boilerplate.
When I read the full response quoted by Barbara, I used the mathematicians' "substitution method" to get a fuller understanding. What if Seldon had said: "Had the Germans, the British, those many Europeans who were involved in the execution of the Holocaust asked why they were doing this..."
Would the interviewer have let it slip by unchallenged?
Would the BBC be defending the egregious misrepresentation the same way and as vigorously?
Ironically, "the Poles" did more to fight the Nazi German Holocaust than did "the British", as individuals who risked and often suffered torture and death for saving Jews and as a nation that tried to expose the crime and urged Allies to do something about it, such as bombing the rails that led to the death camps. The Allies would not listen, and now blame the Poles so off-handedly.
Thank you all for your vigilance.
John Halucha
Sault Ste Marie, Canada

From: Stefan Wisniowski
To: "Kresy-Siberia@..."
Cc: "Kresy-Siberia@..."
Sent: Tuesday, April 23, 2013 9:02:10 AM
Subject: Re: [www.Kresy-Siberia.org] BBC Complaints - Case number CAS-2059681-D32RXL



I wrote direct to the professor and cc to BBC but have yet to receive ?a response.... :(

Best regards
Stefan Wisniowski
Sydney Australia?

On 23/04/2013, at 19:57, Helen Bitner <helen.bitner@...> wrote:

?
Barbara and Nicola,
I have also been ?dismissed with the identical letter but signed by Patrick Mc Manus.?
Kind regards
Helen Bitner
UK


On 23 Apr 2013, at 05:16, Barbara Scrivens <scrivs@...> wrote:

?

Dear Nicola and others following this issue,
?
I received the same worded message this morning regarding the complaint I put to them.
?
Below is my reply. It was returned, so I printed two copies and posted them separately to Michelle McGahan and Adrian Wishbourne at the address on the complaints page, PO Box 1922, Darlington, DL3 0UR.
?
To say I was mortified at BBC?�?s response is an understatement.
?
Kind regards,
Barbara Scrivens
NZ
?
?
From: Barbara Scrivens [mailto:scrivs@]
Sent: Tuesday, 23 April 2013 7:13 a.m.
To: 'bbc_complaints_website@...'
Subject: RE: BBC Complaints - Case number CAS-2059681-D32RXL
?
Dear Michelle,
?
Thank you for your reply, to which I see by the PS, I may not respond to.
?
However, just in case this does get to be read by Adrian Washbourne, please will you let him know:
1)????? ?�?Mr Seldon?�?s comment referring to countries and nations involved in the Holocaust was made in passing in relation to a much wider point about ways of reacting to authority.?�
?
?�?in passing?�? I do not agree. One of the things which chilled me was the slow and completely deliberate way Mr Seldon made his comment.
2)????? ?�?It wasn?�?t in any way meant to dispute the facts that Poland was a victim during the Second World War and that the Holocaust was created and engineered by Nazi Germany.?�
?�?It wasn?�?t in any way meant to dispute the facts?� I do not agree. Mr Seldon specifically attached Poles to the Germans. His exact words were: ?�?Had the Germans, the Poles, those many Europeans who were involved in the execution of the Holocaust asked why they were doing this...?� If I were someone not acquainted with the history of World War II, I would have assumed the Poles were the executioners. After all, Auschwitz is on Polish soil.
?
3)????? It was not the editorial intention to raise this topic in the programme, and as you?�?ll no doubt be aware, we cannot control what interviewees choose to reference.
?
?�?cannot control what interviewees choose to reference?�? I absolutely do not agree. One of the tenets of good journalism is the ability to listen to the interviewee and be flexible, challenge such gross discrepancies. May I suggest your radio interviewers listen to Radio New Zealand National on any morning show. Saturdays and Sundays have in depth-interviews and on Sunday mornings 9.05 (NZ time) there is a regular Media Watch show. ?Kim Hill, on Saturday mornings won the 2012 International Radio Personality of the Year from the Association for International Broadcasting, so I don?�?t think you will be bored.
?
4)????? ?�?Given the passing nature of the comment...?�
?
?�?passing nature?�? You are repeating your assumption, with which I do not agree. There was nothing ?�?passing?� about this comment.
?
5)????? ..and the fact that it was unanticipated within an interview on a wholly different issue it was not unreasonable for the presenter Philip Dodd to move on.?�
?
?�?unanticipated?�? Isn?�?t the unanticipated nature of human beings the joy and challenge of interviewing? Isn?�?t that why radio interviews are so revealing and interesting?
?
?�?a wholly different issue?�? The programme was apparently meant to be examining authority. Why didn?�?t Phillip Dodd do that if Anthony Seldon was at that time the ?�?authority?�?
?
?�?not unreasonable?�? I do not agree. There was a gross mistake in what the interviewee said. By allowing him to move on and not bring him back to rectify the mistake, if not immediately then soon after, shows agreement with the interviewee.
6)????? ?If he had challenged this - when he had not been briefed on this area ?�“ it would substantially have changed the theme of the discussion.
?�?changed the theme?�? I do not agree. Challenging authority was the theme. The Poles left in Poland during the war challenged authority at every turn. Have you heard about the Polish ??egota?
?
Michelle, my concerns have not been allayed. Mr Washborne?�?s response has made me uneasy and fearful about the content the BBC is ?�?educating?�? the British public with. I?�?m also uneasy about the fact that the BBC described Mr Seldon as ?�?an educationalist and head of a major institution?�. He has an influence on young minds. He teaches. If he can?�?t be challenged by an institution such as the BBC, who will challenge him? Who will put him right?
?
Perhaps I?�?m sensitive, but I had hoped that by now, at least the icon of the BBC would accept that Poland was an ally without whom World War II would have turned out very differently. The word ?�?foreigner?� was one of the first English words I learned. I thought I was being called that because we moved from St Albans to Dunstable. It was only years later that I realised it was because of my foreign-sounding name.
?
I left the UK in 1967. I truly hoped that you lot had grown up by now. It saddens me that you haven?�?t.
?
Regards
Barbara Scrivens
?
?
?
From: bbc_complaints_website@... [mailto:bbc_complaints_website@]
Sent: Tuesday, 23 April 2013 2:42 a.m.
To: Barbara Scrivens
Subject: BBC Complaints - Case number CAS-2059681-D32RXL
?
Dear Mrs Scrivens
Reference CAS-2059681-D32RXL
Thank you for contacting us regarding the Radio 3 programme 'Nightwaves' broadcast 19 March.
We understand you found comments made on the programme offensive.
We forwarded your concerns to the programme production team. The programme Editor Adrian Washbourne responded as follows:
?�?The interview with Anthony Seldon was part of a programme that examined the nature of authority, the extent to which it can be a force for good and how its abuse be can be prevented.
Mr Seldon?�?s comment referring to countries and nations involved in the Holocaust was made in passing in relation to a much wider point about ways of reacting to authority. It wasn?�?t in any way meant to dispute the facts that Poland was a victim during the Second World War and that the Holocaust was created and engineered by Nazi Germany.
It was not the editorial intention to raise this topic in the programme, and as you?�?ll no doubt be aware, we cannot control what interviewees choose to reference. Given the passing nature of the comment and the fact that it was unanticipated within an interview on a wholly different issue it was not unreasonable for the presenter Philip Dodd to move on. If he had challenged this - when he had not been briefed on this area ?�“ it would substantially have changed the theme of the discussion.
We recognise that this is an important issue. Were we to deal with it on a future occasion, we would naturally wish to reflect the range of historical opinion which would be our normal aim and practise.?�
We hope this response allays your concerns. Nevertheless, we do appreciate you feel strongly regarding this, and as we?�?re guided by feedback such as yours, I?�?d like to assure you that I?�?ve registered your comments on our audience log. This is a report of audience feedback that?�?s compiled daily and made available to staff across the BBC, including members of the BBC Executive Board, channel controllers and other senior managers.
Thanks again for taking the time to contact us.
Kind Regards
Michelle McGahan
BBC Complaints
NB This is sent from an outgoing account only which is not monitored. You cannot reply to this email address but if necessary please contact us via our webform quoting any case number we provided.


?
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BBC wierdness

 

fwiw: here's the wierd autoreply i received when i emailed the BBC to
complain, can anyone who understands computers tell whats happening?

why would a German mail server be involved?
---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: Mail Delivery System <Mailer-Daemon@...>
Date: Mon, 15 Apr 2013 12:41:08 +0200
Subject: Mail delivery failed: returning message to sender
To: tim.bucknall@...

This message was created automatically by mail delivery software.

A message that you sent could not be delivered to one or more of
its recipients. This is a permanent error. The following addresses
failed:

feedback@...:
quota exceeded

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Subject: still waiting for response to my complaint
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--
Tim Bucknall
Congleton, UK
RDR54D1 + CLP5130
BBC morons

 

well done on at least getting a reply from the BBC which is more than i got!
a point that the BBC reply completely ignores is that Seldon mentioned
Poles before Germans in relation to the Holocaust
hasn't the BBC put out any statement in response to the Ambassadors comments?
they seem to think/hope that this will just fade away if they ignore it

I think the BBC have a problem with their internal email getting
hijacked which may explain the lack of response, when i first emailed
i got some wierd auto respond messages back from an unfamiliar email
adress before i got the proper BBC auto reply.
next time they do something stupid i suppose i'll have to phone them instead

if you've ever listened to the radio show "feedback" you'll know that
the BBC never apologises for anything, they just tell the complainant
why he's wrong!

Tim B
Congleton
Re: [www.Kresy-Siberia.org] BBC Complaints - Case number CAS-2059681-D32RXL

 

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I wrote direct to the professor and cc to BBC but have yet to receive ?a response.... :(

Best regards
Stefan Wisniowski
Sydney Australia?

On 23/04/2013, at 19:57, Helen Bitner <helen.bitner@...> wrote:

?

Barbara and Nicola,

I have also been ?dismissed with the identical letter but signed by Patrick Mc Manus.?
Kind regards
Helen Bitner
UK


On 23 Apr 2013, at 05:16, Barbara Scrivens <scrivs@...> wrote:

?

Dear Nicola and others following this issue,

?

I received the same worded message this morning regarding the complaint I put to them.

?

Below is my reply. It was returned, so I printed two copies and posted them separately to Michelle McGahan and Adrian Wishbourne at the address on the complaints page, PO Box 1922, Darlington, DL3 0UR.

?

To say I was mortified at BBC?�?s response is an understatement.

?

Kind regards,

Barbara Scrivens

NZ

?

?

From: Barbara Scrivens [mailto:scrivs@]
Sent: Tuesday, 23 April 2013 7:13 a.m.
To: 'bbc_complaints_website@...'
Subject: RE: BBC Complaints - Case number CAS-2059681-D32RXL

?

Dear Michelle,

?

Thank you for your reply, to which I see by the PS, I may not respond to.

?

However, just in case this does get to be read by Adrian Washbourne, please will you let him know:

1)????? ?�?Mr Seldon?�?s comment referring to countries and nations involved in the Holocaust was made in passing in relation to a much wider point about ways of reacting to authority.?�?

?

?�?in passing?�?? I do not agree. One of the things which chilled me was the slow and completely deliberate way Mr Seldon made his comment.

2)????? ?�?It wasn?�?t in any way meant to dispute the facts that Poland was a victim during the Second World War and that the Holocaust was created and engineered by Nazi Germany.?�?

?�?It wasn?�?t in any way meant to dispute the facts?�? I do not agree. Mr Seldon specifically attached Poles to the Germans. His exact words were: ?�?Had the Germans, the Poles, those many Europeans who were involved in the execution of the Holocaust asked why they were doing this...?�? If I were someone not acquainted with the history of World War II, I would have assumed the Poles were the executioners. After all, Auschwitz is on Polish soil.

?

3)????? It was not the editorial intention to raise this topic in the programme, and as you?�?ll no doubt be aware, we cannot control what interviewees choose to reference.

?

?�?cannot control what interviewees choose to reference?�?? I absolutely do not agree. One of the tenets of good journalism is the ability to listen to the interviewee and be flexible, challenge such gross discrepancies. May I suggest your radio interviewers listen to Radio New Zealand National on any morning show. Saturdays and Sundays have in depth-interviews and on Sunday mornings 9.05 (NZ time) there is a regular Media Watch show. ?Kim Hill, on Saturday mornings won the 2012 International Radio Personality of the Year from the Association for International Broadcasting, so I don?�?t think you will be bored.

?

4)????? ?�?Given the passing nature of the comment...?�?

?

?�?passing nature?�?? You are repeating your assumption, with which I do not agree. There was nothing ?�?passing?�? about this comment.

?

5)????? ..and the fact that it was unanticipated within an interview on a wholly different issue it was not unreasonable for the presenter Philip Dodd to move on.?�?

?

?�?unanticipated?�?? Isn?�?t the unanticipated nature of human beings the joy and challenge of interviewing? Isn?�?t that why radio interviews are so revealing and interesting?

?

?�?a wholly different issue?�?? The programme was apparently meant to be examining authority. Why didn?�?t Phillip Dodd do that if Anthony Seldon was at that time the ?�?authority?�??

?

?�?not unreasonable?�?? I do not agree. There was a gross mistake in what the interviewee said. By allowing him to move on and not bring him back to rectify the mistake, if not immediately then soon after, shows agreement with the interviewee.

6)????? ?If he had challenged this - when he had not been briefed on this area ?�“ it would substantially have changed the theme of the discussion.

?�?changed the theme?�?? I do not agree. Challenging authority was the theme. The Poles left in Poland during the war challenged authority at every turn. Have you heard about the Polish ??egota?

?

Michelle, my concerns have not been allayed. Mr Washborne?�?s response has made me uneasy and fearful about the content the BBC is ?�?educating?�? the British public with. I?�?m also uneasy about the fact that the BBC described Mr Seldon as ?�?an educationalist and head of a major institution?�?. He has an influence on young minds. He teaches. If he can?�?t be challenged by an institution such as the BBC, who will challenge him? Who will put him right?

?

Perhaps I?�?m sensitive, but I had hoped that by now, at least the icon of the BBC would accept that Poland was an ally without whom World War II would have turned out very differently. The word ?�?foreigner?�? was one of the first English words I learned. I thought I was being called that because we moved from St Albans to Dunstable. It was only years later that I realised it was because of my foreign-sounding name.

?

I left the UK in 1967. I truly hoped that you lot had grown up by now. It saddens me that you haven?�?t.

?

Regards

Barbara Scrivens

?

?

?

From: bbc_complaints_website@... [mailto:bbc_complaints_website@]
Sent: Tuesday, 23 April 2013 2:42 a.m.
To: Barbara Scrivens
Subject: BBC Complaints - Case number CAS-2059681-D32RXL

?

Dear Mrs Scrivens

Reference CAS-2059681-D32RXL

Thank you for contacting us regarding the Radio 3 programme 'Nightwaves' broadcast 19 March.

We understand you found comments made on the programme offensive.

We forwarded your concerns to the programme production team. The programme Editor Adrian Washbourne responded as follows:

?�?The interview with Anthony Seldon was part of a programme that examined the nature of authority, the extent to which it can be a force for good and how its abuse be can be prevented.

Mr Seldon?�?s comment referring to countries and nations involved in the Holocaust was made in passing in relation to a much wider point about ways of reacting to authority. It wasn?�?t in any way meant to dispute the facts that Poland was a victim during the Second World War and that the Holocaust was created and engineered by Nazi Germany.

It was not the editorial intention to raise this topic in the programme, and as you?�?ll no doubt be aware, we cannot control what interviewees choose to reference. Given the passing nature of the comment and the fact that it was unanticipated within an interview on a wholly different issue it was not unreasonable for the presenter Philip Dodd to move on. If he had challenged this - when he had not been briefed on this area ?�“ it would substantially have changed the theme of the discussion.

We recognise that this is an important issue. Were we to deal with it on a future occasion, we would naturally wish to reflect the range of historical opinion which would be our normal aim and practise.?�?

We hope this response allays your concerns. Nevertheless, we do appreciate you feel strongly regarding this, and as we?�?re guided by feedback such as yours, I?�?d like to assure you that I?�?ve registered your comments on our audience log. This is a report of audience feedback that?�?s compiled daily and made available to staff across the BBC, including members of the BBC Executive Board, channel controllers and other senior managers.

Thanks again for taking the time to contact us.

Kind Regards

Michelle McGahan

BBC Complaints

NB This is sent from an outgoing account only which is not monitored. You cannot reply to this email address but if necessary please contact us via our webform quoting any case number we provided.



?

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[www.Kresy-Siberia.org] Re: Soviet rations supplied to Polish Army 1941/42..what kind? [1 At

 

Janusz

Thank you for this attachment. I had been aware of the story of the
Poles being required to pay for their own support, but it is significant
to see the actual correspondence instead of relying on secondary or
tertiary sources. Lend-lease recipients were evidently well-catered
for.

Regards

Frances




--- In Kresy-Siberia@..., JanZ wrote:

Frances,



The Lend Lease arrangements were not available for refugees. All
supplies to
the refugees had to be paid for in cash by the Polish government.



See the attached correspondence discussing this issue in 1944.



Janusz London



From: Kresy-Siberia@...
[mailto:Kresy-Siberia@...]
On Behalf Of frncsgts@...
Sent: 21 April 2013 10:30
To: Kresy-Siberia@...
Subject: [www.Kresy-Siberia.org] Re: Soviet rations supplied to Polish
Army
1941/42..what kind? [1 At






There was a big production effort in the US for tushonka. I've
attached a
copy of Life Magazine from 29 March 1943, which is an interesting
educational issue about the USSR for its American readers and which
includes
some photographs of tushonka in production.

www.books.google.com.au/books?id=A1AEAAAAMBAJ
sr+meat+%22lend+lease%22+%22tushonka%22&source=bl&ots=MPPskXEv3k&sig=rVR&#92;
x86N
QlT8dQ01W6v2q3XcLQMs&hl=en&sa=X&ei=A5xzUZvkIIahiAeJzoCwDg&ved=0CEYQ6AEwA&#92;
w#v=
onepage&q=ussr%20meat%20%22lend%20lease%22%20%22tushonka%22&f=false>
&pg=PA18&lpg=PA18&dq=ussr+meat+%22lend+lease%22+%22tushonka%22&source=bl&#92;
&ots
=MPPskXEv3k&sig=rVRx86NQlT8dQ01W6v2q3XcLQMs&hl=en&sa=X&ei=A5xzUZvkIIahiA&#92;
eJzo
CwDg&ved=0CEYQ6AEwAw#v=onepage&q=ussr%20meat%20%22lend%20lease%22%20%22t&#92;
usho
nka%22&f=false

The second protocol of the lend-lease policy for supplies to the USSR
-
which was via the Persian Corridor - didn't start until mid-1942.
It's
possible that the Polish troops and refugees may have missed out on
some of
this.

Frances
Sydney

--- In Kresy-Siberia@..., Dan Ford wrote:

From my notes, it appears that one of thet American supplies sent to
Russia through Persia from 1942 to 1945 was tushonka, tinned pork
and
lard that was a staple of the Red Army diet.

Also 15 million pairs of boots. Probably some of those got eaten
too..
-- Dan Ford US
Re: [www.Kresy-Siberia.org] Introducing new member Mark Daly from London, England

Carol Hornby Clements
 

Welcome Mark. Look forward to getting to know you. Glad you are as passionate about Poland as we are.
Carol UK

On Apr 23, 2013 10:12 AM, "Helen Bitner" <helen.bitner@...> wrote:



Dear Group
Please welcome new member Mark who visited our table at the recent WDYTYA exhibition. Mark ?has introduces himself below explaining his background and interests. Welcome once more Mark.?



Kind regards
Helen Bitner
Colchester UK

??
"Dzien dobry, everyone! My name is Mark Daly and I live in Wimbledon, London. I have been a genealogist and historical researcher for 20 years and run?. Although I have no Polish family myself, in the last few years I have become passionate about Poland, its history and particularly the Siberia story. I make a point of helping Brits who know little of their Polish ancestry. My research has included Polish aristocracy, Polish roots in present-day Belarus and Ukraine, the gulags, officers in the Austro-Hungarian Army, First World War Polish refugee camps, Monte Cassino, wartime Krakow and?the UK?resettlement camps.?I spent three months last year touring Poland, Russia and Ukraine in a campervan, getting to the know the region in depth. Absolutely beautiful.
?
I have found the Kresy-Siberia website to be a fantastic memorial and celebration and the people I have met through it?(including Helen Bitner, Eva Szegidewicz, Mirka Wojnar, Martin Stepek and Agata Blaszczyk) have been wonderfully helpful and enthusiastic. The Yahoo discussion group also has some very knowledgeable people on it and I will no doubt have lots of questions in the future. In return, if anyone would like general family history advice or is stuck with something in the UK, France or Italy, please?feel free to ask me through the Yahoo group and I will share?any tips. Czesc, Mark"
?
?
Re: [www.Kresy-Siberia.org] BBC Complaints - Case number CAS-2059681-D32RXL

Helen Bitner
 

开云体育

Barbara and Nicola,
I have also been ?dismissed with the identical letter but signed by Patrick Mc Manus.?
Kind regards
Helen Bitner
UK


On 23 Apr 2013, at 05:16, Barbara Scrivens <scrivs@...> wrote:

?

Dear Nicola and others following this issue,

?

I received the same worded message this morning regarding the complaint I put to them.

?

Below is my reply. It was returned, so I printed two copies and posted them separately to Michelle McGahan and Adrian Wishbourne at the address on the complaints page, PO Box 1922, Darlington, DL3 0UR.

?

To say I was mortified at BBC’s response is an understatement.

?

Kind regards,

Barbara Scrivens

NZ

?

?

From: Barbara Scrivens [mailto:scrivs@]
Sent: Tuesday, 23 April 2013 7:13 a.m.
To: 'bbc_complaints_website@...'
Subject: RE: BBC Complaints - Case number CAS-2059681-D32RXL

?

Dear Michelle,

?

Thank you for your reply, to which I see by the PS, I may not respond to.

?

However, just in case this does get to be read by Adrian Washbourne, please will you let him know:

1)????? “Mr Seldon’s comment referring to countries and nations involved in the Holocaust was made in passing in relation to a much wider point about ways of reacting to authority.”

?

“in passing”? I do not agree. One of the things which chilled me was the slow and completely deliberate way Mr Seldon made his comment.

2)????? “It wasn’t in any way meant to dispute the facts that Poland was a victim during the Second World War and that the Holocaust was created and engineered by Nazi Germany.”

“It wasn’t in any way meant to dispute the facts” I do not agree. Mr Seldon specifically attached Poles to the Germans. His exact words were: “Had the Germans, the Poles, those many Europeans who were involved in the execution of the Holocaust asked why they were doing this...” If I were someone not acquainted with the history of World War II, I would have assumed the Poles were the executioners. After all, Auschwitz is on Polish soil.

?

3)????? It was not the editorial intention to raise this topic in the programme, and as you’ll no doubt be aware, we cannot control what interviewees choose to reference.

?

“cannot control what interviewees choose to reference”? I absolutely do not agree. One of the tenets of good journalism is the ability to listen to the interviewee and be flexible, challenge such gross discrepancies. May I suggest your radio interviewers listen to Radio New Zealand National on any morning show. Saturdays and Sundays have in depth-interviews and on Sunday mornings 9.05 (NZ time) there is a regular Media Watch show. ?Kim Hill, on Saturday mornings won the 2012 International Radio Personality of the Year from the Association for International Broadcasting, so I don’t think you will be bored.

?

4)????? “Given the passing nature of the comment...”

?

“passing nature”? You are repeating your assumption, with which I do not agree. There was nothing “passing” about this comment.

?

5)????? ..and the fact that it was unanticipated within an interview on a wholly different issue it was not unreasonable for the presenter Philip Dodd to move on.”

?

“unanticipated”? Isn’t the unanticipated nature of human beings the joy and challenge of interviewing? Isn’t that why radio interviews are so revealing and interesting?

?

“a wholly different issue”? The programme was apparently meant to be examining authority. Why didn’t Phillip Dodd do that if Anthony Seldon was at that time the “authority”?

?

“not unreasonable”? I do not agree. There was a gross mistake in what the interviewee said. By allowing him to move on and not bring him back to rectify the mistake, if not immediately then soon after, shows agreement with the interviewee.

6)????? ?If he had challenged this - when he had not been briefed on this area – it would substantially have changed the theme of the discussion.

“changed the theme”? I do not agree. Challenging authority was the theme. The Poles left in Poland during the war challenged authority at every turn. Have you heard about the Polish ?egota?

?

Michelle, my concerns have not been allayed. Mr Washborne’s response has made me uneasy and fearful about the content the BBC is ‘educating’ the British public with. I’m also uneasy about the fact that the BBC described Mr Seldon as “an educationalist and head of a major institution”. He has an influence on young minds. He teaches. If he can’t be challenged by an institution such as the BBC, who will challenge him? Who will put him right?

?

Perhaps I’m sensitive, but I had hoped that by now, at least the icon of the BBC would accept that Poland was an ally without whom World War II would have turned out very differently. The word “foreigner” was one of the first English words I learned. I thought I was being called that because we moved from St Albans to Dunstable. It was only years later that I realised it was because of my foreign-sounding name.

?

I left the UK in 1967. I truly hoped that you lot had grown up by now. It saddens me that you haven’t.

?

Regards

Barbara Scrivens

?

?

?

From: bbc_complaints_website@... [mailto:bbc_complaints_website@]
Sent: Tuesday, 23 April 2013 2:42 a.m.
To: Barbara Scrivens
Subject: BBC Complaints - Case number CAS-2059681-D32RXL

?

Dear Mrs Scrivens

Reference CAS-2059681-D32RXL

Thank you for contacting us regarding the Radio 3 programme 'Nightwaves' broadcast 19 March.

We understand you found comments made on the programme offensive.

We forwarded your concerns to the programme production team. The programme Editor Adrian Washbourne responded as follows:

“The interview with Anthony Seldon was part of a programme that examined the nature of authority, the extent to which it can be a force for good and how its abuse be can be prevented.

Mr Seldon’s comment referring to countries and nations involved in the Holocaust was made in passing in relation to a much wider point about ways of reacting to authority. It wasn’t in any way meant to dispute the facts that Poland was a victim during the Second World War and that the Holocaust was created and engineered by Nazi Germany.

It was not the editorial intention to raise this topic in the programme, and as you’ll no doubt be aware, we cannot control what interviewees choose to reference. Given the passing nature of the comment and the fact that it was unanticipated within an interview on a wholly different issue it was not unreasonable for the presenter Philip Dodd to move on. If he had challenged this - when he had not been briefed on this area – it would substantially have changed the theme of the discussion.

We recognise that this is an important issue. Were we to deal with it on a future occasion, we would naturally wish to reflect the range of historical opinion which would be our normal aim and practise.”

We hope this response allays your concerns. Nevertheless, we do appreciate you feel strongly regarding this, and as we’re guided by feedback such as yours, I’d like to assure you that I’ve registered your comments on our audience log. This is a report of audience feedback that’s compiled daily and made available to staff across the BBC, including members of the BBC Executive Board, channel controllers and other senior managers.

Thanks again for taking the time to contact us.

Kind Regards

Michelle McGahan

BBC Complaints

NB This is sent from an outgoing account only which is not monitored. You cannot reply to this email address but if necessary please contact us via our webform quoting any case number we provided.



?

No virus found in this incoming message.
Checked by AVG -
Version: 9.0.932 / Virus Database: 2641.1.1/5759 - Release Date: 04/22/13 04:50:00
Re: [www.Kresy-Siberia.org] Introducing new member Mark Daly from London, England

 

开云体育

Mark welcome to group and oh my goodness, from what is written in your first introduction, there will be a wonderful mutual exchange of information with KS group members and yourself.

Warmest regards

Pozdrawiena

Lenarda, Sydney, Australia

?

From: Kresy-Siberia@... [mailto:Kresy-Siberia@...] On Behalf Of Helen Bitner
Sent: Tuesday, 23 April, 2013 7:12 PM
To: Kresy-Siberia@...
Subject: [www.Kresy-Siberia.org] Introducing new member Mark Daly from London, England

?

?

Dear Group

Please welcome new member Mark who visited our table at the recent WDYTYA exhibition. Mark ?has introduces himself below explaining his background and interests. Welcome once more Mark.?

?

?

?

Kind regards

Helen Bitner

Colchester UK

?

??

"Dzien dobry, everyone! My name is Mark Daly and I live in Wimbledon, London. I have been a genealogist and historical researcher for 20 years and run?. Although I have no Polish family myself, in the last few years I have become passionate about Poland, its history and particularly the Siberia story. I make a point of helping Brits who know little of their Polish ancestry. My research has included Polish aristocracy, Polish roots in present-day Belarus and Ukraine, the gulags, officers in the Austro-Hungarian Army, First World War Polish refugee camps, Monte Cassino, wartime Krakow and?the UK?resettlement camps.?I spent three months last year touring Poland, Russia and Ukraine in a campervan, getting to the know the region in depth. Absolutely beautiful.

?

I have found the Kresy-Siberia website to be a fantastic memorial and celebration and the people I have met through it?(including Helen Bitner, Eva Szegidewicz, Mirka Wojnar, Martin Stepek and Agata Blaszczyk) have been wonderfully helpful and enthusiastic. The Yahoo discussion group also has some very knowledgeable people on it and I will no doubt have lots of questions in the future. In return, if anyone would like general family history advice or is stuck with something in the UK, France or Italy, please?feel free to ask me through the Yahoo group and I will share?any tips. Czesc, Mark"

?

?
Introducing new member Mark Daly from London, England

Helen Bitner
 

开云体育

Dear Group
Please welcome new member Mark who visited our table at the recent WDYTYA exhibition. Mark ?has introduces himself below explaining his background and interests. Welcome once more Mark.?



Kind regards
Helen Bitner
Colchester UK

??
"Dzien dobry, everyone! My name is Mark Daly and I live in Wimbledon, London. I have been a genealogist and historical researcher for 20 years and run?. Although I have no Polish family myself, in the last few years I have become passionate about Poland, its history and particularly the Siberia story. I make a point of helping Brits who know little of their Polish ancestry. My research has included Polish aristocracy, Polish roots in present-day Belarus and Ukraine, the gulags, officers in the Austro-Hungarian Army, First World War Polish refugee camps, Monte Cassino, wartime Krakow and?the UK?resettlement camps.?I spent three months last year touring Poland, Russia and Ukraine in a campervan, getting to the know the region in depth. Absolutely beautiful.
?
I have found the Kresy-Siberia website to be a fantastic memorial and celebration and the people I have met through it?(including Helen Bitner, Eva Szegidewicz, Mirka Wojnar, Martin Stepek and Agata Blaszczyk) have been wonderfully helpful and enthusiastic. The Yahoo discussion group also has some very knowledgeable people on it and I will no doubt have lots of questions in the future. In return, if anyone would like general family history advice or is stuck with something in the UK, France or Italy, please?feel free to ask me through the Yahoo group and I will share?any tips. Czesc, Mark"
?
?
Re: [www.Kresy-Siberia.org] New Polska Walczaca lists

 

Thank you so much for these lists.

Kind regards

Beata (Skotna-Nikiel) Hanks
Melton Mowbray UK

From: JanZ
To: Kresy-Siberia@...
Sent: Monday, 22 April 2013, 20:58
Subject: [www.Kresy-Siberia.org] New Polska Walczaca lists

?
?
The following three lists contain names of some of the deported. The lists were published in the London newspaper "Polska Walczaca" between 1943 and 1944.
?
The first of these lists was supplied to the Kresy group a few years ago, but I think the other two lists are new. The originals are available in the POSK library in London, UK.
  • Osoby wyewakuowane z ZSSR (Persons evacuated from the USSR)
  • Adresy rodzin wojskowych w ZSSR (Addresses of army families in the USSR)
  • Polacy przebywajacy w Teheranie (Poles in Teheran)
?
Before they apear on the Kresy web site, you can get copies from here:
?
I've passed the two lists through an OCR programme, so they are searchable but be warned that not every thing will be found, so worth a manual check. Also be aware that the files are very large and will take some time to load.?
?
?
I've also included a file with some relevant articles on the Polish Army in Russia, the Cadets and Pestki.
?
?
?
?
Janusz
?
FW: BBC Complaints - Case number CAS-2059681-D32RXL

Barbara Scrivens
 

开云体育

Dear Nicola and others following this issue,

?

I received the same worded message this morning regarding the complaint I put to them.

?

Below is my reply. It was returned, so I printed two copies and posted them separately to Michelle McGahan and Adrian Wishbourne at the address on the complaints page, PO Box 1922, Darlington, DL3 0UR.

?

To say I was mortified at BBC’s response is an understatement.

?

Kind regards,

Barbara Scrivens

NZ

?

?

From: Barbara Scrivens [mailto:scrivs@...]
Sent: Tuesday, 23 April 2013 7:13 a.m.
To: 'bbc_complaints_website@...'
Subject: RE: BBC Complaints - Case number CAS-2059681-D32RXL

?

Dear Michelle,

?

Thank you for your reply, to which I see by the PS, I may not respond to.

?

However, just in case this does get to be read by Adrian Washbourne, please will you let him know:

1)????? “Mr Seldon’s comment referring to countries and nations involved in the Holocaust was made in passing in relation to a much wider point about ways of reacting to authority.”

?

“in passing”? I do not agree. One of the things which chilled me was the slow and completely deliberate way Mr Seldon made his comment.

2)????? “It wasn’t in any way meant to dispute the facts that Poland was a victim during the Second World War and that the Holocaust was created and engineered by Nazi Germany.”

“It wasn’t in any way meant to dispute the facts” I do not agree. Mr Seldon specifically attached Poles to the Germans. His exact words were: “Had the Germans, the Poles, those many Europeans who were involved in the execution of the Holocaust asked why they were doing this...” If I were someone not acquainted with the history of World War II, I would have assumed the Poles were the executioners. After all, Auschwitz is on Polish soil.

?

3)????? It was not the editorial intention to raise this topic in the programme, and as you’ll no doubt be aware, we cannot control what interviewees choose to reference.

?

“cannot control what interviewees choose to reference”? I absolutely do not agree. One of the tenets of good journalism is the ability to listen to the interviewee and be flexible, challenge such gross discrepancies. May I suggest your radio interviewers listen to Radio New Zealand National on any morning show. Saturdays and Sundays have in depth-interviews and on Sunday mornings 9.05 (NZ time) there is a regular Media Watch show. ?Kim Hill, on Saturday mornings won the 2012 International Radio Personality of the Year from the Association for International Broadcasting, so I don’t think you will be bored.

?

4)????? “Given the passing nature of the comment...”

?

“passing nature”? You are repeating your assumption, with which I do not agree. There was nothing “passing” about this comment.

?

5)????? ..and the fact that it was unanticipated within an interview on a wholly different issue it was not unreasonable for the presenter Philip Dodd to move on.”

?

“unanticipated”? Isn’t the unanticipated nature of human beings the joy and challenge of interviewing? Isn’t that why radio interviews are so revealing and interesting?

?

“a wholly different issue”? The programme was apparently meant to be examining authority. Why didn’t Phillip Dodd do that if Anthony Seldon was at that time the “authority”?

?

“not unreasonable”? I do not agree. There was a gross mistake in what the interviewee said. By allowing him to move on and not bring him back to rectify the mistake, if not immediately then soon after, shows agreement with the interviewee.

6)????? ?If he had challenged this - when he had not been briefed on this area – it would substantially have changed the theme of the discussion.

“changed the theme”? I do not agree. Challenging authority was the theme. The Poles left in Poland during the war challenged authority at every turn. Have you heard about the Polish ?egota?

?

Michelle, my concerns have not been allayed. Mr Washborne’s response has made me uneasy and fearful about the content the BBC is ‘educating’ the British public with. I’m also uneasy about the fact that the BBC described Mr Seldon as “an educationalist and head of a major institution”. He has an influence on young minds. He teaches. If he can’t be challenged by an institution such as the BBC, who will challenge him? Who will put him right?

?

Perhaps I’m sensitive, but I had hoped that by now, at least the icon of the BBC would accept that Poland was an ally without whom World War II would have turned out very differently. The word “foreigner” was one of the first English words I learned. I thought I was being called that because we moved from St Albans to Dunstable. It was only years later that I realised it was because of my foreign-sounding name.

?

I left the UK in 1967. I truly hoped that you lot had grown up by now. It saddens me that you haven’t.

?

Regards

Barbara Scrivens

?

?

?

From: bbc_complaints_website@... [mailto:bbc_complaints_website@...]
Sent: Tuesday, 23 April 2013 2:42 a.m.
To: Barbara Scrivens
Subject: BBC Complaints - Case number CAS-2059681-D32RXL

?

Dear Mrs Scrivens

Reference CAS-2059681-D32RXL

Thank you for contacting us regarding the Radio 3 programme 'Nightwaves' broadcast 19 March.

We understand you found comments made on the programme offensive.

We forwarded your concerns to the programme production team. The programme Editor Adrian Washbourne responded as follows:

“The interview with Anthony Seldon was part of a programme that examined the nature of authority, the extent to which it can be a force for good and how its abuse be can be prevented.

Mr Seldon’s comment referring to countries and nations involved in the Holocaust was made in passing in relation to a much wider point about ways of reacting to authority. It wasn’t in any way meant to dispute the facts that Poland was a victim during the Second World War and that the Holocaust was created and engineered by Nazi Germany.

It was not the editorial intention to raise this topic in the programme, and as you’ll no doubt be aware, we cannot control what interviewees choose to reference. Given the passing nature of the comment and the fact that it was unanticipated within an interview on a wholly different issue it was not unreasonable for the presenter Philip Dodd to move on. If he had challenged this - when he had not been briefed on this area – it would substantially have changed the theme of the discussion.

We recognise that this is an important issue. Were we to deal with it on a future occasion, we would naturally wish to reflect the range of historical opinion which would be our normal aim and practise.”

We hope this response allays your concerns. Nevertheless, we do appreciate you feel strongly regarding this, and as we’re guided by feedback such as yours, I’d like to assure you that I’ve registered your comments on our audience log. This is a report of audience feedback that’s compiled daily and made available to staff across the BBC, including members of the BBC Executive Board, channel controllers and other senior managers.

Thanks again for taking the time to contact us.

Kind Regards

Michelle McGahan

BBC Complaints

NB This is sent from an outgoing account only which is not monitored. You cannot reply to this email address but if necessary please contact us via our webform quoting any case number we provided.



?

No virus found in this incoming message.
Checked by AVG -
Version: 9.0.932 / Virus Database: 2641.1.1/5759 - Release Date: 04/22/13 04:50:00
Re: [www.Kresy-Siberia.org] Re: Lecture by Dr Monica Janowski in London in June

 

Have to agree with Krystyna.

I think Dr Janowski's intent and heart are in the right place.
If anything a polite email or word during her lecture and I'm
sure she will gladly correct/edit her oversight.

Chris Calgary

From: "kms0902@..."
To: Kresy-Siberia@...
Sent: Monday, April 22, 2013 3:37:28 PM
Subject: [www.Kresy-Siberia.org] Re: Lecture by Dr Monica Janowski in London in June

?
Hi Stan,
?
I would not be too concerned about information in a Wikipedia article – no serious historian uses Wikipedia as a proper reference anyway.?
?
Here, in North America, famous comedians constantly refer to Wikipedia in the jokes that they tell – indicating that anything you find there cannot be relied upon as being fact.
?
Krystyna
Winnipeg, Canada
?
?

Sent: Monday, April 22, 2013 1:11 PM
Subject: Re: [www.Kresy-Siberia.org] Lecture by Dr Monica Janowski in London in June
Hi!
It is sad to see the so-called history science of UK.

The doctor Janowski:
"On September 17, 1939 the Soviet Union invaded Poland, two weeks after Germany had invaded from the west. They deported large numbers of ethnic Poles (the numbers are unclear and vary a good deal depending on source; Wikipedia estimates 4.5 million—http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Population_transfer_in_the_Soviet_Union) to Siberia and Kazakhstan..."
Posts are searchable

 

Hi,

I just did a google search on my name to see what information is out there on my name (for privacy reasons). I was a little shocked that my posts to this group came up in the search. Is there a way to delete my posts, or make posts private (unsearchable in google)?

Thank you.
Re: [www.Kresy-Siberia.org] Introducing new member Bruce Trybus from Fort Lauderdale Florida, USA

 

开云体育

Bruce, welcome to group, I know the members of KS will be happy to assist you in putting the pieces together of your family history. Also, from what is written, you have a lot to share with us, which will be of historical value for our records and other members of group in their journey of research.

Warmest regards,

Lenarda, Sydney, Australia

?

From: Kresy-Siberia@... [mailto:Kresy-Siberia@...] On Behalf Of Helen Bitner
Sent: Tuesday, 23 April, 2013 7:43 AM
To: Kresy-Siberia@...
Subject: [www.Kresy-Siberia.org] Introducing new member Bruce Trybus from Fort Lauderdale Florida, USA

?

?



Dear Group
Please welcome Bruce to the group. Bruce's father is Adolf Jan Trybus born May 15, 1933 in Urytwa, Poland (now Urytva, Ukraine) (near Kosova). Adolf is the second-youngest surviving son of Sczcepan and Agniezska Trybus who moved to Urytwa from the Szymbark area in the early 1920s, and were in one of the "colonies" there where they farmed very successfully before being deported to Siberia by the Russians in February1940. Adolf's baby brother Antosz died while they were travelling from Krasnoyarsk to Zimovaya Teia by sleigh. There was a post from a lady named Karolinka in 2010 whose family seems to have come from the same area and may even have been on the same train because they also ended up there. Bruce would like very much to contact Karolinka

Sczcepan's oldest son Frank was in the Polish army and was captured by the Germans; he survived the war. The next oldest, a daughter named Julika, died in Zimovaya Teia,as did the father, Sczcepan. Both of them and the mother, Agniezska, worked in the forests. The third child was Jan, who was sent to work in a gold mine 40 kilometres away; after the father died he was allowed to return to Zimovaya Teia. The other children were Karol, born in 1929, and Adolf.

After ' amnesty' the family made their way south to Kazakhstan, where Jan joined the Polish army and Agniezska died, probably from typhus. That left only Karol and Adolf, as orphans. They were taken to Persia (Isfahan) and then to Lebanon, where a ship took them to Oudtshoorn in South Africa. Later Adolf moved to Rhodesia, where Bruce was born. Adolf now lives in Johannesburg. Karol passed away two years ago.

In 2002 Bruce took his father to Poland, where they saw his relatives, and to Urytva, where an old Ukrainian woman who used to be one of Julika's friends remembered the family. That was the first time Adolf had visited either place since the war.
Bruce videoed an interview of his father and Karol before he died and is now writing a brief account of their experience. He is thinking about trying to find Zimovaya Teia and going there for a visit.

Thank you Bruce for such a detailed account of your family's tragic experiences. I look forward to seeing your written account of your father's life. Will you put it into the KSVM Hall of Memories?
I also wrote up the voice recordings of my husband's reminiscences about his family's deportation and eventual journey to freedom at

(

Kind regards
Helen Bitner
Colchester UK
Re: new member Bruce Trybus from Fort Lauderdale Florida, USA

 

开云体育

Dear Bruce,
?
Your father’s information on the Wall of Names came from the following source (as shown on the profile):
Polish Children’s Home, Oudtshoorn, South Africa 1942-1947 (compiled by Robert Weiss)
?
Information that comes from archival source lists may sometimes contain inaccurate details because of typing errors, so I invite you to correct your father’s details, add more information to the Wall of Names profile by filling in the online form, and adding a photo of your father from his early years, so as to complete the profile.
?
I invite all of our members to do likewise ...... to complete your family information and add a photo to their Wall of Names profile, or to add a profile for any family member not yet appearing on the Wall.? You will find ADD PERSON and EDIT PERSON tabs – these open up the online form and present you with an easy-to-follow form to fill in.?
?
This is an opportunity to honour the experiences and sacrifices of our family members, and I hope that you will seize the opportunity for your family members.? They all deserve to be honoured and remembered.
?
Kind regards,
Krystyna
Winnipeg, Canada
?
?

Sent: Monday, April 22, 2013 5:53 PM
Subject: [www.Kresy-Siberia.org] Re: Introducing new member Bruce Trybus from Fort Lauderdale Florida, USA
?
?

Thank you for allowing me to join the group. Please note that my father's date of birth, from the wall of names, is inaccurate. I tease him about this sometimes, telling him he is older than he is. Karolinka, I would very much appreciate the map - I have been unable to find one on-line, probably because of the Cyrillic alphabet. I have probably 20 or 30 pages completed about his experiences in Urytva and Siberia and I will be happy to post it for the group when it is done, which I hope to complete in time to send him for his 80th birthday early next month.

Bruce.

--- In mailto:Kresy-Siberia%40yahoogroups.com, "karolinkamichalczyszyn" wrote:
>
> Hi Bruce,
> I have a map! Unfortunately I am travelling overseas for work at present and won't be able to get it to you until I get home. But, from memory, Teya is a tributary of the Velmo river. Zimovaya Teya (not sure if my spelling is correct) is a settlement next to the Teya river.
>
> My father (Jan Michalcsyszyn) operated the barge that drove the logs down the stream; the rest of the men were in the taiga cutting down trees. My uncle Stanislaw climbed trees, knocked down pine cones and roasted them to get the seeds inside. because there was so little food, this one enterprise kept the family fed.
>
> my babcia Maria also died from typhus after the family escaped to Kazakhstan.
>
> Wow, - so many stories.
>
> I will be in contact when i return to Melbourne.
>
> Karolinka
>
> --- In mailto:Kresy-Siberia%40yahoogroups.com, Helen Bitner wrote:
> >
> >
> >
> > Dear Group
> > Please welcome Bruce to the group. Bruce's father is Adolf Jan Trybus born May 15, 1933 in Urytwa, Poland (now Urytva, Ukraine) (near Kosova). Adolf is the second-youngest surviving son of Sczcepan and Agniezska Trybus who moved to Urytwa from the Szymbark area in the early 1920s, and were in one of the "colonies" there where they farmed very successfully before being deported to Siberia by the Russians in February1940. Adolf's baby brother Antosz died while they were travelling from Krasnoyarsk to Zimovaya Teia by sleigh. There was a post from a lady named Karolinka in 2010 whose family seems to have come from the same area and may even have been on the same train because they also ended up there. Bruce would like very much to contact Karolinka
> >
> > Sczcepan's oldest son Frank was in the Polish army and was captured by the Germans; he survived the war. The next oldest, a daughter named Julika, died in Zimovaya Teia,as did the father, Sczcepan. Both of them and the mother, Agniezska, worked in the forests. The third child was Jan, who was sent to work in a gold mine 40 kilometres away; after the father died he was allowed to return to Zimovaya Teia. The other children were Karol, born in 1929, and Adolf.
> >
> > After ' amnesty' the family made their way south to Kazakhstan, where Jan joined the Polish army and Agniezska died, probably from typhus. That left only Karol and Adolf, as orphans. They were taken to Persia (Isfahan) and then to Lebanon, where a ship took them to Oudtshoorn in South Africa. Later Adolf moved to Rhodesia, where Bruce was born. Adolf now lives in Johannesburg. Karol passed away two years ago.
> >
> > In 2002 Bruce took his father to Poland, where they saw his relatives, and to Urytva, where an old Ukrainian woman who used to be one of Julika's friends remembered the family. That was the first time Adolf had visited either place since the war.
> > Bruce videoed an interview of his father and Karol before he died and is now writing a brief account of their experience. He is thinking about trying to find Zimovaya Teia and going there for a visit.
> >
> > Thank you Bruce for such a detailed account of your family's tragic experiences. I look forward to seeing your written account of your father's life. Will you put it into the KSVM Hall of Memories?
> > I also wrote up the voice recordings of my husband's reminiscences about his family's deportation and eventual journey to freedom at
> >
> > (
> >
> >
> > Kind regards
> > Helen Bitner
> > Colchester UK
> >
>
Re: Bruce Trybus from Fort Lauderdale Florida, USA

 

I will do that Krystyna, thanks.

Bruce.

--- In Kresy-Siberia@..., <kms0902@...> wrote:

Dear Bruce,

Welcome to the group! I trust that our members will help you with any research enquiries you may have.

I hope that you will share your recordings with us. Please contact me directly at Krystyna.Szypowska@... so that we can discuss how best to do this. I can also answer any questions you may have regarding uploading materials to the Hall of Memory.

Looking forward to hearing from you.
Krystyna
Winnipeg, Canada


From: Helen Bitner
Sent: Monday, April 22, 2013 4:42 PM
To: Kresy-Siberia@...
Subject: [www.Kresy-Siberia.org] Introducing new member Bruce Trybus from Fort Lauderdale Florida, USA


Dear Group
Please welcome Bruce to the group. Bruce's father is Adolf Jan Trybus born May 15, 1933 in Urytwa, Poland (now Urytva, Ukraine) (near Kosova). Adolf is the second-youngest surviving son of Sczcepan and Agniezska Trybus who moved to Urytwa from the Szymbark area in the early 1920s, and were in one of the "colonies" there where they farmed very successfully before being deported to Siberia by the Russians in February1940. Adolf's baby brother Antosz died while they were travelling from Krasnoyarsk to Zimovaya Teia by sleigh. There was a post from a lady named Karolinka in 2010 whose family seems to have come from the same area and may even have been on the same train because they also ended up there. Bruce would like very much to contact Karolinka

Sczcepan's oldest son Frank was in the Polish army and was captured by the Germans; he survived the war. The next oldest, a daughter named Julika, died in Zimovaya Teia,as did the father, Sczcepan. Both of them and the mother, Agniezska, worked in the forests. The third child was Jan, who was sent to work in a gold mine 40 kilometres away; after the father died he was allowed to return to Zimovaya Teia. The other children were Karol, born in 1929, and Adolf.

After ' amnesty' the family made their way south to Kazakhstan, where Jan joined the Polish army and Agniezska died, probably from typhus. That left only Karol and Adolf, as orphans. They were taken to Persia (Isfahan) and then to Lebanon, where a ship took them to Oudtshoorn in South Africa. Later Adolf moved to Rhodesia, where Bruce was born. Adolf now lives in Johannesburg. Karol passed away two years ago.

In 2002 Bruce took his father to Poland, where they saw his relatives, and to Urytva, where an old Ukrainian woman who used to be one of Julika's friends remembered the family. That was the first time Adolf had visited either place since the war.
Bruce videoed an interview of his father and Karol before he died and is now writing a brief account of their experience. He is thinking about trying to find Zimovaya Teia and going there for a visit.

Thank you Bruce for such a detailed account of your family's tragic experiences. I look forward to seeing your written account of your father's life. Will you put it into the KSVM Hall of Memories?
I also wrote up the voice recordings of my husband's reminiscences about his family's deportation and eventual journey to freedom at

(

Kind regards
Helen Bitner
Colchester UK
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Re: Introducing new member Bruce Trybus from Fort Lauderdale Florida, USA

 

Thank you for allowing me to join the group. Please note that my father's date of birth, from the wall of names, is inaccurate. I tease him about this sometimes, telling him he is older than he is. Karolinka, I would very much appreciate the map - I have been unable to find one on-line, probably because of the Cyrillic alphabet. I have probably 20 or 30 pages completed about his experiences in Urytva and Siberia and I will be happy to post it for the group when it is done, which I hope to complete in time to send him for his 80th birthday early next month.

Bruce.

--- In Kresy-Siberia@..., "karolinkamichalczyszyn" <hamc@...> wrote:

Hi Bruce,
I have a map! Unfortunately I am travelling overseas for work at present and won't be able to get it to you until I get home. But, from memory, Teya is a tributary of the Velmo river. Zimovaya Teya (not sure if my spelling is correct) is a settlement next to the Teya river.

My father (Jan Michalcsyszyn) operated the barge that drove the logs down the stream; the rest of the men were in the taiga cutting down trees. My uncle Stanislaw climbed trees, knocked down pine cones and roasted them to get the seeds inside. because there was so little food, this one enterprise kept the family fed.

my babcia Maria also died from typhus after the family escaped to Kazakhstan.

Wow, - so many stories.

I will be in contact when i return to Melbourne.

Karolinka

--- In Kresy-Siberia@..., Helen Bitner <helen.bitner@> wrote:



Dear Group
Please welcome Bruce to the group. Bruce's father is Adolf Jan Trybus born May 15, 1933 in Urytwa, Poland (now Urytva, Ukraine) (near Kosova). Adolf is the second-youngest surviving son of Sczcepan and Agniezska Trybus who moved to Urytwa from the Szymbark area in the early 1920s, and were in one of the "colonies" there where they farmed very successfully before being deported to Siberia by the Russians in February1940. Adolf's baby brother Antosz died while they were travelling from Krasnoyarsk to Zimovaya Teia by sleigh. There was a post from a lady named Karolinka in 2010 whose family seems to have come from the same area and may even have been on the same train because they also ended up there. Bruce would like very much to contact Karolinka

Sczcepan's oldest son Frank was in the Polish army and was captured by the Germans; he survived the war. The next oldest, a daughter named Julika, died in Zimovaya Teia,as did the father, Sczcepan. Both of them and the mother, Agniezska, worked in the forests. The third child was Jan, who was sent to work in a gold mine 40 kilometres away; after the father died he was allowed to return to Zimovaya Teia. The other children were Karol, born in 1929, and Adolf.

After ' amnesty' the family made their way south to Kazakhstan, where Jan joined the Polish army and Agniezska died, probably from typhus. That left only Karol and Adolf, as orphans. They were taken to Persia (Isfahan) and then to Lebanon, where a ship took them to Oudtshoorn in South Africa. Later Adolf moved to Rhodesia, where Bruce was born. Adolf now lives in Johannesburg. Karol passed away two years ago.

In 2002 Bruce took his father to Poland, where they saw his relatives, and to Urytva, where an old Ukrainian woman who used to be one of Julika's friends remembered the family. That was the first time Adolf had visited either place since the war.
Bruce videoed an interview of his father and Karol before he died and is now writing a brief account of their experience. He is thinking about trying to find Zimovaya Teia and going there for a visit.

Thank you Bruce for such a detailed account of your family's tragic experiences. I look forward to seeing your written account of your father's life. Will you put it into the KSVM Hall of Memories?
I also wrote up the voice recordings of my husband's reminiscences about his family's deportation and eventual journey to freedom at

(


Kind regards
Helen Bitner
Colchester UK
7521 - 7540 of 63086