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I have a client who is trying to use a commercial software package called Methasoft in an addiction treatment clinic, and it's an accessibility nightmare.? Parts of it clearly get exposed to JAWS, and others don't, making it very difficult to know exactly where you are and what you're doing at any given moment.? I have already started discussions about the need for custom scripting, but that will not occur in short order, so I'm looking for possible workarounds in the meantime.

I will give one example, in one dialog, as something we're facing.? If you go to do a patient lookup, none of the search edit boxes are labeled, but, because we only use patient ID number or patient surname, it's easy to know that you enter ID number in the first edit box, and surname in the third, if you're using each, respectively.? But if you are using either the ID number or surname, and perform the search, there is a table where the resulting patient(s) are presented in a list that I cannot gain access to by keyboard for love nor money.? However, the information needed is visible on screen, and if we could get it read to us, via any technique, that would go a long way at the moment.

I have not dealt with the need to "virtualize" screens that don't read by usual methods, but I seem to recall that can be done.? Sort of like OCRing the dialog itself and dealing with the resulting text document.? Can this sort of thing be done, and, if there's more than one way to do it, what method is likely best?

By the way, Methasoft is not a web app, so most of the keyboard shortcuts one might be able to use if it were do not apply.? For instance, I can't use the T shortcut to locate that table in the dialog, which is one of the major problems.? I have only been able to access the data returned there by point and click, which is useless to a screen reader user since pointing is not an option (though clicking can be).

Any ideas that anyone might have to offer as far as getting some sort of access would be appreciated.? Realize that I know that anything suggested is a stopgap, workaround measure.? I'm not trying to leave the client with a piece of inaccessible software that she can only get partial access to in order to do her job.? But even partial, or more partial than we've got now, is a step forward.
--

Brian??·?♂??·??????-?Virginia, USA?-?Windows 11 Pro, Version 23H2, Build 22631;?M365 Family;?Android 13 (MIUI 14)

I prefer true but imperfect knowledge, even if it leaves much undetermined and unpredictable, to a pretense of exact knowledge that is likely to be false.

?? ~ ?F.A. Hayeky

Brian,

If I didn't need to interact with the list, I would try JAWS' touch
cursor. You can actually interact with the touch cursor but all you
can do is click on things.

Something else you might try is to try various settings for using MSAA
for lists and which MSAA mode to use. These are all in the settings
center (JAWS+6) under the Miscellaneous section.

hth
Gene...

On Sat, Apr 27, 2024 at 2:31?PM Brian Vogel via groups.io
<britechguy@...> wrote:

I have a client who is trying to use a commercial software package called Methasoft in an addiction treatment clinic, and it's an accessibility nightmare. Parts of it clearly get exposed to JAWS, and others don't, making it very difficult to know exactly where you are and what you're doing at any given moment. I have already started discussions about the need for custom scripting, but that will not occur in short order, so I'm looking for possible workarounds in the meantime.

I will give one example, in one dialog, as something we're facing. If you go to do a patient lookup, none of the search edit boxes are labeled, but, because we only use patient ID number or patient surname, it's easy to know that you enter ID number in the first edit box, and surname in the third, if you're using each, respectively. But if you are using either the ID number or surname, and perform the search, there is a table where the resulting patient(s) are presented in a list that I cannot gain access to by keyboard for love nor money. However, the information needed is visible on screen, and if we could get it read to us, via any technique, that would go a long way at the moment.

I have not dealt with the need to "virtualize" screens that don't read by usual methods, but I seem to recall that can be done. Sort of like OCRing the dialog itself and dealing with the resulting text document. Can this sort of thing be done, and, if there's more than one way to do it, what method is likely best?

By the way, Methasoft is not a web app, so most of the keyboard shortcuts one might be able to use if it were do not apply. For instance, I can't use the T shortcut to locate that table in the dialog, which is one of the major problems. I have only been able to access the data returned there by point and click, which is useless to a screen reader user since pointing is not an option (though clicking can be).

Any ideas that anyone might have to offer as far as getting some sort of access would be appreciated. Realize that I know that anything suggested is a stopgap, workaround measure. I'm not trying to leave the client with a piece of inaccessible software that she can only get partial access to in order to do her job. But even partial, or more partial than we've got now, is a step forward.
--

Brian · ♂? · ???? - Virginia, USA - Windows 11 Pro, Version 23H2, Build 22631; M365 Family; Android 13 (MIUI 14)

I prefer true but imperfect knowledge, even if it leaves much undetermined and unpredictable, to a pretense of exact knowledge that is likely to be false.

~ F.A. Hayeky

Brian,

Something else you might try, this is also in the Miscellaneous
section of the settings center, try turning on or off the
accessibility driver, most of the time I barely notice the difference,
but every once in a blue moon it actually helps!

Again, hth.
Gene...

Thanks Gene.

Is the JAWS touch cursor meant to be used with a touch screen?? This is one thing I've never delved into very much.? If it does require touchscreen that's not something we do not have on this particular machine.

I really dislike the way Freedom Scientific named the various cursors.? The JAWS Cursor is, I think, the virtual cursor JAWS works from.? The PC cursor is, in reality, pretty much what has focus, and that also generally relates to what the mouse last clicked on or that you tabbed to to gain focus on it (or navigated otherwise).? The Touch Cursor, I'm not so sure.

And for all I know, I could be mixing up the JAWS and PC cursors.? I really prefer the terminology scheme that NVDA uses for these things, as they equate more closely to something a sighted assistant (or sighted person, period) recognizes as analogous to what's being manipulated.
--

Brian??·?♂??·??????-?Virginia, USA?-?Windows 11 Pro, Version 23H2, Build 22631;?M365 Family;?Android 13 (MIUI 14)

I prefer true but imperfect knowledge, even if it leaves much undetermined and unpredictable, to a pretense of exact knowledge that is likely to be false.

?? ~ ?F.A. Hayek

Brian,

No, a better name for the touch cursor would be object browser. It
allows you to browse the objects on the screen within the active
window. It's great for seeing what's on some screens, but all you can
do is click you can't manipulate a combo box control. And I agree with
you, when the touch cursor was first introduced, I thought it was for
touch screens too.

hth
Gene...

On Sat, Apr 27, 2024 at 3:39?PM Brian Vogel via groups.io
<britechguy@...> wrote:

Thanks Gene.

Is the JAWS touch cursor meant to be used with a touch screen? This is one thing I've never delved into very much. If it does require touchscreen that's not something we do not have on this particular machine.

I really dislike the way Freedom Scientific named the various cursors. The JAWS Cursor is, I think, the virtual cursor JAWS works from. The PC cursor is, in reality, pretty much what has focus, and that also generally relates to what the mouse last clicked on or that you tabbed to to gain focus on it (or navigated otherwise). The Touch Cursor, I'm not so sure.

And for all I know, I could be mixing up the JAWS and PC cursors. I really prefer the terminology scheme that NVDA uses for these things, as they equate more closely to something a sighted assistant (or sighted person, period) recognizes as analogous to what's being manipulated.
--

Brian · ♂? · ???? - Virginia, USA - Windows 11 Pro, Version 23H2, Build 22631; M365 Family; Android 13 (MIUI 14)

I prefer true but imperfect knowledge, even if it leaves much undetermined and unpredictable, to a pretense of exact knowledge that is likely to be false.

~ F.A. Hayek