Hi,

Still getting to grips with this platform and have come across an issue with the search routine.

The group I run has messages that can contain as much as 5,000 lines of data.
When using the search option, it seems to return results for the first 50 or so lines, but beyond that everything is completely ignored.
I have contacted the support email address but not heard anything back as yet. (Does this take like a day, a week, a month?)
Has anyone else experienced this issue and if you have what was your findings please?

Also, is there a post or a wiki page or such like that also explains how the search routine actually works.

Part of the data in the messages are in hexadecimal format and I notice that if I enter one in the search field it appears it tries to search on each individual character rather than the entire 'word'
for example if I search on
A1DEF2
the results highlight every 'A', every '1', every 'D', etc

Thanks for your help
Alexis

I'm no expert on search, Alexis, but I find that when I put the search term I'm looking for in quotes "like this for example" that's what the search returns--every incidence where those words in that sequence appear.? Give it a shot!

No experience searching GIO beyond 50 or so lines because most posts on my group are no longer than that.? However, if I were writing code for a search and wanted to speed up the search (and WOW, the GIO search is FAST!), I'd probably limit the search to the first 500 words or 50 lines or something similar.

Milt?

Thanks for the reply Milt.

As for the speed, well it may be fast but if it only searches part of a message then it is of no use at all.

After all if most messages are less than 50 lines or 500 words long, then it makes no sense to limit the amount of the message it searches on to speed things up, as the 'limits' will not be reached.

Would anyone else have more definitive info please?

Cheers
Alexis

Another thing to keep in mind is that search only finds complete words.? If you were searching for A1DEF2 as part of C2A1DEF2, it won't be found.? Basically, you can search for items that have a space on either end.? I haven't yet found a post long enough to check on finding it further down, but maybe this will allow you to do so.? There has been some discussion on the beta group about having partial searches, especially with things like part numbers (or code), but no progress yet.

Duane
--
Help: /static/help
GMF's Wiki: /g/GroupManagersForum/wiki
Search button at the top of Messages list
A few site FAQs: /static/pricing#frequently-asked-questions

On Sat, May 26, 2018 at 09:18 am, Alexis wrote:

As for the speed, well it may be fast but if it only searches part of a message then it is of no use at all.

I think the premise is that by the time you've gotten 500 words into a message the subject matter should have been mentioned at least once. Groups.io was set up to accommodate discussion groups...those with a need to post lengthy documents as messages and rely on the search engine to index those documents for them are in a definite minority here.

Would anyone else have more definitive info please?

See also?/g/GroupManagersForum/wiki/Using-the-Search-Engine

Hope this helps,
Bruce

?
--
The system Help is your friend.??/static/help

开云体育

Alexis,

When using the search option, it seems to return results for the first
50 or so lines, but beyond that everything is completely ignored.
I have contacted the support email address but not heard anything back
as yet. (Does this take like a day, a week, a month?)

You should have promptly received an automated "[Request received]" message from support. If not, you need to figure out if it landed in your Spam folder or was otherwise diverted by your email service, or if your message wasn't sent, or was sent to the wrong address.

If you got the automated reply, but are awaiting a human response that normally takes a day or so, but recently support has been innundated both with Yahoo Group transfer requests and likely with issues relating to Europe's new GDPR law. Still, it shouldn't take Mark more than a few days to respond.

I'd be interested to hear what response you (eventually) get from support, or however this issue turns out. If there's an undocumented restriction on searching lengthy messages that deserves to be brought to light.

Also, is there a post or a wiki page or such like that also explains
how the search routine actually works.

Thanks Bruce for that excellent page!
/g/GroupManagersForum/wiki/Using-the-Search-Engine

Part of the data in the messages are in hexadecimal format and I
notice that if I enter one in the search field it appears it tries to
search on each individual character rather than the entire 'word'
for example if I search on A1DEF2 the results highlight every 'A',
every '1', every 'D', etc

That's... peculiar.

I tried searching for that and got no results, rather than a bunch of messages with those characters highlighted. But I didn't create any messages that would actually contain that string so maybe I didn't have the initial conditions of the test set up correctly.

You didn't accidentally include any invisible separators between those characters did you? For example, did you simply type the string "A1DEF2" into the search box or did you copy/paste it from somewhere (like a message body)?

Shal


--
Help: /static/help
More Help: /g/GroupManagersForum/wiki
Even More Help: Search button at the top of Messages list

Thanks for that. Useful info to have.

all the searches done in my group are on complete 'words' so at least that should not be an issue.

Cheers
Alexis

Ah, but when the subject matter is a log of data, all the contents of the message are relevant, or not releveant to the subject.
But I do see you argument, and have always realised that the type of messages posted on my groups are in the minority, especially as they contain very few real words.

But still, limiting the search to only a certain number of words seems pointless.
If a message is less than the limit, the the speed factor will not come into it. If it is more than the limit and the entire message is searched, then that particular search will just take longer.
I realise that it may put extra strain on the server, but as the bulk of the messages, as you stated are less than 500 words, the hadnful of seraches made on my group and other similar ones, coupled with good indexing and search coding, along with modern hardware, should cause even a noticeable strain in the server.

Do you know for sure that there is a limit on the search routines. Or is it just supposition?

Cheers
Alexis

On 26/05/2018 13:05, Shal Farley wrote:

Alexis,

> When using the search option, it seems to return results for the first
> 50 or so lines, but beyond that everything is completely ignored.
> I have contacted the support email address but not heard anything back
> as yet.? (Does this take like a day, a week, a month?)
You should have promptly received an automated "[Request received]" message from support. If not, you need to figure out if it landed in your Spam folder or was otherwise diverted by your email service, or if your message wasn't sent, or was sent to the wrong address.

I have received the confirmation email, but nothign else..was just wondering what an 'average' response time may be? And I realise with the influx of yahoo users that it will take longer.

If you got the automated reply, but are awaiting a human response that normally takes a day or so, but recently support has been innundated both with Yahoo Group transfer requests and likely with issues relating to Europe's new GDPR law. Still, it shouldn't take Mark more than a few days to respond.
I'd be interested to hear what response you (eventually) get from support, or however this issue turns out. If there's an undocumented restriction on searching lengthy messages that deserves to be brought to light.

Absolutely, and it doe snto make sense to me as I have described elsewhere.

> Also, is there a post or a wiki page or such like that also explains
> how the search routine actually works.
Thanks Bruce for that excellent page!
/g/GroupManagersForum/wiki/Using-the-Search-Engine

Ah, wonderful and thanks Bruce :)

> Part of the data in the messages are in hexadecimal format and I
> notice that if I enter one in the search field it appears it tries to
> search on each individual character rather than the entire 'word'
> for example if I search on A1DEF2 the results highlight every 'A',
> every '1', every 'D', etc
That's... peculiar.

I thought so to, but as very few of the contents of the messages are real 'words' I have become used to such things from all the search engines, over the years :)

I tried searching for that and got no results, rather than a bunch of messages with those characters highlighted. But I didn't create any messages that would actually contain that string so maybe I didn't have the initial conditions of the test set up correctly.
You didn't accidentally include any invisible separators between those characters did you? For example, did you simply type the string "A1DEF2" into the search box or did you copy/paste it from somewhere (like a message body)?

Very good point, but I manually typed in the search term, so no hidden characters there.

Thanks very much for your help
Alexis

On Mon, May 28, 2018 at 12:36 pm, Alexis wrote:

Ah, but when the subject matter is a log of data, all the contents of the message are relevant, or not relevant to the subject.

Understood.

Do you know for sure that there is a limit on the search routines. Or is it just supposition?

Your original post on this topic suggested that this was something you had actually checked. I have no independent knowledge regarding how much of a given message is searched. Like Duane, my groups simply do not contain any "messages" that long. And as Shal noted, if true, we need to capture this limitation and include it in the wiki page.
?
Regards,
Bruce
--
The system Help is your friend.??/static/help

On Mon, May 28, 2018 at 12:38 pm, Alexis wrote:

I have received the confirmation email, but nothign else..was just wondering what an 'average' response time may be?

That's difficult to say. I have sent messages to support and never received a reply at all.
?
Bruce
--
The system Help is your friend.??/static/help

Thanks, suspected that, but just liked to confirm. :)

On Mon, May 28, 2018 at 12:36 pm, Alexis wrote:

Do you know for sure that there is a limit on the search routines.

I'm not sure what it tells us, but I found a post that I could test on, ? I searched the group, , for "blind" since it only appears way down at the bottom, and it was found.? I then wondered if it was related to numbers, so searched for 1803, also found at the bottom, with no problem.

Duane
--
Help: /static/help
GMF's Wiki: /g/GroupManagersForum/wiki
Search button at the top of Messages list
A few site FAQs: /static/pricing#frequently-asked-questions