Never ending.

Since Mark does updates every week will there ever be a time when he does not have to update? Or are updates a never ending thing?

Don

开云体育

Yes, that would be the thing to do, but, as I said, when dealing with people all sorts of surprises can occur, even with the simplest of things. For example, when I asked this individual to subscribe to the new groups.io group to test it out he couldn't do it. I provided the subscribe email address but he kept deleting, or his system kept deleting, the +subscribe part of the address. Even after pointing this out to him he still couldn't see it. I then went to another very high quality person. He essentially did the same thing. Somehow the '+' was replaced with '%2B' and he couldn't see the error when the message came back saying the group does not exist. It is so simple to do. Just copy the email address from the message I sent them. I don't understand it. I know that if I include a warning statement prior to the move, some people will not have understood it, or forget it by the time it takes place which could be days a week. For example, it is now two days since I informed transfer to move the small astronomy group and it still has not happened.
Stan

To help minimize the unsubs, you could include the information in the Welcome message that would also be sent (you could change it to something more appropriate for your group after the move.)? That, along with an announcement in your YG, seems about the best you can do.

Duane
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On the group page, choose Admin on the left-hand side menu, then Upgrade below that.

For a new group, you can choose "Start a Group" with a particular plan on?/static/pricing

wunder
Walter Underwood
wunder@...
??(my?blog)

Stan,

I do not have readily on hand the actual text of the message a member of YG's gets to inform them that the group has been moved to groups.io. However, I do remember that the message gives the member an easy way to unsubscribe from the groups.io group by a simple click of the mouse.

The most recent I have is from last August. I'm not sure if this notice is among the things Mark recently improved. but here's the paragraph:

---

You do not have to do anything to continue being a member of this group. If you do not wish to be a member of GroupName, click here to unsubscribe and you will be unsubscribed immediately.

---

(I've edited the GroupName and the link, of course) It is the fourth of six short paragraphs.

Is it possible for the support team to remove the option to immediately
unsubscribe in the message they send to members who have been transferred?

Possible, sure. Likely, I doubt it.

I understand your concerns, but I'm sure that Mark considers having the opt-out there is essential for "good behavior" on his part. I'm sure some could make a case that only an opt-in would be "good behavior", but that I think would be way too limiting.

Shal
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I do not have readily on hand the actual text of the message a member of YG's gets to inform them that the group has been moved to groups.io. However, I do remember that the message gives the member an easy way to unsubscribe from the groups.io group by a simple click of the mouse. There have been definite instances, without going into details, where members of a YG thought this was a group they didn't subscribe to and so they unsubscribed. I would like to move a group from YG's to groups.io that is very important to me. I would not like to lose members because they mistakenly unsubscribed. Once unsubscribed they probably will not re-subscribe again. I could send out posts informing them that the move will take place and to not unsubscribe, but it seems when dealing with people all kinds of surprising things happen. It seems the simplest things cannot be understood.

Is it possible for the support team to remove the option to immediately unsubscribe in the message they send to members who have been transferred?
Stan

Stan,

"Another thought that concerns me is that I believe I read that one or
more of the creators of what is now Yahoo groups, which was bought out
by Yahoo around 1999, is/are working on developing groups.io."

That's about the most open of secrets. It's the core of the Groups.io product announcement (linked from the Groups.io About page):

What assurance do we have that the same thing might not happen with
groups.io, ...

We have none, and are not likely to ever have such. At least not covering years in the future.

I may as well fret that Kia will sell off its US operations and leave me with inferior maintenance and warranty for my hamster car. I'm sure many Saturn owners will answer that with, "well, yeah".

In Y!GMF I had to act (as moderator) to squelch idle speculation about Yahoo Groups' value to Verizon / Oath / Yahoo. Let's not run this GMF too far off topic in a similar direction.

Shal


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I didn't complete my sentence correctly. I said "Another thought that concerns me is that I believe I read that one or more of the creators of what is now Yahoo groups was bought out by Yahoo around 1999."

It should have been "Another thought that concerns me is that I believe I read that one or more of the creators of what is now Yahoo groups, which was bought out by Yahoo around 1999, is/are working on developing groups.io."
Stan


On 2/17/2018 1:56 PM, Stan Gorodenski wrote:

Ditto for me. I have the same concerns as Barb, plus, will the 1G option be free in the future? To keep it free, could there at some time be a cap on the number of messages? Right now there is no limit on the number of messages even if they in total exceed 1G.

Another thought that concerns me is that I believe I read that one or more of the creators of what is now Yahoo groups was bought out by Yahoo around 1999. What assurance do we have that the same thing might not happen with groups.io, except being bought out by maybe another company instead of Yahoo? Then, probably, we would once again have to cope with being inundated with advertisements, maybe higher charges for space, and maybe once again experiencing the slowness and other problems we now experience with Yahoo.
Stan

[excess quote trimmed by moderator]

Ditto for me. I have the same concerns as Barb, plus, will the 1G option be free in the future? To keep it free, could there at some time be a cap on the number of messages? Right now there is no limit on the number of messages even if they in total exceed 1G.

Another thought that concerns me is that I believe I read that one or more of the creators of what is now Yahoo groups was bought out by Yahoo around 1999. What assurance do we have that the same thing might not happen with groups.io, except being bought out by maybe another company instead of Yahoo? Then, probably, we would once again have to cope with being inundated with advertisements, maybe higher charges for space, and maybe once again experiencing the slowness and other problems we now experience with Yahoo.
Stan

Hi all,

These are the change logs for the last three weeks:



(guess I've been derelict in this task)

Feel free to reply to this topic if you'd like to comment on the
changes. Or better yet, if you expect a lot of discussion start a new
topic (or rejoin an existing one) about a specific change.

NEW: When [email protected] receives an invite to join a Yahoo Group,
we automatically send back an acknowledgement that we received the
invite.
CHANGE: Changed the Yahoo crawling code to retry all fetches of
messages, files and photos, and to report errors in group transfers.

These were both in response to the problems Yahoo Groups were having. Sending back a prompt acknowledgment won't stop people from trying again when they get the (erroneous) error message on the Invite page, but it may keep them from coming back to it and trying some more later. Anyway, something to tell people when they ask about what to do when Invite "fails".

NEW: Fig Leaf group setting to disable fig leafing.

This one has been long awaited by some group managers. I'm not sure if it makes sense in a group with unrestricted membership (such as GMF), but where membership is carefully guarded the risk is minimal.

("Fig leaf" refers to masking the domain name (the part to the right of the @ sign) of email addresses when message bodies are displayed in the group's Messages section. The original purpose was to combat spammers who might join a group simply to collect email addresses from its archived messages.)

CHANGE: Improved information display after sending a login link;
contains info about the subject line and sender.

Thanks to all of you who participated in the threads on beta, helping Mark improve the guidance given to new Groups.io users

CHANGE: Smarter about when to make a member clickable in the Members
page based on moderator privileges.
CHANGE: Added text to moderator privileges part of member page,
explaining more of what access is granted with each one.

I and some others here noticed some anomalies in how the settings interacted with the members list. I need to go back and try them again to see the improvements, and see if any cases were missed.

CHANGE: Added anchors to the FAQs on the Pricing page.

Now it is easy to cite particular parts of the page, when people ask "but what about ...". Same as the Help page - link icons appear when you hover near a section heading. Copy that link and it will take people to that section.

NEW: Automatically strip out common email sigs like "Sent from my
iPhone".

Yay! He's long had a list of ads to strip, it makes sense to do that for sigs like this, which are essentially ads. I've noticed a few ads for a certain antivirus vendor sneak through into pending messages, I'll have to cite one of those for Mark.

And to anyone using a software product that drops ads into your outbound email messages, please check and see if there's a control that will let you turn that off. Your fellow list members (and moderators) will appreciate it.

NEW: Added J's Member Notices help text to the help section.
NEW: New Muting and Following section of help from J.

Thank-you J_Catlady! Your work improving the official help page will help a lot of people.

BUGFIX: Don't HTML Escape the email subject used for mailto replies in
full digests, because it was causing html escaped entities to show
up inappropriately.

Oh my. I've been known to heap towering piles of scorn onto Yahoo Groups' programmers for not being able to keep straight when plain text is plain text. But I will admit this is a subtle case. ;-)


Comments about these others are also welcome:

Changed 'All Messages' to 'Individual Messages' Email Delivery option.
CHANGE: Don't set a user's name from email if the subscription has a
name already set.
CHANGE: In the direct add page for a group with subgroups, sort the
subgroups alphabetically.
BUGFIX: Fix for brackets in subject lines screwing up full digests and
summaries.
BUGFIX: If 2 factor is enabled, do not allow the user to delete their
password.
CHANGE: Don't strip CC headers if present in the original message.
INTERNAL: Centralized all logs, on a big disk, to be able to reference
more than a day's worth.
CHANGE: When viewing a table, you can now click anywhere on a row to
bring up the row itself.
CHANGE: Prevent known bots from submitting an email a login link
request.
INTERNAL: Sped up the overall topics view.
BUGFIX: When creating a repeating event with an RSVP, the RSVP note
was not included in the message sent to the group.
INTERNAL: Changed the database queries to make jumping to a specific
month in the archives more efficient.
BUGFIX: Fixed a permissions problem that would sometimes not allow
someone to edit their own row in a table.
BUGFIX: Fix issue that would sometimes cause the Downgrade Group
button to not do anything.
CHANGE: Reformatted the login page, changed some wording to hopefully

make it easier to understand.

INTERNAL: Updated the publicsuffix package for parsing domains when
figuring out DMARC.
CHANGE: Changed "email group" to "group" in direct add/invite
/subgroupdirect add emails.
BUGFIX: Hopefully fix deadlock issue when multiple simultaneous clicks
on a mute thread link.
CHANGE: When migrating a group to an enterprise group, change any
default welcome messages to reflect the new domain.
NEW: Can disable converting +1 emails to likes on a per-enterprise
group basis (some enterprise groups don't want this feature).
INTERNAL: Support for dns-01 authentication scheme with Let's Encrypt
when fetching new certs, because tls-01 has gone away.
NEW: New subgroup privacy option: unlisted, public archives.
CHANGE: We now support more Facebook pages, ones that have their
Facebook ID appended to the end of their name.
BUGFIX: Database table searches could return results from other tables
in the same group.
BUGFIX: Fixed a bug in the code that looks for inline attachments in
HTML parts that would result in a broken MIME part.
BUGFIX: After editing an event, return to the same month on the
calendar.
BUGFIX: Fixed updating a single event to a repeating event and
converting a repeating event to a single event.
BUGFIX: Fixed privacy setting options for subgroups on the settings
page.
INTERNAL: Upgraded Go compiler to latest version.
BUGFIX: Changed repeating parts of a repeating event were not saved.
CHANGE: Change 'Send Invite To Group' to default to checked, 'Send
Notice to Group' default to unchecked when created a new event.
CHANGE: For repeating events with RSVPs, the link from the #cal-invite
page takes you to a view event page that lets you select which
instance to RSVP to.
CHANGE: Direct adds now contain a link to the normal /leave page
instead of a special /directunsub page, for more consistency and to
prevent spam filters from unsubscribing someone accidentally.
CHANGE: Text clarification in the confirmation email and when joining
a group for the first time. Also, you can now set your password
directly in the welcome screen from the confirmation email.
BUGFIX: For polls with answers that contained quotes, when editing the
poll, the answers were chopped off.
BUGFIX: When viewing profiles groups with a subdomain in the Accounts
view, the profile photo was sometimes broken.
NEW: Enterprise groups can use their Google Analytics code.
CHANGE: Viewing poll responses in the 'Answer' mode, we no longer page
because that gave incorrect results. Also display total responders
instead of responses, and we now display percentages for each
answer.
CHANGE: Temporarily removed jump points on the overall Topics view
because my algorithm was completely wrong and did not work.
CHANGE: Added Help link to top navbar.
CHANGE: Tweaked limits of email sending server to fix delayed email
delivery.

Please call out any you find significant.

Shal



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Don,

> I did find the post, and there were really three images attached. When
> I clicked on the thumbnail in the post and clicked on Inspect I copied
> this.
> <div class="att-thumb grey has-thumb" data-imgurl="
> ...> Does that tell you anything?

I think it tells me that that particular image, thinlite cover.JPG, was picked out by Yahoo! Groups and replaced with a link to it as an attached image file. This looks like code for a thumbnail of the image at the bottom of the message, and notably the thumbnail is an "http" style image, not itself an attachment. The thumbnail is still stored there:




Note, in this message the thumbnail is a "cid" image, I did that rather than "http" in case the image isn't available later.

So, no, from this particular code snippet I'd say we only saw a demonstration of what I expected: "http" images are not attachments.

You might have to have saved this message in your email folders to have it as a "pristine" example, unmodified by Yahoo Groups.

Shal


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Norman,

... is there any way to whitelist him here so he's not continuously
removed?

No.

Mark's concern is that the email service will "punish" Groups.io (by treating more of its messages as spam) if he does not act on their notice about the member marking the message as spam.

(Yes, I know sometimes the member didn't do that, it was the service that delivered the message to the member's spam folder. Can't be helped, that's just bad behavior on the part of that email service. An automatic delivery to the spam folder ought, IMO, be treated as a neutral event.)

Shal


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Sharon,

... I have resisted HTML vigorously. (The colors and fonts people
choose are horrendous.)

The "Normalize HTML Emails" checkbox, in the Message Formatting section of your group's Settings page, will help with that if you want to allow some formatting.

Suddenly “attachments” appeared. I couldn’t figure out how people had
gotten them attached. Huge pictures, etc.

But won't help with that, it still allows images to pass.

I think I tried combining that with setting the Attachments option to "Strip". The result in some (but not all) cases was a rectangle outline where the image had been, in other cases the text closed up leaving no empty space where the image had been. I don't think I tried "http" or "data" images to see if they would still appear.

Shal


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Thanks Duane.? Our group is private so that answers it.? Thanks so much!

--Paula

Shal,

I looked for the file in Attachments on my YG, and I could not find it. I did find the post, and there were really three images attached. When I clicked on the thumbnail in the post and clicked on Inspect I copied this.

<div class="att-thumb grey has-thumb" data-imgurl=" id="yui_3_15_0_2_1518886354882_5350" style="background-image: url(/g/GroupManagersForum/messages/&quot;;);"><div class="header"><div class="att-type" aria-hidden="true">JPG</div><div class="att-size" aria-hidden="true">40 KB</div></div><div class="att-name fs-12" aria-hidden="true">thinlite cover.JPG</div></div>

Does that tell you anything?

Don

Only the parts that are publicly accessible.? That pretty much limits it to messages, calendar, or the Wiki, if they're set up to be public.? Don't forget that as long as you don't log out, you can quickly go to a page for 30 days (per device) until it will ask you to log in.

Duane
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