Doug,

No, I simply cannot sign in. However, I *can* received postings by
members of this group, and reply to them by altering the headers, but
I simply cannot enter the group itself to make any changes.

I'd like to explore this a bit further, but that would be a conversation better suited to the Yahoo Groups version of GMF:
Subscribe : groupmanagersforum-subscribe@...
Post Message : groupmanagersforum@...

Or we could just take it off-list if you'd rather not subscribe to another group just for that.

... but I doubt that he could sign me in and then promote me to owner,
not being one himself.

No, not owner. That's the one thing a moderator, no matter what privileges you give them, cannot do.

He has been co-moderator for 2 or 3 years, but I can't remember what
privileges I gave him, probably not too high to avoid anyone trying to
take over the group, ...

That's usually the problem.

Without the "Add, remove, and change moderator privileges" privilege your co-moderator won't be able to assist you with the transfer to Groups.io

You could ask him to go to the "Manage Members" page in your Yahoo Group and click on some member (not mod or owner) there. If the Edit Member pop-up dialog contains the Role control then you're in luck - he has the needed privilege.

I may get him to download all the many photographs which we have
there, ...

PG Offline will likely be very helpful doing that:


Shal


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On Sun, Mar 24, 2019 at 12:59 PM, Don Dawson wrote:

it is from NetZero.net

That's the name of the service and has been for many years.? There's nothing you can do to change it.? If you try to go to the NetZero.com site, you'll end up at NetZero.net.

Duane
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Chris,

I grieves me to say it but IHMO the change to the default sort order
implemented a couple of days ago was a mistake.

I don't think that change alone was necessarily a mistake.

However, given that it was rapidly followed by a change to remember one's chosen sort order I think it should have been rolled back first.
I've said so on beta, but that topic is moderated and my post has not yet appeared there so here's what I said:

"I may be too late in saying this, but perhaps you should have rolled
back the prior change to date order before rolling out this change.

"That would have preserved the "least astonishment" principle by having
no change in site behavior until a user explicitly changes their sort
order."

... I suspect that I will not be the only owner / moderator who feels
that this change was rushed through without enough consideration about
its unintended consequences.

Certainly not, as others' comments in the beta topic attest. Including Duane's nearly identical request.

One or two beta members have requested that the group - level default
sort order should be owner settable, but I have no idea whether that
will be implemented or not.

I think it is unlikely, given that Mark has implemented memory of the user's chosen sort order. The two could work together but that may be seen as an over-complication that would lead to further usage/support questions.

Shal


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On, my photos are sortable within a Photo album, and my sort selection is staying selected, even after leaving the group, and going back.? Just click on the sort button and select from, "Name, Posted or Taken", and each option has the option to sort by first or last
--
Patty S.

On Sun, Mar 24, 2019 at 12:59 AM, Jim Higgins wrote:

Any chance this prevents seeing those annoying sig images, thus making it even harder to delete them?

Hmmm...and yet another change in default behavior that IMO was not carefully thought through.

I hope this is not in response to my request for a group option to strip embedded images. If so, this "remedy" bears little resemblance to what I asked for.
?
Bruce
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开云体育

On Sun, Mar 24, 2019 at 05:41 AM, Chris Jones wrote:

Many changes brought about because of requests on beta have little or no impact on those who did not request them and perhaps don't need them; this change is different in that it affects everybody, and may in fact have disadvanted more subscribers than it benefitted.

I agree that default behaviors such as this should be changed with extreme caution.?The silent majority tend to be happy with things the way they are...and recently it seems that their interests have been too often subverted by a handful of people who are willing to make a lot of noise.?

Not everybody maintains a presence in the beta group, and it's a very unpleasant experience to wake up one morning and find that something that once worked fine (or that you put a lot of energy into to make work fine) is now broken.

Regards,
Bruce
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On Sun, Mar 24, 2019 at 01:45 PM, Denny G. wrote:

Nothing has really changed.

Yes it has; the default sort.

The user-selectable sort order was implemented and works perfectly in that you can now set the order you prefer on a given viewing, and the software remembers that sort order for the next viewing.

Yes it works, but from a different starting point.

I really don't understand your issue as nothing has changed except that the sort order now does not require an individual to reset it each visit.

The "big" issue is that in providing a solution for a perhaps small group of not computer - savvy subscribers in may well have created a problem for a much larger group of not computer - savvy subscribers.

Why not just set the sort how YOU like to have it and forget it? Unless, of course, you want to sort differently the next time you visit PHOTOS.

I have spent a lot of time trying to organise both Photo Album Titles, and the sequence of Photos within albums into some sort of sensible sequence. I now have to consider sending out instructions for >2500 subscribers about how to restore that order.

This is an excellent enhancement IMHO, regardless of how many people requested it.

Having different / additional "sort" options is clearly an enhancement; altering the default is not. And your comment regardless of how many people requested it can easily lead to the problems that can arise from the "tyranny of the minority".

I have no objections to additional options, but changing the default takes away the option of not having to do anything. If a group - level option were to be provided then my objections would cease to exist after no more than perhaps half a dozen clicks.

Chris

开云体育

On Sun, Mar 24, 2019 at 08:45 AM, Denny G. wrote:

Nothing has really changed. The user-selectable sort order was implemented and works perfectly in that you can now set the order you prefer on a given viewing, and the software remembers that sort order for the next viewing.

I think Chris's concern, as well as mine, is that the default sort is now newest first instead of by title.? Changing the default messed up a lot of work that some folks had done to get things in the order they wanted, so members of all those groups will need to switch back.? Now that the 'remember' is enabled, I think the default should be changed back.? Either way, there will be some members that aren't comfortable changing to another setting, so there will be complaints.

Duane
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Chris ... Nothing has really changed. The user-selectable sort order was implemented and works perfectly in that you can now set the order you prefer on a given viewing, and the software remembers that sort order for the next viewing. I really don't understand your issue as nothing has changed except that the sort order now does not require an individual to reset it each visit. Why not just set the sort how YOU like to have it and forget it? Unless, of course, you want to sort differently the next time you visit PHOTOS. This is an excellent enhancement IMHO, regardless of how many people requested it.
Dennis

My experience has been, based in part on information I have read about on websites dedicated to fighting malware, phishing, scams, etc, that contacts from legitimate sources -- like the real Oath (or Verizon, etc) -- usually frame outreach in terms of giving you an opportunity to enhance your on line experience, that if you upgrade or whatever, something good will happen. Non-legitimate sources usually do the reverse, try and intimidate people by implying that if you don't act now something bad will happen. (Have your account disabled or deleted). The legitimate sources are usually aware that people may be suspicious and don't like to 'click on the link,' and, if they include one (because they sometimes do), often offer you the alternative of visiting their website with a keyword you can enter in their site's search box to pull up the relevant information.

The emails I got from Oath that seemed malicious contained the warning and 30 day deadline in the subject line, I deleted them without opening them. A few times when I've been really uncertain about an email -- might be legit, might not be -- rather than open it on my own personal computer I went to a FedEx Office location and opened it on their computer. Or tried to. Those kinds of computers usually have extremely sophisticated security programs. I recall an email I got unexpectedly from Dropbox, with a file attached, sent by someone who had sent me legitimate files from Dropbox in the past. But this one was to a different email address. Why would he have done that? (Yes it was an AOL account.) I emailed him but when he didn't answer I went to FedEx. The computer at FedEx wouldn't let me open the file. It said the file contained suspicious code and appeared to contain a virus. The security program suggested I delete it and I did.

tommy0421

On Sun, Mar 24, 2019 at 07:34 AM, Marcia Hudspeth wrote:

Is there a way to put Photo Album's in alpha order?

I grieves me to say it but IHMO the change to the default sort order implemented a couple of days ago was a mistake. I accept that it was requested by a (fairly small) number of beta members, commonly on the basis that their members were not necessarily computer - savvy and as a result had difficulties making their photos section work for them. However, the change overlooked the fact that it has forced other groups - whose members might be equally non - computer savvy - to handle a completely different sort order which very possibly doesn't work for them. OK; individual members can set a suitable sort order for themselves, but this brings people up against the "computer savvy" issue immediately.

Many changes brought about because of requests on beta have little or no impact on those who did not request them and perhaps don't need them; this change is different in that it affects everybody, and may in fact have disadvanted more subscribers than it benefitted.

I know this post risks having the sky brought down on my head but I suspect that I will not be the only owner / moderator who feels that this change was rushed through without enough consideration about its unintended consequences. Certainly for the group I moderate It has mangled the album sort order, although for reasons I won't risk boring you with this shouldn't be too much of a problem for us; suffice to say we have a separate index (of links) and that still functions. However, the mangling of the sort order within albums? - albeit correctable at an individual level - has really wound me up.

One or two beta members have requested that the group - level default sort order should be owner settable, but I have no idea whether that will be implemented or not. If it is then there will be no longer - term problem. If it isn't? Well I for one will be very disappointed.

Chris

On Sun, Mar 24, 2019 at 02:34 AM, Marcia Hudspeth wrote:

Is there a way to put Photo Album's in alpha order?

Yes.? On the Photos page, select "Sort By Title ^" from the drop down at the upper right.? Your choice now becomes the default for all of your groups.? This feature/option to remember your sort order should be available for photos within an album in a few days.

Duane
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On 24/03/2019 15:30, Shal Farley wrote:

Doug,
I don't recognize you from Y!GMF, if you'd like some advice in trying to get your new address connected to your group contact us over there.

Hi Shal

and Thanks for your email.

I only signed up for Groups Managers Forum today, my thanks for the help and further offers of help.

> There seems to be nothing I can do except pay them money (which I
> won't do) to talk to a real live person, and who may be unable to help
> anyway..
Be cautious with anyone asking for money. There are a lot of scam outfits out there pretending to be Yahoo Customer Care.

This is actually on the yahoo site, so should be quite OK. Nevertheless, I'm not going to get caught in there at what I see is a dead end.

On the other hand there is a relatively new Yahoo! Account Pro service, which is paid, but given that your primary concern is a access to a Yahoo Group they probably won't know how to do that.

What I see is not good. I think it is going to be a move to Groups.io. After my experiences through the years, this is the way for me to go.

If you can still sign in to your Yahoo Account, the one that owns the Yahoo Group, then you can do what you need without email access.

No, I simply cannot sign in. However, I *can* received postings by members of this group, and reply to them by altering the headers, but I simply cannot enter the group itself to make any changes.

> My group has one co-moderator who could use his email address. Would
> this work?
As long as he can invite someone (the transfer address) to join the group, and then promote that new member to moderator status, then yes. He could do the Yahoo tasks for your group.

He may be able to sign me in as a new member, if I use my brother's name or somesuch illegal stuff, but I doubt that he could sign me in and then promote me to owner, not being one himself. He has been co-moderator for 2 or 3 years, but I can't remember what privileges I gave him, probably not too high to avoid anyone trying to take over the group, although he is a fellow collector, well-known in his circles, (I'm in New Zealand, he's in US) I trust him, and I doubt any problems would arise. We are fellow collectors of old toy trains, especially two makes of Japanese.

I may get him to download all the many photographs which we have there, and later transfer them to the new site, after which we can simply abandon yahoo. The text messages are hardly worth saving.

It is the privilege to promote a member to moderator that you might not have given him as a moderator. Many owners are hesitant to give out that privilege as it is effectively all-powerful, second only to being an owner.

See paragrph above..

> He could become a co-owner of the new group.
That would allow him to do the Groups.io side of the transfer, which is probably the simplest way to handle it.
Shal

I think your last paragraph has it all sorted.. I agree..

So, my grateful thanks for the trouble you have taken here, and I will see what happens over the next couple of weeks. I'm now 80, and getting too old for this nonsense!

--
Cheers.
--------
Doug Harris
Cambridge, New Zealand

Received from Shal Farley at 3/24/2019 01:49 AM UTC:

Mark missed this one (for some it's kind-of a big one):

* CHANGE: Only display photos in the Emailed Photos album that are
larger than 100x100 pixels.

Any chance this prevents seeing those annoying sig images, thus making it even harder to delete them?

I don't accept attachments or imbedded images so can't test in my groups.

Jim H

What is the feed page?

Don

NEW: The /feed page is now feature complete, including displaying

> chats, wikis, databases, new subgroups, and recent images sent as
> attachments.

That probably amounts to a "last call for comments" before it goes live.

Doug,

Yahoo would not accept my change of email, and blocked me from the
group which I own!

I don't recognize you from Y!GMF, if you'd like some advice in trying to get your new address connected to your group contact us over there.

There seems to be nothing I can do except pay them money (which I
won't do) to talk to a real live person, and who may be unable to help
anyway..

Be cautious with anyone asking for money. There are a lot of scam outfits out there pretending to be Yahoo Customer Care.

On the other hand there is a relatively new Yahoo! Account Pro service, which is paid, but given that your primary concern is a access to a Yahoo Group they probably won't know how to do that.

Can you please advise if IO can move this yahoo group to Groups.IO
using this blocked email address?

If you can still sign in to your Yahoo Account, the one that owns the Yahoo Group, then you can do what you need without email access. The key is being able to sign in using your original Yahoo account ID and password. Where the sign-in page says to enter your email address it means the yahoo.com address associated with your Yahoo account.

My group has one co-moderator who could use his email address. Would
this work?

As long as he can invite someone (the transfer address) to join the group, and then promote that new member to moderator status, then yes. He could do the Yahoo tasks for your group.

It is the privilege to promote a member to moderator that you might not have given him as a moderator. Many owners are hesitant to give out that privilege as it is effectively all-powerful, second only to being an owner.

He could become a co-owner of the new group.

That would allow him to do the Groups.io side of the transfer, which is probably the simplest way to handle it.

If you're leery about promoting him to owner you could take the steps on the Groups.io side and he could (in coordination with you) take the required steps on the Yahoo side.

Shal


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