开云体育

Thanks Shal. I don't fully understand what you are saying, but since everything
is working fine (and has been for 22 years now) I'm not proposing to make any
immediate changes.

Some of my confusion comes from your reference to "talktalk servers". There are
two parts of Talktalk involved, which hardly seem aware of one anothers'
existence. My domain name is registered with Talktalk Business (I think they
use talktalk.co.uk), and that is where I receive emails. My ISP, through which
I send emails, is Talktalk Residential (who use the talktalk.net domain).

In addition, I had not heard of either SPF or DKIM before and I'm not sure of
the significance of either of them.

Jim

--
- My thoughts on freedom (needs updating)
- political snippets, especially economic policy
- misc. snippets, some political, some not
Forget Google! I search with which doesn't spy on you

On Sat, Aug 18, 2018 at 02:10 AM, <birrell@...> wrote:

We are about to create a new group.? One of the users wanted to know whether all backups of the group's messages are deleted if the group is deleted?

You question is ambiguous with regard to what your user's concern is.?Assuming a backup of some kind is a *desirable* thing, you can create your own backup. Navigate to Admin>Settings and click on the "Export Group Data" button at the top.

Actually restoring your group from backup is another matter entirely...there is currently no way to do that via the user interface.

Hope this helps,
Bruce
--
The system Help is your friend.??/static/help

On Sat, Aug 18, 2018 at 04:53 PM, Shal Farley wrote:

This is handy as a short and easy to type URL when telling people about your group. In most browsers you don't even need to type the https:// part when entering it into the address bar. And once you've used it a time or two your browser will likely auto-complete it for you as you type your group name. Slick!

And it would be even cooler if this group also had an alias such as "gmf".
?
--
Gerald

Hi all,

This week's change log:


Feel free to reply to this topic if you'd like to comment on the
changes. Or better yet, if you expect a lot of discussion start a new
topic (or rejoin an existing one) about a specific change.

BUGFIX: For groups without subgroups, you can now go to
, and it will redirect correctly.

This is handy as a short and easy to type URL when telling people about your group. In most browsers you don't even need to type the part when entering it into the address bar. And once you've used it a time or two your browser will likely auto-complete it for you as you type your group name. Slick!

This also means that your group's subdomain is propagated into the DNS system soon after group creation. So when you later create your first subgroup you won't have a "dead time" when you can't get to your group, as some have reported here in GMF.

NEW: Added a section to the Help about the FBL and people being
removed because of spam.

Short and to the point:
/static/help#a-member-was-removed-because-of-spam
We should update ours to cite it.
/g/GroupManagersForum/wiki/Removed-for-spam

NEW: When viewing a subgroup where you aren't subscribed, but you are
a mod/owner of the parent group, the tag on the sidebar will now say
'Parent Mod' or 'Parent Owner'.

Excellent. This might be why he widened the left column, but it may be worth it in terms of clarifying a somewhat mysterious behavior (primary group mods and owners automatically have mod or owner access in all subgroups).

NEW: On the pending message screen, if you use the Approve &
Unmoderate Button to approve messages from non subscribers, a dialog
will now pop up telling you that these people cannot be unmoderated
(because they're not members).

Joe reported a bug involving this function. If you get a confirmation dialog that is titled "Confirm Delete" - don't. It actually deletes the pending message instead of approving it. Use the "Approve" button instead of "Approve & Unmoderate Senders" for non-subscribers (at least until this bug is fixed).
/g/GroupManagersForum/message/11180

CHANGE: Don't fig leaf email addresses when viewing source.

This was a leftover of when members could use view source. I kind of miss that, but I understand why it may be too revealing, fig-leafs notwithstanding.


Comments about these others are also welcome:

SYSADMIN: Upgraded the main database instance.
BUGFIX: Fixed escaping of special characters in search query strings.
BUGFIX: Fixed two bugs in the DKIM verifying library we use.
BUGFIX: The 'Bulk Remove' button was being shown to some moderators
who didn't have the right permission to use it (they were not able
to actually use the feature).
CHANGE: Tweaked the sidebar width in certain instances, making it a
little larger.
BUGFIX: Disabled the 'Subscribe to Calendar' button for subgroups
where you are not a subscriber (but are owner of the parent group).
CHANGE: Parallelized updating the DNS servers to speed subgroup
creation up.
BUGFIX: Fixed a problem with repeating event reminders that could
cause some of them to not be sent.
BUGFIX: Fixed some labels on the group settings page for screen
readers.
CHANGE: Added wording on Display Name edit pages: "Note: When you
post, your email address is also shown to group members who receive
messages via email."
CHANGE: Upgraded Go toolchain from 9.4 to 10.3. This unexpectedly
broke several parts of the web site that dealt with uploading files.
Fixed.
SYSADMIN: Upgraded main bastion host.
NEW: Adding Authentication-Results header line showing DKIM/SPF tests.
Only visible when viewing message source in the archives.
SYSADMIN: Renewed *.groups.io ssl certificate.
CHANGE: When posting a message, ignore returns clicked when editing
the subject.
BUGFIX: When viewing or editing an individual database row that has a
date column, the date displayed would always be today.
BUGFIX: When viewing or editing an individual database row that has an
empty date column, the date displayed would always be today.

Please call out any you find significant.

Shal


--
Help: /static/help
More Help: /g/GroupManagersForum/wiki
Even More Help: Search button at the top of Messages list

I assume you are referring to the data backups maintained by groups.io for disaster recovery.? This is a question support would have to answer but it is highly unlikely.? The group's data would remain in the backup tapes/files as long as the backup copy is retained.? If you have concerns contact [email protected].
Toby

dd,

You fixed it! It’s working fine now. Thank you for your help.

Where "you" in this case refers to Mark at Groups.io (who is not a member of GMF).


Shal


--
Help: /static/help
More Help: /g/GroupManagersForum/wiki
Even More Help: Search button at the top of Messages list

KA5DWI,

I invited the Transfer Agent on July 25 and have yet heard from
anyone.

What does the In Process page tell you about your status? Look particularly for any boxed text at the top of the page. If you don't know what that means, read on.

I think I was a little too late :)

I don't think it is too late until Yahoo Groups stops working altogether.

Hope there are good written instructions :)

There is a large collection of notes about the transfer process in GMF's wiki:
/g/GroupManagersForum/wiki/Transfer-from-Yahoo-Groups

Read thoroughly, and in particular follow the link to Bruce's step-by-step. Then if you have more questions post again here in GMF. If your question isn't about the time it takes, maybe create a new topic with a more specific subject line.

Shal


--
Help: /static/help
More Help: /g/GroupManagersForum/wiki
Even More Help: Search button at the top of Messages list

I invited the Transfer Agent on July 25 and have yet heard from anyone.

I will give it another week (actually until Labor Day), then call it a day.
I think I was a little too late :)
All of us know that Yahoo (Verizon) could care less about their Groups.? 450 members here.

Worse comes to worse, I will do it manually. Hope there are good written instructions? ?:)

When a group is deleted, everything associated with it is deleted.? You (nor anyone else) can use the name of that group for some (unknown) amount of time.? I suspect there will be a record of the information in the site backup for awhile, but wouldn't depend on it for recovery.

Duane
--
Help: /static/help
GMF's Wiki: /g/GroupManagersForum/wiki
Search button at the top of Messages list
A few site FAQs: /static/pricing#frequently-asked-questions

Shal Farley wrote:

It was a bit tricky, until I discovered the from-address locks-in
after the 1st message received.

/g/GroupManagersForum/message/11039

From that I've been assuming that each integration allows only one sender. But it might be worth testing to be sure.

Yes, that's what I found.

FYI - my testing scenario:
For a new email integration, I sent From: "unsubscribed address" To: "integration address", it worked.
I tried a different From: "repo" (in my case it was a message generated from repo commit) To "integration address" it failed (and left me scratching my head for a bit).
I deleted the email integration, created a new email integration, used From: "repo", To: "new integration address", it worked.

-Emre

We are about to create a new group.? One of the users wanted to know whether all backups of the group's messages are deleted if the group is deleted?
Thanks.

Joe,

If I click OK and un-moderate sender, I get a message that the posts
were OKed, but that the sender cannot be unmoderated because it is not
in the group. The posts then DISAPPEAR!

Am I missing something or should a report a bug?

Report a bug. The "Approve & Unmoderate Sender" button should not be shown when the sender is a non-subscriber.

I'd been meaning to test and report this since an earlier report, but haven't yet found the appropriate "round tuit".

100+ senders

Ack. I haven't tried it, but Emre said:

It was a bit tricky, until I discovered the from-address locks-in
after the 1st message received.

/g/GroupManagersForum/message/11039

From that I've been assuming that each integration allows only one sender. But it might be worth testing to be sure.

The sender has a suspicious DNS TXT record that starts
"google-site-verification=..."

I'm not familiar with reading DNS records, used nslookup for the first time just the other night, but I do know that's where senders publish both SPF and DMARC information, among many other things.

Shal


--
Help: /static/help
More Help: /g/GroupManagersForum/wiki
Even More Help: Search button at the top of Messages list

Chris,

I'm not going to say that it /isn't/ correct but it doesn't accord
with my / our experience.

What I said was correct, but you're right - it wasn't the whole story. Rather than try to tell the whole story I cited GMF's wiki page on the subject.

The group I moderate has just over 2900 "members"; the bouncing list
has about 650 entries, with the vast majority identified as bouncing
on the day we migrated from Yahoo.

As Bruce mentioned, many of those may have been set to No Email or Special Notice and not detectable as "bouncing". But it is also true that Yahoo Groups' bounce tracking mechanism has been unreliable for some years now.

So you'll have some false negatives transferred to your Groups.io group - and promptly detected as bouncing.

There may also be false positives in there - Y!Group members with perfectly functional email addresses, but who did not transfer over because Yahoo had them on bouncing status. These are probably far fewer in number, but one never knows. The easiest way I know of to find out is to Invite or Direct Add them and see what happens.

Yet another possibility are addresses that accept messages from Yahoo Groups, but not from Groups.io and end up bouncing here. This can happen if the service has very tight anti-spam filters, or allows their users to select things like requiring senders to "prove themselves human" before their messages are accepted. The user, or the service, may have "whitelisted" Yahoo Groups as a sender.

Another oddity is that some addresses seem to be "cut off"
immediately, while others have a whole string of bounced messages
recorded before the sending process is suspended.

It depends on the service and their rejection code for the bounced messages - Groups.io does its best to preserve communication for cases where acceptance seems erratic or might be restored after a few days.

... but I'm not sure that messages get the same treatment. ISTR
finding posts from people who were no longer members with their names
still shown.

Messages are a little different. They will still show the original posting member, but they aren't "owned" by that (now) non-member. That is, in my experience you can't find them via "All Posts By This Member" or similar means.

Shal


--
Help: /static/help
More Help: /g/GroupManagersForum/wiki
Even More Help: Search button at the top of Messages list

On Fri, Aug 17, 2018 at 05:45 PM, Shal Farley wrote:

Joe,

> We have a small management group that receives outside posts from
> participants and government announcements via a subscription service.

Sounds like a job for either the "Allow Non Subscribers to Post" setting
or an Email Integration. The former will will accept all comers, but
requires that all such posts be approved by a moderator.

Just tried this. Ran into a PROBLEM. Emails go into Pending. If I OK them (I forget exact terminology) they go to messages as expected. If I click OK and un-moderate sender, I get a message that the posts were OKed, but that the sender cannot be unmoderated because it is not in the group. The posts then DISAPPEAR!

Am I missing something or should a report a bug?

With an integration moderation is optional, but a basic group can only
have five of them. If I understand correctly each integration accepts
messages only from a single source, established by the first message it
receives.

100+ senders

> I tried a similar setup for groups.io, but all outside posts show up
> as from funnel@... and fred@... doesn't show up
> anywhere.

Sounds like an issue with how you've set it up in Gmail. A manually
forwarded message always takes on your own address as the from. I'm not
so sure about an automatically forwarded message; that might go out
preserving the original sender's address. I haven't tried using that forwarding
feature. Another name for this type of forward is a "redirect", and many
email services no longer support it.

As best I can tell, the setup for both forwarding accounts are contemporaneous and identical.

> About a year ago, the government delivery service made some sort of
> change that screwed the subscriptions up. Now when the government
> sends out any notice we get unsubscribed within seconds.

"We" who? Get unsubscribed from what? If you mean that your funnel gets
unsubscribed from the delivery service it could be a reaction to the
government delivery service setting a DMARC policy forbidding forwarding
of their messages.

Gmail doesn't (normally) reject messages even when the sender has
published "reject" as their policy, but it is possible that Google
groups do. And the delivery service's response to getting a rejection
notice might well be to unsubscribe the addressee.9

Yes, funnel gets unsubscribed. It could be something like DMARC (I am now 20 minutes familiar with it). The sender has a suspicious DNS TXT record that starts "google-site-verification=..."

Shal

Thanks,

Joe

Joan,

It was my understanding that you couldn’t have multiple topics all
with the exact same wording. Is this correct? Or not?

As you've discovered, "not correct".

Since I wrote them all , I know they are written exactly the same.

If you wrote each using "New Topic" that will make each their own topic. Reply would make the new post thread with the topic you reply to.

Similar rules apply when posting by email, but it gets a little more complicated due to fact that Groups.io can't tell if the message was sent by the equivalent of New Topic (with a copied subject) or was in fact a reply but the sending service didn't provide the conventional fields for a reply (in the message's header).

Other than replying to the topic, is there a way to manage this?

You can merge them.
/g/GroupManagersForum/wiki/How-to-Merge-Threads

Shal


--
Help: /static/help
More Help: /g/GroupManagersForum/wiki
Even More Help: Search button at the top of Messages list

Stew,

I wish to ask the owner of a private group of which I'm a member
(archive invisible to public) to create a sub-group whose message
archive will be visible to all primary group members

In the Privacy section of the subgroup's Settings page, set the Visibility control to "Group listed in parent group, messages visible by parent group members". Note: if the subgroup's visibility has already been restricted to subgroup members only, then this option won't be available. One can only tighten Visibility, one cannot loosen it.

but posting only by sub-group members.

In the Message Policies section of the subgroup's Settings page, do not check "Allow Non Subscribers to Post".

Shal


--
Help: /static/help
More Help: /g/GroupManagersForum/wiki
Even More Help: Search button at the top of Messages list

Beth,

Another note for my beginning members in a file/wiki somewhere.

If you have the itch to write it, we'd be happy to host some additional "beginner" pages in GMF's wiki. The "Quick-Start Guide" section is woefully underpopulated.
/g/GroupManagersForum/wiki/home

Shal


--
Help: /static/help
More Help: /g/GroupManagersForum/wiki
Even More Help: Search button at the top of Messages list

Joe,

We have a small management group that receives outside posts from
participants and government announcements via a subscription service.

Sounds like a job for either the "Allow Non Subscribers to Post" setting or an Email Integration. The former will will accept all comers, but requires that all such posts be approved by a moderator.

With an integration moderation is optional, but a basic group can only have five of them. If I understand correctly each integration accepts messages only from a single source, established by the first message it receives.

I tried a similar setup for groups.io, but all outside posts show up
as from funnel@... and fred@... doesn't show up
anywhere.

Sounds like an issue with how you've set it up in Gmail. A manually forwarded message always takes on your own address as the from. I'm not so sure about an automatically forwarded message; that might go out preserving the original sender's address. I haven't tried using that feature. Another name for this type of forward is a "redirect", and many email services no longer support it.

About a year ago, the government delivery service made some sort of
change that screwed the subscriptions up. Now when the government
sends out any notice we get unsubscribed within seconds.

"We" who? Get unsubscribed from what? If you mean that your funnel gets unsubscribed from the delivery service it could be a reaction to the government delivery service setting a DMARC policy forbidding forwarding of their messages.

Gmail doesn't (normally) reject messages even when the sender has published "reject" as their policy, but it is possible that Google groups do. And the delivery service's response to getting a rejection notice might well be to unsubscribe the addressee.

Shal


--
Help: /static/help
More Help: /g/GroupManagersForum/wiki
Even More Help: Search button at the top of Messages list

This sounds a lot like the problem I have with alias address' from my account.

My account is bryan@... but I often send emails from other@...

Groups.io will always see bryan@ no matter what the 'from' address was in the email. I am told, no fix for it. Other than to create an entire new account in my case, an option that won't work.