Re: Cross posting to other lists

#7066

On Sat, Apr 07, 2018 at 06:07:54PM -0700, Bruce Bowman wrote:

There is an Email Integration designed to facilitate cross-posting INTO
groups.io. If you can get the same thing set up in the other group (perhaps a
dummy account with posting privileges but receiving "no email"), then your main
problem will be getting people to STOP CC-ing both groups.I do want them to be able to control when there is cross posting.  It
certainly isn't the case that every message applies to both, in fact
most messages only apply to one or the other.

I admit I haven't thought this through carefully and the last thing you want to
do is create a dupe loop. But I hope you get the idea. I know of no way to
avoid creating a separate messageID, however. If that's the gist of your
problem or there's other stuff in the message headers messing you up you're way
beyond my ability to help.It seems that if I uncheck "I always want copies of my own messages",
it doesn't generate new message IDs.  At least I think that is what is
happening.  I've asked someone to send me headers from one of my
messages on our list so that I can check if that is the case, or if
groups.io just avoided sending the message to me at all.

David

Re: Cross posting to other lists

#7065

On Sat, Apr 07, 2018 at 05:50:43PM -0700, Shal Farley wrote:

  * The recipients of the groups.io list receive a newly generated
message (with its own message-id).That's optional.

In your Account preferences page there's a checkbox that is checked by
default:
|_|  I always want copies of my own messages

The effect of that checkbox is to cause the Message-Id to be replaced on
messages you post. For some email services (Gmail notably among them)
this allows you to see the message as returned from the group. Otherwise
(if the Message-ID were left intact) Gmail would see a message with that
same ID already in your account (the Sent folder) and would not display
the "duplicate" message as received.This only affects messages that I send, right?  Is there a way to set
this for everyone.  I'll have to play with this a bit, though.

In addition, anyone on both lists/groups will get a separate copy of
each message, and it is unclear which one they should reply to.Hmm...

Groups.io will insert a Reply-To field in the outbound header. The
content of that header is set by one of your group's Settings. But none
of the available choices will cause it to include the other group/list
and if the member uses plain Reply that would likely exclude the other
list, even if it were not removed from the To or CC. So I guess the
member would need to use Reply-All to get the reply to go to both lists
(and direct to the original poster).It seems to just not insert a Reply-To for our list, which is pretty
important for cross posting to work (otherwise our group effectively
steals threads from every other list).

Thanks,
David

Re: Cross posting to other lists

#7064

There is an Email Integration designed to facilitate cross-posting INTO groups.io. If you can get the same thing set up in the other group (perhaps a dummy account with posting privileges but receiving "no email"), then your main problem will be getting people to STOP CC-ing both groups.

I admit I haven't thought this through carefully and the last thing you want to do is create a dupe loop. But I hope you get the idea. I know of no way to avoid creating a separate messageID, however. If that's the gist of your problem or there's other stuff in the message headers messing you up you're way beyond my ability to help.

Bruce

Re: Cross posting to other lists

#7063

Hi David,

  * The recipients of the groups.io list receive a newly generated
message (with its own message-id).That's optional.

In your Account preferences page there's a checkbox that is checked by default:
|_|  I always want copies of my own messages

The effect of that checkbox is to cause the Message-Id to be replaced on messages you post. For some email services (Gmail notably among them) this allows you to see the message as returned from the group. Otherwise (if the Message-ID were left intact) Gmail would see a message with that same ID already in your account (the Sent folder) and would not display the "duplicate" message as received.

  * Sometimes, the otherlist will be pruned from the headers, and
    sometimes not (I haven't figured out the pattern here).Possibly the distinction is whether the To or CC field was used? Also, there was a relevant change in late Jan or early Feb so that the CC field is no longer stripped. See the fifth item here:


  * Replies on 'otherlist' tend to go to to the groups.io
    list, which accepts it, at least if the group is
    open to posting be non-members.Accepted yes, but non-subscriber posts are always placed in moderation.

In addition, anyone on both lists/groups will get a separate copy of
each message, and it is unclear which one they should reply to.Hmm...

Groups.io will insert a Reply-To field in the outbound header. The content of that header is set by one of your group's Settings. But none of the available choices will cause it to include the other group/list and if the member uses plain Reply that would likely exclude the other list, even if it were not removed from the To or CC. So I guess the member would need to use Reply-All to get the reply to go to both lists (and direct to the original poster).

Shal


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Subgroup visibility...not-visible AND public messages?

#7062

I'm really unclear about the Visibility option for subgroups.? What does this option mean: "Group not listed in parent group, publicly viewable message."? I have come to think of this as the "messages from God" option.? Is this for one-way email subgroups?

Re: search operators

#7061

Since this is such a poorly-documented feature, I've added it to the GMF wiki.?

See?/g/GroupManagersForum/wiki/Using-the-Search-Engine

Additions or corrections appreciated.

Bruce

Cross posting to other lists

#7060

Hi, our group (for the Zephyr Project) has just started using . A lot of the developers on this list have come from the Linux kernel development community, and cross-posting messages is fairly common there.

I'm trying to figure out what the best way to handle this with would be. Right now, what seems to happen is:

A user sends an email to our address, as well as to otherlist@....
Their original email is delivered to the recipients of otherlist.
The recipients of the list receive a newly generated message (with its own message-id).
Sometimes, the otherlist will be pruned from the headers, and sometimes not (I haven't figured out the pattern here).
Replies on 'otherlist' tend to go to to the list, which accepts it, at least if the group is open to posting be non-members.
Replies to the messages make it back to this list, but because the otherlist was pruned from the To header, the message gets dropped from that list.

In addition, anyone on both lists/groups will get a separate copy of each message, and it is unclear which one they should reply to.

I guess my first question is: How is this expected to work. The devs clearly have thought of this, as there is some sophistication going on to what things to cull from the headers. I think this would mostly work fine if the otherlist was never removed from the header, the only problem there being the duplicate messages for everyone subscribed to both.

In addition to CCing lists, it is common in these community to "CC" specific individuals. With most mailing software it is possible to mark messages that are sent directly to me. It also makes it possible to include someone in a thread that isn't subscribed to the group. With the header stripping, sometimes these people will get dropped out.

Thoughts?

David Brown

Re: search operators

Gerald Boutin

#7059

Frances caught me. I thought I checked for upper case AND, but apparently not very well.?After I looked a bit further, both of Frances' blind AND bouncing search results were actually correct. It wasn't obvious from the first couple lines of the search result, but looking at the full post did show that both search terms appeared.

In any case, add me to the suitably humbled list also.

--
Gerald

Re: search operators

#7058

Hmmm...OR seems to work too, if it's in all caps.?

NOT also works...I was able to get 10 hits with one search and filter out two of them by adding a NOT.

If you mix OR and AND, it kinda works, but the operator precedence doesn't seem to match standard programming language precedence. So I haven't been able to make sense of that (yet).

So Lena is right. I stand wholly [and humbly] corrected.

Bruce

Re: Need to be able to customize Invite message.

#7057

开云体育

Don,

What I would like to be able to do is send an invite message to myself so I can what it really looks like…For editing purposes.

In the Invitation to be Sent box the Invite page gives you a live copy of the message, including your inserted section. The only thing missing is the filled in invitee name replacing [Name] in the sample.

If you're looking for a static example, look in your inbox for an invitation to shalstest.

Shal

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Re: Need to be able to customize Invite message.

#7056

Mike,

In my opinion, the pre-written letter is simply too involved. I would
like the ability to edit it.That ability does not exist. The most you can do is add your own section to it. I use horizontal lines to make it clearer:
/g/GroupManagersForum/message/5779

Some people, especially those who moderate groups that operate in another language, have asked for the ability to write the complete invite message. However I think though Groups.io has some solid reasons to make sure the boilerplate remains.

See also:

Shal

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Re: search operators

#7055

Well, an all caps AND does work. Perhaps not perfectly.?

Try blind AND bouncing.?
Two results.?
If it a lower case and, just one of the two. The only explanation I can think of is proximity.?

Frances

Re: Need to be able to customize Invite message.

#7054

开云体育

What I would like to be able to do is send an invite message to myself so I can what it really looks like…For editing purposes.

?

Don

?

Show quoted text

From: [email protected] <[email protected]> On Behalf Of mike@...
Sent: Saturday, April 7, 2018 3:20 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: [GMF] Need to be able to customize Invite message.

?

? ??I've only been here two or three months-?so maybe this matter has been tell with.? ?I could not find anything in doing a search.
In my opinion, the?pre-written?letter is simply too involved.? ??I would like the ability to edit it.? ??

Need to be able to customize Invite message.

[email protected]

#7052

? ??I've only been here two or three months-?so maybe this matter has been tell with.? ?I could not find anything in doing a search.
In my opinion, the?pre-written?letter is simply too involved.? ??I would like the ability to edit it.? ??

Re: search operators

Gerald Boutin

#7051

On Sat, Apr 7, 2018 at 02:20 pm, Lena wrote:

The search engine does not use or recognize Boolean operators.
See /g/GroupManagersForum/message/2257
Both wrong. Boolean operators do work. Default is AND, not OR. Phrase in "quotes" works. Unfortunately, despite Mark's assurance, wildcards don't work.

It seems that we are either guessing or using different terminology. I agree that phrases in quotes do work. I tried it.?However, AND and OR are not treated as boolean operators. They are treated as any other word to search for. Search for these 3 words: boolean and operators

Here's one of the results.

Both wrong.?Boolean?operators?do work. Default is?AND, not OR.?

--
Gerald

Re: search operators

#7050

The search engine does not use or recognize Boolean operators.
See /g/GroupManagersForum/message/2257Both wrong. Boolean operators do work. Default is AND, not OR. Phrase in "quotes" works. Unfortunately, despite Mark's assurance, wildcards don't work.

Re: Automatic Deletion of Members If Message Marked As Spam #poll

#7049

On Sat, Apr 7, 2018 at 01:26 pm, Shal Farley wrote:

But only if I'm correct about that.

I described the situation as a "time bomb" in a post on beta.

You probably are, and yes you did, in that order.

I may "beef up" the Mechanism section of the draft wiki to emphasise that preventative action by members is the best, even the only, way of keeping on top of the situation, and that they cannot rely on Owners and Moderators to do it for them.

But it won't be tonight.

Chris

Groups.io site updates #changelog

#7048

Hi all,

This week's change log:


Feel free to reply to this topic if you'd like to comment on the
changes. Or better yet, if you expect a lot of discussion start a new
topic (or rejoin an existing one) about a specific change.


NEW: When attempting to change your email address to an address that
  already has an account, and that isn't just subscribed to updates@,
  we now offer the ability to merge the two accounts automatically. An
  email is sent to the to account and that account has to accept it.Awesome. This should be of great help to any member who's moved across from Y!Groups as a member of more than one group, using different addresses in those groups. This will allow the member to consolidate their Groups.io subscriptions under a single address.

There still remains a need for a means to allow one to manage subscriptions under different email addresses from within a single login. Currently one must still log out and in (or use separate browser sessions) to access web pages for memberships held under different subscription addresses.


NEW: From the directory, you can send an email to another member.
  Limited to 2 per day to a specific person, 10 per day total per
  group.Very nice. Groups that don't want to allow this can (and probably already had) make the Directory inaccessible to members. Note that the limits amount to limits on initiating contact - the message you send will be "From" your email address so that person and you can carry on your conversation off-list.


NEW: We now keep and display the response from the email server on
  successful deliveries, in the Email Delivery History pages.Interesting. I'll have to watch for circumstances in which that can be useful information. Beyond simple curiosity.


CHANGE: The group home page month view now takes into account a user's
  timezone.Ah, good. That does mean that different members may see slightly different tables, but at least the search links will work correctly. Marcelo and Wim van Dam take note.
/g/GroupManagersForum/message/5373
/g/GroupManagersForum/message/6789


CHANGE: Allow padding-left style, to fix indented HTML.Ah, good. That was bugging me in formatting wiki pages: paragraphs I indented would lose their indentation when I saved the page.


Comments about these others are also welcome:

BUGFIX: When editing a poll, the message that gets sent out now starts
  "A poll has been updated"....
BUGFIX: Plain text messages had emails obscured even when the group
  was set to show them.
BUGFIX: Fix page back in group directory.
BUGFIX: Honor group aliases when processing emails.
Please call out any you find significant.

Shal


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Re: Automatic Deletion of Members If Message Marked As Spam #poll

#7047

Paul,

When an IO group Email is put into one's spam folder is only one
message sent back to IO or does the offending Email cause repeated
messages to be sent as long as the Email stays in the spam folder?I'm not on the inside of this issue - I've never seen an FBL report - but my current belief is that being delivered to the Spam folder does not itself trigger an FBL report, it is when the message is deleted from that folder (having not been previously marked as "not Spam") that the report is generated.

On the other hand, if the message was delivered to the member's Inbox, and the member him/herself marked it as Spam, that would cause the report immediately (and probably not again later).

So only once. I think.

Shal


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Re: Automatic Deletion of Members If Message Marked As Spam #poll

#7046

Chris,

Ahhh... So the "Notifications..." should more correctly read /A
message that had been marked as spam was deleled..But only if I'm correct about that.

I described the situation as a "time bomb" in a post on beta. I hope that Mark would have corrected me on that point had I got it wrong, but possibly that comment got lost in the larger issue and was left to stand without comment.


Shal


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