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Re: Groups.io site updates #changelog

 

Shal,
In DON we tried to devise fool-proof (or sailor-proof) plan, but in our management systems we found that
the only systems that had problems were those run by the computer system experts...

KEN

"It has always seemed strange to me," said Doc. "The things we admire in
men, kindness and generosity, openness, honesty, understanding and feeling
are the concomitants of failure in our system. And those traits we detest,
sharpness, greed, acquisitiveness, meanness, egotism and self-interest are
the traits of success." STEINBECK - CANNERY ROW

On 2018-02-17 17:44, Shal Farley wrote:
Don,

Or are updates a never ending thing?
There's an old saying in computer science to the effect that the only
complete and error-free program is one that nobody uses.
The observation is that any software that is in regular use ends up
being used for things the author never anticipated - and so unexpected
behaviors ("bug reports") and new requirements ("feature requests")
are endlessly generated. I wish I could dig up the source on that one.
Then there's this gem:
"There are two ways to write error-free programs; only the third one
works."
Alan Perlis, "Epigrams on Programming"
Back in the late seventies I took a class on programming in APL from
Dr. Perlis. The quote is very much apt of his humor.
Shal
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A Groups.io group used as a mirror for an existing, other mailing list. Is this feature offered?

 


A Groups.io group used as a mirror for an existing, other mailing list. Is this feature offered?

Google Groups offered this for a while then discontinued it while grandfathering those already using this feature.

It would need to provide a unique user ID to use to subscribe the mirror group to the mirrored list.

Is this offered now or in future plans for the free service or pay.
--
Lawrence F. London, Jr.
lfljvenaura@...
Re: Upgrading from basic to premium

 

Thanks.?? I don't know why I didn't see that earlier.

Sara

On Sat, Feb 17, 2018 at 4:23 PM, Walter Underwood <wunder@...> wrote:
On the group page, choose Admin on the left-hand side menu, then Upgrade below that.

For a new group, you can choose "Start a Group" with a particular plan on?/static/pricing

wunder
Walter Underwood
wunder@...
??(my?blog)


Re: Groups.io site updates #changelog

 

Shal,

That's pretty funny stuff...lol

Don
Re: Site Updates - How Does He Do It! #testimonials

 

"I may as well fret that Kia will sell off its US operations and leave me with inferior maintenance and warranty for my hamster car. I'm sure many Saturn owners will answer that with, "well, yeah".

I'm a Saturn owner, and I can attest GM dealerships still work on past lines of cars...They can still work on my 1970 Chevy C-20 if I needed them too.

Don
Re: Site Updates - How Does He Do It! #testimonials

 

¿ªÔÆÌåÓý

¡°After a couple of years without profit or supposedly faced with substantial costs to update their technology, the new owners have decided to cut their losses.¡±

?

The theory in the Groups.io model is, paid subscribers will pay for the free subscribers and more. If there is enough volume in paid subscribers, it will offset the free subscribers and Mark¡¯s overhead, and Mark will make a living.

?

Don
Re: Groups.io site updates #changelog

 

Don,

Or are updates a never ending thing?
There's an old saying in computer science to the effect that the only complete and error-free program is one that nobody uses.

The observation is that any software that is in regular use ends up being used for things the author never anticipated - and so unexpected behaviors ("bug reports") and new requirements ("feature requests") are endlessly generated. I wish I could dig up the source on that one.

Then there's this gem:

"There are two ways to write error-free programs; only the third one
works."
Alan Perlis, "Epigrams on Programming"

Back in the late seventies I took a class on programming in APL from Dr. Perlis. The quote is very much apt of his humor.

Shal


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Re: Site Updates - How Does He Do It! #testimonials

 

"What assurance do we have that the same thing might not happen with groups.io, except being bought out by maybe another company instead of Yahoo?"

Th only thing in life that is guaranteed, is death and taxes.

Don
Re: Groups.io site updates #changelog

J_Catlady
 

Never ending.

On Feb 17, 2018, at 4:42 PM, Don <dgrass1@...> wrote:

Since Mark does updates every week will there ever be a time when he does not have to update? Or are updates a never ending thing?

Don
Re: Groups.io site updates #changelog

 

Since Mark does updates every week will there ever be a time when he does not have to update? Or are updates a never ending thing?

Don
Re: A Transferred Attachment

 

¿ªÔÆÌåÓý

Shal,

?

I can bring up the image by clicking on the thumbnail, but I don¡¯t know if that will give me any pertinent information. After I found the email with the three thumbnails below the text, I started wondering if all the images were done at the same time, in the same way, why didn¡¯t I get all three images instead of just one. Whatever that person did with his post couldn¡¯t be an isolated occurrence (Or could it be?), that they or no one else had not replicated in 18 years of posts. If the image was embedded into the email could that make a difference?

?

Don

?

From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Shal Farley
Sent: Saturday, February 17, 2018 10:26 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [GMF] A Transferred Attachment

?

Don,

> I did find the post, and there were really three images attached. When
> I clicked on the thumbnail in the post and clicked on Inspect I copied
> this.
> <div class="att-thumb grey has-thumb" data-imgurl="
> ...> Does that tell you anything?

I think it tells me that that particular image, thinlite cover.JPG, was picked out by Yahoo! Groups and replaced with a link to it as an attached image file. This looks like code for a thumbnail of the image at the bottom of the message, and notably the thumbnail is an "http" style image, not itself an attachment. The thumbnail is still stored there:




Note, in this message the thumbnail is a "cid" image, I did that rather than "http" in case the image isn't available later.

So, no, from this particular code snippet I'd say we only saw a demonstration of what I expected: "http" images are not attachments.

You might have to have saved this message in your email folders to have it as a "pristine" example, unmodified by Yahoo Groups.

Shal


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Re: The Transfer Message

 

Yes, that would be the thing to do, but, as I said, when dealing with people all sorts of surprises can occur, even with the simplest of things. For example, when I asked this individual to subscribe to the new groups.io group to test it out he couldn't do it. I provided the subscribe email address but he kept deleting, or his system kept deleting, the +subscribe part of the address. Even after pointing this out to him he still couldn't see it. I then went to another very high quality person. He essentially did the same thing. Somehow the '+' was replaced with '%2B' and he couldn't see the error when the message came back saying the group does not exist. It is so simple to do. Just copy the email address from the message I sent them. I don't understand it. I know that if I include a warning statement prior to the move, some people will not have understood it, or forget it by the time it takes place which could be days a week. For example, it is now two days since I informed transfer to move the small astronomy group and it still has not happened.
Stan

On 2/17/2018 3:37 PM, Duane wrote:
To help minimize the unsubs, you could include the information in the Welcome message that would also be sent (you could change it to something more appropriate for your group after the move.) That, along with an announcement in your YG, seems about the best you can do.

Duane
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Re: The Transfer Message

 

To help minimize the unsubs, you could include the information in the Welcome message that would also be sent (you could change it to something more appropriate for your group after the move.)? That, along with an announcement in your YG, seems about the best you can do.

Duane
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Re: Upgrading from basic to premium

 

On the group page, choose Admin on the left-hand side menu, then Upgrade below that.

For a new group, you can choose "Start a Group" with a particular plan on?/static/pricing

wunder
Walter Underwood
wunder@...
??(my?blog)
Re: The Transfer Message

 

Stan,

I do not have readily on hand the actual text of the message a member of YG's gets to inform them that the group has been moved to groups.io. However, I do remember that the message gives the member an easy way to unsubscribe from the groups.io group by a simple click of the mouse.
The most recent I have is from last August. I'm not sure if this notice is among the things Mark recently improved. but here's the paragraph:
You do not have to do anything to continue being a member of this group. If you do not wish to be a member of GroupName, click here to unsubscribe and you will be unsubscribed immediately.
(I've edited the GroupName and the link, of course) It is the fourth of six short paragraphs.

Is it possible for the support team to remove the option to immediately
unsubscribe in the message they send to members who have been transferred?
Possible, sure. Likely, I doubt it.

I understand your concerns, but I'm sure that Mark considers having the opt-out there is essential for "good behavior" on his part. I'm sure some could make a case that only an opt-in would be "good behavior", but that I think would be way too limiting.

Shal
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Upgrading from basic to premium

 

How do you upgrade a group to premium?

Sara Tarpley
The Transfer Message

 

I do not have readily on hand the actual text of the message a member of YG's gets to inform them that the group has been moved to groups.io. However, I do remember that the message gives the member an easy way to unsubscribe from the groups.io group by a simple click of the mouse. There have been definite instances, without going into details, where members of a YG thought this was a group they didn't subscribe to and so they unsubscribed. I would like to move a group from YG's to groups.io that is very important to me. I would not like to lose members because they mistakenly unsubscribed. Once unsubscribed they probably will not re-subscribe again. I could send out posts informing them that the move will take place and to not unsubscribe, but it seems when dealing with people all kinds of surprising things happen. It seems the simplest things cannot be understood.

Is it possible for the support team to remove the option to immediately unsubscribe in the message they send to members who have been transferred?
Stan
Re: Site Updates - How Does He Do It! #testimonials

 

Stan,

"Another thought that concerns me is that I believe I read that one or
more of the creators of what is now Yahoo groups, which was bought out
by Yahoo around 1999, is/are working on developing groups.io."
That's about the most open of secrets. It's the core of the Groups.io product announcement (linked from the Groups.io About page):


What assurance do we have that the same thing might not happen with
groups.io, ...
We have none, and are not likely to ever have such. At least not covering years in the future.

I may as well fret that Kia will sell off its US operations and leave me with inferior maintenance and warranty for my hamster car. I'm sure many Saturn owners will answer that with, "well, yeah".

In Y!GMF I had to act (as moderator) to squelch idle speculation about Yahoo Groups' value to Verizon / Oath / Yahoo. Let's not run this GMF too far off topic in a similar direction.

Shal


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Re: Site Updates - How Does He Do It! #testimonials

 

That would be Mark Fletcher who is, AFAIK, the one-man band behind . I've voiced the same concern, now exacerbated by the demise of #Wikispaces. When I first started a free wiki on it, the founders controlled the company. Then they were bought out and the result soon after was an annual fee. After all, somebody has to pay for the buyout... After a couple of years without profit or supposedly faced with substantial costs to update their technology, the new owners have decided to cut their losses.

On Feb 17, 2018 4:29 PM, "Stan Gorodenski" <stanlep@...> wrote:
I didn't complete my sentence correctly. I said "Another thought that concerns me is that I believe I read that one or more of the creators of what is now Yahoo groups was bought out by Yahoo around 1999."

It should have been "Another thought that concerns me is that I believe I read that one or more of the creators of what is now Yahoo groups, which was bought out by Yahoo around 1999, is/are working on developing ."
Stan

[excess quote trimmed by moderator]
Re: Site Updates - How Does He Do It! #testimonials

 

I didn't complete my sentence correctly. I said "Another thought that concerns me is that I believe I read that one or more of the creators of what is now Yahoo groups was bought out by Yahoo around 1999."

It should have been "Another thought that concerns me is that I believe I read that one or more of the creators of what is now Yahoo groups, which was bought out by Yahoo around 1999, is/are working on developing groups.io."
Stan


On 2/17/2018 1:56 PM, Stan Gorodenski wrote:
Ditto for me. I have the same concerns as Barb, plus, will the 1G option be free in the future? To keep it free, could there at some time be a cap on the number of messages? Right now there is no limit on the number of messages even if they in total exceed 1G.

Another thought that concerns me is that I believe I read that one or more of the creators of what is now Yahoo groups was bought out by Yahoo around 1999. What assurance do we have that the same thing might not happen with groups.io, except being bought out by maybe another company instead of Yahoo? Then, probably, we would once again have to cope with being inundated with advertisements, maybe higher charges for space, and maybe once again experiencing the slowness and other problems we now experience with Yahoo.
Stan
[excess quote trimmed by moderator]
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