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Re: Can't find this member to moderate them

 

On Thu, May 7, 2020 at 03:54 AM, babygrand wrote:
sent "new topic" message saying "Hello, glad to be here, excited about the group content"? I approved this first message, since all new members are moderated, and removed their aut-moderation since?they seemed ok.
Generic messages like that are a red flag for me.? This is one reason that it's good to set the Unmoderate After to 2 or more and let the system handle it.

I thought of one last possibility.? There's a topic here and another on the about spammers joining groups to do things like this a few days ago.? If the address you were looking for was one of those that Mark disabled, it would just suddenly disappear from your membership list.? If you had checked before he disabled it, you would have seen it.? I saw this same thing happen a few months ago when we were having spammer problems on the site and Mark disabled a bunch of accounts.

Duane
--
The official Groups.io user documentation is in the Groups.io Help Center.
GMF's Unofficial Help Wiki: /g/GroupManagersForum/wiki
Re: Can't find this member to moderate them

 

¿ªÔÆÌåÓý

Thanks, Shal,
appreciate your thoughts here.??

I have searched the members admin list successfully looking for other members with both email, display name? and fragments of each without issue before.? This name just didn't work at all, nothing found.? ?I also did it the long way, by scrolling through the 3200 members after sorting by email address, nothing.? Did that twice.? Sorted members by join date, too nothing found for this member.?

Bulk delete confirmed the deletion of the exact same email address of the member, and the log shows the deletion of that address.? The log shows the messages they sent giving their email, message number and "sent via web".? The messages they sent appear in both logs and messages lists for the whole group.? They're all sent to the right group per the header "to" field.?

Their display name in the message is just their email@doma....? partially rendered like that.? (There's no display name to report from admin pages since they don't appear there).
Have to rule out typos, I've double checked even on different days, and tried copy/paste as well, same results, nothing found on search in the admin pages.

Does any of that help?? I'm really a bit new to this...
Bob

From: [email protected] <[email protected]> on behalf of Shal Farley <shals2nd@...>
Sent: Wednesday, May 6, 2020 11:27 PM
To: [email protected] <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: [GMF] Can't find this member to moderate them
?
Bob,

?> They don't appear in the joined when I sort by date joined.? Not at
?> all.
?> Yes, the groups.io footer does appear in their emails I have gotten.

And the other half of the question: did their message appear in your
group's Messages list?

Are there entries in your group's Activity log corresponding to the date
and time their spam messages were posted?

Is it possible that their message came to you via a different group than
the one you're looking in? Check to be sure that the To: field of the
message exactly matches the posting address of your group.

?> Very odd they won't turn up anywhere in admin tools, ...

So odd that I consider it impossible. Hence the search for a plausible
explanation.

?> no display name to search,

That doesn't matter. I wonder why you keep bringing it up?

Where is it that you are not seeing a Display Name? Are you talking
about either the Inbox or an opened message in your email interface?
That could be the source of the confusion.

Have they confused matters by putting what looks like an email address
in their Display Name? That could obfuscate their actual email address.

But it should stand out like a sore thumb in your group's Members list,
an email address in the Display Name column.

Plus, it wouldn't matter. Putting even part of the text you have into
the Search box in your group's Members list would find that text in
either the Display Name or the Email column.

?> their email is not searchable

The only way you might not find them by searching the Members list or
the Activity log is if you have a typo in the search text you entered.

?> (I enclosed it wrongly but only to show if it had anything odd about
?> it that could throw the software off).

There was not (I'm the moderator who redacted it).

How did you copy the address? Copy / Paste the From field of a received
message? Or did you copy it by hand? There is a possibility that the
address contains characters that look like different characters, leading
to an inability to match it.

?> But the team should know there are emails that can completely hide
?> from the admin, yet will allow themselves to be deleted by bulk
?> delete.

I don't believe such hiding is possible. To be a member of the group the
person's email address must appear in the Members list.

What Bruce asks is a possibility - posting by a non-member. But such
posts are always held for moderation and I assume you would have not
approved spam messages.

Plus, what leads you to believe that bulk delete deleted them if you
were not able to find them in the first place?

Apologies for the long string of questions, but I'm trying to find the
evidence that will tell us what happened. Usually that search begins and
ends with the Groups' activity log - a great tool for revealing message
posting activity and Memberships joining and leaving.

Shal


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Help: /helpcenter
More Help: /g/GroupManagersForum/wiki
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Re: Can't find this member to moderate them

 

¿ªÔÆÌåÓý

thanks?Bruce.??


I checked log
they signed up via web as member

sent "new topic" message saying "Hello, glad to be here, excited about the group content"? I approved this first message, since all new members are moderated, and removed their aut-moderation since?they seemed ok.

they then send ad add for something, as a 'reply' to their own first message, and my group is non-commercial, so I deleted the ad?

I left the first message by the spammer, since by then other members had added legitimate content in their own replies to that message, and I wanted those replies to survive.

the spam ad they sent shows in the log as:
their email address, a message number, and "sent via web"

It came to me in my own email inbox as usual messages to the group do, addressed to group in the header, with the usual footer.? I'm convinced this was a way to pop in an ad by getting friendly and unmoderated so they could put it out there.

But it did occur that their user and email addresses both were unsearchable, yet were deletable under bulk delete.? Strange.

Thanks, Bruce.? stay safe.
Bob

From: [email protected] <[email protected]> on behalf of Bruce Bowman <bruce.bowman@...>
Sent: Thursday, May 7, 2020 12:13 AM
To: [email protected] <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: [GMF] Can't find this member to moderate them
?
Bob -- Another thought:? Do the spam posts have an #email hashtag? If so, they are coming in via an email integration. So if spam posts continue that's something else to look for.

Also, could the post have been sent to the +owner address, rather than the group? Anyone can send an email to that address, not just group members.

Did the message come with [DM] in the subject line? If so, that would have been sent to you via the Directory.

Failing that, I guess you already got rid of the offending member using the bulk delete function, so it's going to be difficult to reconstruct the "can't find him in the members list" problem.

As Shal said yesterday, you really do need to check the activity log, and report back on what it says.?No matter how the spam message made it to your message archive, there should be a log entry explaining where it came from.?Messages to +owner should appear there, too.

If the message landed in your email inbox but never appeared in the message archive, then it wasn't a group message, not matter how legitimate it looked. An enterprising spammer would have no difficulty appending a fake groups.io footer to a direct email. It's as simple as cut-and-paste.

I hope something in there rings a bell.

Regards,
Bruce
Check out the new groups.io Help Center?and?groups.io Owners Manual

Re: Question - "Content flagged as objectionable"

Candice Massey
 

Thank you all for your good advice much of which I have incorporated in my response to the group. I posted this today as a special notice so all see it:
*
ADMIN - A Note About Proper Procedure Reporting Possible Guidelines Violations

Candice Massey?<cmassey@...>
To:[email protected]
Thu, May 7 at 1:59 AM

A note about proper procedure:

All Moderation or notes to individuals or groups whom have potentially
violated Fanciers guidelines have always traditionally been handled
privately, off-list, by the Mods/Co-Owners with just the people
involved. Just because you do not see any Moderations meted out, does
not mean it has not happened.

The proper way to report any supposed or potential violation of any
Fanciers guideline, is a **private off-list note**? to any of the Mods of your
choice. Members posting off-topic and online, any complaint about
another member or a post, will be also potentially Moderated as a
violation of off-topic nature. It is recommended to be without sin in
your reporting process before reporting others. Becoming abusive or
argumentative with other members or Mods is not generally advised
privately or publicly, as that always compounds the initial problem.

Straying from our Fanciers guidelines may result in a friendly **private**
email from one of our Moderators. Repeated or very serious violations
may result in temporary or permanent restrictions on posting, again done
**privately** by one of our Mods. It is no one's business who gets
Moderated, other than the Mods and the actual person or group involved,
this process specifically excludes notification to any violation "reporters".

Thank you for your understanding and future cooperation,
Candice Massey, Mod and Co-Owner Fanciers
****

I stickied this post. I am hopeful this will qwell the pouncers' reasons to
attempt to get other members/mods into trouble, or for them to make public
controversy on the group list.

Thank you everyone here for your welcome insights and help in solving this matter!
Candice
Re: Can't find this member to moderate them

 

Bob -- Another thought:? Do the spam posts have an #email hashtag? If so, they are coming in via an email integration. So if spam posts continue that's something else to look for.

Also, could the post have been sent to the +owner address, rather than the group? Anyone can send an email to that address, not just group members.

Did the message come with [DM] in the subject line? If so, that would have been sent to you via the Directory.

Failing that, I guess you already got rid of the offending member using the bulk delete function, so it's going to be difficult to reconstruct the "can't find him in the members list" problem.

As Shal said yesterday, you really do need to check the activity log, and report back on what it says.?No matter how the spam message made it to your message archive, there should be a log entry explaining where it came from.?Messages to +owner should appear there, too.

If the message landed in your email inbox but never appeared in the message archive, then it wasn't a group message, not matter how legitimate it looked. An enterprising spammer would have no difficulty appending a fake groups.io footer to a direct email. It's as simple as cut-and-paste.

I hope something in there rings a bell.

Regards,
Bruce
Check out the new groups.io Help Center?and?groups.io Owners Manual
Re: Can't find this member to moderate them

 

Bob,

They don't appear in the joined when I sort by date joined. Not at
all.
Yes, the groups.io footer does appear in their emails I have gotten.
And the other half of the question: did their message appear in your group's Messages list?

Are there entries in your group's Activity log corresponding to the date and time their spam messages were posted?

Is it possible that their message came to you via a different group than the one you're looking in? Check to be sure that the To: field of the message exactly matches the posting address of your group.

Very odd they won't turn up anywhere in admin tools, ...
So odd that I consider it impossible. Hence the search for a plausible explanation.

no display name to search,
That doesn't matter. I wonder why you keep bringing it up?

Where is it that you are not seeing a Display Name? Are you talking about either the Inbox or an opened message in your email interface? That could be the source of the confusion.

Have they confused matters by putting what looks like an email address in their Display Name? That could obfuscate their actual email address.

But it should stand out like a sore thumb in your group's Members list, an email address in the Display Name column.

Plus, it wouldn't matter. Putting even part of the text you have into the Search box in your group's Members list would find that text in either the Display Name or the Email column.

their email is not searchable
The only way you might not find them by searching the Members list or the Activity log is if you have a typo in the search text you entered.

(I enclosed it wrongly but only to show if it had anything odd about
it that could throw the software off).
There was not (I'm the moderator who redacted it).

How did you copy the address? Copy / Paste the From field of a received message? Or did you copy it by hand? There is a possibility that the address contains characters that look like different characters, leading to an inability to match it.

But the team should know there are emails that can completely hide
from the admin, yet will allow themselves to be deleted by bulk
delete.
I don't believe such hiding is possible. To be a member of the group the person's email address must appear in the Members list.

What Bruce asks is a possibility - posting by a non-member. But such posts are always held for moderation and I assume you would have not approved spam messages.

Plus, what leads you to believe that bulk delete deleted them if you were not able to find them in the first place?

Apologies for the long string of questions, but I'm trying to find the evidence that will tell us what happened. Usually that search begins and ends with the Groups' activity log - a great tool for revealing message posting activity and Memberships joining and leaving.

Shal


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Help: /helpcenter
More Help: /g/GroupManagersForum/wiki
Even More Help: Search button at the top of Messages list
Re: Can't find this member to moderate them

 

¿ªÔÆÌåÓý

I didn't know that existed, but makes perfect sense how I could have messages there without a known member source, but I took a look, and no, it wasn't/isn't checked.? Only members can post.

Bob

From: [email protected] <[email protected]> on behalf of Bruce Bowman <bruce.bowman@...>
Sent: Wednesday, May 6, 2020 8:50 PM
To: [email protected] <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: [GMF] Can't find this member to moderate them
?
On Wed, May 6, 2020 at 11:33 PM, babygrand wrote:
Sorry, I meant there are members, not emails, that can completely hide from the owner/admin.
Are you allowing non-members to post? See Admin>Settings>Message Policies, first checkbox.

Bruce
Check out the new groups.io Help Center?and?groups.io Owners Manual

Re: Can't find this member to moderate them

 

On Wed, May 6, 2020 at 11:33 PM, babygrand wrote:
Sorry, I meant there are members, not emails, that can completely hide from the owner/admin.
Are you allowing non-members to post? See Admin>Settings>Message Policies, first checkbox.

Bruce
Check out the new groups.io Help Center?and?groups.io Owners Manual
Re: Can't find this member to moderate them

 

¿ªÔÆÌåÓý

Sorry, I meant there are members, not emails, that can completely hide from the owner/admin.? Or at least their email addresses do not show on search, don't list on sorting, etc.? I've seen this and it's true.

Bob

From: [email protected] <[email protected]> on behalf of Duane <txpigeon@...>
Sent: Wednesday, May 6, 2020 3:40 PM
To: [email protected] <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: [GMF] Can't find this member to moderate them
?
On Wed, May 6, 2020 at 05:29 PM, babygrand wrote:
there are emails that can completely hide from the admin
No, there aren't.? It may not be visible to some moderators, but can always be seen by the group owner.? I'd still look through the activity log to see who approved the membership.

Duane
--
The official Groups.io user documentation is in the Groups.io Help Center.
GMF's Unofficial Help Wiki: /g/GroupManagersForum/wiki

Re: send a special message by just sending an email to the group? #specialnotice #messages

 

If I am understanding your question correctly, you can send a message to the group from your email program and address it to the posting address that appears at the bottom of the home page.? Now I know you don't have a group here, but it would work like it did in Yahoo Groups.? You need to make sure the first part of the email address is the name assigned to the group when you crated it and then @groups.io .? Depending on the mail delivery settings of your members will depend on who receives it.?

The one problem I have with that is you won't be able to indicated you want the message to go to those members who selected Special Notice as their mail delivery choice. That can only be done through the groups New Topic option or I haven't figured out a way to do it.? .?

Judy F.
SW Florida - USA


On Wed, May 6, 2020 at 05:06 PM, Bob Petti wrote:
Is it possible for a moderator to send a special message by just sending an email to the group?? Instead of going into the group page??

We are on Yahoo right now, and don't allow members to post at all, but we want to. Two obstacles: (1) many members do not want to get ANY emails except those posted by moderators. I am aware that we can set the new members default to special messages only.? (2) Moderators don't want to go to an app (computer or phone) to post any? message, special or not.??

Right now we just send an email and we are done. So one solution? might be for a moderator to send special messages by emailing a specific address. Possible?

Thanks for your help!

[Mod Note:? Enhanced subject line]

?
--
Judy F.
SW Florida - USA
Re: send a special message by just sending an email to the group? #specialnotice #messages

 

On Wed, May 6, 2020 at 06:29 PM, Bob Petti wrote:
So where does the hash tag go?? In the subject line of the email?? If so, I don't think this will help us since we need to simply forward emails, frequently done from a phone in a car - not very conducive to doing that. Darn it!
Try setting up an Email Integration for the group and forward any priority messages to the integration address instead of the group address. If you also set the Special flag on the #email hashtag that might give you what you want.

Regards,
Bruce?
Check out the new groups.io Help Center?and?groups.io Owners Manual
Re: Can't approve a message

 

¿ªÔÆÌåÓý

Hi Chris,

???? I only have one email associated with Group.io so it has to be my owner login.

????? I did find out the poster added a photo to the post.?

?

Gregg Gammie???????????? ??? ????Yo Quiero Libertad!!

Whippet@...?????????? Viva el Insurgente!

?

¡°The soldier above all people, prays for peace, for they must suffer and bear the deepest wounds and scars of war.¡± ¨C Gen. Douglas MacArthur

?

?

"There are only two means by which men can deal with one another: guns or logic. Force or persuasion. Those who know that they cannot win by means of logic, have always resorted to guns." ¡ªAyn Rand (1905-1982)

?
Re: Can't find this member to moderate them

 

On Wed, May 6, 2020 at 05:29 PM, babygrand wrote:
there are emails that can completely hide from the admin
No, there aren't.? It may not be visible to some moderators, but can always be seen by the group owner.? I'd still look through the activity log to see who approved the membership.

Duane
--
The official Groups.io user documentation is in the Groups.io Help Center.
GMF's Unofficial Help Wiki: /g/GroupManagersForum/wiki
Re: send a special message by just sending an email to the group? #specialnotice #messages

 

On Wed, May 6, 2020 at 05:29 PM, Bob Petti wrote:
So where does the hash tag go?? In the subject line of the email?
Yes, it must be on the subject line with a space on either side.? I'd suggest putting it in front of the existing subject line, but I'm not sure if there needs to be a space in front of it then.? Someone else may have a different way that I'm not familiar with.

Duane
--
The official Groups.io user documentation is in the Groups.io Help Center.
GMF's Unofficial Help Wiki: /g/GroupManagersForum/wiki
Re: email control of message delivery settings?

 

On Wed, May 6, 2020 at 05:29 PM, Patti wrote:
I thought there was a way to change your own message delivery settings for a group using email.
Sure!? See /helpcenter/membersmanual/1/additional-information/standard-group-email-addresses

Duane
--
The official Groups.io user documentation is in the Groups.io Help Center.
GMF's Unofficial Help Wiki: /g/GroupManagersForum/wiki
Re: Can't find this member to moderate them

 

¿ªÔÆÌåÓý

Thanks, Shal.? They don't appear in the joined when I sort by date joined.? Not at all.
Yes, the groups.io footer does appear in their emails I have gotten.

What I finally did was "bulk delete" their email address and that seems to have worked, but no way to know until they go to post again.? Very odd they won't turn up anywhere in admin tools, no display name to search, their email is not searchable (I enclosed it wrongly but only to show if it had anything odd about it that could throw the software off).

For now, the "bulk delete" seems to be the answer in case anyone else runs into this problem.? But the team should know there are emails that can completely hide from the admin, yet will allow themselves to be deleted by bulk delete.? The question is "from where are they being deleted if they won't show up in any listings?"

Bob

From: [email protected] <[email protected]> on behalf of Shal Farley <shals2nd@...>
Sent: Wednesday, May 6, 2020 2:10 PM
To: GMF <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: [GMF] Can't find this member to moderate them
?
Bob,


I've got a member [redacted] with NO display name (so cannot search them, does not turn up anything)

In the Members list, search will find email addresses too, not just Display Names.

and when I sort the member list by emails, they also do not turn up there.? They are a new member without moderation,

Sort by the Joined column to bring new members to the top.

?
yet I set moderation for new members to "on" so they somehow snuck in.?

Look also in your group's Activity Log to see how they joined, and any actions they've taken or a moderator has taken on them. You can focus on just that member putting their email address in the search box and searching for all actions.

They are posting spam, ads etc.?

One question, since you don't see them in the Members list, is whether they actually are posting via the list. Did the spam show up in the Messages list? If you receive them in email do they have the Groups.io footer?

Shal

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Re: send a special message by just sending an email to the group? #specialnotice #messages

 

Duane,

Thanks for the speedy answer.? I am new here and really appreciate it. So where does the hash tag go?? In the subject line of the email?? If so, I don't think this will help us since we need to simply forward emails, frequently done from a phone in a car - not very conducive to doing that. Darn it!

Bob
email control of message delivery settings?

 

Hello everyone! I thought there was a way to change your own message delivery settings for a group using email. I know we used to do that for Yahoo groups, and I could have sworn that you could also do it with Groups.io, but I have looked through the help pages, the FAQ, everywhere I could think of, and cannot find this feature mentioned. Is there a way? Or has my memory finally gone down the tubes?

Thanks for any help!

Patti
Re: stopping/blocking unwanted invitations

b&p
 

We get the occasional potential spammer "wanting to join," i.e., hack the group. The reject reply in the e-mail from does the job for us. But we are a "secret" group with very limited membership and a strong affinity base rather thana general interest group, so our experiences may vary. I don't think there's any way to stop intruders from probing, but that's how we stop them once they have probed. (

What I'm curious about is how they even know we exist if we are indeed a "secret" group.

Paul
co-owner?
Re: Question - "Content flagged as objectionable"

 

Hi GMF peeps,

OK, so we already have the "can talk about Covid-19" thread, pinned to top of topic list --
I'm writing a hopefully very calm post to post on that thread, today,
will remind people how to mute topics/threads they don't care to see

One of the issues in this mess is, there really are things our group needs to talk about/educate/etc. around covid-19 --
the group is about cat care, and veterinary service is hugely impacted, some members are breeders, some are rescuers, some do both, and getting vet care, going to manage colonies, etc. is hugely impacted.? Adoptions are very low, many people are relinquishing pets to shelters on the mistaken idea that cats can give humans the virus, many shelters are closed.? It has become very difficult or impossible to get many veterinary drugs and treatments.? Just as with human care, many "non-critically-urgent" medical procedures are being postponed for cats.? Vet practices that still have some open hours, are having people call from the parking lot at the time of their appointment, a vet tech gets the cat-in-carrier and brings into the practice, the cat's human doesn't get to accompany.?

Another issue is the pouncing-members' tendency to label any criticism of government pandemic response, as "this is a political rant" -- which it is emphatically not.? There is no question that our government response is incompetent.?
Two of my best friends from Caltech (they graduated, I dropped out) work for major drug research firms, one of them is working huge amount of overtime since their employer is working to make a reliable antibody test, the other's employer is working furiously on developing more anti-viral drugs (they're a virus researcher).? Other friends work as nurses.? In our urban area, major hospitals are literally begging the public for PPE (personal protective equipment) like masks -- this includes major players like Kaiser, etc.? These folks are on the inside of the battle, and they make my statements seem incredibly mild.?

It isn't a political statement to say (and yep we can include, 'this is our opinion, AND the opinion of the virus researchers we know'), 'our government's response to pandemic has been incompetent', so we need to do more at local and state levels.

Ironically, when we moved this group to groups.io, and set out with the intent to reinvigorate the group, which like so many had lost a huge number of members when yahoo did the neo format, one of our goals was to restore the focus on critical thinking!? which had lapsed in the neo-format years.?

Quite possibly the fussing members may continue to fuss, the complaining-to-groups-io person threatened to quit (while they contribute good information on certain technical vet things, they're very prone to drama)(and a mod commented don't let the door hit you on your way out....)

Thanks for all your thoughts.? In the grand scheme of things these days, this is a very minor problem.? We'll post a mild post, and see how it goes.? Gesine

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