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Dano,

You should be more specific when you refer to word processors.

Duly noted.

I'll have to confess that the vast majority of my experience with word processors has been MS Word. With a smattering of LibreOffice (which is an MS-office work-alike, so that's not really different). And back in the dim ages some desktop publishing software such as Ventura Publisher (later Corel Ventura).

Shal

On Tue, Jun 6, 2017 at 04:25 pm, Shal Farley wrote:

here you're working with quoted material (my text).

Shal,

My whole issue is the fact that I can't block QUOTE (emphasis on quote) from the previous message in order to answer it. (Note the "quotation" mark sign in the editor toolbar LOL.:) It works for the first instance (the case of selecting and copying text makes it appear automatically, and indented, at the top of the response, as it did here), but nowhere afterwards without all kinds of futzing around.

Re having to hit enter twice, I'm saying you have to hit enter twice even to create two lines from one. From?

the quick brown fox jumped over the lazy dog

to

the quick brown fox
jumped over the lazy dog

takes TWO clicks on the return key.

I think I'm out of this conversation, at least for now. It's getting too convoluted and everyone involved (you, me, Mark) is using a different browser. So who knows what's going on. I've put all the time into this that I can afford to at this point.

J

Where else but in a word processor does a single Enter cause a
paragraph break? I've run into a few, but far and away most ordinary
text entry forms I've used treat Enter as a line break.

Shal

You should be more specific when you refer to word processors. In WordPerfect, Enter gives a simple line break. That people use Word as a standard is just a sad situation caused years ago by deception on the part of M$ to sell their own second class software and push out competitors. YMMV.

Dano

J,

Yes, all of those behave as expected. You don't have to hit "return"
twice to get a blank line displayed, period.

Intriguing. In that case I don't think I know what you mean by hitting return twice.

My mental picture: starting with an empty box, type "ABC[Enter]123". The result I expect is:

ABC
123

With no blank line between. To get a blank line (paragraph break) between them I'd have to hit Enter twice.

Everywhere but in a word processor; and there it isn't really a blank line, it is a paragraph separation with whatever vertical spacing is specified by your paragraph styles.

No, it's not already fixed or it wouldn't have done it to me again
just now, even despite trying to insert blank lines.

Hm, but here you're working with quoted material (my text). And yes I've had trouble in that circumstance. But starting with a blank page and just typing one's own text it seems better behaved. I haven't done much testing with quoted material.

Shal

On Tue, Jun 6, 2017 at 02:51 pm, Shal Farley wrote:

How about any software or web site other than a word processor?
Say Gmail.
Say Yahoo Mail.
Say Thunderbird.
Say Yahoo Groups.

Yes, all of those behave as expected. You don't have to hit "return" twice to get a blank line displayed, period. Using firefox or safari. I don't know why you are having a different experience.?

I didn't need to do that in my test earlier or just now. Maybe it is already fixed?

No, it's not already fixed or it wouldn't have done it to me again just now, even despite trying to insert blank lines. You can see what happened here. It quoted my entire message. Also, if Mark had already fixed it he would have communicated that to me instead of just giving me the workaround (which even now does not seem to be working).

Don't get me wrong. I had no love for the former editor. ?But this one is worse.

J

J,

I'm not referring to quoted matter, and after reporting this bug to
Mark, he confirmed it and gave me the workaround (insert blank lines
around the text).

Interesting. I didn't need to do that in my test earlier or just now. Maybe it is already fixed?

Line 1
Line 2
Line 3

Put the cursor in line 2 (or select that whole line) and click Blockquote. I get:

Line 1

Line 2

Line 3

And I do NOT expect to have to hit "return" twice to get a blank
line! As you pointed out, this is the opposite of what word
processors do (Typewriter? Are you kidding?

How about any software or web site other than a word processor?
Say Gmail.
Say Yahoo Mail.
Say Thunderbird.
Say Yahoo Groups.

Where else but in a word processor does a single Enter cause a paragraph break? I've run into a few, but far and away most ordinary text entry forms I've used treat Enter as a line break.

Shal

On Tue, Jun 6, 2017 at 01:32 pm, Shal Farley wrote:

I'm not having that problem with text I entered, but it definitely has issues with text that came from elsewhere (quoted matter) ....There's no accounting for taste. ;-)

I'm not referring to quoted matter, and after reporting this bug to Mark, he confirmed it and gave me the workaround (insert blank lines around the text). And I do NOT expect to have to hit "return" twice to get a blank line! As you pointed out, this is the opposite of what word processors do (Typewriter? Are you kidding? Yes, I suppose there IS no accounting for taste.:) And yes, I'm on safari when this happens. I haven't tried yet using firefox. Mark said he was using chrome.

J

In #1838 J_Catlady wrote:

Shal, that issue with the Enter key causes problems elsewhere. For
example, you can't block quote without block quoting the entire draft
unless the place where you want to insert the text has a blank line
before and after it.

I'm not having that problem with text I entered, but it definitely has issues with text that came from elsewhere (quoted matter). It seems that if the original material used HTML paragraph tags then this editor tends to put newlines inside the paragraphs rather than between them. And then the blockquote applies to the entire span of the paragraph.

Another thing it does is it tends to eat single newlines.

Taking a three-line
paragraph and crunching
it into one line.

If you select the center line, or have the cursor in the center line, then Blockquote will make just that line a quote - as expected. But...

If you select all three of those lines and click Blockquote you get:

Taking a three-lineparagraph and crunchingit into one line.

Re-wrapping it is surprising; omitting the whitespace is just wrong.

And to insert the blank line, you actually have to hit "return"
twice, not once.

That, to me, is the desired and expected behavior. I want Enter to work in the more typewriter fashion. A line break, not a paragraph break. I recognize that this is the opposite of what word processors like Word do.

The normal "undo edit" key in a browser doesn't work, and you instead
have to click on the advanced toolbar and use the "undo" arrow from
there.

I haven't run into that problem. Ctrl+Z has always worked fine for me. In Firefox. Maybe it is a browser issue.

There's an issue with fonts that I haven't been able to isolate yet.

Mark may have fixed that today, if it is the same issue. I'd noticed that font selection would show in the editor, and in the message sent by email, but not on site.

I would switch back to the old editor in a heartbeat.

There's no accounting for taste. ;-)

Shal

Shal, that issue with the Enter key causes problems elsewhere. For example, you can't block quote without block quoting the entire draft unless the place where you want to insert the text has a blank line before and after it. And to insert the blank line, you actually have to hit "return" twice, not once. The normal "undo edit" key in a browser doesn't work, and you instead have to click on the advanced toolbar and use the "undo" arrow from there. There's an issue with fonts that I haven't been able to isolate yet. And probably more. I would switch back to the old editor in a heartbeat.

I'll try to find time to add these to the wiki, or you can feel free to do it.

J

On Tue, Jun 6, 2017 at 10:05 am, Douglas Swearingen wrote:

The only place I am having this problem is typing to send an email through Groups.io.

But it happens when you are typing an email, not when you are on the groups.io site? It's implausible that your email program recognizes that you are planning to send a message to groups.io and screws up while you're typing then and only then, and not with all your emails. Is that what you're saying? ?

J

J,

p.s. I do wonder if it's a problem with the new editor, which I find very user-unfriendly and weird in general, if not downright buggy.

If you can describe a weirdness or quirk please add it to GMF's wiki page Message composition tips and tricks.

Myself I'm much happier with the new editor.? A large part of that is because the Enter key is now a single line break rather than a paragraph break. But I also like the advanced toolbar and the ability to set fonts separately from format.

Has anyone seen this problem before the new editor went live?

I haven't noticed it in the new editor or old. But I don't often compose on site so if there is a time-of-day factor I might not be hitting "rush hour". Too, I have a pretty fast cable-modem connection so if round-trip time is a factor I'll probably not notice that either.

Shal

p.s. I do wonder if it's a problem with the new editor, which I find very user-unfriendly and weird in general, if not downright buggy. Has anyone seen this problem before the new editor went live?

J

On Tue, Jun 6, 2017 at 05:12 am, Douglas Swearingen wrote:

I just thought it might have been my keyboard or computer, but I guess not..

?It happened to me a couple of years ago, but with everything I typed, including emails, not just groups.io. It did turn out to be my computer (and not the keyboard). I don't remember the details but at first I thought it was software-related. I did end up having to buy a new computer. So I was assuming it was just your computer.

J

Scott, is this when writing on the group home (as I am now) or email? Likely the first. I am not seeing any trouble. At least not now and I don't recall a problem.

A further text: The quick brown fox jumped over the lazy dog. ?No problem.

Frances

I see it now and then, but usually just for a short time. I'm pretty sure it depends on network delays between your computer and the site. A good test for me is about 30 minutes after school lets out, when all the kids get on the internet, as things tend to get real slow. Now, at 4:00 in the morning, things zip along nicely! I'm still on a limited bandwidth connection, so have gotten used to a lot of things like that.

Duane

Not sure if I just report this as a bug or not?so I thought I'd come here and ask if this is happening to anyone else first.

When I start a new post (or when I start a reply to someone else's post) - everything is fine. I type and it appears immediately. However within ONE sentence, whatever I'm typing begins to delay more and more until I am experiencing a several second delay.

As an example:? The quick brown fox jumped over the lazy dog.

By the time I had pressed all the keys for that sentence, only "The quick b" has appeared.?

Scott