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Chris,

In this case it /is/ problems with the email service that have

arisen, > ...

That is a point. Relying solely on email links to log in may not be a good option if you are having trouble with your email service.

Unfortunately in cases like Bart's it is a catch-22: there's no way to set up a password in the first place without the email link arriving on time at least once.

(c) "sign up" with a permanent password which will restore account
access via the web UI.

Which requires either of (a) or (b) ...

There is no (d) get the owner or a moderator to do "something".

There may be a (d) ask support to do "something". For cases like Bart's support could possibly create a temporary password or send a login link with an extended expiration time. I've not had the need to ask about that (thankfully).

... can anyone be /certain/ that a lost or stolen device can never be
used to gain access to Groups.io simply by not having a permanent
password set up?

No.

The login by email method is only as secure as your email account. If a crook gains access to your email by phishing, stealing your (unlocked) mobile device, or otherwise then your Groups.io account is exposed.

And that's true whether or not you've set up a password.

And that's true (for most services) even if there is no log in by email mechanism: the crook could simply request a password reset. If that operates without additional authentication then they are in. A typical protection against phishing or password guessing or the like is second-factor authentication*. But even that is of no help if the crook has physical access to your (unlocked) device - be it desktop or mobile.

I wonder if there is any mileage in requesting a method of
/cancelling/ a permanent password so that once normal email service is
restored a member can revert to requesting log - in links.

The two mechanisms are not exclusive. That is, one can always ask for login by email, whether or not you have set password. And in fact that's also the means by which you set a password in the first place, or reset it if you forget it.

I routinely use an email link to log in with my smartphone, but almost always use my password from the desktop. That choice is merely one of which is the more convenient (for me) on the respective type of device.

Shal
* See the Security page in your Groups.io account to set up Two-Factor Authentication.


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On Tue, Oct 30, 2018 at 07:26 AM, I wrote:

I wonder if there is any mileage in requesting a method of cancelling a permanent password so that once normal email service is restored a member can revert to requesting log - in links.

Silly me; of course that exists at the moment in a member's "Account" section where there is a "delete password" tab. I wonder if judicious use of that might be part of the way round the overall problem.

Chris

Virgina,

I am using the same email that I was in June when I was invited into this group. Something odd is going on that is preventing all (three) members except the original owner from seeing this group.

The only real likelihood is that you aren't actually logged in with the same email address which is in the group's Members list.

Have a look at your log-in email by clicking on your name in the upper right corner of any group page:



Compare that to the email address at the bottom of the footer of messages you receive from the group:



Those must match exactly.

If they do, yet you don't see the group on the Your Groups page (click on the Groups.io logo at the top left of any page) then all I can suggest is that you report the situation to [email protected] - there is no setting a group can make that would cause that to fail as long as you continue to receive group messages (that is, as long as you have not been unsubscribed, or changed your subscription address).

Shal
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On Mon, Oct 29, 2018 at 10:55 PM, Shal Farley wrote:

In that sense not having a password is actually more secure, though a potential problem if your email account gets disabled by your service.

?

Shal,

I do understand the point you are making, along with the rest of your post. (There was no point in quoting all of it!) In this case it is problems with the email service that have arisen, so there is a clear choice:

the member concerned can

(a) pursue their mail service provider and pester them to sort the problem out.
(b) do nothing in the hope that somehow the problem resolves itself.
(c) "sign up" with a permanent password which will restore account access via the web UI.

There is no (d) get the owner or a moderator to do "something".

I can see that the (lack of) physical security of a mobile device can be a problem, but having said that can anyone be certain that a lost or stolen device can never be used to gain access to Groups.io simply by not having a permanent password set up? I would have thought not. (But then I don't have a mobile device!)

Perhaps it ought to be made clear to members that the setting up of a permanent password is a matter of choice for them, but if they don't then there may / will be occasions when they will not be able to use Groups.io and that there will be little or nothing a moderator can do to help them.

I wonder if there is any mileage in requesting a method of cancelling a permanent password so that once normal email service is restored a member can revert to requesting log - in links. (For all I know requesting a link automatically deletes a permanent password anyway, but I don't propose to put it to the test in case something horrible happens!)

Chris

Bart,

In any event, does anyone know if there is a work-around where I can
set a password for him, so he can have full access?

No.

... he was unable to receive the login verification email in 'real
time', ie. within the timeout period. They are showing up about 24
hours later.

That's a tough situation.

He can use either the "Forgot your password, or don't have one yet?" link or the "Email me a link to log in" button, but either way he needs to receive the resulting email message within the timeout period.

They send identical messages, so I don't think it matters which he uses.

Note that he is getting the regular emails, Just not the item that is
a Noreply type of email.

Which is a bit odd. I wonder if /some/ regular messages are also delayed (specifically those from members using Yahoo Mail, AOL, or a few others). Those also arrive with groups.io as the domain in the From address.

He tells me that they are uncooperative and telling him its the forum
server's issue.

It would be nice if they'd tell him a way whitelist the messages from groups.io so as to avoid the delay. I had a similar problem long ago with Verizon and I could never get them to acknowledge that they were delaying acceptance of messages, despite my strong evidence that they were. Very frustrating.

If it helps any, the login link message looks like this:

----------
To: [me]
From: "Groups.io" <[email protected]>
Subject: Link to log into Groups.io

Hello,

Here is a link to log into your Groups.io account:

/loginlink/[long string of digits]

It will expire in 60 minutes, on 09/30/2018 at 11:43pm PDT,
but you'll stay logged in for 30 days, unless and until you log out.

If you did not ask for a login link to be sent to you, please ignore this email.


Cheers,
The Groups.io Team
----------

It is a plain text message, about as innocuous as they come, apart from having an URL in it.

Shal


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On Tue, Oct 30, 2018 at 03:52 AM, Virginia wrote:

The original owner of this group that Cathy and I belong to can see all of us and confirmed that I am co-owner and Cathy is a Moderator. I am using the same email that I was in June when I was invited into this group.

I would be interested to know if your second sentence has been confirmed by the "original owner" or not. I would suggest that you & Cathy ask the original owner to send separate emails to each of you from the records within the group just to confirm that you each get those emails. This may or may not provide a further clue to whatever has gone wrong, and you may still have to contact support but being able to confirm that the "email test" works may help Mark work out what is wrong.

Chris

Charlie,

I have had several situations arise recently where it would be really
handy for the owner (me) to have access to a subscriber's personal
alias information, perhaps even have the ability to set an alias for
someone who is having difficulty.

Are you referring to an Email Alias, as set in the Advanced Settings section of a user's Account pages?

Is there such a means?

Likely not, but it depends on precisely what you're talking about. For Email Alias no; but moderators can, for example, edit a member's Display Name via their page in the Members list (excluding subgroups).

Shal


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Received from Barb M at 10/28/2018 02:16 PM UTC:

Though I hate to add to this lengthy conversation, I have to confess to being totally baffled by it. Groups.IO will work just like Yahoo did if you create a password at the beginning, as Yahoo *required* you to do.

I don't find that to be the case. On Yahoo I had a username and password. Here on Gio I have an email address and a password. So far the same thing.

On Yahoo(Groups) I logged in once using my username and password and from then on all I had to do was visit my Yahoogroups and I found myself logged in via a cookie Yahoo stored on my computer. That cookie was refreshed upon each new visit. I never had to log in again using my username and password unless I foolishly deleted my Yahoo cookies or manually logged out.

On Gio I can log in on let's say Jan 1 using my email address and password and for the next 30 days all I have to do is visit my Gio groups and I find myself logged in via a cookie Gio stored on my computer. That cookie is NOT refreshed upon each new visit and after 30 days it expires. Then when I visit Gio I don't see my groups and I have to log in again manually with email address and password. (Or I can request a login link that resets the cookie without requiring me to know (or even have) a password.)

I'm used to this behavior so know what to do. The several times weekly threads by people who don't know what to do is the reason I think this approach to cookies needs to be changed so the cookie is refreshed upon each visit.

I used the analyzer, and it showed my ISP holding up the email that took almost three days to get to me. I'll have to contact my ISP about the problems I'm experiencing, and maybe I can get something resolved. If I do get this fixed through the ISP, I'll let you all know how it went.

Don

I have had several situations arise recently where it would be really handy for the owner (me) to have access to a subscriber's personal alias information, perhaps even have the ability to set an alias for someone who is having difficulty.? Is there such a means?? If there is, I have not been able to find it.

????????????? -- Charlie

I am a co-owner of this same group that Cathy is in and I also cannot see it in my groups list (I belong to one other group which I do see). I used to see this group also but not any more. The original owner of this group that Cathy and I belong to can see all of us and confirmed that I am co-owner and Cathy is a Moderator. I am using the same email that I was in June when I was invited into this group. Something odd is going on that is preventing all (three) members except the original owner from seeing this group. Any ideas?

On Mon, Oct 29, 2018 at 08:10 PM, Bruce Bowman wrote:

be advised that everyone involved will be refreshing the chat page a lot (it does not auto-refresh).

Apparently, that depends on browser, device, etc.? The couple of times I used Chat for testing, it updated itself.


Duane
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On Mon, Oct 29, 2018 at 07:35 PM, Duane wrote:

There's a possible work-around.? You could set up a single hashtag that was for use by moderators only, require the use of an existing hashtag on messages, then use it when first posting a message.? This would require that the person that starts the discussion be a moderator.

I agree with Duane that this should work.?

• Go to Admin>Settings>Message Policies and tic the "Hashtags Required" box
• Immediately below, pull down the "Hashtag Permissions" menu and select "bounce" (second option).
• Click "Update Group" at the bottom of the page.
• Create ONE hashtag for the group. Click on "Use by Mods only" but unclick "Replies by Mods only."

At that point your "meetings" should function correctly as long as the Moderator who starts it remembers to include the hashtag. Otherwise, their post will bounce, too. It's kind of annoying, but is probably your only option, assuming you don't want to moderate every post.

Hope this helps,
Bruce

P.S. If you prefer to interact in real time you might want to consider using the chat function for your meetings; but be advised that everyone involved will be refreshing the chat page a lot (it does not auto-refresh).
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As you were told 4 days ago, /g/GroupManagersForum/topic/27637112, no one from Groups.io management is on this group.? Maybe someone with a paid group can tell you if this can be done on one of those.? It sounds to me like you don't want a group, just a mailing list.? There are other sites that would be more appropriate for that.

Duane
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On Mon, Oct 29, 2018 at 08:23 PM, AL Guevara wrote:

We sure would like "no footer links" whatsoever.
Want a PURE email group, with no member ever learning there is an "online interface" whatsoever.

Al --

Please join and post this request to , which is the official "suggestion box" for groups.io. There are also??over there that you could give a bump to.

No one from groups.io management monitors GMF. We are just group owners like yourself, trying to help each other. While you're not the first person to inquire about this, you're just spinning your wheels posting it here.?
?
Regards,
Bruce
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On Mon, Oct 29, 2018 at 08:22 PM, <dgrass1@...> wrote:

I just today got an email I sent to my group last Saturday, so that's about a three day lag.

See this message on an email header analyzer that can tell you very quickly where the message was held up.?

Hope this helps,
Bruce?
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We sure would like "no footer links" whatsoever.
Want a PURE email group, with no member ever learning there is an "online interface" whatsoever.

Why?
Dont wanna teach newbz how to use online interface.?
Don't want the hassle.

Can g.io add a PRICE POINT option for this ?

I just today got an email I sent to my group last Saturday, so that's about a three day lag.

I have recently been using my ISP web mail interface, to see if it has been showing or acting any differently than my Outlook program on my computer. While using the web mail I checked Spam settings, and added Groups.io and my group to the Allow feature. I'll take Donald's advice and check it again.

Don

Hello, the only solution I can offer you, and in order to keep people from creating new topics, is to put everyone meaning your whole group on moderated status meaning keeping it moderate a group. That way they you have control weather a new topic is created or not. As far as your second item, you will have to get Mark to add a functionality to disable the leading topics. Because I don't think there is your convenience.

"Groups. io" <[email protected]> of those in the settings. I will paste his address below four.

You should be able to start a new transfer, then select only files during the actual transfer step.? Just make sure the total size will fit in your group without going over the storage limit.

Duane
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