I have just moved a group over from Yahoo where the Polls seem to be separate from messages.? We use Polls extensively to conduct business, and we need to keep the poll results for legal reasons. In groups.io they seem to be part of the topics/messages area instead of in their own space which means finding and keeping them is going to be a challenge.?

What am I missing or how do other groups manage this?
Thanks
Beth

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As far as the transmission of e-mails is concerned, BiKenG is right. But there's nothing in the e-mail standards to prevent the e-mail destination interpreting names however it likes -- that's not twisting or bending the rules at all. The parallel is with the name at the top of an address on paper post. The postal service is not allowed to assume that Frederika Example and Fred Example of 25 Main Street are the same person, but she herself is. Similarly, the e-mail delivery system, including Groups.io as a mailing list processor, must assume that frederika@... and fred.nospam@... are different, but they might well arrive in the same mailbox.

? - Mark

On Fri, Jul 27, 2018 at 11:24 PM, Shal Farley wrote:

All work and no play could be worse for the company's long-term health, if
burn-out sets in. I've no idea what kind of hours Mark works, but he's running
a 24/7 business and that's got to have an impact.

== ==
Shal (et Al),

As to Mark . . .

We at the users' end frequently do not evidence a complete grasp of how much work really goes on behind the scenes to make the end product be user friendly AND function properly. And as with any other artist or craftsman who stays too close to his or her work for too long, they can reach a point where they are unable to notice some of the small problems it may have.

So taking a break is a good thing for all involved –and that would not unreasonably include us users.

Hooray for Holidays!

Paul M.
==

Bob,

If may make the company go belly up but that's the boss's perogative.

All work and no play could be worse for the company's long-term health, if burn-out sets in. I've no idea what kind of hours Mark works, but he's running a 24/7 business and that's got to have an impact.

Shal


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If you're the sole proprietor you can do what you darn well please.
If may make the company go belly up but that's the boss's perogative.
--

Bob Bellizzi

Founder, Fuchs Friends??
Founder & Executive Director,?

Toby, keep you and Alan and the same reply. I have not heard, of Mark hiring any help. He had a friend, that was going to watch out for things while he in travel mode. India will small issues. However, I have not heard of him wanting to hire any help. Alan, the reason why you did not see marks message, is because you're not part of the beta group beta is the group that Mark runs and Post to. He is not a part of GMf.

Shal, I appreciate your calm and reasonable comments, recognize that you aren't responsible for the policy, and are trying to be fair. But I must respectfully disagree with much of what you said.

First of all, obviously this policy IS based on personal beliefs. People's political identification depends on their own personal beliefs. People join "causes" because of their personal beliefs. Additionally, the statement on the pricing page refers to the "immoral policies" of one political group. That is a personal belief expressing a judgment of condemnation against the many people who don't share that belief. It also offers a privilege to people who share that belief while denying it to others who do not.

Referring to a group's beliefs as "immoral" may not be "hate speech" in a legal sense, but is at least an expression of intolerance and bigotry against that group. This is not a "stretch." The policy statement impugns the morality of an entire group of people while assuming the superiority of a differing group.?

Granted, this policy doesn't deny service to members of? a particular group. They can still ride the groups.io bus. They just have to pay for their tickets while members of the assumed "morally superior" group get to ride for free..?

The argument that only a tiny fraction of people might feel discriminated against by this policy is both patronizingly facile and grossly inaccurate. It's like saying that it's no big deal to discriminate against a certain ethnic group because they are only a small fraction of the population anyway. Also, the implication that only a tiny fraction of people would disagree with the policy is just factually wrong. The people who would disagree with the policy happen to constitute the current ruling majority political party of the United States, which is supported by approximately half of the people in this very large country. The precise numbers are debatable, but unquestionably millions of people would in principle find this policy offensive and objectionable if it became publicly known to them.

Facebook's loss of $118B reported yesterday would seem to counter the suggestion that politicization of social media services might be a profitable business practice. One could argue that was mostly due to privacy issues, but the subject? of political bias was also prominent in the public conversation about Facebook's policies and was a significant factor.

I don't think that I have a loss of perspective. I believe that I am putting the policy into a perspective which the groups.io owner may not recognize or respect.The loss then is not mine, but his.


[mod note: and so this topic ends as I somewhat thought it would. In an intractable debate on subjects that have nothing to do with helping users run their groups.]

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Thank you Shal,
Sorry for the lack of patience.
When I was in IT (the 2nd Millennium), you didn't go on vacation to keep your job. :)
I will await his/her return.
Kind Regards.

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Chris,

anyone know how to turn off the reply to group link in the footer.
I have an announcement group so members cannot post to it. So Reply to Group does not seem to make much sense.

In the Message Policies section of your group's Settings page select either Sender or Moderators in the Reply To control, and also check the Remove Other Relply Options box just below that.

Shal


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Hi
anyone know how to turn off the reply to group link in the footer.
I have an announcement group so members cannot post to it. So Reply to Group does not seem to make much sense.
Hence I would like to turn it off

anyone know how to do this?

Daniel,

This is why I hate this topic. Politics causes some people to lose all perspective.

It's not illegal discrimination, but It is plainly discrimination
nonetheless: giving a preference to some group of people while denying
it to others based on some personal characteristic ...

Keep this clearly in mind: the only people being offered a free upgrade are those who run lists (groups) in service of a particular cause. Yes, that is technically discrimination. But no, it is not based on anyone's personal characteristics or beliefs.

I imagine that many members of my PTA and my classmate groups would agree with that cause, while another portion would hold the diametrically opposed view. None of them are being discriminated for or against. I would say likewise for the membership of GMF. It is only the tiny fraction of the membership, if any, which might run a group aligned with or against that particular issue who might have a reason to feel discriminated for or against.

For the rest of us, it is of no practical importance, though it may be of philosophical importance to some.

Regardless of the discrimination issue, it's an extremely stupid
business decision.

I don't know about "extremely stupid", but I do think it was an unwise one.

But I could be wrong. In recent years social media campaigns to punish companies for taking a political or moral stand have often as not backfired when supporters of that stand rally round the company. A social media campaign centered on Groups.io, even in opposition, might be a level of marketing Groups.io could never hope to achieve otherwise. That's an old observation by the way, which probably predates P. T. Barnum:


But no, I am NOT in any way shape or form insinuating that Mark is that cynical.

And finally, it is a violation of group.io's own Terms Of Service /
User Conduct section 6 (vi) that states groups.io must not be used in
any way which is "hateful racially, ethnically or otherwise
objectionable."

This is what I mean about the loss of perspective. To get there you had to stretch "otherwise objectionable" way beyond the context of that sentence (hate speech).
Shal



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It's not illegal discrimination, but It is plainly discrimination nonetheless: giving a preference to some group of people while denying it to others based on some personal characteristic which you happen to share with the group you give preference to.

Regardless of the discrimination issue, it's an extremely stupid business decision. Consider Ford Motor Company saying that they are going to give free cars to anyone who is a registered Democrat. Obviously then Ford is not going to make any money selling cars to Democrats since they are giving them to them for free instead. And how many Republicans are going to buy a Ford once they hear about this?

?And finally, it is a violation of group.io's own Terms Of Service / User Conduct section 6 (vi) that states groups.io must not be used in any way which is? "hateful racially, ethnically or otherwise objectionable."
/static/tos

Or is that just a double standard which applies only to the groups.io users but not to the owner?

Art,

Any reason for a delay??

The transfer agent is on vacation:


Shal


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Daniel,

I also suspect that this blatant bias for and against certain users
based on their political beliefs is going to soon become a viral hot
topic on social media.

Keep in mind that Groups.io is not turning anyone away. All that has happened is that groups of a certain nature are offered a free upgrade to Premium.

Some may consider it a distinction without a difference, and I'm sure many will, but I don't think offering a discount to a certain class of groups constitutes discrimination against all the others. I certainly don't feel that GMF or my PTA group or my classmate groups, all being non-political, are being discriminated against.

People who have large audiences in social media may be advising others
to avoid, move away from, or otherwise boycott groups.io because of
this discriminatory policy.

People have to make their own decisions, obviously. They should consider whether:

a) the apparent fact that Mark Fletcher holds a political view that they disagree with; or
b) the fact that some groups were offered an upgrade that was not offered to them;

is sufficient cause for them to move to another service, one which likely provides inferior features and support for them and their group members.

Shal


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