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Re: Members post and Groups.io unsubscribes them!

 

Brandy,

No, they're not using one of those services.
Ok (good), that pretty much eliminates the removed for spam report mechanism.

... Mark told me to look on the static help pages and ask for help
here. I kinda thought they should know their own system and figure
this out. :-\ Little frustrated right now.
That only means that based on what you said it appeared to be something we should be able to figure out. Sort-of like the Carl Sagan adage that extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence.

Here is what happened with one member (shared with permission):

I read the message in gmail and hit reply in gmail. Then I just typed
my reply and hit send. This bounced back to me because my default
email address didn't match the registered address.

Then I hit reply again and copied my message from the other window
into this one and changed the reply email address. It went through
that time. I got the "sorry to see you go" a few minutes later. Don't
know which send triggered it.
A bounce from a non-subscriber address would be rejected, and noted in the Activity log ("Non-member ... attempted to send message"), but nothing more. In particular it couldn't have any effect on the subscribed address - the system would have no knowledge that those two addresses were in any way related.

So only the second send could possibly have triggered it, but it went through normally. So this indicates that the unsubscribe wasn't (directly) caused by the emailed message.

One other possibility:

Did this member forward this (or any other) group message on to someone else?

It is possible that the someone else received it and used the footer link to unsubscribe the member -- thinking that he/she would be unsubscribing him/herself. The footer Unsubscribe link contains an ID for the member corresponding to the email address shown next to it.

Morale of that story: always delete the footer before forwarding a group message.

Shal


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Re: Members post and Groups.io unsubscribes them!

 

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Brandy,

I do not know if this is your problem or not, but may be something to check.? If any of your members receive a message marked as spam and the member deletes all the spam, they will be removed.? However, if this is the reason they are removed they should almost immediate receive a link to click on and reinstate themselves.? In this case it is their email client putting through the message as spam.? The only way to avoid this situation is the have the members mark any spam messages that are coming from Groups.io as not being spam before deleting the spam.? I know at one time Outlook, AOL, and Yahoo have been bad about that.

Maybe someone else will respond with any other possibilities.

Doug


From: [email protected] <[email protected]> on behalf of Brandy Brow <brandy@...>
Sent: Monday, January 21, 2019 5:01 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: [GMF] Members post and Groups.io unsubscribes them!
?
I just successfully transferred over my groups but Groups.io is automatically unsubscribing any of the members who post, even when replying to messages. What's going on and how do I stop this? It's set so members can post and new members should be moderated. Under message settings, the only things selected are disable message editing, virus blocking, and separate footer settings. None of those should be causing the members to have "left via web."



Brandy Brow
-----------------------------
Freelance Editor & Writer
Create & Correct Word Services
-----------------------------
"Medicine for Words and Hearts"


Re: Wiki photos

 

You can test by saving the url?of the image (rt click)
delete, paste in a new one
save
ck the new pic?urln against the old (likely a different?url?)
wait a few days, and?ck?if the old url still displays the old image, or redirects you to the home page.


Re: Members post and Groups.io unsubscribes them!

 

¿ªÔÆÌåÓý

Could this phenomena be happening because attachments were set to bounce, so when someone replies from a mail program that treats the original response like an attachment, it's making part of the post bounce, so it will post to the group but then the member gets booted from the bounced attachment?

In the member's case I cited, she posted from a wrong email, it bounced, then she copied and pasted the message and sent with the right email. Perhaps Gmail treated it like an attachment that bounced?

Just in case, I changed settings so it will strip instead of bounce attachments.

I'm beginning to think Groups.io's bounce then boot policy needs serious rethinking.


Brandy Brow
-----------------------------
Freelance Editor & Writer
Create & Correct Word Services
-----------------------------
"Medicine for Words and Hearts"


Re: Members post and Groups.io unsubscribes them!

 

¿ªÔÆÌåÓý

Good thoughts, Bruce. The ones this is happening to so far are regulars and should not have been caught off-guard, especially because I gave clear notice ahead of transfer and what to expect so they were well-aware. And it's after they've posted from service providers that aren't flagged with a bounce issue, so very strange. I don't want to see more people post and get booted, so I really hope I can get this figured out and fixed.


Brandy Brow
-----------------------------
Freelance Editor & Writer
Create & Correct Word Services
-----------------------------
"Medicine for Words and Hearts"


Re: Messages/Topics

 

On Thu, Oct 25, 2018 at 06:14 AM, Duane wrote:
What you see shown in the drop down depends on how you get there.? If you get there from the group's home page or the Your Groups list at the top, the view will be the same as it was last time you were there, either Topics, Messages, Expanded, or Polls.? The site remembers the view that you used last.? The exception to this is if you use the overview page of all your groups.? When you click on a group name there, it always goes to the Topic view and that becomes the new default.
? As a newbie, I'm still confused.? I prefer to see Topics in Messages, not individual messages.? I'm in two groups other than this one.

? Where is the "overview page of all your groups"?? How do I get there and what do I select?

Thanks,

Dan P


Re: Members post and Groups.io unsubscribes them!

 

¿ªÔÆÌåÓý

Here is what happened with one member (shared with permission):


I read the message in gmail and hit reply in gmail. Then I just typed my reply and hit send. This bounced back to me because my default email address didn't match the registered address.

Then I hit reply again and copied my message from the other window into this one and changed the reply email address. It went through that time. I got the "sorry to see you go" a few minutes later. Don't know which send triggered it.

I'm not sure at all what this would be. My only thought is that you mentioned it would remove us if something went to spam. Maybe it detected the bounce? But then I'm not sure it would have connected it with me specifically. Just not sure what happened.


This should not have bounced her out when she sent from the correct email because that one hadn't bounced in the system.

?


Brandy



Brandy Brow
-----------------------------
Freelance Editor & Writer
Create & Correct Word Services
-----------------------------
"Medicine for Words and Hearts"


Re: Members post and Groups.io unsubscribes them!

 

A move to groups.io always seems to confuse a few people, no matter how hard you try to tell them that it's coming. This is especially to those subscribers on No Email or Special Notices, who generally have to be contacted individually to give them a heads-up.?

Imagine for a moment getting a notice out of the blue that welcomes you to a mysterious site called groups.io (what's this .io top-level domain, anyway?) and says you've been added to a group and tells you where to post messages. If you didn't expect it, you'd no doubt think it was spam. You might reply with a complaint about how you didn't want to be added to any group, then click on that unsub button in a huff. And so I have to wonder what the corresponding messages look like.

Later (perhaps and hour and 50 minutes later?) it dawns on you that this was the same group you were already subscribed to at Y!G, and so you come back and ask to be reinstated...

In any event, I see no clear indication from the log that the unsubs are directly related to posting activity, and suspect this will sort itself out in a day or two. I don't know how many subscribers are in this group, or how frequently they check group emails and actively participate...but if only a handful of them were blindsided, you should probably consider yourself fortunate.
?
Regards,
Bruce
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Re: Members post and Groups.io unsubscribes them!

 

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On 1/21/19 10:44 PM, Shal Farley wrote:
Brandy,

> One member tried to send a message to the group from an email that
> wasn't subscribed, and then when she sent one from her subscribed
> email, it posted the message and then booted her.

After a 12 minute delay. And after an hour 50 minutes in the case of M Thompson.

I wonder if there's a bug in the log reporting, and these are actually cases of "removed for marking a message as spam". The time delay and the phrasing "resumed membership via web" makes me suspicious - I've only seen "resumed" used with the spam mechanism.

Are these members by any chance using one of the known services that cause the "marking as spam" problem?
/g/GroupManagersForum/wiki/Removed-for-spam#Service-Providers

No, they're not using one of those services.



If you can contact the affected members and confirm that they haven't interacted with the web site then I'd recommend reporting this to [email protected] along with the copy from the activity log.


Underway. I reported this already to support at Groups.io (didn't send the activity log yet) and Mark told me to look on the static help pages and ask for help here. I kinda thought they should know their own system and figure this out. :-\ Little frustrated right now.



Brandy Brow
-----------------------------
Freelance Editor & Writer
Create & Correct Word Services
-----------------------------
"Medicine for Words and Hearts"


Re: Wiki photos

 

Ken,

Is there a particular location/folder where photos on wiki pages
reside? I see the obscure URL. Can we get to them?
Not that I know of.

I don't mind uploading a "/*new*/" photo but would like to
remove/clean up the old junk, I mean content, that is no longer used.
I just delete the old photo from the page and paste in the new one. It never occurred to me that the old might still be hanging around somewhere.

Other than using an exceptionally large photo so that I can see the effect in my usage stats I'm not sure how to test this. And even then you'd have to test carefully, as there might be an arbitrary delay between deleting the photo and garbage-collection and/or update of the usage stat.

Shal


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Re: Members post and Groups.io unsubscribes them!

 

Brandy,

One member tried to send a message to the group from an email that
wasn't subscribed, and then when she sent one from her subscribed
email, it posted the message and then booted her.
After a 12 minute delay. And after an hour 50 minutes in the case of M Thompson.

I wonder if there's a bug in the log reporting, and these are actually cases of "removed for marking a message as spam". The time delay and the phrasing "resumed membership via web" makes me suspicious - I've only seen "resumed" used with the spam mechanism.

Are these members by any chance using one of the known services that cause the "marking as spam" problem?
/g/GroupManagersForum/wiki/Removed-for-spam#Service-Providers

There is also an Unsubscribe link in the footer of each message. That would take them to the web page to unsubscribe (hence "left via web"), but I don't know how that would get activated without the member deliberately clicking it and then confirming at the web site.

You'll see one in there sent a message and wasn't booted.
I see that.

If you can contact the affected members and confirm that they haven't interacted with the web site then I'd recommend reporting this to [email protected] along with the copy from the activity log.

Shal


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Wiki photos

 

Is there a particular location/folder where photos on wiki pages reside?? I see the obscure?URL.? Can we get to them?
I ask because using MediaWiki, if I need to edit or change an image, I just upload a revised photo that?replaces the one saved, instead of uploading an additional photo.?

I don't mind uploading a "new" photo but would like to remove/clean up the old junk, I mean content, that is no longer used.

-ken


Re: Members post and Groups.io unsubscribes them!

 

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On 1/21/19 9:02 PM, Shal Farley wrote:
Brandy,


I just successfully transferred over my groups but Groups.io is automatically unsubscribing any of the members who post, even when replying to messages.

Is that in fact what's happening?

Yes.

I mean, is it happening to every member who posts? Or was "any" a typo for "many"?

Presumably you haven't been unsubscribed from the group after posting.

Nope, I haven't, but I'm the owner. The others have. One managed to post and remain in the group.



None of those should be causing the members to have "left via web."

There isn't a setting that would cause an automatic unsubscription (there is a mechanism that would, removed because of spam report, but it has a different log entry). As Bruce mentioned, left via web in the logs means that the member him/herself performed the Unsubscribe action, either at the bottom of the Subscription page or on their subscription list (Groups home page).

That's what I'd think...


Immediately after transferring some of my groups I experienced what Bruce mentioned: many members who had been "No Email" on the Yahoo Group unsubscribed themselves promptly after the transfer. But with one notable exception those people didn't bother to post or reply before unsubscribing, so I'm still a little puzzled by the apparent coincidences in your case.


No, I've had those. These were different. Here is the log (modified for privacy)

One member tried to send a message to the group from an email that wasn't subscribed, and then when she sent one from her subscribed email, it posted the message and then booted her. Both people who posted did so by email. Their messages posted and then the logs say they left via the web, but I don't think they actually were on the web. You'll see one in there sent a message and wasn't booted.




5:19pm
applied for membership via web 3:50pm
L Norman <deleynabee@> left via web 3:34pm
sent message #37169, via email 3:22pm
Non-member @deleynabee.com attempted to send message "White listing in gmail" via email 3:08pm
changed group settings via web 2:54pm
changed group settings via web 2:51pm
resumed membership via web 2:40pm
mvtgrtrt@ sent message "Re: Sorry to see you leave CWGI" to owners via email 2:39pm
sent message #37168, via email 1:30pm
J Robertson <janerobeson@> left via web 10:15am
M Thompson <mvtgrtrt@> left via web 8:15am
sent message #37167, via email 6:25am
sent message #37166, via email 4:33am


???


Brandy Brow
-----------------------------
Freelance Editor & Writer
Create & Correct Word Services
-----------------------------
"Medicine for Words and Hearts"


Re: Members post and Groups.io unsubscribes them!

 

Brandy,


I just successfully transferred over my groups but Groups.io is automatically unsubscribing any of the members who post, even when replying to messages.

Is that in fact what's happening?

I mean, is it happening to every member who posts? Or was "any" a typo for "many"?

Presumably you haven't been unsubscribed from the group after posting.
?
None of those should be causing the members to have "left via web."

There isn't a setting that would cause an automatic unsubscription (there is a mechanism that would, removed because of spam report, but it has a different log entry). As Bruce mentioned, left via web in the logs means that the member him/herself performed the Unsubscribe action, either at the bottom of the Subscription page or on their subscription list (Groups home page).

Immediately after transferring some of my groups I experienced what Bruce mentioned: many members who had been "No Email" on the Yahoo Group unsubscribed themselves promptly after the transfer. But with one notable exception those people didn't bother to post or reply before unsubscribing, so I'm still a little puzzled by the apparent coincidences in your case.

Shal


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Re: Members post and Groups.io unsubscribes them!

 

On Mon, Jan 21, 2019 at 07:36 PM, Brandy Brow wrote:
I just successfully transferred over my groups but Groups.io is automatically unsubscribing any of the members who post, even when replying to messages. What's going on and how do I stop this? It's set so members can post and new members should be moderated. Under message settings, the only things selected are disable message editing, virus blocking, and separate footer settings. None of those should be causing the members to have "left via web."
If "left via web" is what the the Activity Log says, then these people are unsubscribing from your group on their own initiative.

Yahoo groups sometimes made it difficult to unsubscribe; others found it difficult to figure out how to do it. So folks would just set their delivery preference to "No Email" and forget about it. Such subscribers will be quite disconcerted when they suddenly find themselves re-added to a group that they tried to leave years ago.?

You'll probably discover that other email addresses will start bouncing because people got new email addresses in the interim and Yahoo never bothered to flag their accounts accordingly.?

It is not unusual to lose 10-20% of your members in this way.?If they aren't going to participate anyway, then you don't need them. If you believe something else is happening, please post the log entries here.

Hope this helps,
Bruce
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Email integration

 

We use an email integration to post formmail from our primary web site to our group, along with PayPal notifications. This is being done to capture new member information and dues payments for our club.

Such posts arrive with the #email hashtag. I want people to be able to reply to those emails, but I don't want the hashtag to appear in the replies, so that I can continue to use it to filter down to the original posts coming in via the integration.?

Thoughts on the best (or any) way to achieve this objective would be appreciated.

Thanks,
Bruce
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Members post and Groups.io unsubscribes them!

 

¿ªÔÆÌåÓý

I just successfully transferred over my groups but Groups.io is automatically unsubscribing any of the members who post, even when replying to messages. What's going on and how do I stop this? It's set so members can post and new members should be moderated. Under message settings, the only things selected are disable message editing, virus blocking, and separate footer settings. None of those should be causing the members to have "left via web."



Brandy Brow
-----------------------------
Freelance Editor & Writer
Create & Correct Word Services
-----------------------------
"Medicine for Words and Hearts"


Re: Owner left

 

Fabien . . .

On Sun, 20 Jan 2019 18:16:49 -0800, "Fabien"
<theboxcarchildren10@...> wrote:

Also, are you able to give someone else admin privileges, or can there be only one admin?

As someone else posted, you can have multiple owners.

Be careful about that, though. You could appoint an owner who could
demote you to moderator. It happened to me, but it was in a group I
set up for the other person anyway. We had a difference of opinion
about one member's posts being inappropriate and needing moderated and
the other owner felt the member didn't offend anyone and didn't need
moderation. I never felt it was my group and I was just there to help
get it set up and started and to help moderate. So my job was really
over at that point anyway.

I ended up leaving the group at a later time since I felt if I wasn't
trusted as a co-owner, I was not needed and would be better off
somewhere else. There was another moderator so I wasn't really
essential to the group's continuation.

Though no harm was done there, it could be a situation where some
other co-owner takes over the group.

I heard about that happening in a Yahoo group a long time ago. The
owner got tired of running things and asked for volunteers to take
over. The person who took the job of being owner got a power trip and
started making lots of rules.

Everyone went somewhere else and they started their own group. :-)

Donald



Join the Icom group, a general Icom discussion group on Groups.io:
/g/ICOM (just launched)


Re: Post preview for links... like Google+ and Facebook and Twitter... #postpreviews

 

Beno?t,
?
?
I want to know if someone know if Mark Fletcher study the question. ^^
?
I don't think there's any way of knowing unless he comments on it in beta.

If you don't want to receive all of beta's messages just to see if he comments on your post that would be a good use for the Advanced Preferences in your subscription to beta: Following Only + Auto Follow Replies.
?
Shal
?

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Re: Post preview for links... like Google+ and Facebook and Twitter... #postpreviews

 

On Mon, Jan 21, 2019 at 12:50 AM, Shal Farley wrote:
I'm not sure what you mean.

If you're talking about Mark Fletcher (Groups.io developer) he is back from vacation but he doesn't read GMF so he wouldn't even know this question has been raised.

I've not heard anything about it since your post in beta:
I want to know if someone know if Mark Fletcher study the question. ^^