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Thanks for that. ?Not sure my members will take to that. ?We have an older crowd, actually quite a few in the 80s and many don't "do" the internet.

--
Bob Bellizzi

The Corneal Dystrophy Foundation

On Mon, Jul 17, 2017 at 01:15 pm, Bob Bellizzi wrote:

Is this a bug?

Yes and no. I know it happens to some people that use Gmail. There are probably other clients that will do the same thing. It seems that Gmail replies to the digest heading information within itself, not the message heading information, so there's no reference or reply-to match for the topic when it arrives at io. (my paraphrasing and probably not exact.) Mark made a tweak a few weeks ago that seems to have stopped some of it, but they still pop up now and then. One work-around is to have them use the Reply Online choice.

I'd suggest sending a report to [email protected], including as much information as you can, including a link to the email and/or user in question. Maybe Mark will be able to nail down an overall solution.

Duane

I recently told one of our members that she apparently wasn't "chaining" her replies to the original message in a topic and
coached her to use the Reply to Group at the end of a message in her Digest.

She just did exactly that and her message is not part of my original topic.

Is this a bug? ?

I hate it when something doesn't seem to do what it seems it should do.
How's that for a mealy mouthed statement
--
Bob Bellizzi

The Corneal Dystrophy Foundation

Shal,

As you've noted, two issues here. I've always been annoyed by the top-posting algorithm's overzealousness, hiding ANY quoted material, not just prior posts but eve purposely quoted text from another source. I've resorted to inserting any sort of bogus text after a quote in order to foil it, but often I forget. It seems that nothing can be done about this. I know Mark has tried, according to what he's said in the past.

As for the gmail phone app, mine evidently behaves differently than yours, for some odd reason. Gmail does make quoted material purple on my Mac, but not on my iPhone. Before I resorted to italicizing the quoted material and even sometimes explicitly putting quotes around it, I used to see my versions of my posts on my phone beginning with statements that I utterly disagreed with and was about to counter, with those statements looking like I was the one saying them. Now, as i said, I work around that.

J

J,

I agree that block-quoted text using the web editor is not
convincingly distinguished in the email version of posts read on
mobile devices.

In the Gmail app in my phone, quoted material is changed to a purple color rather than black. Visually I find it distinct enough. This applies to both both plain text > marked quotes and HTML blockquotes. It also attempts to detect bottom-quotes and hide them beneath a "show quoted text" link.

My complaint with it is that hiding of bottom quotes too often sucks up the original content as well. But that's a complaint I'd have to take to Google; it isn't a Groups.io thing.

Shal

John,

Some members use email clients to compose and read messages and
others simply use the web interface. It is the latter group who are
sometimes having difficulties distinguishing between new text and
quoted text in messages posted to our group.

The site attempts to detect bottom-quoted or top-quoted material and hide it beneath an elipses (...) button. See the example of J's reply to you, where her quote of your message is hidden. Click the button to see your text:
/g/GroupManagersForum/message/2015

For in-line quotes in plain-text messages (like this one) the quotes are marked with a light gray bar on the left. See this unrelated message of mine:
/g/GroupManagersForum/message/2011

This arises because of the way some members who use email clients
format the quoted text in their response.

There are two "standard" ways of marking quoted material in email user interfaces ("clients" or "apps"): in HTML messages using the blockquote element; and in plain text like this one using the right angle bracket character > along the left edge. The site converts the plain-text form to blockquote.

As you note though, many users (and user interfaces) do other things. Including indentation and/or changes of color or font.

You might have a look at the "Normalize HTML Emails" option in the Message Formatting section of your group's Settings page. If you have that box checked then color or font changes won't be shown on your group's messages on site. If that's how some of your email client using members are marking quoted material this may be the source of the problem. But then I think this option would affect members that read by email as well.

I have been asked if it is possible using a group setting, to
automatically highlight quoted text in email client responses so that
readers who use the web interface can make the distinction between
new and quoted text. I can't find such a setting if it does exist.

There is no group setting to highlight quotes more aggressively than it does already: using the light gray bar on the left as the rendering of blockquote elements for inline quotes; nor any controls for the hiding of top- or bottom-quotes under elipses buttons..

If it isn't possible, is this a question that could be directed to
the Beta@ Group.

There, or to [email protected] if you have specific examples where the top- or bottom-quote detection for elipses is failing.

If you don't have any specific examples to cite it will be difficult for support (or members of beta@ for that matter) to imagine the difficulty your members are complaining about.

Shal

开云体育

We have a small private group (approx. 70 members) which I transferred from Yahoo just over 12 months ago. We are an active group and have posted almost 15,000 messages in that time.

Some members use email clients to compose and read messages and others simply use the web interface. It is the latter group who are sometimes having difficulties distinguishing between new text and quoted text in messages posted to our group.

This arises because of the way some members who use email clients format the quoted text in their response.

I have been asked if it is possible using a group setting, to automatically highlight quoted text in email client responses so that readers who use the web interface can make the distinction between new and quoted text. I can't find such a setting if it does exist.

If it isn't possible, is this a question that could be directed to the Beta@ Group.

Regards,
John P

One of the best ways to learn it is to just dive in and play. Before I moved my Yahoo group over, I wanted to be sure that y members could find the help that THEY needed, which meant that I had to provide it. I'd never written a wiki document before but I just started. It works very much like a rich text word processor... and much like this editor. The best way to learn it is to do it (which is my teaching philosophy overall).?

You can set your group permission so that only you have access to it while you are learning. Unless you tell people the wiki has content they most likely won't know.?

Within 2 weeks I had a comprehensive wiki for my group...
Ginny

LeeAnne,

The logical problem was handled this way by Yahoo:

It isn't a problem in a list of messages, as in Yahoo's digest.

Is those links that don't work on my iPhone.

That's probably a limitation of the email app you're using on your iPhone.

With groups.io there is no indication of who the messages are from.

Again, because it is a list of topics; each of which may have several people posting to it.

I help the newbies a lot and have no clue if they are posting or not
without having to go to the groups.

You can tell by scrolling through the messages in the digest.

Would this be a topic for beta?

I believe it has been. But yes, that would be the place for a suggestion to change the Topic list in digests to a Message list.

Shal

Renaming the subdomain back was quick and easy. No problems and it was there right away.

I have no idea what happened the first time.

开云体育

Hi

The logical problem was handled this way by Yahoo:


The links above would take you down our very long digest to the spot in the digest and if someone I wanted to read posted I could tell without having to skim the whole digest to see who posted. ?Is those links that don't work on my iPhone. ?

With groups.io there is no indication of who the messages are from. ?Shar is right it is a real time saver. ?I help the newbies a lot and have no clue if they are posting or not without having to go to the groups.?

TOPICS IN THIS DIGEST:

.

1. 2. 3. 4. 5. 6.

Would this be a topic for beta??

--
-LeeAnne

?Archivist

Hi JMichaelTX,

I'm looking for detailed documentation on how to start, manage, and
use the group.io wikis. If anyone has links to this info, please post.

I don't know that there is any, yet. That's one of the hazards of using this still-new service - the official help page (note, singular) is still rather limited, though it has been improving lately.

So, what are the basics?

One thing to know is that wiki page editor is (almost exactly) the same as the message editor. So most of this page will be helpful for page composition:
/g/GroupManagersForum/wiki/Message-composition-tips-and-tricks

Naturally, the devil is in that "almost".

One difference is the behavior of the Enter key versus Shift+Enter is reversed. In the wiki Enter starts a new paragraph, Shift+Enter starts a new line.

Another difference is that the Wiki has an Icons button in the Advanced Toolbar, where the message composition has a Special Character button. I don't understand why the wiki editor doesn't have both features: neither set of characters is a subset of the other.

The Icons are drawn from Font Awesome, and may not be available in a member's email interface, which I think explains why that feature isn't in the message composition window.


But the Special Characters is just the set of HTML named character entities. I see no reason wiki editors shouldn't have easy access to them.

*Submitted for your review, comment, and revision:*
Wiki Guide for Users and Editors

Excellent start! I've added it to the "Advice to Group Members" section of GMF's Wiki home page, replacing the two it links to. You may think it is too rough to be promoted this way, but it isn't that much rougher than some of the other pages.

My apologies for not asking for permission first.

None needed: GMF's wiki needs all the help it can get. ;-)

So, I guess my biggest question at this time, why can't I create a
page on the primary group (sub-group) of interest to me:

Presuming that you've logged on as a member of that group, it is possible the group management has restricted access so that only moderators can add or edit wiki pages.

If you are a moderator of that group, perhaps it's Wiki control is set to "Disabled". But I think in that case you'd be asking "Where is the wiki", not why can't you create a page.

Shal
GMF Owner

Hi everyone! I'm looking for detailed documentation on how to start, manage, and use the group.io wikis. If anyone has links to this info, please post.

I have done extensive searching, both within the groups.io, and this group in particular, as well as general internet searches on "group.io wiki", but have been able to find only bits and pieces. Seems like this basic help topic should be part of the main groups.io service. But I can't find it.

I have found only 3 topics with the hashtag #wiki in this group. They were helpful, but incomplete. I need something that starts from ground zero. I've setup and edited a number of other wikis, and all of them have had comprehensive help instructions.

So, what are the basics?

Well, while I was writing this topic, I was looking around this group, and stumbled on how to create a new wiki page. So I did.

Submitted for your review, comment, and revision:
Wiki Guide for Users and Editors

My apologies for not asking for permission first. If I've created something inappropriate, please feel free to delete.
Or, if there was already something there I missed, feel free to merge my new page with it.

So, I guess my biggest question at this time, why can't I create a page on the primary group (sub-group) of interest to me:
https//apple-dev.groups.io/g/jxa/wiki/home

Thanks in advance for your help and guidance.

开云体育

I miss this too. It was a good time-saver and quite helpful.

*~* Shar *~*

Yep.? It's back now.? Either it took some time, or the email I sent to support was already read and he helped out.

I am afraid to put it back, but that is my next step.? I'll wait until tomorrow or later today.

I hope it just took some time to happen.? Not that I plan to rename the sub domain, but it would be nice to know if it was needed it is easy to do.

Jeff,

Specifics are the group was called JeffTest. I added sub groups so it
became [email protected].

The default for the parent group would have been [email protected] - the prior group name becomes the subdomain name, not both group and subdomain.

Not sure if the subdomain field is editable and should not be, or if
all the variations I have been trying just pushed something over the
edge.

The subdomain field is supposed to be editable.

I can no longer get to the group nor send it emails.

I don't know if you've made further corrections, or if it just took a while to sink in, but it works for me:


It is possible that the directory doesn't update instantly, or that your browser had cached an old copy.

Shal