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Re: Taper - I think I have a problem?!
wrlabs
Hi Ian,
Thanks for the response! --- In 7x12minilathe@..., "steam4ian" <fosterscons@...> wrote: That was the easy part :). Spent most of the evening working at following these directions and I am still not sure I got this right. If you would please look at: The first 4 are checking the quill on the tailstock and it seems to look pretty good, Up by 0.001 in the back and toward the rear of the lathe by 0.0025 (closest to the tailstock, front of quill was used as zero). I spent yesterday finally getting my tailstock toI can understand that after tonight :-). Made the measurements several different ways and many different times and got somewhat different values. Still confused, but somewhat less so (I think :-). Measuring the dead center with the DI clamped in the chuck, you see the results. I tried it using the quill end (just get the ball up on it) and got a different set of values: Ball sitting on top (rear of ball touching) rather than front touching as in the pix referenced above: <pre> Ball back resting on top of quill, dial up............: reference zero. Ball back resting on front of quill, dial front......: -0.008 / -0.0085 Ball back resting on bottom of quill, dial down..: -0.0035 / -0.004 Ball back resting on back of quill, dial rea.........: -0.005 </pre> Pretending I am getting a clue here, that would make the back end of the work closer to the front of the lathe which would cut the workpiece thinner than the front (chuck end). Many different variations in the different pieces, certainly a challenge to get them all working the right way. Starting to think this little 7x12 is rather amazing for as good as it is out of the box after being shipped halfway across the planet! I moved the clamping screw from underNeed to figure out how to do that one, not clear to me why it is on the bottom in the first place, just seems wrong to me. So far what tapers I needed were short enough to do the math and set the compound accordingly. Don't use the rolling centre when making alignment;Did indeed use the dead center that came with the lathe. for critical workUnderstand, thanks. use the method which holds a shim between the centre to verifyDo you mean crush (dent) the shim between a pointed rod in the chuck against the center in the tailstock to see if they match up? BTW. It turning between centres the alignment of the headstock willWith it having been fully extended to get space to work, I was getting all it has to give :). Keep up the work on the laser centre and edge finder, it looks aProblem with using cheap laser pointers to do that is that NONE of them (that I have tried so far) project a decent dot, if a dot at all. One can get a donut pretty easily, but that requires better eyeballs than I have to use. I looked into decent laser modules (Digikey, IIRC) and the folks offering them for $40-$60 are one fantastic deal. Of the 5 I have tried so far, none was significantly better than the first one I did :-/. If there are decent laser modules at affordable prices out there, I have been unable to locate them :-(. Thanks very much & take care, Vikki. |
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Re: Micromill vs Minimill .... Now milling attachment
Gavin McIntosh
A milling slide vice for lathe means you are limited by the lathe speed.
You will not be able to mill with the smaller bits which will need higher speeds. Gavin From: andrew franks <andyf1108@...>_________________________________________________________________ Advertisement: Meet Sexy Singles at Lavalife today. Click here |
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A FEW MINUTES TO SPARE
G'day all.
Had a few minutes to spare this morning and I had to get out of the house to clear my head. No! not a hangover. I was sick of catching my thumb nail on the cap screws which retain the cross slide and compound handles. First thought, use a 6mm bolt purchased from an auto parts store but found I didn't have any threaded full length. Scrounging through stuff I had picked up I found two 6mm round head screws, they were too long so I slipped a nut onto them and put them in the vice, chopped off the over-length with the hacksaw and cleaned them up with a file; backing the nut off cleaned up the thread. Worked perfectly. Now I had two short 6mm cap screws looking for a job. They fitted the holes in the saddle for the travelling steady. Next a swarf tray mounted on the saddle. I had to hand some 0.8mm Aluminium sheet (Aluminum sheet won't do!) so out with the rule, square, marker pen and tin snips. Overall the cutout is 125mm by 85mm to make a pan which projects towards the headstock by about 75mm. At the back there is a 90deg. fold down of 20mm and at the front a 45deg. fold up of 20mm with a 10mm 45deg fold up at the side (headstock end). The flat part of the pan is 100 by 70mm, the extra 5mm in the cutout dimensions allows the edges at the front and side to be rolled over. A 6mm hole in the right place allows the pan to be retained on the saddle using the said screw. I threw a bit if scrap bar in the chuck and turned it down, The swarf and cutting oil fell neatly in the pan. Next an offcut of brass and the chips sprayed into the pan, nothing on the ways or leadscrew. Verdict: a success, why hadn't hadn't I done this ages ago? It all took less time to do than to describe. My head now clear I went inside and continued the task in hand. What am I going to do with the other 6mm screw??? One good turn deserves another. Regards, Ian The pan is 70mm long and 120mm wide plus a 10mm fold up at the front, 20mm fold down at the rear and a 20mm fold up at the front. I the cut 5mm oversize front an |
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Re: My 8x12 is here :) (Cleaning it up)
Well, I just dove in with both feet to get it cleaned up. I decided
to go ahead and disassemble the cross slide, compound, and tailstock for the cleaning. Since the parts were away from the lathe, I just used paint thinner for cleaning. I didn't find much more than a little protective layer of grease, really not much. Oh, I did find some surface rust on the cross slide. I bit the bullet and got after it with some 400 grit and that was that. A bit of it was on the under side of the cross slide but I think it will be ok. It was at the very end. Got it all put back together lubricating with Mobil 1 as I went. It seemed to go back together well. I had to tinker with the nut for the screw on the compound. If you don't get it juuuuuuuust right, the compound gets tight at one end of travel. Maybe I shouldn't have removed it for cleaning. No big deal. I may have to fiddle more with that later. I still have to degrease the pullys on the HS before crankin it up. I'm thinking that removing them would be prudent. Two have clip rings and the one on the 'other' end of the spindle has a threaded nut. Any one know of a reason I shouldn't remove these for cleaning? One thing I was pleasantly surprised with when I first got to looking closer to my new toy was to see all the oil ports with the check balls. However, could someone tell me what kind of oil can or spout I need to oil those things? Is there a special fitting on oil cans for those? Lastly, during the unpacking from the crate, I found one loose screw rolling around underneath the lathe. During the cleaning process, the only place I could see where a threaded hole did not have a screw is at the TS end of the bed. There's a hole in the casting below the TS. However, I can't see where it would make a difference whether it was installed or not. Oh, and lastly #2, could another HF 8x12 owner tell me if it is supposed to come with a pan underneath the lathe? I knew it did not have a back splash but thought it DID have a pan that goes underneath it. Thanks to all of you for the information you have provided me and for the encouragement that has gotten me this far in metal turning. Rance |
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Re: Anybody know what this is?
Hi Rance,
That toolhaus.org link is a beauty. It sure beats scrolling through dozens of pages to check the weak points for high turnover sellers. Puts all non-positive comments together where you can easily form an opinion as to whether the seller has a problem or just problem customers. Very useful link! John --- In 7x12minilathe@..., "rancerupp" <rupps@...> wrote: a nervous breakdown in Feb of this year. History can be seen atneutral/neg. fb for ebayers.nomral type moretool post. The photo is quite poor, and the seller further seems interested in terms of payment. |
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Re: Indexable bit holder for cummins mini lathe
Hi,
If they are the red painted ones with braised carbide tips, they are crap. Other than practice the only reason for putting them in the box was so you had something to do on Christmas afternoon if Santa forgot the accessories. Unless you get a QCTP, get used to shims. It's normal practice. If your lathe is designed to support 5/16 tooling it will be DELIBERATELY a tad low on 5/16" tools. That's to allow you to shim the last bit. If they tried to get the height exact, tolerances would often land them on the high side so shims wouldn't work. Of course, you can grind HSS tools lower. But you get the idea. You're actually MEANT to shim tools on fixed height turret holders. John --- In 7x12minilathe@..., "harleyknall" <knall@...> wrote: 5/16" bits. They seemed to contact the work are a bit low, and neededto be shimmed UP.sided) what size shank should I be looking to get? |
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Re: LMS Wood Turning Tool Rest, needs mods out of the box?
Vikki,
Now that I've got my lathe to look at I'm thinking of an alternative option for a woodworking tool rest. I might plan on just running the spindle in reverse and doing my woodworking-turning from the back side of the lathe. On a bench this might present a problem but I have mine on a rolling cart of sorts. I'm thinking that a magnetic base for the tool rest and sitting it on the rear of the cross slide. On my 8x12 there looks to be acres and acres of room for this sort of setup. Just a thought, no experience with this method yet. Rance (grinning from ear to ear right now) --- In 7x12minilathe@..., "wrlabs" <wrlabs@...> wrote: some spurnotesQuite good, gives me a real good idea of how to improve this, err, livecenter is very nice. If I want to do something quick though, I prettycenter round, then put that end in the chuck and it works out well. Barry |
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Re: Woodworking with the mini-lathe
It's usually fairly easy to find somebody cheaper than Woodcraft,
some of their apparent higher price disappears when shipping is calculated. Penn State has a pretty good reputation, the 3 tool set looks like it's aimed at general turning. The 5 pc set looks like its a little too light for general use; hard to tell for sure without a size reference in the pictures. Woodcraft has some retail (franchise) stores scattered around, might be worth checking your yellow pages. Pulling the chuck is easy. The secret is making a little gizmo to keep the nuts from running away! A piece of wire with a bent end will work, a fancier tool has a 5mm piece the nut will slide on & a short blunt point to fit in the socket of the mounting screw. It's also not a bad idea to mark the chuck & mounting flange so it'll reinstall in the same position. Personally, I haven't found much difference in different positions, still a possibility. If you want to keep the chuck on, it's easy to make a center for light woodturning. Find a bolt with a head about the size you want, chuck it, face it off, leaving a raised center. Drill a couple of holes to fit some short brads, press them in, points sticking out; voila, custom center! Roy --- In 7x12minilathe@..., "wrlabs" <wrlabs@...> wrote: lathe latheuse. The bigger ones look like a generic carving set, not a suitableset. Still, for small work, anything you can make work is a fortool. The size of the machine makes pen turning tools about the for.the last 30 yrs:-)I've pretty much written off both those sets as an "educational" that looks like it might do for small projects as well as pen turning too(?): the chisels).LMS so it might fit in the chuck, but I just don't know if that wouldwork and I'd hate to ruin it :-/. Since it seems to be too big for |
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Re: Marvel Mystery Oil & lathes
--- In 7x12minilathe@..., "Steve Claggett" <790racer@...>
wrote: use a syn 30wt on the lathe and mill cause it's what I have around. Theof the fromrecent ones (which were good) and gleened some good information just to offer one more opinion. i mixed up a batch of stp and mobil1them. consisting of 1oz. stp to 3oz. mobil1. i was amazed at the results. it makes a fantastic wayoil! i also used it on the cross slide and compound. both leadscrews, and dovetails. for me at least it's fabulous! don |
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Re: Anybody know what this is?
Charles E. Kinzer
Boy are you right about interesting ideas. His site is loaded with "why didn't I think of that" ideas. And not only that, great photos and short and to the point text.
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Here's a link straight to his index page for anyone interested... By the way, I'm a big believer in learning by hanging around the right people. THIS gentleman is an example of just the kind of craftsman to hang around if you can. Chuck K. ----- Original Message -----
From: John To: 7x12minilathe@... Sent: Saturday, March 24, 2007 5:00 PM Subject: [7x12minilathe] Re: Anybody know what this is? Hi Mark, Check Frank Ford's site for how he adapted a similar large toolholder to fit his QCTP: Frank has lots of interesting ideas so his site is well worth checking out. The toolholder in the blurry picture looks like it is made for facing while the shank is mounted perpendicular to the spindle axis (the normal position). My tangential for the QCTP is similar in some ways since it can turn or face without changing position on the toolpost - depending on the shape of the bit, the blurry holder might be able to do the same. The difference would be the simplicity of making a jig to sharpen the tangential. John --- In 7x12minilathe@..., "markzemanek" <markzemanek@...> wrote: > > Yeah, that 90 degree turn is a bit of a mystery alright. > > It may not be out of the hands of the home shop machinist to build > his/her own tool holders. A short while back there was a discussion > about tangential tool holder, which for all purposes on our 7x's can > use 1/8" tool bits, and gadgetbuilder (where are ya' dude!...help me > out here...) has built a piece that sure inspires me. Before I can > make one, however, I am going to have to wait until I get myself a mill... > > > > Mark > ========== > > --- In 7x12minilathe@..., "Charles E. Kinzer" > <ckinzer@> wrote: > > > > Did some minor searching and ETCO is Engineering Tooling Corp., > "Quality Tools and Inserts for Swiss Style CNC Screw Machines" > > > > > > > > A couple of the tool holders shown on their home page seem to hold > these inserts, just not at the 90 degree angle of the one on ebay. > > > > The screw machine world is a bit of mystery to me. I suspect they > buy the "micro inserts" ready ground, and being small, they are cheaper. > > > > I suspect it would be too much of a project to make a similar tool > holder for the home shop and use small HSS tool bits. > > > > Chuck K. > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: markzemanek > > To: 7x12minilathe@... > > Sent: Saturday, March 24, 2007 2:12 PM > > Subject: [7x12minilathe] Anybody know what this is? > > > > > > Howdy gang: > > > > I've come across an interesting looking, alternative tool post on > > ebay, of the likes I've never seen before. > > > > The seller does not mentio what advantage it has over thet nomral type > > tool post. The photo is quite poor, and the seller further seems more > > interested in terms of payment. > > > > Looking beyond all this, though, might anybody here know what the > > application is for this type of toolpost? > > > > > > > > Thanks, Mark > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > |
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Re: Taper - I think I have a problem?!
Chris Bailey
Okay, it's not a complex deal although it appears to be. First off, find an old dot matrix printer and rob all the rods out of it. Take the larger one that the print carrige rides on and chuck it up. Drill a centering hole at one end if it doesn't already have one and then put that in the tailstock center. Mount a dial test indicator on the carriage of the lathe so that the test probe contacts the FRONT of the bar and reads. Run the carriage back and forth while watching the dial. This will tell you how much you're off either at the tailstock or the headstock / spindle. To eliminate chuck runout, turn the spindle 90 degrees and repeat. If your readings change, your chuck isn't centered. Repeat the whole process on the TOP of the bar to find out what your error is in tailstock HEIGHT.
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Chris Bailey wrlabs wrote:
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Re: Micromill vs Minimill .... Now milling attachment
andrew franks
I've got one of those vertical slides. It's fittted by removing the topslide and fastening it down to the "swivel disk" in the cross-slide. It would have been better if it had T-slots to fasten jobs (or a vise) to the front of it, rather than that big, overhanging, "toolpost" arrangement. Check if your cross-slide will wind far enough over to make full use of its 2.7" (approx) width. To adjust the depth of cut with a milling cutter in the chuck (or collet), the carriage handwheel isn't nearly precise enough; you will need a handwheel and graduated dial on the outboard end of the leadscrew. As I've previously remarked, I wish I'd put the money into a mini-mill fund.
Andy Steve Claggett <790racer@...> wrote: Have you seen this? A friend has one, he is happy doing basic work, but he said it can only handle small cuts or he has a chatter problem. --- In 7x12minilathe@..., Richard Stevens <rtjstevens@...> wrote: won't fit the 7x12 (I believe). Does anyone know of one that will fit? I dohave a DVD from Chronos UK that shows a Taig/Peatol attachment (with a fewminor mods) being able to fit the 7x10/12. Has anyone any experience of doingthis? If so, what's the max capacity for milling?better than the equivalent mill from Seig? --------------------------------- New Yahoo! Mail is the ultimate force in competitive emailing. Find out more at the Yahoo! Mail Championships. Plus: play games and win prizes. |
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Re: Taper - I think I have a problem?!
Aaron Pasteris
No twist in my bed but the headstock was off by 0.015 in 8" when I got it.
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After aligning using "Rollie's Dad's Method", my DTI (0.0005) doesn't twitch over the same distance. I can turn a 3" length and have it come out with no taper as measured with a good (? Starret) micrometer. Aaron ----- Original Message -----
From: Ed Boysun To: 7x12minilathe@... Sent: Saturday, March 24, 2007 8:54 AM Subject: [7x12minilathe] Re: Taper - I think I have a problem?! Guys that should know, tell me that a lathe bed has almost no resistance to twist. You need to beg, borrow, or steal a machinist's precision level and check the bed, both at the headstock and near the tailstock to make sure that the level reads exactly the same in both places. If your bench is solid, you may need to add shims beneath the legs on the lathe, then clamp it back to the bench. If your table is not completely rigid, you can adjust the feet of the table to impart some twist to the table, and thus to the lathe bed. It surprised me; just how much a small shim will de-twist the bed. A twisted bed will exhibit exactly the symptoms you describe. Ed B --- In 7x12minilathe@..., "wrlabs" <wrlabs@...> wrote: > > Hi Folks, > > If I can poll the collective wisdom on this I'd appreciate it. > > I'm not sure I have a problem, but I think so. > > Turning down a rod I get a 0.015" difference over 5.5", please see: > > > > I would guess that would turn into 0.030" over 11"? > > If I turn a cone in the chuck and pull up the tailstock, they appear > to match up as near as I can tell. > > My failed laser edge finder drew a circle around the the tailstock > center that looked centered to me. > > I get this just turning a reasonably robust rod just clamped in the > chuck too (measurable difference between ends, forget what the value > is now). > > I'm really lost on this, only thing I can think of (SWAG) is (horrors) > that the bed is crooked or perhaps the saddle is crooked?!??? > > I'm really out of ideas, am I expecting too much of the 7x12? > > Thanks & take care, Vikki. > |
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Re: Micromill vs Minimill .... Now milling attachment
Steve Claggett
Have you seen this?
A friend has one, he is happy doing basic work, but he said it can only handle small cuts or he has a chatter problem. --- In 7x12minilathe@..., Richard Stevens <rtjstevens@...> wrote: won't fit the 7x12 (I believe). Does anyone know of one that will fit? I dohave a DVD from Chronos UK that shows a Taig/Peatol attachment (with a fewminor mods) being able to fit the 7x10/12. Has anyone any experience of doingthis? If so, what's the max capacity for milling?better than the equivalent mill from Seig? |
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Re: Marvel Mystery Oil & lathes
Steve Claggett
If it's all you have on hand, it's better than nothing. I have used
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it in all my pneumatic tools for thirty five years. Personally, I use a syn 30wt on the lathe and mill cause it's what I have around. The v-twin 50wt was a bit thick. --- In 7x12minilathe@..., "rancerupp" <rupps@...> wrote:
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Re: Indexable bit holder for cummins mini lathe
Steve Claggett
Mine uses 5/16 according to the owners manual. I have a QCTP so I
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have 5/16 and 3/8. I would think use the biggest you can. --- In 7x12minilathe@..., "harleyknall" <knall@...> wrote:
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Re: Anybody know what this is?
Hi Mark,
Check Frank Ford's site for how he adapted a similar large toolholder to fit his QCTP: Frank has lots of interesting ideas so his site is well worth checking out. The toolholder in the blurry picture looks like it is made for facing while the shank is mounted perpendicular to the spindle axis (the normal position). My tangential for the QCTP is similar in some ways since it can turn or face without changing position on the toolpost - depending on the shape of the bit, the blurry holder might be able to do the same. The difference would be the simplicity of making a jig to sharpen the tangential. John --- In 7x12minilathe@..., "markzemanek" <markzemanek@...> wrote: mill... nomral type moretool post. The photo is quite poor, and the seller further seems interested in terms of payment. |
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Re: Taper - I think I have a problem?!
G'day Vikki
Your site shows you have a dial indicator. Mount it on the cross slide and extend the tail stock quill out to the limit of its travel and clamp it. Run the dial indicator along the side and top of the quill. You may well find the dial indicator moves during the travers indicating that the quill is not parallel to the bed axis. Unless you have spent time working over the tailstock you will find that it is too high by up to 20 thou and the the quill alignment is out by up to the same amount. I spent yesterday finally getting my tailstock to near "perfect" alignment and height yesterday, this has taken me 10 months of intermittent effort. I moved the clamping screw from under to above the foot. Don't use the rolling centre when making alignment; for critical work use a dead centre with the tip lubricated with molebdenum grease. I use the method which holds a shim between the centre to verify alignment. BTW. It turning between centres the alignment of the headstock will not effect the job. If the tailstock quill is not aligned then the alignment with the headstock will differ as the quill is extended. Keep up the work on the laser centre and edge finder, it looks a great project. One good turn deserves another. Regards, Ian --- In 7x12minilathe@..., "wrlabs" <wrlabs@...> wrote: (horrors) that the bed is crooked or perhaps the saddle is crooked?!??? |
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Re: Anybody know what this is?
Yeah, that 90 degree turn is a bit of a mystery alright.
It may not be out of the hands of the home shop machinist to build his/her own tool holders. A short while back there was a discussion about tangential tool holder, which for all purposes on our 7x's can use 1/8" tool bits, and gadgetbuilder (where are ya' dude!...help me out here...) has built a piece that sure inspires me. Before I can make one, however, I am going to have to wait until I get myself a mill... Mark ========== --- In 7x12minilathe@..., "Charles E. Kinzer" <ckinzer@...> wrote: "Quality Tools and Inserts for Swiss Style CNC Screw Machines" these inserts, just not at the 90 degree angle of the one on ebay. buy the "micro inserts" ready ground, and being small, they are cheaper. holder for the home shop and use small HSS tool bits.
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Re: Taper - I think I have a problem?!
wrlabs
Thanks to all that responded to this query.
OK, I am *totally* intimidated after going through some of the websites suggested :-(. It is going to take a LOT more experience and especially more understanding than I have before I start tearing down the lathe to that degree. Of interest, I dug out that bolster bar I made out of the 1" stainless rod and measured that at each end (3") and it is only off by 0.001. Chucked on one end, center drilled and supported by the live center in the tailstock. Wonder if my problem is flex in the workpiece, as in I am hogging it? It would see that would make it off in the middle were it is unsupported though. Yep, I am totally confused about what is going on here. The item that was off the 0.015 was wood and I am now wondering if the centers being slightly off from the center marks (assuming they were perfect) would cause that much difference? I would think that turning that down would result in it being symmetrical / consistent from end to end once it was turned down far enough? Starting to think I really need a mentor or at least a decent course about all this. Thanks & take care, Vikki (The Massively Confuzed). |
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